DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[Chinmoy]

I would assume Mahindra already undergone those tests.. since its been acquired for UNOPS as well as frontline in limited no.

Any chassis change required homologation again and again series of tests. Remember even Mahindra's current vehicle is reworked Israeli AXE - and undergoing trials for more than decade for every iteration. Tata will undergo the same.

In protected mobility vehicle, both Mahindra and TATA has undergone extensive trials along with Kalyani.

In Multipurpose vehicle category, none has undergone any tests.

 

[Chinmoy]

is there some sort of projected procurement plan for 1.5-2.5 tonne payload 4 wheel armoured category vehicles, all forces put together?

i am guessing, the number would be 10-15k over 15 year period, all variants combined.

15k is too much IMO. Majority of the user would be IA in this category with IAF coming second and IN distant third.

 

[Chinmoy]

It should have been HAL from day fucking one.

Yes it should have been.

But government has their own reason to rope in private companies.

 

[Blood+]

Yes it should have been.

But government has their own reason to rope in private companies.

I know but they couldn't have chosen a worse project for their experience. AMCA is too crucial to be left in the hands of enterprises who are total noobs in aeronautics!!

 

[Chinmoy]

I know but they couldn't have chosen a worse project for their experience. AMCA is too crucial to be left in the hands of enterprises who are total noobs in aeronautics!!

Noob?

TATA, Mahindra, Kalyani is already in the business. What project you think would be good enough for them to start with? Because every project is a critical one in one way or other.

 

[Blood+]

Noob?

What experience these guys have got in aeronautics that comes even a quarter way close to that's possessed by HAL??!! Even the term noob is an understatement. TATA, Mahindra, Kalyani is already in the business.

What project you think would be good enough for them to start with? Because every project is a critical one in one way or other.

Anything!! Anything but AMCA!!

 

[slayingheaven]

Noob?

TATA, Mahindra, Kalyani is already in the business. What project you think would be good enough for them to start with? Because every project is a critical one in one way or other.

Actually our plans in terms of ideological strategy seems nice and logical but babus fuck up timelines and funding. What is the best way for a complete noob company to enter Aerospace?. It is through licensed manufacturing of Fighter jets. No, HAL is inefficient and we need Modern way of Jet Manufacturing from any reputed company like LM, Boeing or dassault. To facilitate this, the idea conceived is to give the MMRCA contract to a private company and hence break the monopoly of inefficient HAL who held monopoly on aerospace manufacturing. But many of the BJP ideas are sound and logical whether it is demonetisation or CAA or NRC or Farmlaws or AtmarnirbharBhart or this idea of inducing expertise through licensed manufacturing but they fuck up at implementing them. Had we gone for MMRCA in 2014 era through a private company we would have fast tracked AMCA now due to the said private companies having production lines and expertise after 10 years.

 

[Chinmoy]

What experience these guys have got in aeronautics that comes even a quarter way close to that's possessed by HAL??!! Even the term noob is an understatement.

Ok.

In that case what would TATA do with C-295 production?
What Mahindra had signed MOU with Embraer for?
What did Adani collaborated on Gripen for?

I am not even talking about components manufacturing already being done by these companies here.

 

[Chinmoy]

Actually our plans in terms of ideological strategy seems nice and logical but babus fuck up timelines and funding. What is the best way for a complete noob company to enter Aerospace?. It is through licensed manufacturing of Fighter jets. No, HAL is inefficient and we need Modern way of Jet Manufacturing from any reputed company like LM, Boeing or dassault. To facilitate this, the idea conceived is to give the MMRCA contract to a private company and hence break the monopoly of inefficient HAL who held monopoly on aerospace manufacturing. But many of the BJP ideas are sound and logical whether it is demonetisation or CAA or NRC or Farmlaws or AtmarnirbharBhart or this idea of inducing expertise through licensed manufacturing but they fuck up at implementing them. Had we gone for MMRCA in 2014 era through a private company we would have fast tracked AMCA now due to the said private companies having production lines and expertise after 10 years.

Just one humble request.

Don't jump in middle of conversation without even going thru the context.

 

[NutCracker]

What experience these guys have got in aeronautics that comes even a quarter way close to that's possessed by HAL??!! Even the term noob is an understatement. TATA, Mahindra, Kalyani is already in the business.

Anything!! Anything but AMCA!!

Its now or never project.. Too late to make them join LCA Mk2.
AMCA will decide if we go US MIC way or Chingchong way (with all disadvantages of democracy)..

 

[Blood+]

Ok.

In that case what would TATA do with C-295 production?
What Mahindra had signed MOU with Embraer for?
What did Adani collaborated on Gripen for?

I am not even talking about components manufacturing already being done by these companies here.

Yeah but these are all relatively new ventures for them, aren't they??

 

[Blood+]

Its now or never project.. Too late to make them join LCA Mk2.
AMCA will decide if we go US MIC way or Chingchong way (with all disadvantages of democracy)..

Well, if this drags on for a few more years like this, it'll be never for us. I'd much rather have us go the chini way if the alternative is a fucking no way at all.

 

[AnantS]

The only way out is to make a new consortium with equal partnership between HAL(Read it as GOI share), TATA, MAHINDRA, L&T, Kalyani and others. Let that consortium setup a greenfield project for working on such projects and even productionizing.

Our Industries are too happy selling vada pao ,bhujias or becoming glorified bicholiyas. They need Danda and more coaxing to do for the nation - and the govt should do it.

OT: The problem with our Industry icons - even ones with solid technical background can be seen in this video:

The fellow who presented car is genius and with can do attitude. His idea may not be investable but what could have been the right thing was to link him with IIT or IISC incubation centers which could guide him or incorporate him in relevant project.

 

[Chinmoy]

Yeah but these are all relatively new ventures for them, aren't they??

Yeah.

But they are ready to join them, not AMCA.

 

[Chinmoy]

The only way out is to make a new consortium with equal partnership between HAL(Read it as GOI share), TATA, MAHINDRA, L&T, Kalyani and others. Let that consortium setup a greenfield project for working on such projects and even productionizing.

Our Industries are too happy selling vada pao and bhujias. They need Danda and more coaxing to do for the nation - and the govt should do it.

Already tried.

But if I am say the outcome here, many over here will start cursing me.

 

[Blood+]

Yeah.

But they are ready to join them, not AMCA.

Well, can you really expect anything else from these money hungry bastards?? All they care about is their share prizes, so no surprise there.

Besides, don't you think AMCA will be too complex an undertaking for their expreience level?? I mean, really, what fighter aircraft has any of them ever produced??

 

[Chinmoy]

Besides, don't you think AMCA will be too complex an undertaking for their expreience level?? I mean, really, what fighter aircraft has any of them ever produced??

Complex in what regard?

 

[Blood+]

Complex in what regard?

Oh come on, man!! Now you're being deliberately obtuse. It's a gen 5 fighter aircraft, is there anything more complex than that (except for women I mean, because nothing in this universe is more complex than them)??

 

[NutCracker]

Yeah.

But they are ready to join them, not AMCA.

Because product is tangibly ready.. and profit margins are well calculated.

I would still say HAL should make AMCA Mk1 prototype and a private entity should assemble it.
Then deep tech transfer for AMCA mk2 will be a smooth learning curve rather than throwing a hardball at them.

 

[Blood+]

Because product is tangibly ready.. and profit margins are well calculated.

I would still say HAL should make AMCA Mk1 prototype and a private entity should assemble it.
Then deep tech transfer for AMCA mk2 will be a smooth learn curve rather than throwing a hardball at them.

Nah, not at all efficient enough. It might have worked ok for a ground based weapon platform like a tank for example, but anything that flies, that'll be a big no no.

As things stand now, AMCA needs to go to HAL if we want them by 2032 or so.