Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

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Of course peace time training is one thing, situation in real conflict is another. Last war fin-rus, FiAF had a confirmed kill ratio 27:1. Even then the Russkies had better planes, for example Finnish Brewsters and Me-109's dropped Russian P-51´s and Hurricanes. Also their own planes were not bad at all.

Regarding that NATO exercise, only info leaked out, was that our Air Force commander mentioned that kill ratio in a speech at some memorial day. Other than that unfortunately no info is available.

I am sure India has great air force and skillful pilots.

Regarding germans, check the list of all time fighter aces, that list is quite icy reading...
History textbook do not aid in winning current war or bettering current scenario. As of today Germany has reduced it's Euro fighter flying time by half, that is what matters and having long list of Aces wouldn't help in that.
 

jouni

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History textbook do not aid in winning current war or bettering current scenario. As of today Germany has reduced it's Euro fighter flying time by half, that is what matters and having long list of Aces wouldn't help in that.
Yeah, these current Germans are like a tamed version of those from the past....
 

Dhairya Yadav

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Finnish Hornets had kill ratio of 16:1 in exercieses with NATO countries who were with their best equipment. Makes one wonder, what that kill ratio could be against Indian air force...LOL
I recommend you to search for TACDE of IAF , the only other fighter training facility comparable to Top Gun of USN.
 

jouni

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I recommend you to search for TACDE of IAF , the only other fighter training facility comparable to Top Gun of USN.
Looks interesting, If there is a Bollywood movie made, I would love to see it if there is not too much music and dance scenes. It looks like Finnish and Indian air forces has lot in common. Previously we also had planes from east and west. Now only Hornets. Damn, it stuck to my mind Indian version of Top Gun movie..
 

Dhairya Yadav

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Looks interesting, If there is a Bollywood movie made, I would love to see it if there is not too much music and dance scenes. It looks like Finnish and Indian air forces has lot in common. Previously we also had planes from east and west. Now only Hornets. Damn, it stuck to my mind Indian version of Top Gun movie..
No there is no movie. However , it would be awesome if they make one.
There is a game by IAF - Guardian of the Skies. Its available on google play and windows store (if you have Nokia Lumia :p).

PS-Even I sometimes get irritated by dancing and songs in Bollywood movies. :p
 

jouni

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Ask USA pilots who participated in Cope India 2004 exercise.
The results of the 2004 exercise in which the IAF won 90% of the mock combat with 9:1 kill ratio, have gone largely unexplained and been misunderstood, according to those based with the 3rd Wing who participated. Two major factors stand out: None of the six 3rd Wing F-15Cs was equipped with the newest long-range, active electronically scanned array (AESA) radars. At India's request, the U.S. agreed to mock combat at 3-to-1 odds and without the use of simulated long-range, radar-guided AIM-120 Amraams that even the odds with beyond-visual-range kills.

These same U.S. participants say the Indian pilots showed innovation and flexibility in their tactics. They also admit that they came into the exercise underrating the training and tactics of the pilots they faced. Instead of typical Cold War-style, ground-controlled interceptions, the Indians varied aircraft mixes, altitudes and formations. Indian air force planners never reinforced failure or repeated tactics that the U.S. easily repelled. Moreover, the IAF's airborne commanders changed tactics as opportunities arose. Nor did U.S. pilots believe they faced only India's top guns. Instead, they said that at least in some units they faced a mix of experienced and relatively new Indian fighter and strike pilots.

Congrats! Of course 9:1 is not 16:1, so FiAF would win 2:1 ;). Good that you brought those yanks down from their high horse!

http://in.rbth.com/blogs/2014/02/16...af_rewrote_the_rules_of_air_combat_33111.html

Interesting. I hope old FiAF Mig-21bis are somewhere mothballed in caves, instead of scrapped.
 
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The results of the 2004 exercise in which the IAF won 90% of the mock combat with 9:1 kill ratio, have gone largely unexplained and been misunderstood, according to those based with the 3rd Wing who participated. Two major factors stand out: None of the six 3rd Wing F-15Cs was equipped with the newest long-range, active electronically scanned array (AESA) radars. At India's request, the U.S. agreed to mock combat at 3-to-1 odds and without the use of simulated long-range, radar-guided AIM-120 Amraams that even the odds with beyond-visual-range kills.

These same U.S. participants say the Indian pilots showed innovation and flexibility in their tactics. They also admit that they came into the exercise underrating the training and tactics of the pilots they faced. Instead of typical Cold War-style, ground-controlled interceptions, the Indians varied aircraft mixes, altitudes and formations. Indian air force planners never reinforced failure or repeated tactics that the U.S. easily repelled. Moreover, the IAF's airborne commanders changed tactics as opportunities arose. Nor did U.S. pilots believe they faced only India's top guns. Instead, they said that at least in some units they faced a mix of experienced and relatively new Indian fighter and strike pilots.

Congrats! Of course 9:1 is not 16:1, so FiAF would win 2:1 ;). Good that you brought those yanks down from their high horse!
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LOL! exercise has many modes of operation, who knows what situation was being simulated. Till I don't know that, I wouldn't comment on that.

Yeah, everybody says about superior tactics. But ground situation is very different. Recently German fan boys were in for a rude shock.
=====================

Answer honestly, how old are you?
 

jouni

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I'm 44, went to military 1991 and watched from CNN how superior USAF bombed the hll out of Iraq. Thought that they are good.
 

power_monger

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Yeah, these current Germans are like a tamed version of those from the past....
Tamed? German Army was my childhood fixation when reading about WW1 and WW2. Now they have become puppets of uncle SAM with no desire to prove their existence militarily.
 

jouni

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Tamed? German Army was my childhood fixation when reading about WW1 and WW2. Now they have become puppets of uncle SAM with no desire to prove their existence militarily.
Maybe they learned from the past and now just focus gaining wealth and prosperity with peaceful means. One could argue that Merkel has achieved all that Hitler wanted to achieve without firing a single shot. Germany is the powerhouse of Europe, Russia and UK are weaker than Germany. They rule the continent of Europe with their economic power, they dont need military power.
 

power_monger

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Maybe they learned from the past and now just focus gaining wealth and prosperity with peaceful means. One could argue that Merkel has achieved all that Hitler wanted to achieve without firing a single shot. Germany is the powerhouse of Europe, Russia and UK are weaker than Germany. They rule the continent of Europe with their economic power, they dont need military power.
it is said that India had 1/4th the wealth of world in 16th century.What happened afterwards? economic prosperity without strong military support is suicide.It will just invite Strong military powers to loot.Safeguarding the money earned is much more important than money earned itself.
 

Dhairya Yadav

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it is said that India had 1/4th the wealth of world in 16th century.What happened afterwards? economic prosperity without strong military support is suicide.It will just invite Strong military powers to loot.Safeguarding the money earned is much more important than money earned itself.
thats the difference. Its 21st century my friend. Times have changed. There are no empires or kings that would attack another country just for money. Now they look at strategic targets- oil, terrorism, rogue nations. There is no need of excessively strong military if you dont have an adversary. Germany knows this, thus they keep a minimum deterence level. A country like India, even though in excessive poverty, needs a strong military because we are surrounded by enemies.
An example of this case can be of Costa Rica. They stopped unnecessary military spendings and rerouted the money to healthcare, poverty declination projects etc. And anyone can say they are doing pretty good now.
 

jouni

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thats the difference. Its 21st century my friend. Times have changed. There are no empires or kings that would attack another country just for money. Now they look at strategic targets- oil, terrorism, rogue nations. There is no need of excessively strong military if you dont have an adversary. Germany knows this, thus they keep a minimum deterence level. A country like India, even though in excessive poverty, needs a strong military because we are surrounded by enemies.
An example of this case can be of Costa Rica. They stopped unnecessary military spendings and rerouted the money to healthcare, poverty declination projects etc. And anyone can say they are doing pretty good now.
wow, rarely I have seen this kind of mail in this forum, @pmaitra, @happy & co, Dhairya could teach you a thing or two about "need for protective zone around Russia" and how that policy shows that Russia lags 100 years behind western Europe regarding security policies and strategic thinking. What else can you expect with people like Dugin formulating those strategies.
 
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Rushil51

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Source:- IAF Expects AN-32, MiG-29 Upgrade Bids This Month

The Indian Air Force is expecting to receive tenders from private companies to upgrade the aging fleet of Russia AN-32 transport aircraft and MiG-29 fighter aircraft this month.
The IAF last year had invited bids from private parties for upgradation of AN-32 transport and MiG-29 fighter aircraft but only a single tender was received for the AN-32s.
"We needed to change certain aspects related to the conditions and invited fresh bids again, which are expected to be received by end of this month," said Air Marshal P Kanakraj, Air Officer Commanding-in-Chief of IAF's maintenance command based at Nagpur. He was addressing a press conference on the occasion of Air Force day.
 

sgarg

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wow, rarely I have seen this kind of mail in this forum, @pmaitra, @happy & co, Dhairya could teach you a thing or two about "need for protective zone around Russia" and how that policy shows that Russia lags 100 years behind western Europe regarding security policies and strategic thinking. What else can you expect with people like Dugin formulating those strategies.
No, fundamentals never change. You are still eating the same bread you were eating in 16th century.

Germany is getting bogged down by other European countries. Lack of independence will cause a lot of trouble to Germany.

The existence of NATO is a serious risk to peace as all these countries have ganged up to scare Russia. China is also feeling the heat.

Russia will do what works for it. I doubt it will repeat what it did 100 years before. Your views are fundamentally wrong and misleading to young readers on this forum.

Russia is not looking for protective zones nut neutral zones. Only West looks for protective zones. Russia want Ukraine to be neutral, which I believe is very logical and two nuclear armed blocs with hair triggers should sit at a distance.
 
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sgarg

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Source:- IAF Expects AN-32, MiG-29 Upgrade Bids This Month

The Indian Air Force is expecting to receive tenders from private companies to upgrade the aging fleet of Russia AN-32 transport aircraft and MiG-29 fighter aircraft this month.
The IAF last year had invited bids from private parties for upgradation of AN-32 transport and MiG-29 fighter aircraft but only a single tender was received for the AN-32s.
"We needed to change certain aspects related to the conditions and invited fresh bids again, which are expected to be received by end of this month," said Air Marshal P Kanakraj, Air Officer Commanding-in-Chief of IAF's maintenance command based at Nagpur. He was addressing a press conference on the occasion of Air Force day.
This development is quite unexpected though very interesting. These are bold steps.
 

jouni

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No, fundamentals never change. You are still eating the same bread you were eating in 16th century.

Germany is getting bogged down by other European countries. Lack of independence will cause a lot of trouble to Germany.

The existence of NATO is a serious risk to peace as all these countries have ganged up to scare Russia. China is also feeling the heat.

Russia will do what works for it. I doubt it will repeat what it did 100 years before. Your views are fundamentally wrong and misleading to young readers on this forum.

Russia is not looking for protective zones nut neutral zones. Only West looks for protective zones. Russia want Ukraine to be neutral, which I believe is very logical and two nuclear armed blocs with hair triggers should sit at a distance.


Germany is perhaps the most active in favor for a strong EU and EURO. They have learned form two wars and know what is the way of the future. If any I try to point out to young readers, that you do not have to believe is somebody builds threat scenarios that somebody is trying to hurt your country. They are mostly for the benefit of the rulers and purely interior politics tool. Here is the Helsinki charter, that SU signed and Russia violated when invading Ukraine.

Sovereign equality, respect for the rights inherent in sovereignty
Refraining from the threat or use of force
Inviolability of frontiers
Territorial integrity of States
Peaceful settlement of disputes
Non-intervention in internal affairs
Respect for human rights and fundamental freedoms, including the freedom of thought, conscience, religion or belief
Equal rights and self-determination of peoples
Co-operation among States
Fulfillment in good faith of obligations under international law
 

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