Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[MirageBlue]

Yes deep feeling
We will regret our dependence over roosi
Have we paid for all 5 regiments if yes then our money would be wasted right

Typically contracts don't work on the principle of paying everything up front. We will pay in installments and typically upon delivery. If there is no delivery then there won't be payments for the S-400 batteries that were not delivered.

 

[pankaj nema]

 

[blackleaf]

Typically contracts don't work on the principle of paying everything up front. We will pay in installments and typically upon delivery. If there is no delivery then there won't be payments for the S-400 batteries that were not delivered.

Can we cancel the order for the remaining batteries of they are too much delayed?
Indian systems like the XR-SAM aren't to far away.

 

[mokoman]

India’s fighter squadron strength will dip to dangerously low levels by 2030 unless medium role fighter ordered AND timely LCA Mk1A supplies are ensured, IAF informs panel. Maintaining `29-31 squadrons’ requires 114 medium role fighters.

India’s fighter squadron strength will dip to dangerously low levels by 2030 unless medium role fighter ordered AND timely LCA Mk1A supplies are ensured

"We should not go below this. We also need to phase out our MiG 21 fighters" - panel told. IAF has 3 remaining MiG 21 squadrons, last one to the phased out by 2025. Bulk LCA Mk1A deliveries unlikely in adequate time to make up for shortfall.

 

[Gyyan]

India’s fighter squadron strength will dip to dangerously low levels by 2030 unless medium role fighter ordered AND timely LCA Mk1A supplies are ensured, IAF informs panel. Maintaining `29-31 squadrons’ requires 114 medium role fighters.

India’s fighter squadron strength will dip to dangerously low levels by 2030 unless medium role fighter ordered AND timely LCA Mk1A supplies are ensured

"We should not go below this. We also need to phase out our MiG 21 fighters" - panel told. IAF has 3 remaining MiG 21 squadrons, last one to the phased out by 2025. Bulk LCA Mk1A deliveries unlikely in adequate time to make up for shortfall.

HAL be like: And i took that personally

 

[blackleaf]

HAL be like: And i took that personally

Building 32 Tejas a year is the best way to ensure the squadron strength remains manageable. 32/year can get us 8 extra squadrons by 2030. The orders need to be placed.

 

[Haldilal]

Ya'll Nibbiars

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

India’s fighter squadron strength will dip to dangerously low levels by 2030 unless medium role fighter ordered AND timely LCA Mk1A supplies are ensured, IAF informs panel. Maintaining `29-31 squadrons’ requires 114 medium role fighters.

India’s fighter squadron strength will dip to dangerously low levels by 2030 unless medium role fighter ordered AND timely LCA Mk1A supplies are ensured

"We should not go below this. We also need to phase out our MiG 21 fighters" - panel told. IAF has 3 remaining MiG 21 squadrons, last one to the phased out by 2025. Bulk LCA Mk1A deliveries unlikely in adequate time to make up for shortfall.

These guys need to understand that even if the MRFA deal for local production of 114 jets is signed today, the first batch of jets won't be delivered until atleast 2028, at the rate of 12-14 jets/annum, not even 2 squadrons of MRFA jets will be inducted till 2030.
Tejas Mk1A is the only fighter jet right now which is readily available for production and rapid induction, and additional orders must be placed.
This is the only solution right now to fix the problem, whether the IAF likes it or not.

 

[vishnugupt]

These guys need to understand that even if the MRFA deal for local production of 114 jets is signed today, the first batch of jets won't be delivered until atleast 2028, at the rate of 12-14 jets/annum, not even 2 squadrons of MRFA jets will be inducted till 2030.
Tejas Mk1A is the only fighter jet right now which is readily available for production and rapid induction, and additional orders must be placed.
This is the only solution right now to fix the problem, whether the IAF likes it or not.

अगर साइन आज हो गया तो कमीशन तो कम से कम कल से आने लगेगा । जेट्स जब आए तब आते रहेंगे।

डील होनी चाहिए

 

[Arpuster]

2027 - 2037 MRFA will cost $ 20 billion.
Same money can be utilised with:-
40 additional tejas mk1a - about $ 2.5 billion 2027-30 + 80 additional tejas mk2 - I guess $ 7-8 billion 2032-36 + $ 5 billion AMCA engine development + $ 5 billion force multipliers like AWACS/refuelers/drones

 

[Arpuster]

Also I think its better to get two teams on the AMCA engine development like:-
Team 1:- Rolls royce + GTRE + Godrej + IITs & IISc
Team 2:- HAL-Safran JV + NAL + IITs & IISc
Let them each develop a prototype in 6 years and declare a team winner for further development based on indigenous content & IP authority.

 

[Corvus Splendens]

MRFA in 2030

 

[johnj]

Warfare has changed. Thousand of mig type jets are useless in modern battle field so are old strike jets like mirage 3&5.
There are thousands of advanced SAMs in inventory and only aircraft with sophisticated defensive systems can evade them but those aircraft will be very costly ( just like rafale ) and hence numbers are going down for most air forces around the planet.

Chinese are only exception because of their massive economy but even that is hitting a plateau and we can't bankrupt ourselves trying to match a 3 times larger economy in military spending.

We gotta find the balance in quality and quantity.

Regarding copium we don't need it cause we are a goddam nuclear power with thermonuclear icbms. Our enemies can cope.

Your theory only applicable against nations without fighter jets.
USAF buying 1700 JSF & keeping a10, f15 c/d/x & f22 & consider buying 500~600 NGAD.
SAM is not a major issue but air superiority jets are- and need air superiority jets to counter air superiority jets.
IAF need 150 air superiority jets against pak & 200 air superiority jets against in 1st day, no country consider using nuke on 1st day of war.
FYI- IAF selected bth eft[air superiority,f22] & rafale[strike,jsff35] in mmrca.
What IAF need is 300~400 lca mk1/mk2 and 42sqn only good against 2000 era PLAAF, not future PLAAF with 1000s plus air superiority jets.

 

[johnj]

Also I think its better to get two teams on the AMCA engine development like:-
Team 1:- Rolls royce + GTRE + Godrej + IITs & IISc
Team 2:- HAL-Safran JV + NAL + IITs & IISc
Let them each develop a prototype in 6 years and declare a team winner for further development based on indigenous content & IP authority.

Who is going fund those- FYI its costs above 12 billion $ & GOI consider buying 80 f35 with it is better and developing kaveri further with GTRE + Godrej + IITs + IISc + NAL.

 

[Arpuster]

Who is going fund those- FYI its costs above 12 billion $ & GOI consider buying 80 f35 with it is better and developing kaveri further with GTRE + Godrej + IITs + IISc + NAL.

IAF can fund it mostly by cancellation of $20 billion MRFA in favour of 40 additional tejas mk 1a and 80 additional tejas mk2 for just $10 billion. Rest by industry. Even Navy can bring some funding since this engine will also be used in TEDBF. Moreover, 6 billion is the requirement asked by Safran for full engine development but here I am talking about funding both teams till prototype and then funding only the winner for full engine development. Infact the Indian partners of losing team can then become junior partners of winning team in final development of engine thereby bringing some part of the investment done on their prototype as well knowledge gained on the final engine. This will make engine more indigenous and less prone to blackmails of foreign OEMs. Besides a great ecosystem may develop in country for jet engines.
The competition between both teams will make them strive harder for excellence. And competition due to two foreign OEMs will force them to transfer greater part of technology to Indian partners.

 

[johnj]

IAF can fund it mostly by cancellation of $20 billion MRFA in favour of 40 additional tejas mk 1a and 80 additional tejas mk2 for just $10 billion. Rest by industry. Even Navy can bring some funding since this engine will also be used in TEDBF. Moreover, 6 billion is the requirement asked by Safran for full engine development but here I am talking about funding both teams till prototype and then funding only the winner for full engine development. Infact the Indian partners of losing team can then become junior partners of winning team in final development of engine thereby bringing some part of the investment done on their prototype as well knowledge gained on the final engine. This will make engine more indigenous and less prone to blackmails of foreign OEMs. Besides a great ecosystem may develop in country for jet engines.
The competition between both teams will make them strive harder for excellence. And competition due to two foreign OEMs will force them to transfer greater part of technology to Indian partners.

Engine Prototype ?? Prototype already exists - ge414, ej200, m88. 6 billion+ for ip & hot section. 2 billion+ for limited hot section.
IAF never fund a huge project when their sqn strength falling below paf.
there is no indian partners.
No investment.
No future.
Its a dead project.
Only thing left is goi, goi can choose to fight or surrender - either pay or die.
FYI- goi stick with diplomacy - pass jv to next gov
GOI motto- why spend $$ on R&D if you can buy entire things with that $$ - old habit die hard & french only taking advantage of it.
Better go for f35 & finish kaveri with russian help, & use knowledge gained from it to develop further instead of spending 15 billion $$ in 5th gen engine. One more word - globalisation - a tool to kill future tech R&D outside US & its allies - means 5th gen engine R&D == 5 billion $ lose & 2x jv == 10 billion $ lose.
Right now there is no advantage of sharing engine tech to india, insisted french, us, uk just play with india & at the end goi forced to buy jets & engine from them.

 

[IndianHawk]

Your theory only applicable against nations without fighter jets.
USAF buying 1700 JSF & keeping a10, f15 c/d/x & f22 & consider buying 500~600 NGAD.
SAM is not a major issue but air superiority jets are- and need air superiority jets to counter air superiority jets.
IAF need 150 air superiority jets against pak & 200 air superiority jets against in 1st day, no country consider using nuke on 1st day of war.
FYI- IAF selected bth eft[air superiority,f22] & rafale[strike,jsff35] in mmrca.
What IAF need is 300~400 lca mk1/mk2 and 42sqn only good against 2000 era PLAAF, not future PLAAF with 1000s plus air superiority jets.

USA has an offensive doctrine. It has ditched point defence fighters long time ago.

 

[johnj]

USA has an offensive doctrine. It has ditched point defence fighters long time ago.

Yes, becz they don't face enemies at their border, same goes to uk, french. But our case is different- IAF can except 100s paf jet in doorstep during first day - chines will use 500 ~ 800s[lacks element of surprise]. & mki busy with maintenance.
LCA = solution, not expensive eu jets.

 

[IndianHawk]

Yes, becz they don't face enemies at their border, same goes to uk, french. But our case is different- IAF can except 100s paf jet in doorstep during first day - chines will use 500 ~ 800s[lacks element of surprise]. & mki busy with maintenance.
LCA = solution, not expensive eu jets.

Hence SAMs come into equation. Pakis will be facing s400 shadow inside their own aur space and a formidable wall of akash , Barak, qrsam etc.
Chinese will face all these plus Himalayas terrain and disadvantage of lifting off from tibet .

 

[v952010]