Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

Enquirer

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Define “immediately” Russians haven’t ever stuck to timelines with India.
None of the Indian ship builders are sticking to any kind of timelines anyways....
Two of the Russian Frigates are almost built!

FYI it wasn’t Russian or Ukrainian money but INDIAN, Russians used the money India paid for original Talwars to upgrade Yanter shipyard then charged India $100m EXTRA and delivered the ships late.
That's all water under the bridge.
The issue is how quickly can IN spruce up its fleet strength in a cost effective manner.
The fact that Russia/Ukraine are hurting due to non-completion of the Frigates (due to sanctions), helped India drive a good bargain.

And from 2022 the IN will start receiving 1 fully loaderd P-17A/year which is FAR more advanced than these Russian frigates. If the IN wanted more ships of this class it should’ve just ordered more 17As.
Ordering is not the issue, taking deliveries is.
Also, P-17As are much more expensive that the Frigates being ordered!
 

abingdonboy

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None of the Indian ship builders are sticking to any kind of timelines anyways....
Two of the Russian Frigates are almost built!
We will see, Russians do a good job of turning relatively simple efforts FUBAR and fleecing India in the meantime.

As for timelines, P-15B has been screwed why? Because of RUSSIAN supply delays (of engine shafts) causing 2+ year delay.

P-17A seems to be on schedule for both MDL and GRSE today. The two Russian built ships will probably land in India around 2021, the Indian built ones, 2025? By then 3 P-17A will be with the IN


Ordering is not the issue, taking deliveries is.
Also, P-17As are much more expensive that the Frigates being ordered!
1) price will fall if more are ordered
2) price comes with additional capabilities and performance so a justified cost


Would’ve been much better all round to have simply order 4/5 more P-17A, why not give GSL the contract and have 3 simultaneous lines for P-17A? IN could easily absorb 15+ of these beasts by 2030.
 

vampyrbladez

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For the price they just aren’t worth it especially when IN has FAR more capable frigates on order (P17A).

It’s totally unnecessary to be procuring foreign frigates at this point.
Its for bolstering our numbers rapidly. Our domestic shipyards aren't big enough to handle volume on the scale of USA and China. HSL can produce frigates after this deal which is timely given NGC, NGMV and P 17A successor will come online after that. Private industry too can benefit with block based construction.

Having said that P 17A is muchos better than Talwar Class. This is also to placate Ruskies who have been feeling neglected after multiple defence deals with USA and whom we still need for critical technologies for space, nuclear and industrial military applications.
 

Jackd

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India signs $5.4-billion deal to buy 5 S-400 missile systems from Russia
BusinessToday.In | New Delhi, Friday, October 5, 2018 | 13:34 IST
Though the US has warned the pact between India and Russia could attract sanctions under the US law, the BJP-led government still decided to go ahead with the $5-billion deal.



India signed the much-anticipated deal worth $5.43-billion to buy five Russian S-400 Triumf missile shield systems at the 19th India-Russia annual bilateral summit at the Hyderabad House here on Friday. During a meeting between Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Russian President Vladimir Putin, the leaders discussed regional as well as global issues, one among which was S-400 surface-to-air missiles. Though the United States has warned any such agreement between India and Russia could attract sanctions under the US law, the BJP-led government has still decided to go ahead with the deal.

Neighbouring China had also bought many combat missiles, including S-400 Triuf, from Russia this year. Apart from the S-400 missile deal, India and Russia also signed an agreement on space cooperation. According to news agency ANI, an Indian monitoring station will be built near the Russian city of Novosibirsk in Siberia.

The Triumf missile deal with Russia will give India's military a much-needed boost, which would act as a deterrent against China's growing presence in the region and a superior edge over Pakistan. The S-400 Triumf missiles are extremely efficient to track and hunt down combat aircraft, even stealth planes, at unprecedented ranges.

As per Reuters, the United States has warned countries trading with Russia's defence and intelligence sectors they would face automatic sanctions under a sweeping legislation called Countering America's Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA) that President Donald Trump signed into law last August. The law is designed to punish Putin for the 2014 annexation of Crimea from Ukraine, "involvement" in the Syrian civil war and alleged "meddling" in the 2016 US presidential election.

But Defence Minister Nirmala Sitharaman had earlier said: "Negotiation on S-400 air defence systems has been on for a long while and it is at a stage where it can be finalised," she said, adding that "We (Russia and India) have a big legacy of buying defence equipment from Russia."

Though Russia was the major supplier (around 80 per cent) of arms and ammunition to India during the Cold War, greater ties with the US shifted the focus towards the West. Now India has imported around $15 billion of arms from the US in the past 10 years. However, the improving ties between India and Russia could hit its relation with the US, say experts.

Meanwhile, tweeting the pictures of the two leaders, Raveesh Kumar, Ministry of External Affairs spokesperson, said: "A relationship radiating warmth and affection! PM @narendramodi welcomed @KremlinRussia_E Vladimir Putin for the 19th India-Russia Annual Bilateral Summit continuing the series of fruitful engagements this year!". Earlier on Thursday, PM Modi welcomed Putin, tweeting: "I look forward to our negotiations, which will undoubtedly strengthen the friendship between India and Russia."

Putin was accompanied by a high-level delegation, including Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov, Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov and Trade and Industry Minister Denis Manturov. He will leave for Russia later during the day.
 

WolfPack86

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Wow it's fantistic news i am really happy that India and Russia sign the deal.
 

Arihant Roy

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I am jumping like anything. I am ecstatic. Finally the deal has been signed . Rs 40k crore for five squadrons.

The 2.2 billion deal for 4 Talwar class, 200 Ka-226T deal and the paxt for license production of AK-103 at an OFB plant will most likely be signed at the upcoming Indo Russian commission for military tech coop.
 

tharun

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How to get that data?
Almost 57 years back, IAF Tribunal convicted an IAF Group Captain S (I won't reveal full name for privacy of his family) of spying for Pakistan.
He gave flight plans to Pak & thus helped them shot down an IAF recce Canberra in 1959.
Later in 1962 a higher court upheld this decision and he was forced to retire dishonourably.
MoD decided not jail him in order to avoid embarrasment.
Sent from my Redmi 4 using Tapatalk
 

arya

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Now we should go for attacking drones from USA . as MMRCA will not happen in current term of Govt.
 

rone

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It's intended for China not porki.. u only need slingshot to shoot down Pakistan jets,
 

Jackd

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I am pissed off about non-signing of
Ka-226T deal. We need those old contraptions, cheetahs and chetaks, to be grounded as fast as possible.
 

cannonfodder

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LCA Update on LCA by Indranil (from BR):

Modji please open LCA Main Thread :smile:.

On Mk1, I came to know of something yesterday which made my lungi flutter quite a lot. I wanted to share it with you, but I was told to hold back a little longer till the TPs can explore that part a bit more. Will let you know as soon as I know. Will make all of you very happy. And then IDRW can go write an exclusive about it
.

The ferry range of Mk1 without refueling was over 2000 kms with three tanks. With two tanks, they used to fly nonstop from Bangalore to Jodhpur with 500 kgs of fuel left in the tank. I will leave it to you to imagine the range when it is refueled.

FOC is very close now. They are going for the last set of flight test for validating the latest CLAW, avionics and weapon profile. They can finish this in about a month and feel comfortable of clearing the tests. Of no NEW demands come, FOC seems likely by year-end or therabouts.

SP-11 is getting close to get to the air SP-12 and 13 in equipping phase. They should be able to deliver Sp-16 by March of next year.
 

Narasimh

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S-400 interesting discussion. Throws some light on integration challenges that IAF must overcome with old and new systems in net centric env:

 

Jackd

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Then we need to fast track our LUH .
Why the fuck we always need the Russian junk.
They always come with strings.

Sent from my Redmi 4 using Tapatalk
HAL will make about 70% of these 'junk' helicopters. I don't see a problem with that since it is a JV like Brahmos.
 
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Enquirer

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Can't see LUH anywhere. Is it in production? Or maybe accepted by the services?
I think it's getting IOC shortly.
Army's need is for 387 light helos; they wanted 200 K-226s & the rest as LUHs.
Even though, I feel all 387 could be LUHs!
K-226 deal was in consideration only to please Putin (when Russia was getting annoyed with US-India relations). Modi does this to please the international big wigs - throw them some red meat (big orders) and then get them to endorse India's views. Part of Rafale deal was to get France to endorse Indian view point at international level!
 

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