DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[lcafanboy]

 

[Suryavanshi]

Su-30MKI is more indigenous compared to IOC LCA Tejas.
View attachment 90014

The engine, ejection, radar, avionics make up most of the value of the plane.
Engine, radar and avionics will be indigenised in the coming years.
Only ejection will remain.

 

[Lonewolf]

The engine, ejection, radar, avionics make up most of the value of the plane.
Engine, radar and avionics will be indigenised in the coming years.
Only ejection will remain.

Engine , not so fast matr

 

[flanker99]

Su-30MKI is more indigenous compared to IOC LCA Tejas.
View attachment 90014

Kaunsa document hai ye?

 

[IndianHawk]

Su-30MKI is more indigenous compared to IOC LCA Tejas.
View attachment 90014

Yup but lca mk1a will leapfrog the su30mki with desi radar.

 

[Lonewolf]

Yup but lca mk1a will leapfrog the su30mki with desi radar.

And more indigenous system.


Anything on foc , import content

 

[FalconSlayers]

The engine, ejection, radar, avionics make up most of the value of the plane.
Engine, radar and avionics will be indigenised in the coming years.
Only ejection will remain.

Ekection seat is something we can do ToT with Russia.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Was doing some reading on the latest in GaN tech. Looks like we have just entered the arena. Currently DRDO has achieved RF Power Density of 10 W/mm at 50V at 3 GHz using first generation AlGaN/GaN tech.

The Japanese are far ahead, where they are using next generation of GaN tech that utilizes Indium-Aluminum-Gallium Nitride in the electron supply layer. Even above this, they have achieved several advances:-

Improvement	Improved RF Power Density / Gate width (W/mm)	Improved Operating Voltage (V)
DRDO AlGaN HEMT (for comparison)	10​	50​
Introduced a spacer layer of AlGaN between the electron supply and channel layers	14.8​	85​
Introduced nano-sized single-crystals layer of diamonds grown on substrate to enhance heat dissipation.	19.9​	100​
Introduced micro-sized single-crystal diamonds layer on one side for 40% reduction in heat generation. When applied on both sides an even better heat dissipation is achieved with 77% reduction in heat generation.	??​	??​

Americans are even more nuts:-

Country (Year)	RF Power Density / Gate width (W/mm)	Band (freq)	Operating Voltage (V)
USA (2017)	50	UHF (600 Hz)	200
USA (2017)	>18	C (5 GHz)	90
USA (2004)	20	S (?)	?
USA (2006)	40	S (4 GHz)	135
Japan (2019)	22.3	S (3 GHz)	100
India (2018)	10	S (3 GHz)	50

I have a feeling that the second table above is an apples to oranges comparison. I don't understand if I am even looking at the correct parameters. Maybe their is some efficiency parameter I am missing. Can't delve too deep into this 'cause this is not my field, hopefully @FalconSlayers can look deeper into this?

 

[Lonewolf]

Was doing some reading on the latest in GaN tech. Looks like we have just entered the arena. Currently DRDO has achieved RF Power Density of 10 W/mm at 50V at 3 GHz using first generation AlGaN/GaN tech.

The Japanese are far ahead, where they are using next generation of GaN tech that utilizes Indium-Aluminum-Gallium Nitride in the electron supply layer. Even above this, they have achieved several advances:-

Improvement	Improved RF Power Density / Gate width (W/mm)	Improved Operating Voltage (V)
DRDO AlGaN HEMT (for comparison)	10​	50​
Introduced a spacer layer of AlGaN between the electron supply and channel layers	14.8​	85​
Introduced nano-sized single-crystals layer of diamonds grown on substrate to enhance heat dissipation.	19.9​	100​
Introduced micro-sized single-crystal diamonds layer on one side for 40% reduction in heat generation. When applied on both sides an even better heat dissipation is achieved with 77% reduction in heat generation.	??​	??​

Americans are even more nuts:-

Country (Year)	RF Power Density / Gate width (W/mm)	Band (freq)	Operating Voltage (V)
USA (2017)	50	UHF (600 Hz)	200
USA (2017)	>18	C (5 GHz)	90
USA (2004)	20	S (?)	?
USA (2006)	40	S (4 GHz)	135
Japan (2019)	22.3	S (3 GHz)	100
India (2018)	10	S (3 GHz)	50

I have a feeling that the second table above is an apples to oranges comparison. I don't understand if I am even looking at the correct parameters. Maybe their is some efficiency parameter I am missing. Can't delve too deep into this 'cause this is not my field, hopefully @FalconSlayers can look deeper into this?

Isn't it related something to operating voltage , we haven't gone to higher voltage yet

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Isn't it related something to operating voltage , we haven't gone to higher voltage yet

That is the limitation of our technology I think. Higher voltages might cause higher temperatures and/or destruction of the GaN material itself due to high KE of electrons. Don't know for sure, like I said, this is not my field. Point is that achieving higher voltages is part of the challenge. Achieving this higher voltage will require improvements to material. Just look at the improvements Japanese did on the baseline GaN tech. Its all to lower power dissipation at higher voltages.
EDIT: For example, higher voltages can cause electrons to accelerate to higher velocities in the electron supply layer which can destroy the channel layer, which is why the Japanese introduced a AlGaN space layer in between.

 

[Lonewolf]

That is the limitation of our technology I think. Higher voltages might cause higher temperatures and/or destruction of the GaN material itself due to high KE of electrons. Don't know for sure, like I said, this is not my field. Point is that achieving higher voltages is part of the challenge. Achieving this higher voltage will require improvements to material. Just look at the improvements Japanese did on the baseline GaN tech. Its all to lower power dissipation at higher voltages.

I also think so , otherwise we may had a radar by yet , but still for ew panel utilization too we need better tech than this , maybe this is the reason we haven't seen a gan radar prototype or something

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

I also think so , otherwise we may had a radar by yet , but still for ew panel utilization too we need better tech than this , maybe this is the reason we haven't seen a gan radar prototype or something

Maybe. Its already been 3 years since we achieved the figures I posted. If we don't see the GaN S-band radar till 2025, we can be sure of major improvements.

 

[omaebakabaka]

The engine, ejection, radar, avionics make up most of the value of the plane.
Engine, radar and avionics will be indigenised in the coming years.
Only ejection will remain.

Very opaque on the labeling....for instance avionics, is it both software and hardware? Who knows....until we export or remain productive even with sanctions, can't say with full confidence. I think ISRO is more indigenous than DRDO in general

 

[Lonewolf]

Very opaque on the labeling....for instance avionics, is it both software and hardware? Who knows....until we export or remain productive even with sanctions, can't say with full confidence. I think ISRO is more indigenous than DRDO in general

Joke of century

 

[SavageKing456]

Very opaque on the labeling....for instance avionics, is it both software and hardware? Who knows....until we export or remain productive even with sanctions, can't say with full confidence. I think ISRO is more indigenous than DRDO in general

Defence technology is more advanced than space technologies

 

[Lonewolf]

Very opaque on the labeling....for instance avionics, is it both software and hardware? Who knows....until we export or remain productive even with sanctions, can't say with full confidence. I think ISRO is more indigenous than DRDO in general

The tech they are importing is either we can't make or those which are generally not developed in house as a norm ,like ejection seat and all , we can develop a good hmds ,and hud in-house but not taken initiative earlier ,both are in deveolpment as of now .

 

[omaebakabaka]

The tech they are importing is either we can't make or those which are generally not developed in house as a norm ,like ejection seat and all , we can develop a good hmds ,and hud in-house but not taken initiative earlier ,both are in deveolpment as of now .

Understandable, as long as we are not rebranding....to me indigenous means more sovereign than necessarily economical that is capability to deliver a product in difficult conditions like sanctions and so on of critical stuff. That is the whole point? I think France and Russia are the only countries that are kinda close to full spectrum in house in most conditions....US is too dependent on other countries

 

[Lonewolf]

Understandable, as long as we are not rebranding....to me indigenous means more sovereign than necessarily economical that is capability to deliver a product in difficult conditions like sanctions and so on of critical stuff. That is the whole point? I think France and Russia are the only countries that are kinda close to full spectrum in house in most conditions....US is too dependent on other countries

Us is the most independent

 

[Lonewolf]

Understandable, as long as we are not rebranding....to me indigenous means more sovereign than necessarily economical that is capability to deliver a product in difficult conditions like sanctions and so on of critical stuff. That is the whole point? I think France and Russia are the only countries that are kinda close to full spectrum in house in most conditions....US is too dependent on other countries

Some recommendation, start reading from somewhere from page 450 , ignore all discussion like casual one we are having here and read all info specially from @porky_kicker @Karthi @fire starter @Chinmoy ,you will get to know what we have and how far we have to go

 

[omaebakabaka]

Some recommendation, start reading from somewhere from page 450 , ignore all discussion like casual one we are having here and read all info specially from @porky_kicker @Karthi @fire starter @Chinmoy ,you will get to know what we have and how far we have to go

Ya, I did ask few times when component pictures were getting posted....never got the confirmation ofcourse its very hard to get those details....thats why I have this doubt on opaqueness and liberal nature of calling indigenous. Would be happy to be proven wrong. Anyway, I will drop as its just general comment based on looking at that 40% indigenous in LCA and MKI