DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[Chinmoy]

Just out of curiosity , what do you think of this possibility ?

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The land based system is plausible enough.

 

[MrPresident]

Bold claims regarding Uttam Radar by DRDO chief.

http://forceindia.net/interview/sec...development-organisation-dr-g-satheesh-reddy/

 

[Enquirer]

Aditya precision tech is a company which makes pumps and fittings. So if they have build this one, it means it is a outsourced project. So obviously they would only make the body and not the RADOME of the missile.

While it's true that this outsourced company will mostly do only the machining of outer metallic portion, we need to look at the picture closely to see that the upper portion is NOT left open.
Look closely, there is a rounded top beyond the edge of the top cylinder.

Is there any reason to be so convinced that it's not MRPKS? As I see, the wording of MRKPS seems to correlate with this image very closely.

 

[Holy Triad]

UTTAM AESA will be ready for induction on Tejas Mk 1A : Dr G. Satheesh Reddy

idrw.org .Read more at India No 1 Defence News Website https://idrw.org/uttam-aesa-will-be-ready-for-induction-on-tejas-mk-1a-dr-g-satheesh-reddy/.

 

[Suryavanshi]

Acccording to this video we have Gained quite a lot expertise in reducing RCS through altering shape and design of Aircraft. About 60 to 70 percent of the RCD reduction is through this means rest 30 to 40 % is achieved by Material and coating where we haven't got much success.
First prototype of AMCA shoudl be out by 2022 and production can be started by 2025 if everything goes right.
Also quantum computing has found a lot of place in development of this plane (don't know the particulars)

 

[Chinmoy]

While it's true that this outsourced company will mostly do only the machining of outer metallic portion, we need to look at the picture closely to see that the upper portion is NOT left open.
Look closely, there is a rounded top beyond the edge of the top cylinder.

Is there any reason to be so convinced that it's not MRPKS? As I see, the wording of MRKPS seems to correlate with this image very closely.

There is a huge chance that the system was not Astra. I've gone thru the brochure and noticed something interesting. @porky_kicker have hidden some facts which gave rise to the doubt in his mind and didn't shared the facts here.
But anyway it's not a prototype of MRPKS or Astra as both of them are single stage system whereas it is a twin stage one.

 

[IndianHawk]

Acccording to this video we have Gained quite a lot expertise in reducing RCS through altering shape and design of Aircraft. About 60 to 70 percent of the RCD reduction is through this means rest 30 to 40 % is achieved by Material and coating where we haven't got much success.
First prototype of AMCA shoudl be out by 2022 and production can be started by 2025 if everything goes right.
Also quantum computing has found a lot of place in development of this plane (don't know the particulars)

He also talked about galium nitrate foundry.
Says we have reached 40 W and target is 110 W after which all ground radars will move to galium nitrate. For airborne radar 10-12 W is required?
I couldn't understand it clearly? Anyone?

In 7 years AMCA will be ready for serial production so should be 2027. Mwf and AMCA will come together??

Also he says geometric shaping is complete on smaller models and now 1:1 model is being built . He believes 70% RCS reduction will be achieved with this.

For rest he is not behind on materials but testing coating material on existing aircrafts hotspots such as air intake. That's what he said.

These are huge developments. Phenomenal progress very fast. Kudos to DRDO and govt to support it.

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[Steven Rogers]

He also talked about galium nitrate foundry.
Says we have reached 40 W and target is 110 W after which all ground radars will move to galium nitrate. For airborne radar 10-12 W is required?
I couldn't understand it clearly? Anyone?

In 7 years AMCA will be ready for serial production so should be 2027. Mwf and AMCA will come together??

Also he says geometric shaping is complete on smaller models and now 1:1 model is being built . He believes 70% RCS reduction will be achieved with this.

For rest he is not behind on materials but testing coating material on existing aircrafts hotspots such as air intake. That's what he said.

These are huge developments. Phenomenal progress very fast. Kudos to DRDO and govt to support it.

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He says that they have achieved 40watt power output for s band trmms, all indian s band radar use GaA at current which are rated at 110w ,at this output the gain is not affected by the noise and with replaced by GaN, the efficiency and power outout will increase at same output.
For X band air borne radars,indian research showed that trm rated at 10-12watt are more efficient in gain and have minimal side lobes, he meant that all the reasearch in the x band is around that power output and the future GaN trms will have higher gain and lower noise than the present GaAs based trms.
Amca will come by 2035,now dont question that by then countries will develop 6th gen(which i consider it a gimmick), amca will be far modern for that time when it come.
Amca will use various types of materials to reduce rcs and IR signatures, from Ram coating to RAM structure and metamaterials.

 

[IndianHawk]

He says that they have achieved 40watt power output for s band trmms, all indian s band radar use GaA at current which are rated at 110w ,at this output the gain is not affected by the noise and with replaced by GaN, the efficiency and power outout will increase at same output.
For X band air borne radars,indian research showed that trm rated at 10-12watt are more efficient in gain and have minimal side lobes, he meant that all the reasearch in the x band is around that power output and the future GaN trms will have higher gain and lower noise than the present GaAs based trms.
Amca will come by 2035,now dont question that by then countries will develop 6th gen(which i consider it a gimmick), amca will be far modern for that time when it come.
Amca will use various types of materials to reduce rcs and IR signatures, from Ram coating to RAM structure and metamaterials.

Thanks for detailed response.

I'm aware amca will take time to mature. But I have a theory. The original plan was to have fgfa first followed by amca later. Now with fgfa gone iaf needs stealth amca faster. In that requirement
It may be feasible to produce early model of AMCA ( mostly with geometric shaping) and then gradually introduce material improvement over next batches.

Even a purely geometric amca could match or exceed fgfa level of stealth or to be less dramatic
Even if amca by 2027 could reach rafale level stealth wouldn't it be wise to start producing it's batches rather than importing more foreign fighters which are not very stealth ( rafale and su57)?

It's just a Theory nothing much. South Korea is going the same way even with a non stealth model first for kf-x .

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[power_monger]

Thanks for detailed response.

I'm aware amca will take time to mature. But I have a theory. The original plan was to have fgfa first followed by amca later. Now with fgfa gone iaf needs stealth amca faster. In that requirement
It may be feasible to produce early model of AMCA ( mostly with geometric shaping) and then gradually introduce material improvement over next batches.

Even a purely geometric amca could match or exceed fgfa level of stealth or to be less dramatic
Even if amca by 2027 could reach rafale level stealth wouldn't it be wise to start producing it's batches rather than importing more foreign fighters which are not very stealth ( rafale and su57)?

It's just a Theory nothing much. South Korea is going the same way even with a non stealth model first for kf-x .

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Where is the engine ? If not we have catch fgfa way where you perfect aerodynamics and then bring advanced engines.

 

[NeXoft007]

MRPKS is guided 122mm MBRL project by DRDO.

 

[ezsasa]

MRPKS is guided 122mm MBRL project by DRDO.

BM-21 replacement?.......................

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Statement of case for Medium Range Precision Kill System (MRPKS)
http://www.makeinindiadefence.gov.in/admin/writereaddata/upload/project/project_file/soc_17.9.pdf

 

[IndianHawk]

Where is the engine ? If not we have catch fgfa way where you perfect aerodynamics and then bring advanced engines.

F414 is engine for prototype and initial batch untill higher thrust engine is build.

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[Steven Rogers]

Thanks for detailed response.

I'm aware amca will take time to mature. But I have a theory. The original plan was to have fgfa first followed by amca later. Now with fgfa gone iaf needs stealth amca faster. In that requirement
It may be feasible to produce early model of AMCA ( mostly with geometric shaping) and then gradually introduce material improvement over next batches.

Even a purely geometric amca could match or exceed fgfa level of stealth or to be less dramatic
Even if amca by 2027 could reach rafale level stealth wouldn't it be wise to start producing it's batches rather than importing more foreign fighters which are not very stealth ( rafale and su57)?

It's just a Theory nothing much. South Korea is going the same way even with a non stealth model first for kf-x .

Sent from my C103 using Tapatalk

The original plan was to get a capability of US 5th grn fighter in a russian superior aerodynamic aircraft, however when we realized that it wont even be matching MMRCA like Rafale we started focus on amca. IAF realized that it wont get 5th gen from usa and Russian aircraft is 5th gen in name only so primary focus made on amca and such realization was done years ago and not with in just two or three years. A geometric stealth aircraft is always stealthy than a non stealth aircraft.iaf set their plan for mwf as mainstay and amca as the replacement for early sukhois.

 

[IndianHawk]

The original plan was to get a capability of US 5th grn fighter in a russian superior aerodynamic aircraft, however when we realized that it wont even be matching MMRCA like Rafale we started focus on amca. IAF realized that it wont get 5th gen from usa and Russian aircraft is 5th gen in name only so primary focus made on amca and such realization was done years ago and not with in just two or three years. A geometric stealth aircraft is always stealthy than a non stealth aircraft.iaf set their plan for mwf as mainstay and amca as the replacement for early sukhois.

So a geometric shapes amca with f414 engine will be far more Stealthy than rafale even without stealth coating material?

In that case it makes sense to start producing initial batches of amca by 2025-27 . We can gradually move on to proper stealth like f35.

Early sukhoi will go through upgrade soon and will probably serve till 2035.

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[Vijyes]

So a geometric shapes amca with f414 engine will be far more Stealthy than rafale even without stealth coating material?

In that case it makes sense to start producing initial batches of amca by 2025-27 . We can gradually move on to proper stealth like f35.

Early sukhoi will go through upgrade soon and will probably serve till 2035.

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Geometric stealth is most important. Bit we can't just get any plane with right geometric properties without considering requirement for other factors. Integration or aircraft with various components ia not simple plug and play. Significant coding and optimisation of codes will be needed to integrate things like AESA, sensors and other LRU.

In addition, stealth planes are fully dependent on FBW for flight due to unstable design. This will mean that even a minor bug in FBW can get the plane to crash. We don't want to get our plane crashed regularly by inducting it prematurely.

 

[IndianHawk]

Geometric stealth is most important. Bit we can't just get any plane with right geometric properties without considering requirement for other factors. Integration or aircraft with various components ia not simple plug and play. Significant coding and optimisation of codes will be needed to integrate things like AESA, sensors and other LRU.

In addition, stealth planes are fully dependent on FBW for flight due to unstable design. This will mean that even a minor bug in FBW can get the plane to crash. We don't want to get our plane crashed regularly by inducting it prematurely.

Ofcourse not. FBW can't be compromised with.

The factors I'm talking about compromising for early batch production are

- stealth coating material if not ready. ( We can go with composite skin as rafale and lca and mwf till we have proper stealth skin like f35 )

- f414 engine for early batches in case 110kn engine is not ready .

- if we can't achieve f35 level sensor fusion by 2027 we can make initial batches with limited sensor fusion . ( On par with rafale spectra of today) . As Uttam aesa will be ready with ew suite for mwf .

- if weapons for internal bay are not ready than initial batches can carry on with external weapons just like rafale.

7 years are enough to test FBW extensively. So no compromise there .

Even with above shortfalls amca with geometric shape and internal weapons wing ( even if we don't have optimum air to air missile for internal bay it will still fit pgm and lgb . ) Will be more Stealthy then rafale and su57.

So we don't need to buy 100s of rafale . We can simply order 36 more for current requirement and move on to AMCA faster .

Batch by batch amca can overcome shortcomings and emerge as proper advanced stealth fighter by 2035.


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[ash2win]

Just out of curiosity , what do you think of this possibility ?

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In addition, procurement of 14 Vertically Launched Short Range Missile Systems was also cleared by the DAC. Of these, 10 systems will be indigenously developed. These systems will boost the self-defence capability of ships against Anti-Ship Missiles.
DAC Approves Procurement for Services amounting to Nearly Rs. 46,000 Crores

 

[aditya10r]

The original plan was to get a capability of US 5th grn fighter in a russian superior aerodynamic aircraft, however when we realized that it wont even be matching MMRCA like Rafale we started focus on amca. IAF realized that it wont get 5th gen from usa and Russian aircraft is 5th gen in name only so primary focus made on amca and such realization was done years ago and not with in just two or three years. A geometric stealth aircraft is always stealthy than a non stealth aircraft.iaf set their plan for mwf as mainstay and amca as the replacement for early sukhois.

I believe AMCA is still 15 years to FOC and full scale production (and for love of God please keep production numbers feasible)

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