HAL Prachand - Light Combat Helicopter (LCH)

[porky_kicker]

does anybody else feel the same way?

look at the position of the pod carefully.

View attachment 63731



View attachment 63732



shouldn't the pods be mounted at the bottom of the nose and downwards pointing like shown in below pic?






View attachment 63733


View attachment 63734

Seriously why is that even an issue ?

Pods position on top or below is irrelevant provided the FOV is as per the requirements.

 

[porky_kicker]

i agree with your point.

but there is a reason why american weapons are best in the world. because they pay close attention to such small details.

here is my take on why the pod should be mounted under the nose.

what you said makes sense for armed conflicts near borders or rural areas or plains (like thar desert, depsang plans, ladkh mountains etc.) where direct line of sight is easily achieved.

but the same pod cannot be used in urban regions where your line of sight might be blocked by some buildings or a small cliff etc..

also, having the pod mounted on the nose creates blind spot at certain angle/degree. this means your enemy knows that your copper have a blind spot..

what if utubekhiladi is flying LCH and then suddenly few tangos open up machine gun fire under my belly or from my blind spot angle? well- too bad, utubekhiladi can't look under his own belly or at certain angles (blindspot) and counterfire. i will be long dead and won't even have time to curse HAL for one last time.

having the pod under the nose enhances the capacity and eliminates the said blind spot. the pilot have the option to look under the belly as well look straight like you mentioned.

we have seen apache being successful in desert, as well as in Bagdad city. mounting the pod under the nose is not that difficult.



that's a valid point. i will definitely be dead if i have to aim -30° below. but if i need to, give me a fair fighting chance and provide the ability on my chopper to look below -30° below

why limit the design of our chopper to not look under the belly (-30° below)????

Helicopters are meant to detect and engage their targets at stand off ranges

The moment you fail to detect a target at standoff distance and the target ends up below your helicopter you are long dead , blow right out of the sky . There is no question of even a fighting chance.

There is a blind zone for onboard weapons below the horizon irrespective of whether your pod can see or not in that blind zone. So what's the use if your guns cannot depress or your missiles cannot be released ?

 

[porky_kicker]

Rare photo angle showing belly of LCH.
View attachment 63344
Credit: Praneeth Franklin

Note the white panel underneath the fuselage

Guess it is some kind of radar based ground proximity sensor and ground collision avoidance system.

 

[Dessert Storm]

Noooo, HCH has nothing to do with IMRH. Those rocket pods were probably for a Rudra like version of MRH. Similar thing was done with Mi 8 and Mi 17 in both Sri Lanka and Kargil.
Its stupid, but... who are we to question their infinite wisdom.

It ain't stupid if they are making things modular in the design phase itself.
If the users want it, then it's on, otherwise not.

 

[Bleh]

@Bleh

do you know where do they store ammo for the 20mm gun on LCH or in Rudra?

one of friend texted me yesterday and claimed that LCH doesn't have space to store required ammos for 20mm gun. that's why no one is ordering any LCH.

could this be true?

Your friend pulled that info out of his Akbar... like most people most often do.

And no, like him I too don't have the deatails of this sort. I guess somewhere behind the tandem cockpit.

What HAL wants to make is not exactly a “HCH”. It can be more appropriately described as a “medium-lift combat helicopter (MCH)” because it’s projected to be similar to Boeing’s Apache.

Yes, now that's proper & plausible.

 

[Dessert Storm]

HCH makes no sense, making Mi17 as a gunship costed us a Mi17 and 6 brave hearts in Kargil war

That was war. During war so many things are tried. They deserve all the credit for trying. Failure dosen't mean that we stop trying thereafter (you would definitely agree to that).
What HAL is trying now, is the smart thing to do. Doing it from the design phase itself. It makes the add-on(s) safer and less time consuming. They do interact a lot with the users and are definitely testing the new one with the mission objectives (real/perceived) in mind.
It's always nice for a product to have an options package. Also, do keep in mind that they would be eyeing exports too in future.

 

[Killbot]

Your friend pulled that info out of his Akbar... like most people most often do.

And no, like him I too don't have the deatails of this sort. I guess somewhere behind the tandem cockpit.


Yes, now that's proper & plausible.

HCH was just a name made up by our presstitutes when the HAL chairman said something like "we will develop a heavier class of attack helicopter like the apache."
Also, they're a generation too late to be doing that. Amreeka is already going with the future vertical lift program.

 

[Bleh]

Also, they're a generation too late to be doing that. Amreeka is already going with the future vertical lift program.

Tilt-rotor Osprey proved too cost inefficient to be used. I doubt india will go for speed over stealth, as the latter is more advantageous in modern convention warfare.

As @AZTEC's post suggest, it'll be a beefed up medium helo with more payload & powerful engines.

 

[FalconSlayers]

That is the IMRH with rocket pods. Nothing to do with HCH. Like I said, HCH is still in conceptual design stage.

How can you say that?

 

[ezsasa]

How can you say that?

Because HCH will not need space for passengers in the rear.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Because HCH will not need space for passengers in the rear.

Bruh I am asking how can you say that an HCH is even in the making? I feel it will be a Rudra inspired IMRH-WSI.

 

[Dessert Storm]

Tilt-rotor Osprey proved too cost inefficient to be used. I doubt india will go for speed over stealth, as the latter is more advantageous in modern convention warfare.

As @AZTEC's post suggest, it'll be a beefed up medium helo with more payload & powerful engines.

Your thoughts on Valor in the context of LPDs/LHDs, future army requirements for troop transport+CAS.

 

[Bleh]

Your thoughts on Valor in the context of LPDs/LHDs, future army requirements for troop transport+CAS.

None... I'm into tech not tactics.
Osprey proved to be too pricey even for Murica. If SEAD goes well then C-17, Mi-17s (& successors) should be able to go on.

 

[Dessert Storm]

None... I'm into tech not tactics.
Osprey proved to be too pricey even for Murica. If SEAD goes well then C-17, Mi-17s (& successors) should be able to gon on.

Anybody who can give an insight into the topic at hand?

 

[ezsasa]

Bruh I am asking how can you say that an HCH is even in the making? I feel it will be a Rudra inspired IMRH-WSI.

Sure, but the basis of speculation on HCH is based on this info from HAL.

Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd plans to produce Apache-like military helicopter in India

The aim of this project is to stop import of more than Rs 4 lakh crore worth of military choppers.

m.economictimes.com

More over, to retain the power balance in the region India does need atleast 150-200 of these heavy combat helicopters over a period of time.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Sure, but the basis of speculation on HCH is based on this info from HAL.

Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd plans to produce Apache-like military helicopter in India

The aim of this project is to stop import of more than Rs 4 lakh crore worth of military choppers.

m.economictimes.com

More over, to retain the power balance in the region India does need atleast 150-200 of these heavy combat helicopters over a period of time.

28 Apache + 72 Rudra + 179 LCH + 200 HCH = 479 Attack helicopters. Excellent number but I don’t think we need to make any such heli. Instead army should go with 40 more Apache as we don’t need 150 HCH.

Our drones would be enough to destroy porki tanks and for close air support 40 Additional apaches would be more than sufficient in western border with porkistan. Coz we can’t use Apache (we can but its foolish) in easter side as LCH can fly at altitudes of 6500 m with 100% fuel and 100% weapons whereas Apache can fly at 6400m with half fuel and weapons. And no Chyenese attack heli is capable to fight at the Indo-Tibetan border as they are useless...

179 LCH is more than enough for China.

Overall I would obviously be happy if 200 HCH are inducted (why wouldn’t one be to know this) as our numbers and capabilities will grow.

कौन खुश नही होगा जानकर की हम २०० HCH शामिल करेंगे।

But I personally don’t feel HCH is a big deal, I would prefer Army buying 40 Additional Apaches or atleast 120 HCH justifying the unnecessary development of a new aircraft.

 

[Dessert Storm]

28 Apache + 72 Rudra + 179 LCH + 200 HCH = 479 Attack helicopters. Excellent number but I don’t think we need to make any such heli. Instead army should go with 40 more Apache as we don’t need 150 HCH.

Our drones would be enough to destroy porki tanks and for close air support 40 Additional apaches would be more than sufficient in western border with porkistan. Coz we can’t use Apache (we can but its foolish) in easter side as LCH can fly at altitudes of 6500 m with 100% fuel and 100% weapons whereas Apache can fly at 6400m with half fuel and weapons. And no Chyenese attack heli is capable to fight at the Indo-Tibetan border as they are useless...

179 LCH is more than enough for China.

Overall I would obviously be happy if 200 HCH are inducted (why wouldn’t one be to know this) as our numbers and capabilities will grow.

कौन खुश नही होगा जानकर की हम २०० HCH शामिल करेंगे।

But I personally don’t feel HCH is a big deal, I would prefer Army buying 40 Additional Apaches or atleast 120 HCH justifying the unnecessary development of a new aircraft.

We would need some on the planned LPDs and LHDs too.

 

[ezsasa]

28 Apache + 72 Rudra + 179 LCH + 200 HCH = 479 Attack helicopters. Excellent number but I don’t think we need to make any such heli. Instead army should go with 40 more Apache as we don’t need 150 HCH.

Our drones would be enough to destroy porki tanks and for close air support 40 Additional apaches would be more than sufficient in western border with porkistan. Coz we can’t use Apache (we can but its foolish) in easter side as LCH can fly at altitudes of 6500 m with 100% fuel and 100% weapons whereas Apache can fly at 6400m with half fuel and weapons. And no Chyenese attack heli is capable to fight at the Indo-Tibetan border as they are useless...

179 LCH is more than enough for China.

Overall I would obviously be happy if 200 HCH are inducted (why wouldn’t one be to know this) as our numbers and capabilities will grow.

कौन खुश नही होगा जानकर की हम २०० HCH शामिल करेंगे।

But I personally don’t feel HCH is a big deal, I would prefer Army buying 40 Additional Apaches or atleast 120 HCH justifying the unnecessary development of a new aircraft.

i was implying Heavy category itself must be 150-200, over and above LCH & Rudra.

We will know the answer to this question soon enough when the question of integrating SANT & HELINA to Apache arises.

Honeymoon period between U.S and any country usually lasts 20-30 years, after that you never know which direction the relationship gonna take. Might as well be prepared for the inevitable.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Honeymoon period between U.S and any country usually lasts 20-30 years

So true!!!

 

[ManhattanProject]

HCH is a joke, HAL HCH is not going to be Apache like but a jugaad.
remember Mi-17 equipped with Rockets Used in Kargil?
HCH will be IMRH equipped with rocket pods

Mi-17 armed
View attachment 63729
IMRH armed (HCH)
View attachment 63730

you do know the LCH came from the Rudra right?
this is what they are trying to do with the HCH.