India-China 2020 Border conflict

[MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00]

Well what happened at today's meeting, any news about that

I didn’t keep up with today’s meeting so don’t know brother

 

[ezsasa]

Indian establishment isn’t exactly innocent and should be criticised for the way they handled the Chinese propaganda blitz. When the Chinese released there propaganda barrage Indian establishment should have immediately struck back breaking the Chinese propaganda then and there and humiliating them in front of the whole world but they didn’t.

Let's look at this expectation realistically.

There is an inherent fundamental differences in how Indian and chinese societies are structured. India is a society where freedom of speech is paramount subject to reasonable restrictions, China has no freedom of speech and CCP controls every bit of information that their citizens consume while going to the extent of scrubbing unfavourable data from their internet.

in this scenario, Indian propaganda even if exists will not reach their intended targets i.e chinese citizens. which puts CCP at an advantage. "humiliating them infront of the whole world" does not arise because chinese citizens will never receive that information.

as far india's internal communication is concerned, they have already provided what they can share.

if these expectations are being influenced by american style senate hearings, they have that luxury because they live on a giant island with no threat to their territorial sovereignty, which is not the case for us.

 

[another_armchair]

There is a simple thing which need to understand by IA. China won't fight real war. They are expert in info warfare and we are losing this war as our establishment is not taking it so seriously. You can counter a pic with a pic, a video with video, an article with article. But if we want to win this info warfare then we need to be more active and offensive. Right now we are beating the drums of "peace" at LAC and giving more chance to PLA for preparation for everything.

Assumption is the mother of all fuckups.

Just saying. Never assume your enemy will not fire a bullet because he is the only child. He might drop a nuclear bomb for that exact reason.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

IMO, this time its not just GoI dropping the ball, but Armed Forces as well, who haven't yet acknowledged this RMA. I've been pointing this out on the "Defence Cyber Agency of India" thread that Defence Cyber Agency should be converted to Defence Cyber and EW Agency. But Signals from Army will play spoilsport as usual, if they ever try to do that, I think.
https://defenceforumindia.com/threads/defence-cyber-agency-of-india.82970/#post-2046500

Cyber and statecraft intelligence also go hand in hand. Cyber Needs to be a cohesive unit, that can work as an integrated unit for RAW as and when needed. But theoretically, cyber command should be under NSA and prime ministers control, just like in the US. Which is why the US were able to plant sleeper bugs in literally every countries
( including their closest Allie’s) critical infrastructure. Rest assured India is in that list too lol.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

pretty sure chinese IT sector is much larger than indias .

sucks but that 45 figure is doubtful ,i think indians started throwing around that figure .

nobody except CCP knows how many died , probably never will.

Not sure about chinese IT sector being larger than India.
Regarding the 45 figure, it wasn’t just India, but the US, russia(chinas closest ally), and the UK who threw around that figure. India actually said more than 45 closer to 90. But hey…

 

[ezsasa]

If the doctrine that young, maybe its us being (as usual) reactive in forming policies in the wake of the Chinese PsyOps that are being unleashed on us.
If so, I seriously hope we aren't similarly waiting for Chinese to teach us other lessons as well, such as a lesson in synergy of EW and Cyber Warfare, because right now, it seems we are.

i am not holding my breath for this, more so because i prefer to make assessment based on merit not expectations.

 

[India Super Power]

What I know is that our cyber warfare capabilities are not public but assured it has better standards

 

[Jimih]

sucks but that 45 figure is doubtful ,i think indians started throwing around that figure .

nobody except CCP knows how many died , probably never will.

No, it was TASS, Russia's state owned news agency.

Anonymous CIA sources to US newspapers stated 35.

 

[ThE BrOkEn HeArT]

Assumption is the mother of all fuckups.

Just saying. Never assume your enemy will not fire a bullet because he is the only child. He might drop a nuclear bomb for that exact reason.

Agreed. That's why I said we need to get more offensive than beating drums of peace. We need to attack first and turn it into defensive narrative through info warfare.

 

[captscooby81]

@lixun Come here you stinking chipmunk read about how your Thugs were dealt in 1962 on this day exactly Our Gernails may be coward our political leaders may show cowardice but never underestimate our foot soldier he will make you bat shit eaters eat your own shit any day .

FIFTY- NINE yrs ago #OnThisDay 10 October 1962 over 500 Chinese troops attacked a platoon of 56 Indian soldiers at NEFA. #LestWeForgetIndia the gallant #IndianBrave Naik Chain Singh #MahaVirChakra (P) 9 Punjab Regt, who held on against the onslaught until his last breath.

Nk Singh was in a platoon position at Tsengjong in NEFA in October 1962. Approx 500 Chinese concentrated in the vicinity of this post and started shelling it with guns & mortars.

Although greatly outnumbered and with a limited ammunition, Nk Singh and his men inflicted heavy casualties on the enemy. The Chinese then launched a more determined assault on this post from all sides; but Nk Singh and his men held on and continued to inflict heavy casualties

When he had nearly run out of ammunition, Nk Singh was ordered to withdraw his section. Ordering his rifle group to withdraw, he took over the light machine gun to give covering fire to the rest of his section. He was hit by a burst of enemy machine gun fire.

Although seriously wounded, the #IndianBrave kept on manning the light machine gun to facilitate the withdrawal of his section. He was again hit by an enemy machine gun burst in the head and killed on the spot.

It was due to the exceptional courage and leadership of Nk Singh that his section could inflict heavy casualties on the attacking Chinese troops and withdraw. The #IndianBrave was warded the #MahaVirChakra posthumously.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

a conversation with someone who was former US army:
when galwan happened:
- why doesn’t India carpet bomb chinese positions?
-well you see…..even if India wanted to, it doesn’t have carpet bombers.
- why doesn’t India encroach into Chinese positions as tit for tat?
-……..(no answer)…..

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Cyber and statecraft intelligence also go hand in hand. Cyber Needs to be a cohesive unit, that can work as an integrated unit for RAW as and when needed. But theoretically, cyber command should be under NSA and prime ministers control, just like in the US. Which is why the US were able to plant sleeper bugs in literally every countries
( including their closest Allie’s) critical infrastructure. Rest assured India is in that list too lol.

Defence Cyber Agency is not meant to protect Indian Cyberspace. For that, GoI has its own setup. DCA is for protecting the Armed Forces' Cyberspace and for attacking enemy Armed Forces' Cyberspace. Attacks on enemy civilian cyberspace, if envisaged, should indeed come under R&AW, NSA and PMO.

 

[Jimih]

Middle Sector is active these days, maybe he is reporting factual this time. Who knows.

 

[MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00]

Distinctly remember trump commenting on the incident, remarking India showing incredible restraint.

India did show restraint but it didn’t help India in anyway. India needs to be proactive and counter enemy narratives thats how india will win in the long run.

 

[another_armchair]

Middle Sector is active these days, maybe he is reporting factual this time. Who knows.

Will these moves be considered aggressive or defensive?

Only the two sides know it.

 

[Jimih]

Will these moves be considered aggressive or defensive?

Only the two sides know it.

Was just going through detresfa's twitter page, he just posted a map of Arunachal Pradesh and showed where China is trying to push its population and it is very very close to the border with Arunachal.

China's new strategy is to settle its citizens very close to the Indian states where LAC runs through. There is a sinister agenda in process.

Reactive approach should be shunned by GoI, imho.

 

[shade]

India did show restraint but it didn’t help India in anyway. India needs to be proactive and counter enemy narratives thats how india will win in the long run.

All restraint drama is likely taken as cowardice by the Chongs, it doesn't strengthen our position.
I hate to quote Sun Tchu, but one of the sayings is "show yourself to be weak when you are strong, but show yourself to be strong when you are weak".

Here the behavior of GoI seems to be very servile and pleading.

The Chong appetite will grow larger and larger the more we "adjust" and appease them like this.

UNLESS

This is really some 4D Chess Mustard-Stroke where they are simply acting like cucks to buy time for certain border infra developments or equipment purchases for the troops *takes long drag of copium*

 

[Love Charger]

All restraint drama is likely taken as cowardice by the Chongs, it doesn't strengthen our position.
I hate to quote Sun Tchu, but one of the sayings is "show yourself to be weak when you are strong, but show yourself to be strong when you are weak".

Here the behavior of GoI seems to be very servile and pleading.

The Chong appetite will grow larger and larger the more we "adjust" and appease them like this.

UNLESS

This is really some 4D Chess Mustard-Stroke where they are simply acting like cucks to buy time for certain border infra developments or equipment purchases for the troops *takes long drag of copium*

What can the local army commander do ?
Unless adesh comes from delhi itself .
I read one report on shia influence in kashmir where shias said that hindus protect them against attacks from Sunnis.
Or how sunni police officer doubled down on shias and how crpf people sent repeated warnings to Delhi that absolute force should not be used against shias yet they were ignored

 

[JBH22]

What can the local army commander do ?
Unless adesh comes from delhi itself .

Order to do what. Central Govt has reduced the trouble to nuisance. The plan is to instill fear for non muslim to come to that region.

I read one report on shia influence in kashmir where shias said that hindus protect them against attacks from Sunnis.

Don't forget in that trap my friend. Shias are as scoundrels as the sunnis. They were at the forefront in the insurgency. Just check who was instigating during ashura procession, but as karma would have it. The Shias got their ass handed over to them by Pakistani.

Or how sunni police officer doubled down on shias and how crpf people sent repeated warnings to Delhi that absolute force should not be used against shias yet they were ignored

Anyone who picks up a weapon against the state is to be neutralised.

 

[LurkerBaba]

The psy war problem can't be solved easily or quickly till you have babus running the show. Compare the quality of RT, Aljazeera or BBC to Doordarshan. Twitter/SM narrative is even more difficult. Unfortunate, but thats the reality

Instead of getting emotional and having a meltdown (as always) members should try some meditation. Also, look for more quantitative evidence rather than getting high off pics on SM. Like this for example - Chinese have changed the head of the Western theatre command for the fourth time in one year ! But this gets far less eyeballs

China changes Western Theatre Commander again

This is the fourth time that the Chinese President, who is also the Chairman of the Central Military Commission (CMC), changed the top General since the India-China standoff in Ladakh last year.

www.indiatoday.in