India-China 2020 Border conflict

[Dessert Storm]

Do they even have such production capability plus 2500 means 5.5 - 6 bn around.

May be over the period we will acquire around 1000 of those.. but we need platforms first to carry them.

Yeah I myself calculated it @€2.5 mil a pop makes it €6.25 bill. But then let's wait for clarification. Amiet R. Kashyep is not known to report incorrect info.

 

[omaebakabaka]

As the famous US Army general said, its all in the logistics.

 

[Suhaldev]

India-China faceoff: Worst-case scenario becoming 'new normal' in eastern Ladakh?

Beyond just the winter that has arrived at the high-altitude standoff zones in eastern Ladakh, there is a growing view that the current border situation between India and China is solidifying into a new normal.

www.indiatoday.in

 

[omaebakabaka]

All these yrs we minded our own business . Now that china has started we have unique oppertunity to do in tibet wht pakistan has been doing in kashmir all along .I am surprised some chinese analysts says india provoked china by removing art 370 unilaterally .

Well i wld say its nothing compared to provocation of china whn they invaded tibet in 1949 and indo tibetian border became indo china border.

What did india do back then ? We accepted tibet to be integral part of china.. we asked for china's permanent membership in UN whn it was isolated by west. We dint recognize taiwan as a independent nation ... We sent our paramedics in korean war .. We were high enough on values and ideolgies to ignore the suffering of tibetians who lived along us peacefully fr thousands of yrs..

None of that except its congi ki naamardaani

 

[bajiraopeshwa]

India-China faceoff: Worst-case scenario becoming 'new normal' in eastern Ladakh?

Beyond just the winter that has arrived at the high-altitude standoff zones in eastern Ladakh, there is a growing view that the current border situation between India and China is solidifying into a new normal.

www.indiatoday.in

Here is a thought - Can India slap an import duty on all Chinese goods to cover the cost of deployment in Ladakh 3 times over ? That way the standoff (or new normal) cost is absorbed without requiring additional taxes or cess

 

[Flying Dagger]

Yeah I myself calculated it @€2.5 mil a pop makes it €6.25 bill. But then let's wait for clarification. Amiet R. Kashyep is not known to report incorrect info.

It's not money which is issue or the no. of missiles we have a huge airforce but MBDA has outright rejected it's mating with Tejas (Israeli Radar) or any Russian platform.

So it will not be our standard missile. But considering we paid same amount of money for MICA it is a better choice.

The only logic I see is either Tejas is getting it ( unlikely though )

Else we have plan to give mmrca to Rafale .

Or it was 250 -300 missiles around.

And since he wrote Carbine as Car bin I am guessing it's just a mistake.

 

[omaebakabaka]

Really curious as to what do they do for 15 hours. Shouldn't telling the other side what you want, receiving a response, haggling (including comms back to command), be wrapped up in 2-3 hours tops?

Our Parliament debates bills over hyper-critical issues faster than a pizza delivery, that too under opposition cacophony, and we're this patient with PLA on what is basically "do this, no, no yuo, kthxbai"?

Talks are lead by Military from my understanding even with MEA officials present, this is the first time its done like this. It takes time as they go post by post.

 

[omaebakabaka]

Here is a thought - Can India slap an import duty on all Chinese goods to cover the cost of deployment in Ladakh 3 times over ? That way the standoff (or new normal) cost is absorbed without requiring additional taxes or cess

Except for the imported equipment, most of the money goes right back into economy? Correct?

 

[tarunraju]

Here is a thought - Can India slap an import duty on all Chinese goods to cover the cost of deployment in Ladakh 3 times over ?

Import duty isn't paid by China, it's paid by Indians.

If you slap a 10% *insert whatever duty/cess/tax* on a 10,000-rupee Oppo cellphone, the Indian consumer pays 11,000 out of his pocket instead of 10,000, and the extra 1,000 is collected by Oppo to pass on to the Indian exchequer. China makes the same amount of money as it used to.

What we can do instead, is anti-dumping. Since the new Chinese law makes CCP participation mandatory in private Chinese companies, we can use that fact to withdraw market-economy status under WTO to Chinese firms, levying anti-dumping fees. These are heavier, and while Indian consumers end up paying these too, they're heavy enough to make Chinese products uncompetitive in the market.

But no matter what you do, the age of cheap products thanks to China is over.

I remember in 2005 my parents paid 30,000 for a 1.5 ton split AC in their bedroom. Today a similar 1.5-ton split AC is still 30,000 in the market despite vast currency depreciation/inflation. Why? Because our AC manufacturers import indoor-units, radiators, and compressors from China to keep their ACs priced at 30,000 for a 1.5-tonner. All these things will begin changing.

 

[omaebakabaka]

It's not money which is issue or the no. of missiles we have a huge airforce but MBDA has outright rejected it's mating with Tejas (Israeli Radar) or any Russian platform.

So it will not be our standard missile. But considering we paid same amount of money for MICA it is a better choice.

The only logic I see is either Tejas is getting it ( unlikely though )

Else we have plan to give mmrca to Rafale .

Or it was 250 -300 missiles around.

And since he wrote Carbine as Car bin I am guessing it's just a mistake.

2500 is a silly number and can't be explained in terms of number of carriers or contact anticipated sorties as of now. If it takes 2 missiles to down 1 then that brings to 1000 or close to, I guess it depends on pk value of this missile in active combat.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

It's not money which is issue or the no. of missiles we have a huge airforce but MBDA has outright rejected it's mating with Tejas (Israeli Radar) or any Russian platform.

So it will not be our standard missile. But considering we paid same amount of money for MICA it is a better choice.

The only logic I see is either Tejas is getting it ( unlikely though )

Else we have plan to give mmrca to Rafale .

Or it was 250 -300 missiles around.

And since he wrote Carbine as Car bin I am guessing it's just a mistake.

Tejas will ultimately get upgraded with our Indigenous UTTAM AESA Radars

 

[omaebakabaka]

Should do more Readjustments beyond our claimed LAC now and force PLA to suffer in winter if they won't budge else War is inevitable..
IA shouldn't give them time to acclimates PLA troops this winter and gain experience

It is more than just acclimatization, IA has been fighting continuously a much more motivated and psychotic enemy internal and external in similar terrain and CCP virgin boys even with acclimitization can't gain that mental roughening easily.

 

[Cactus09]

Here is a thought - Can India slap an import duty on all Chinese goods to cover the cost of deployment in Ladakh 3 times over ? That way the standoff (or new normal) cost is absorbed without requiring additional taxes or cess

No it will hurt us more than it hurts them. Indian companies will still be paying the same to Chinese while at the same time it will increase their tax burden. That will lead to increase in prices and hence fall in competitiveness of our own exports. The better way would be to displace Chinese in global supply chain which is where the quad comes in. I really hope we bargain for quantum jump in investments from these countries as part of " formalization of quad". That way we can actually hurt them economically. At the same time will increase the robustness of supply chain and of course more jobs and income for India.

 

[omaebakabaka]

Tibet has not much population & has decent living standards Tourism industry too.. Though I doubt about any reliable Chinese data.
Xinjiang is cutoff & it might be most poor. Though more than 40% population in Han Chinese I guess so they will be in much better shape than Uyghurs... Who mostly are in re education centres.

Native Tibetans are actually poor, not allowed to travel easily from out of Tibet and you can see that traveling in Tibet. All hotels and businesses are owned by Han invaders.

 

[Cactus09]

Import duty isn't paid by China, it's paid by Indians.

If you slap a 10% *insert whatever duty/cess/tax* on a 10,000-rupee Oppo cellphone, the Indian consumer pays 11,000 out of his pocket instead of 10,000, and the extra 1,000 is collected by Oppo to pass on to the Indian exchequer. China makes the same amount of money as it used to.

What we can do instead, is anti-dumping. Since the new Chinese law makes CCP participation mandatory in private Chinese companies, we can use that fact to withdraw market-economy status under WTO to Chinese firms, levying anti-dumping fees. These are heavier, and while Indian consumers end up paying these too, they're heavy enough to make Chinese products uncompetitive in the market.

But no matter what you do, the age of cheap products thanks to China is over.

I remember in 2005 my parents paid 30,000 for a 1.5 ton split AC in their bedroom. Today a similar 1.5-ton split AC is still 30,000 in the market despite vast currency depreciation/inflation. Why? Because our AC manufacturers import indoor-units, radiators, and compressors from China to keep their ACs priced at 30,000 for a 1.5-tonner. All these things will begin changing.

A bit of correction. We have refused to provide market economy status to China already amid their strong protest.

India rejects market economy tag for China

Govt will be able to impose steep anti-dumping duties on Chinese imports.India must fulfil its obligation to WTO and recognize China as market economy, Chinese firms say

www.livemint.com

 

[Bhadra]

Any news about the deployment of a fourth division in Ladakh..After yesterday's talks will IA/GOI move ahead with the deployment of another division ?

I think they have decided on the deployment of Two divisions in Ladakh as an operational imperative. There is no escape from it.

The indication came from the participation of two Maj Gens as Goc of 3 Inf Div and 39 Mountain Division in the talks. Otherwise, why involve GOC 39 Mountain Division.
Besides those, there are bound to be two more divisions in the Area as also 17 MCC as per earlier Media reports.

 

[tarunraju]

A bit of correction. We have refused to provide market economy status to China already amid their strong protest.

India rejects market economy tag for China

Govt will be able to impose steep anti-dumping duties on Chinese imports.India must fulfil its obligation to WTO and recognize China as market economy, Chinese firms say

www.livemint.com

Yes, but we are yet to levy anti-dumping. If levied, all those 15,000-rupee Xiaomi smartphones offering features rivaling 30,000-rupee Samsung phones will be priced at 30,000 (with the Indian exchequer collecting the difference as anti-dumping penalty). Once there is price-parity between Xiaomi and Samsung, the consumer will be motivated to pick Samsung.

 

[Lancer]

Scathing comments from Hellfire:

 

[bajiraopeshwa]

No it will hurt us more than it hurts them. Indian companies will still be paying the same to Chinese while at the same time it will increase their tax burden. That will lead to increase in prices and hence fall in competitiveness of our own exports. The better way would be to displace Chinese in global supply chain which is where the quad comes in. I really hope we bargain for quantum jump in investments from these countries as part of " formalization of quad". That way we can actually hurt them economically. At the same time will increase the robustness of supply chain and of course more jobs and income for India.

What about duties when we are not exporting the Chinese import but we are the last destination (like mobile phones etc)

As prices go up due to duties, demand will go down for the Indian companies and in turn the demand for the Chinese products will go down. The Indian companies can then negotiate with the Chinese to lower their prices to increase demand to the former level (or live with lower demand). The Chinese will be hurt by either lower demand or falling prices.

 

[Lancer]

So basically, while we made some good moves on the heights by Pangong Tso; the Chinese have still successfully changed facts on ground at a few other places (though I imagine we're well positioned to take on a Chinese offensive if it comes). Meaning, on the net, ground has still been lost.

Now we either remove them, or live with it.