Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[Cutting Edge 2]

Actually it does fit perfectly in our doctrine of Nuclear triad. The current scenario of using Brahmos from MKI is classic example of jugaad. Deep penetrating Fighters like MKIs are not fit for carrying such heavy missiles. In future when you would come up with even longer range CM, then you need one dedicated strategic heavy bomber for that role. Loading a nuclear capable missile or a nuclear bomb under MKI or Rafale doesnt make one capable of possessing true Nuclear Triad.

Requirement for strategic bomber was a long pending but for some reason IAF never took it seriously. If I remember correctly back in 2013 someone from IAF said that we don't need a dedicated bomber because upcoming MMRCA can fulfil this role. It was a laughable statement back then. Nice too see that finally under new MoD some common sense is prevailing in IAF.

 

[Cutting Edge 2]

India-made multi-role choppers to match Russian Mi-17s: All you need to know
If all goes as per the plans of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, the first prototype of the helicopter could be out by 2020. A senior HAL official said the programme was on track and a priority for the state-owned firm.

Updated: May 09, 2017 13:22 IST

India is pursuing plans to build its own multi-role helicopters that could be made available to the three services in the next 6 years.

If all goes as per the plans of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, the first prototype of the helicopter could be out by 2020. A senior HAL official said the programme was on track and a priority for the state-owned firm.

Here’s all you need to know about the Indian multi-role helicopter (IMRH) project:

Competition for Mi-17 choppers

The IMRH is expected to compete with Russian Mi-17 choppers in both Indian and foreign markets. HAL says the platform could have a huge market as nearly 40 air forces across the world operate Mi-17 type helicopters. The Mi-17 is the mainstay of the Indian Air Force’s transport fleet.

Types of missions

HAL officials say the IMRH will be capable of carrying out a wider variety of missions than the Mi-17. The indigenous helicopter, which is currently in design stage, could be used for transporting troops, conducting assault operations, air maintenance and anti-submarine warfare among other roles.

SPECIFICATIONS OF PROPOSED INDIA-MADE MULTI-ROLE CHOPPERS

• Weight class: 12.5 tonne
• Engines: 2
• Payload: 3,500kg
• Passengers: 24
• Service ceiling: Over 20,000 feet

Indigenous platform

The HAL is seeking to build the helicopter without any foreign help. However, HAL sources said the engines for the IMRH could be sourced from a foreign military contractor. HAL has estimated a requirement for 350 to 400 choppers but the number could be revised depending on market projections.

Indian helicopter fleet

The IMRH will join a wide variety of helicopters in the Indian fleet ranging from Mi-17V5, Dhruv advanced light helicopter, Ka-226T (yet to be built) to Apache attack helicopters and Chinook heavy-lift choppers whose induction will begin in about 2 years.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/india...eed-to-know/story-J4uGipbbB9uHfnQfvwFFMO.html

 

[Filtercoffee]

India-made multi-role choppers to match Russian Mi-17s: All you need to know
If all goes as per the plans of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, the first prototype of the helicopter could be out by 2020. A senior HAL official said the programme was on track and a priority for the state-owned firm.

Updated: May 09, 2017 13:22 IST

India is pursuing plans to build its own multi-role helicopters that could be made available to the three services in the next 6 years.

If all goes as per the plans of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, the first prototype of the helicopter could be out by 2020. A senior HAL official said the programme was on track and a priority for the state-owned firm.

Here’s all you need to know about the Indian multi-role helicopter (IMRH) project:

Competition for Mi-17 choppers

The IMRH is expected to compete with Russian Mi-17 choppers in both Indian and foreign markets. HAL says the platform could have a huge market as nearly 40 air forces across the world operate Mi-17 type helicopters. The Mi-17 is the mainstay of the Indian Air Force’s transport fleet.

Types of missions

HAL officials say the IMRH will be capable of carrying out a wider variety of missions than the Mi-17. The indigenous helicopter, which is currently in design stage, could be used for transporting troops, conducting assault operations, air maintenance and anti-submarine warfare among other roles.

SPECIFICATIONS OF PROPOSED INDIA-MADE MULTI-ROLE CHOPPERS

• Weight class: 12.5 tonne
• Engines: 2
• Payload: 3,500kg
• Passengers: 24
• Service ceiling: Over 20,000 feet

Indigenous platform

The HAL is seeking to build the helicopter without any foreign help. However, HAL sources said the engines for the IMRH could be sourced from a foreign military contractor. HAL has estimated a requirement for 350 to 400 choppers but the number could be revised depending on market projections.

Indian helicopter fleet

The IMRH will join a wide variety of helicopters in the Indian fleet ranging from Mi-17V5, Dhruv advanced light helicopter, Ka-226T (yet to be built) to Apache attack helicopters and Chinook heavy-lift choppers whose induction will begin in about 2 years.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/india...eed-to-know/story-J4uGipbbB9uHfnQfvwFFMO.html

For me and for total control over updates of technology, 100% Indian engines are ideal for all series made by HAL.

 

[sbm]

Has anyone seen any new build HAS at air bases? Particularly for the Su-30MKI? I am particularly curious if the HAS now get blast doors.

 

[sjsivfcare]

India is getting more and more powerful that's awesome, we need power to protect our country

 

[bhramos]

Has anyone seen any new build HAS at air bases? Particularly for the Su-30MKI? I am particularly curious if the HAS now get blast doors.

old news though

Parliamentary panel concerned that Sukhoi-30 fighters have no protective shelters

The IAF informed the committee in oral evidence that the aircraft are deprived of hardened shelters because the Sukhoi-30 MKI cannot be fit into the existing ones because of their large size. “It is a much bigger aircraft. Therefore some New Generation Hardened Aircraft Shelter (NGHAS) has to be made in which not only a SU-30 can fit but also servicing, loading of weapons and maintenance activities can be done inside the shelter,” the committee was informed.

The committee members were also informed by representatives of the MoD that the NGHAS “is a large project and it costs thousands of crores of rupees”. It was further informed that NGHAS are specialised structures and “are designed to save a Sukhoi-30 MKI aircraft from direct hit of 2000 lbs bomb”.

http://indianexpress.com/article/in...khoi-30-fighters-have-no-protective-shelters/

 

[captscooby81]

If someone here with more info on IAF aircraft modernisation plan can throw some light on the below things

1.Mig-21 Current inventory is around 200+ and we are planning retire the entire fleet by 2022/2023 which is 6 years from .
2.Jaguar we have around 140+ which we are planning to be retired by 2030
3.Mirage we have around 48 which again planning to be retired by 2030
4.Mig-29 we have around 69 which again planning to be retired by 2030

All put together we are going to retire around 450+ Fighter aircraft's by 2030 which is just around 12 years away

Now HAL will max produce 20 Tejas/year which will help to finish the current order of 123 in 6 years from now.
Even if the Single engine order of F-16 or Gripen 200 gets signed by next year i don't see the Makeinindia production starts before 2021..How are we going to fill the shortfall of another 150 Aircrafts ..Apart from those 36 Rafales which will be delivered by 2022 ..What were those guys in IAF and MoD was smoking with such shortfall gap ..This rate we will never touch the 42 Squadrons before 2040...

Is the IAF planning to defend the entire country with just Su-30MKI of 200+ aircrafts

 

[aditya10r]

If someone here with more info on IAF aircraft modernisation plan can throw some light on the below things

1.Mig-21 Current inventory is around 200+ and we are planning retire the entire fleet by 2022/2023 which is 6 years from .
2.Jaguar we have around 140+ which we are planning to be retired by 2030
3.Mirage we have around 48 which again planning to be retired by 2030
4.Mig-29 we have around 69 which again planning to be retired by 2030

All put together we are going to retire around 450+ Fighter aircraft's by 2030 which is just around 12 years away

Now HAL will max produce 20 Tejas/year which will help to finish the current order of 123 in 6 years from now.
Even if the Single engine order of F-16 or Gripen 200 gets signed by next year i don't see the Makeinindia production starts before 2021..How are we going to fill the shortfall of another 150 Aircrafts ..Apart from those 36 Rafales which will be delivered by 2022 ..What were those guys in IAF and MoD was smoking with such shortfall gap ..This rate we will never touch the 42 Squadrons before 2040...

Is the IAF planning to defend the entire country with just Su-30MKI of 200+ aircrafts

By 2030,i beleive indian air force will have following things in its inventory:

1. Su-30mki(hopefully super standard)-250
2. FGFA-100
3.Rafale-36
4.Single engine jet(f-16/gripen-e)-150
5.Tejas-150
6.Mig-29+mirage 2000+jaguar-200

Total-approx-900 combat jets

Mig-29's+M2K's+Jags will be replaced by AMCA(it should be out by 2030) and airforce will operate these migs and mirages till 2040(they will).

If a single engine fighter is selected then that will end scopes for Tejas mk2(because air force will have foren maal that is an equivalent of tejas mk2).

Air force should work on generating higher sorties per aircraft,lower the types of jet fighters,have better infra along the border and proper indigenisation.

 

[captscooby81]

well i didn't included Su-30MKI as they are not up for retirement at least by 2050 if the super sukhoi upgrade happens ..

FGFA will have its first prototype by 2025 if i am not wrong so having 100 by 2030 looks very bleak ..

Rafale wont be restricted to 36 ..I am sure there is more numbers going to come at cost of some Bn$ .

Why to keep doing this tamasha of single engine aircraft competition ..imagine someone going to invest under makeinindia just to make 200 Aircrafts and then shuts the shop and goes does is sound feasible instead of that why the IAF and Govt put that pressure on HAL ask it to use the IPO money on expanding its infrastructure and build more Tejas and then move to FGFA or AMCA what ever becomes reality in the future ..

not able to fathom the critical decision making thinking of our Decision makers in IAF and Mod...

By 2030,i beleive indian air force will have following things in its inventory:

1. Su-30mki(hopefully super standard)-250
2. FGFA-100
3.Rafale-36
4.Single engine jet(f-16/gripen-e)-150
5.Tejas-150
6.Mig-29+mirage 2000+jaguar-200

Total-approx-900 combat jets

Mig-29's+M2K's+Jags will be replaced by AMCA(it should be out by 2030) and airforce will operate these migs and mirages till 2040(they will).

If a single engine fighter is selected then that will end scopes for Tejas mk2(because air force will have foren maal that is an equivalent of tejas mk2).

Air force should work on generating higher sorties per aircraft,lower the types of jet fighters,have better infra along the border and proper indigenisation.

 

[aditya10r]

well i didn't included Su-30MKI as they are not up for retirement at least by 2050 if the super sukhoi upgrade happens ..

FGFA will have its first prototype by 2025 if i am not wrong so having 100 by 2030 looks very bleak ..

Rafale wont be restricted to 36 ..I am sure there is more numbers going to come at cost of some Bn$ .

Why to keep doing this tamasha of single engine aircraft competition ..imagine someone going to invest under makeinindia just to make 200 Aircrafts and then shuts the shop and goes does is sound feasible instead of that why the IAF and Govt put that pressure on HAL ask it to use the IPO money on expanding its infrastructure and build more Tejas and then move to FGFA or AMCA what ever becomes reality in the future ..

not able to fathom the critical decision making thinking of our Decision makers in IAF and Mod...

You are right.............Buying the single engine fighter will kill tejas mk2 and Hal will not be able to absorb tech.
The best is to purchase 60 more rafales,tweak up tejas mk2 development and production.

For fgfa-we should simply ditch and buy pak-fa off the shelf,Lets say we do that by 2022 and then we set up a production line in hal,that assembly line can produce upto 20 jets per year from 2025 onwards.

Fast track the development of AMCA and super sukhoi upgrade so that we have it by 2027 for the super sukhoi and 2030 for the amca.

 

[Filtercoffee]

You are right.............Buying the single engine fighter will kill tejas mk2 and Hal will not be able to absorb tech.
The best is to purchase 60 more rafales,tweak up tejas mk2 development and production.

For fgfa-we should simply ditch and buy pak-fa off the shelf,Lets say we do that by 2022 and then we set up a production line in hal,that assembly line can produce upto 20 jets per year from 2025 onwards.

Fast track the development of AMCA and super sukhoi upgrade so that we have it by 2027 for the super sukhoi and 2030 for the amca.

We can have Tejas MK - 2, AMCA MK - 1 prototypes, TDs and or LSPs by 2025. Buying more Rafales is ditched because of make in India initiative I think, and not revealed completely to the public. Upgrades of SU - 30 MKI are timelined.

 

[aditya10r]

We can have Tejas MK - 2, AMCA MK - 1 prototypes, TDs and or LSPs by 2025. Buying more Rafales is ditched because of make in India initiative I think and not revealed completely to the public. Upgrades of SU - 30 MKI are timelined.

If make in india jets happen,Then bid a goodbye to Tejas mk2..................

Because then the AF officials will say,we have a tejas mk2 equivalent so fuck it.

 

[Filtercoffee]

If make in india jets happen,Then bid a goodbye to Tejas mk2..................

Because then the AF officials will say,we have a tejas mk2 equivalent so fuck it.

First priority to Indian products and I am sure MK 3 will happen after the MK 2 is a success.

 

[aditya10r]

First priority to Indian products and I am sure MK 3 will happen after the MK 2 is a success.

No,no mk3 will happen because building a 4th gen jet (no matter how technically advanced) in lates 20's or early 30's makes no sense.Better invest in AMCA and have 2-3 blocks/variants/iterations of it.

 

[Filtercoffee]

No,no mk3 will happen because building a 4th gen jet (no matter how technically advanced) in lates 20's or early 30's makes no sense.Better invest in AMCA and have 2-3 blocks/variants/iterations of it.

Yes this is true only when the stress of a production line setup is destroyed, will we see a fast paced series update for all of HAL series. We need more investment in only production and testing.

 

[sbm]

Yes it this NGHAS I am trying to find out about.

 

[sbm]

I found this photograph. Does anyone think that there are doors in front and back? It's clearly reinforced but are those doors? Open front, closed back?

 

[Chinmoy]

India's Air Force withholds payments for switch in airfield system

http://www.janes.com/article/70454/...hholds-payments-for-switch-in-airfield-system

 

[indiatester]

India's Air Force withholds payments for switch in airfield system

http://www.janes.com/article/70454/...hholds-payments-for-switch-in-airfield-system

This news had to come on janes?
Either Tata SED did not do a proper job, OR MoD is being well bureaucratic. I hope the reasonable explanation is given.

 

[Chinmoy]

This news had to come on janes?
Either Tata SED did not do a proper job, OR MoD is being well bureaucratic. I hope the reasonable explanation is given.

Whatever be the reason, seems MOD is hell bent on making the defaulters pay. TATA had opted for Australian product when an equivalent Indian product is available around. Seems TATA SED had been unable to make their point clear.