HAL Advanced Light Helicopter Dhruv

[sandeepdg]

Dhruv can land on WATER?!?!
The following excerpt is from a Mauritian newspaper (translated from french)


Any of you guys knew that?

Yeah, the naval version of the Dhruv will have flotation gear which will housed on fairings on fuselage sides.

 

[RPK]

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: DHRUV CRASH UPDATE #9: Blackbox To Be Analysed By US Govt Dept

DHRUV CRASH UPDATE #9: Blackbox To Be Analysed By US Govt Dept

The blackbox of the Ecuadorian Dhruv helicopter that crashed on October 27 will be shipped to the US, where it will analysed by the Department for Aviation Safety, a part of the National Transportation Safety Board. The data will then be sent to HAL for a second analysis. The Accident Investigation Board has submitted a preliminary report to Ecuador's Defence Ministry, and will submit its final report by Jan-Feb 2010. Ecuador's government has apparently come under pressure to send the blackbox to a "neutral" agency in the US (ha!), instead of having it analysed first off by HAL, which in their view would constitute a conflict of interest.

 

[marcos98]

Good news guys, M'tius is considering the acquisition of additional Dhruvs for the MPF. Just heard it on the radio! Cheers!

UPDATE:

Rough translation of what the spokesman said:
-Dhruv carried out its first rescue mission recently
-The machine is world class and the MPF is really satisfied with it.
-M'tius does NOT plan to ground the dhruv (regarding Ecuador crash)
-Indian technicians will be assisting local personnel for a further 6 months.

video of dhruv of mauritius police.....
Vidéo : Dhruv, le nouvel hélicoptère de la police

 

[Vladimir79]

DHRUV CRASH UPDATE: DEFENCE MIN TO BE IMPEACHED OVER DHRUV!

Questions about purchase

Opposition sectors seek impeachment against the Minister of Defence, the questions surrounding the purchase of helicopters

Following the accident of one of the newly acquired Dhruv helicopters to India to equip those machines with the Ecuadorian Armed Forces, there were doubts about the goodness of such helicopters, as reported, had already had problems in terms of its operation in India itself, where they make and in some other country that had purchased. Chile is also known that he refrained from making a similar purchase of these devices, apparently due to negative reports in terms of quality and functionality, and finally, within the ranks of the military establishment emerged questioning, by ex-officers Air Force on the purchase of these helicopters allegedly disregarding recommendations to the contrary.

Anyway, if passed Dhruv helicopters and political level, and the opposition, including assembly of Patriotic Society, seek, as announced recently a political trial against the Defense Minister, for alleged irregularities in the purchase of challenged the fleet of aircraft after the accident he suffered one of them. The official concerned has deplored it seeks to link the shopping process with the accident, but is something that can not be separated, and raising questions that newly acquired helicopters suffer this kind of accidents, especially when you know that some of its parts were not from the time of manufacture that was stipulated in the light of a history of other mishaps in such equipment.

What is striking, without suggesting more detail, it is hidden just to buy helicopters from a source without much prestige, made by a country without denying its technological advances, is not exactly at the forefront of the manufacture of helicopters good quality, under the assumption that only Indians were cheaper equipment, inadequate argument for determining an acquisition, where other parameters may obviously play much more important than the simple comparison of prices in the respective bids. In any case, doubts floating around the case of Dhruv helicopters and relevance to the country of purchase.

Opinin - Interrogantes sobre compra - Noticias de Cuenca - Azuay - Ecuador - ElTiempo de Cuenca

_____________________________

I told you this wasn't going to go well. They will impeach the man just to prove my point.

 

[nitesh]

here is the good news guys:

Hindustan Aeronautics to fly light combat chopper soon

Though the LCH was to take-off by August, HAL announced in September that the first flight would take place by this year-end or early January, as its overall weight had to be reduced by about 20 percent (580) kg.

“We have overcome the weight problem. The target weight will be achieved for a successful test flight,” a HAL copter division official told IANS later.

 

[blade]

DHRUV CRASH UPDATE: DEFENCE MIN TO BE IMPEACHED OVER DHRUV!

Questions about purchase

Opposition sectors seek impeachment against the Minister of Defence, the questions surrounding the purchase of helicopters

Following the accident of one of the newly acquired Dhruv helicopters to India to equip those machines with the Ecuadorian Armed Forces, there were doubts about the goodness of such helicopters, as reported, had already had problems in terms of its operation in India itself, where they make and in some other country that had purchased. Chile is also known that he refrained from making a similar purchase of these devices, apparently due to negative reports in terms of quality and functionality, and finally, within the ranks of the military establishment emerged questioning, by ex-officers Air Force on the purchase of these helicopters allegedly disregarding recommendations to the contrary.

Anyway, if passed Dhruv helicopters and political level, and the opposition, including assembly of Patriotic Society, seek, as announced recently a political trial against the Defense Minister, for alleged irregularities in the purchase of challenged the fleet of aircraft after the accident he suffered one of them. The official concerned has deplored it seeks to link the shopping process with the accident, but is something that can not be separated, and raising questions that newly acquired helicopters suffer this kind of accidents, especially when you know that some of its parts were not from the time of manufacture that was stipulated in the light of a history of other mishaps in such equipment.

What is striking, without suggesting more detail, it is hidden just to buy helicopters from a source without much prestige, made by a country without denying its technological advances, is not exactly at the forefront of the manufacture of helicopters good quality, under the assumption that only Indians were cheaper equipment, inadequate argument for determining an acquisition, where other parameters may obviously play much more important than the simple comparison of prices in the respective bids. In any case, doubts floating around the case of Dhruv helicopters and relevance to the country of purchase.

Opinin - Interrogantes sobre compra - Noticias de Cuenca - Azuay - Ecuador - ElTiempo de Cuenca

_____________________________

I told you this wasn't going to go well. They will impeach the man just to prove my point.

Where dose chile come when compared to the standared and capability of Indian military? When IA is buying DHRUV in bulk Chile showing the technical concern is absolutely funny. They are about 10% of indian strength & requirement. DHRUV is developed to perform under extreme conditions. Chile seem to be trying to hide their incompetence in handling this mechine. Indian military has a world wide reputation of being extremely choosy.

 

[Vladimir79]

Where dose chile come when compared to the standared and capability of Indian military? When IA is buying DHRUV in bulk Chile showing the technical concern is absolutely funny. They are about 10% of indian strength & requirement. DHRUV is developed to perform under extreme conditions. Chile seem to be trying to hide their incompetence in handling this mechine. Indian military has a world wide reputation of being extremely choosy.

The Chile reference was that it wasn't able to pass FAA and JAA certification which is required for Chilean Air Force tenders. India doesn't appear to be so choosy when it comes to inducting domestic aerocraft. I wouldn't really worry about the editorial component of the article but the fact the Ecuadorian government is trying to impeach the guy over defending the Dhruv purchase.

 

[p2prada]

The Chile reference was that it wasn't able to pass FAA and JAA certification which is required for Chilean Air Force tenders. India doesn't appear to be so choosy when it comes to inducting domestic aerocraft. I wouldn't really worry about the editorial component of the article but the fact the Ecuadorian government is trying to impeach the guy over defending the Dhruv purchase.

The opposition's demand is acceptable in democracies. However, they need to wait for the inquiry to complete and the committee to submit its report before jumping to conclusions.

Dhruv is still being perfected, flaws are to be expected. Ecuador and Chile do not have an equivalent helicopter in the world that can rival the ALH's capabilities on mountains.l

 

[Rahul Singh]

Some people really enjoy DHRUV bashing!...... Reports are coming on both 'PRO' and against..... Nothing is going to happen unless investigation is over. BTW Turkey is also buying three DHRUV(Air Ambulance). Question is, are they wrong too? I don't think so. May be a NATO ally should consult Ecuadorians. Heh!

 

[Rahul Singh]

. India doesn't appear to be so choosy when it comes to inducting domestic aerocraft.

Kinda revelation to me. Would you like to quote some examples?

 

[sandeepdg]

Yeah, just as i said before that some people are f*****g desperate to jump the gun without waiting for the final word from a competent authority. Those who are investigating the whole issue are the ones we should listen too after all !!

 

[mattster]

This is again another example of putting the cart before the horse.

Lets take a hard look at this whole Dhruv fiasco in Ecuador. I said it once before on this forum, and I will say it again.

1) A country like India which is taking its first baby steps in the aerospace industry with its first generation homegrown helicopter and first fighter aircraft should not rush headlong into pushing for exports. (Manufacturing under license does not count in this regard)
These products should be used extensively in India for at least 3 to 4 years before any exports are considered. Think of it as an "extra long user trial" at home so that any deficiencies can be rectified before exporting the product.

2) The small number of exports to a few countries does not really make a huge difference to India or HAL in business terms. These exports are mainly being pushed for the sake of international prestige, brand recognition, marketing hype, etc.
But when something goes wrong abroad, it becomes very hard to manage the public relations nightmare regardless of what the actual reason for the crash was.

3) Once you have successfully designed and deployed your first generation and proven its performance, and then moved on to your 2nd generation products and you have a more mature established aviation industry and high quality manufacturing supplier chains; then, thats the time to push for exports.

 

[Daredevil]

This is again another example of putting the cart before the horse.

Lets take a hard look at this whole Dhruv fiasco. I said it once before on this forum, and I will say it again.

1) A country like India which is taking its first baby steps in the aerospace industry with its first generation homegrown helicopter and first fighter aircraft should not rush headlong into pushing for exports. Manufacturing under license does not count in this regard.
These products should be used extensively in India for at least 3 to 4 years before any exports are considered. Think of it as an "extra long user trial" at home so that any deficiencies can be rectified before exporting the product.

Dhruv has been actively deployed in India from 2002. They are serving at the highest altitudes in the world without any problems.

2) The small number of exports to a few countries does not really make a huge difference to India or HAL in business terms. These exports are mainly being pushed for the sake of international prestige, brand recognition, etc.
But when something goes wrong abroad, it becomes very hard to manage the public relations nightmare regardless of what the actual reason for the crash was.

All aircrafts will have some crash rate. Dhruv is no exception.

3) Once you have successfully designed and deployed your first generation and proven its performance, and then moved on to your 2nd generation products and you have a more mature established aviation industry and high quality suppliers; then, thats the time to push for exports.

It is mature enough and that is why other countries are buying.

 

[Vladimir79]

Kinda revelation to me. Would you like to quote some examples?

For example, ALH Dhruv is not certified to fly in Europe (JAA) and North Amerika (FAA). Russia had to rebuild all of our models that operate in these markets to reach these certifications. If India wants to reach a global export market, they will have to reach these certifications as was the case in Dhruv being barred in Brazil and Chile.

 

[enlightened1]

This is again another example of putting the cart before the horse.

Lets take a hard look at this whole Dhruv fiasco in Ecuador. I said it once before on this forum, and I will say it again.

1) A country like India which is taking its first baby steps in the aerospace industry with its first generation homegrown helicopter and first fighter aircraft should not rush headlong into pushing for exports. (Manufacturing under license does not count in this regard)
These products should be used extensively in India for at least 3 to 4 years before any exports are considered. Think of it as an "extra long user trial" at home so that any deficiencies can be rectified before exporting the product.

You don't know anything about the Dhruv..do you? It's been in active service since 2002..& what is this Dhruv fiasco BS? They bought nine helicopters & unfortunately one crashed..which aircraft doesn't have a crash rate?..even their air-chief said it was due to pilot error. Dhruvs fly on a daily basis to Siachen with no problem..it was designed to do that whereas other choppers have to be heavily modified.
LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: SPECIAL: Dhruv Shakti In Siachen
LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: 'Dhruvs Best In Their Class, No Question Of Returning Them' - Ecuador's Defence Minister
LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: More Photos Of Crashed Dhruv, Ecuador's Air Chief Says Pilot Error

2) The small number of exports to a few countries does not really make a huge difference to India or HAL in business terms. These exports are mainly being pushed for the sake of international prestige, brand recognition, marketing hype, etc.

& HAL's balance sheet.

But when something goes wrong abroad, it becomes very hard to manage the public relations nightmare regardless of what the actual reason for the crash was.

This was the first crash, next time HAL will have the experience on how to deal with it.

3) Once you have successfully designed and deployed your first generation and proven its performance, and then moved on to your 2nd generation products and you have a more mature established aviation industry and high quality manufacturing supplier chains; then, thats the time to push for exports.

The countries buying the Dhruv don't seem to know that it's India's first helicopter isn't it?

 

[Sridhar]

Wednesday, November 25, 2009

Dhruvs Airborne Again, HAL Team In Ecuador Chills


At The Festival Of India in the Quito Hilton Hotel on November 19.

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: Dhruvs Airborne Again, HAL Team In Ecuador Chills

 

[Vladimir79]

If anyone wants to know how many have been exported to date;

HAL has exported five numbers of the indigenously developed Helicopters Dhruv to Ecuador and one to Mauritius.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri AK Antony in a written reply to Shri Balavant Alias Bal Apte and others in Rajya Sabha today.
PIB Press Release

 

[Rahul Singh]

For example, ALH Dhruv is not certified to fly in Europe (JAA) and North Amerika (FAA). Russia had to rebuild all of our models that operate in these markets to reach these certifications. If India wants to reach a global export market, they will have to reach these certifications as was the case in Dhruv being barred in Brazil and Chile.

JAA and FAA are not mandatory for Indian Airspace, only DGCA certification is mandatory. And, as far as Indian forces are concerned, here, you should know that they want CEMILAC certification before induction, not JAA, FAA or others.

Just an information. Turkey is buying three DHRUV(MEDVAC). I'll love to know your take on this.

You said Indian forces are not that choosy when it comes to Indian made systems. Depending on your quote, IA or IAF should have gone for either BELL or NH or Eurocopter etc etc. But they did not, because, DHRUV is performing excellently in sectors where these western giants struggled. This is the reason, only reason, why Indian armed force went for DHRUV. On other hand IA(largest DHRUV operator) selected T-90 instead of Arjun, and this defies your assertion.

Hope, this time, you put something which backs your answer, instead of diplomatic words.

 

[Vladimir79]

JAA and FAA are not mandatory for Indian Airspace, only DGCA certification is mandatory.

And, as far as Indian forces are concerned, here, you should know that they want CEMILAC certification before induction, not JAA, FAA or others.

And what? None of them are as stringent as Western safety standards. That is the whole point.

Just an information. Turkey is buying three DHRUV(MEDVAC). I'll love to know your take on this.

Awaiting HAL's promised JAA certification, they won't operate until they get it as that is the law.

You said Indian forces are not that choosy when it comes to Indian made systems. Depending on your quote, IA or IAF should have gone for either BELL or NH or Eurocopter etc etc. But they did not, because, DHRUV is performing excellently in sectors where these western giants struggled. This is the reason, only reason, why Indian armed force went for DHRUV. On other hand IA(largest DHRUV operator) selected T-90 instead of Arjun, and this defies your assertion.

I said they must not be choosy about allowing domestic aircraft. The loss of Western models illustrates the point that India is more concerned with inducting domestic brands than aviation safety. Why you bring tanks into it is of no relavence to this conversation.

Hope, this time, you put something which backs your answer, instead of diplomatic words.

I already did the first time.

 

[icecoolben]

Hal has been working towards getting FAA and JAA for some time now, so that it could crack europe's and north america's civilian market for the ambulance version, transport etc. Its just a matter of time.

With Indian diplomatic and political clout growing v can definitely manage, even foreign governments from behaving aggressively. The nepalise had problems with dhuruv, Hal managed to fix them without breaking a sweat. Now we have broken into USA'S backyard market, its a good experience for Hal, marketing its product overseas. This episode would make Hal's marketing strategies stronger rather than bring down dhuruv sales.
Another potential crash cause has been identified and i'm sure the fligt controls would be adjusted to thwart it the next time. Its a good thing too, that it happened to dhuruv than wsi or lch version. As i quoted before, its only time before dhuruv gets the necessary certificates for operations in europe and north america to field both the civilian and military variants in its skies.