Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[Dark Sorrow]

the same one Russians use on su57 is what people think.

i read about UTTAM , but dont know much . i dont think details of upgrade were ever published.

Russians has not offered N036 Byelka for MKI upgrade.

 

[Corvus Splendens]

I believe airframe reinforcement is part of the program ? We need Russkies to certify the aircraft after modifications are made. HAL "could" do it locally by themselves maybe.

 

[vishnugupt]

We can fit everything indigenous on Su-30MKI, we have the mission computer and code with us. The only problem is Russia will be very unhappy, that fact which we must ignore now.

Believe me this is not Russia who will be unhappy. It is our own Air force which is opposing it and will be unhappy.

Fact is, Russia has nothing to offer for Su-30mki they can only help to maintain Su-30mki fleets operational.

This is UN Air force which is insisting to keep Russian in loop as a guarantor for which Russian asking huge fees. On the other hand IAF is as usual reluctant to go with local solution.

Cry baby have habit of abandon their old jets once they got new shinny toys. Soon SU-30MKI will go on Mig-21 path.

Going Chinese way will take years and by the time it's available su-30mki itself become obsolete.

 

[mist_consecutive]

Believe me this is not Russia who will be unhappy. It is our own Air force which is opposing it and will be unhappy.

Fact is, Russia has nothing to offer for Su-30mki they can only help to maintain Su-30mki fleets operational.

This is UN Air force which is insisting to keep Russian in loop as a guarantor for which Russian asking huge fees. On the other hand IAF is as usual reluctant to go with local solution.

I don’t know where you get these from, who told you

 

[vishnugupt]

I don’t know where you get these from, who told you

Then I will say you are not well informed. India and China have almost same type agreement with Russia for SU-27. Difference is we has been sitting on ToT for 22 years while Chinese has been doing incremental change.

Su-30mki supposed to get Indian EW suit for which even DARE was working and succeeded somewhat.

DRDO done aerodynamic study of configuration but problem is that Russia will not take any guarantee for shortcoming in performance if India do inhouse airframe change. Hence IAF dropped the plan

 

[johnj]

If I recall, back in the day when we did not have UTTAM AESA Radar Ready, The Russians were offering us their Zhuk AESA radar for SU-30 MKI.

IAF rejected Zhuk AESA, and no interest in Zhuk AESA equipped mig 35 and said, it is inferior compared to other ones.

 

[STORE]

 

[mist_consecutive]

 

[vishnugupt]

@mist_consecutive @vishnugupt
Where are experts
Ok let me tell as this has been discussed earlier
I want to say this thing is as old as may infact as old as 2017
Iaf has given up Russian upgrades since 2017 and chose Indian derivative since then upgrade has started and will happen in phased manner
Super sukhoi is being done Indian way but speed was raised since 2019
Project navchakshu is going on to improve its ew capabilities and mind it dcmaws will be integrated not sure pod based or embedded in body but surely it will and rest incremental upgrades will be done in phased manner
Even I was tensed till last year then expert here clarified so no probs I don't know where are they
So folks be calm Super sukhoi is going on especially indigenously and in phased manner
@vishnugupt ji I really respect your views and opinions but this was not right so I wrote it
If u have doubts u can check alpha defense videos or twitter handle

I want to put emphasis on technical and legal issues when it's come to upgrade product built under Screwdrivergiri (so called 100% ToT).

Things become even more complicated when DRDO is upgrading SU-30MKI but IAF want Guarantee from Russia that upgrade should not affect aircraft performance which Russia is not giving.

It's like, if you involve third party and your product's warranty cease to exist.

 

[vishnugupt]

Just wanna ask FDIans.

This what you defend day and night. This guy have only 2 jobs

Kill aerospace industry by import.
Oppose theaterisation.

Imported Airforce has became another Air India. Government need to dismantle imported airforce by law and attached it with Army.

 

[vishnugupt]

I understand sir
But the point is that we are proceeding with it and obviously it is happening with consent of iaf
So it's happening we are also indigenizing the spares also
I know about certification but don't what's happening there let's see
But upgrades are happening and u will see in short frame of time

Ofcourse there will some upgrade but I doubt how efficient it will be unless we pay to Russia.

Front looking RWR/MWS/FoF installation will hamper aerodynamic and we can't change design.

I'm not saying we can't do it. All I am saying given the reluctance of IAF it wouldn't be easy.

 

[mokoman]

anyone know how does china approach this ?

do they have a separate air defence command ?

 

[mist_consecutive]

Just wanna ask FDIans.

This what you defend day and night. This guy have only 2 jobs

Kill aerospace industry by import.
Oppose theaterisation.

Imported Airforce has became another Air India. Government need to dismantle imported airforce by law and attached it with Army.

Read and think for a moment before jumping the gun.

ACM Chaudhari is talking realistically here. Unlike Navy/Army where the assets are more or less fixed to a local theatre due to their mobility constraints, the Air Force elements can be relocated East to West, South to North within hours.

The ops of each theater will be overlapped by multiple other theaters, hence the air-defense / air-offense should be one single India-level theatre.

You can put a counter-argument instead of name-calling the ACM.

 

[mist_consecutive]

anyone know how does china approach this ?

do they have a separate air defence command ?

I am interested to know too.

From what I can gather, they do have air brigades containing flight groups of several kinds of aircraft, but they work on a central level controlled by PLAAF HQ only, instead of the local theatre level as their combined arms brigades.

 

[Blademaster]

Read and think for a moment before jumping the gun.

ACM Chaudhari is talking realistically here. Unlike Navy/Army where the assets are more or less fixed to a local theatre due to their mobility constraints, the Air Force elements can be relocated East to West, South to North within hours.

The ops of each theater will be overlapped by multiple other theaters, hence the air-defense / air-offense should be one single India-level theatre.

You can put a counter-argument instead of name-calling the ACM.

US military has figured that part out already. They have theaterization in place and now they have joint synergy across all platforms and units. ACM is way off the mark here. There is an actual example of it working out. All he has to do is look at US, UK, and France.

 

[mokoman]

I am interested to know too.

From what I can gather, they do have air brigades containing flight groups of several kinds of aircraft, but they work on a central level controlled by PLAAF HQ only, instead of the local theatre level as their combined arms brigades.

looks like they moved army air defence into under air force chain of command , all comming under single western theatre command .

what ever the fuck that means.

PLA sets up army, air force joint defence system in western theatre command

The new joint system is part of the western theatre command’s focus on war preparation and exploration of the establishment of a joint air defence system

www.hindustantimes.com

US military has figured that part out already. They have theaterization in place and now they have joint synergy across all platforms and units. ACM is way off the mark here. There is an actual example of it working out. All he has to do is look at US, UK, and France.

US and china have shit load of jets and helicopters to share among theatres . we dont have that many , besides india-china+pakistan border is like ~7000 km long.

dont think there is another country with our peculiar problem.

 

[Blademaster]

US and china have shit load of jets and helicopters to share among theatres . we dont have that many , besides india-china+pakistan border is like ~7000 km long.

dont think there is another country with our peculiar problem.

That is why I said look at UK and France too. They don't have shitloads of jets and helicopters and yet they have theaterization.

 

[mist_consecutive]

That is why I said look at UK and France too. They don't have shitloads of jets and helicopters and yet they have theaterization.

I am not familiar to ORBAT of USA, UK and France, maybe you can tell us how they are managing, or point us towards relevant material that explains the same ?

 

[vishnugupt]

Read and think for a moment before jumping the gun.

ACM Chaudhari is talking realistically here. Unlike Navy/Army where the assets are more or less fixed to a local theatre due to their mobility constraints, the Air Force elements can be relocated East to West, South to North within hours.

The ops of each theater will be overlapped by multiple other theaters, hence the air-defense / air-offense should be one single India-level theatre.

You can put a counter-argument instead of name-calling the ACM.

Should I remind you 27feb 2019 when Imported Airforce demonstrate both air defense and air defense operation?

Can't imagine a better cooperation than it took place on that day.

Only these kickback general possess wisdom (quiet visible) rest Kargil committee, former CDS, MOD everyone is just stupid and sold people.

Btw.. Air defence command is future it's not only deal with aircraft or missile threats but even futuristic threats. Moreover it will rationalised air defense assets.

 

[mist_consecutive]

Should I remind you 27feb 2019 when Imported Airforce demonstrate both air defense and air defense operation?

Can't imagine a better cooperation than it took place on that day.

Only these kickback general possess wisdom (quiet visible) rest Kargil committee, former CDS, MOD everyone is just stupid and sold people.

Really dude, do you really have anything to contribute other than "armed forces bad" ?

I want to have a fruitful discussion here about how theaterisation may or may not hamper our air force capabilities. Our ACM says it will, and @Blademaster here says it won't since USAF and other NATO AFs are already doing it (I doubt if they are doing it the hard way).

If you just want to do RR and cuss the evil world, do it somewhere else, if you want I can even open a dedicated thread just for you to unravel the corruption and hopelessness of our armed forces.