DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[ezsasa]

True and that's why you'll never see a member bitching about the SAMAR system, cause that's true innovation and a damn useful one at that. But jetpacks?? Really??!!

news headline may have said jetpack, but it's EDF(electric ducted fan), lot of discussion has already happened on it's viability some months back, should be there in this thread somewhere.

 

[karn]

Ok, explain why. How do you think jetpacks will be useful in the battlefield of the morrow??

Small example .. During Bangladesh liberation crossing of rivers were done by helicopters . These days helicopters are a lot more vulnerable due to ubiquitous shoulder fired missiles. Jetpacs can insert troops instead of using helicopters and can open a front that can catch the enemy unawares distracting them from the main crossing.
Any case for short range helicopter insertion can be taken up by jetpacs .

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

Here you go.

US has been testing these but not for "crossing minefield" and US has shit ton of money they don't make ideas and world follows

 

[mokoman]

So to cross landmine Infested areas you are getting a jetpack that will make noise and leave you valunarable throughout your flight to any bullets enemy's send your way sounds like a great logic to me. Anyway are there no anti landmine technology yet?

maybe idea is to equip small sf team crossing mine field for sabotage or recon but even that is a stretch .

honestly seem like a lame excuse to buy few jet pack for generals to do photo op .

 

[Covfefe]

Also its quite interesting that the forum is silent on the latest AON clearance accorded for towed guns, did I miss the conversation

AoN is the new RFI.. Only CCS clearance or Contract signing matters, rest all is BS to keep everyone humoured

 

[jai jaganath]

For Republic day parades, finally bike stunts will be gone . There are so many basic equipment's/problems to be solved, But nope as @abingdonboy says we are not a serious nation. Also its quite interesting that the forum is silent on the latest AON clearance accorded for towed guns, did I miss the conversation.

Its less than 15 tonnes
So atags is definitely out
Coming to indigenous options Bharat 52 and ofb has a gun too but forgot the name
I am damn sure these won't be procured
But Bharat 52 has cleared ia trails but again no motive in procuring that stuff
It seems again adani elbit atmanirbhar jumla and athos being given Sanskrit name with 60-70% Israel sourced indigenous parts(I mean secondary purchase from Indian company which directly imports from Israel)
And IA and MoD explaining the purchase as to learn how artillery works and how should we operate them as if we have never seen or operated 155mm guns

 

[Blood+]

Small example .. During Bangladesh liberation crossing of rivers were done by helicopters . These days helicopters are a lot more vulnerable due to ubiquitous shoulder fired missiles. Jetpacs can insert troops instead of using helicopters and can open a front that can catch the enemy unawares distracting them from the main crossing.

And what makes you think these jetpacks will be any less vulnerable than good old helicopters?? At least with helis, you have the option of counter measures.

 

[karn]

And what makes you think these jetpacks will be any less vulnerable than good old helicopters?? At least with helis, you have the option of counter measures.

A helicopter downing means 14 troops lost . One jetpack one trooper lost . And then there is the insertion time, whereas the helicopter has to hover in place while the troops rappel down. Jetpac troopers need only land dump the pac and are ready to go .

 

[Blood+]

A helicopter downing means 14 troops lost . One jetpack one trooper lost .

Ever heard of a little thing known as a GPMG?? Make no mistake, you WILL be losing all 14 of the jetpackers.

And then there is the insertion time, whereas the helicopter has to hover in place while the troops rappel down.

Or the chopper can just touch down (or have it hover 2 feet off the ground) for a few seconds for the troopers to jump out and then fuck off.

Jetpac troopers need only land dump the pac and are ready to go .

What gives you the confidence that they will even survive long enough to land in the first place?? I mean if you're using these in an urban setting such as Gaza instead, then at least it'd make some sense but in an open field or a river bank??!! That's height of stupidity.

 

[karn]

Ever heard of a little thing known as a GPMG?? Make no mistake, you WILL be losing all 14 of the jetpackers.

Or the chopper can just touch down (or have it hover 2 feet off the ground) for a few seconds for the troopers to jump out and then fuck off.


What gives you the confidence that they will even survive long enough to land in the first place?? I mean if you're using these in an urban setting such as Gaza instead, then at least it'd make some sense but in an open field or a river bank??!! That's height of stupidity.

You are seriously underestimating how difficult it is to shoot a flying object at range with a GPMG . Otherwise drones wouldn't even be a problem for anyone.

The entire reason that most heli insertions happen by rappelling down is cause a small obstacle may hit the rotor . A limitation not shared by a jetpack user.

 

[Blood+]

You are seriously underestimating how difficult it is to shoot a flying object at range with a GPMG . Otherwise drones wouldn't even be a problem for anyone.

You're really comparing a tiny FPV drone that can zoom around all over the place like Brownian motion with a fucking human being on jetpacks??!! Are you insane??

The entire reason that most heli insertions happen by rappelling down is cause a small obstacle may hit the rotor . A limitation not shared by a jetpack user.

We are talking about crossing minefields or rivers here, so what obstacle??

 

[karn]

You're really comparing a tiny FPV drone that can zoom around all over the place like Brownian motion with a fucking human being on jetpacks??!! Are you insane??

We are talking about crossing minefields or rivers here, so what obstacle??

No.. I am talking about low level winged recon drones .

We are talking about crossing minefields or rivers here, so what obstacle??

Any obstacle.

 

[Blood+]

No.. I am talking about low level winged recon drones .

They still present a lot smaller target and are still a lot faster and more maneuverable than a guy on jetpack would be. Plus, those drones don't need to come down on the ground, but jetpack troops do and that's when they will be at their most vulnerable.

Any obstacle.

Huh, remember Jaffna University heli drop?? They landed the Mi-8s in a small playground surrounded by buildings and trees.

 

[karn]

They still present a lot smaller target and are still a lot faster and more maneuverable than a guy on jetpack would be. Plus, those drones don't need to come down on the ground, but jetpack troops do and that's when they will be the most vulnerable.

Huh, remember Jaffna University heli drop?? They landed the Mi-8s in a small playground surrounded by buildings and trees.

Yeah I remember that the Jaffna attack was a disaster ... cause the playground was the bit of clear ground where the helis could land . Making it easy for the enemy to setup an ambush.

 

[Blood+]

Yeah I remember that the Jaffna attack was a disaster ... cause the playground was the bit of clear ground where the helis could land . Making it easy for the enemy to setup an ambush.

Nope, not at all!! It became a disaster almost exclusively because of the last minute withdrawal of a number of helicopters for some exercise (which meant the entire contingent could no longer be inserted in one swift go as had been originally planned) and then the incompetence of the officer in charge of the 13 Sikh LI detachment, a certain Major Birendra Singh, that sealed their fate for good.

Anyway, a jet pack assault would be out of question even if they were a thing back then because of the numbers of men involved in the operation, which brings us to another point - do you realize how many jet packs would be required to ferry across even a single company worth of men??

 

[karn]

Nope, not at all!! It became a disaster almost exclusively because of the incompetence of the officer in charge of the 13 Sikh LI detachment, a certain Major Birendra Singh.
Anyway, a jet pack assault would be out of question even if they were a thing back then because of the numbers of men involved in the operation, which brings us to another point - do you realize how many jet packs would be required to transfer even a single company of men??

. The operation was doomed from the start The enemy knew that a heliborne attack was coming knew where it would land .

One pack per soldier so 120 per company I'm guessing.

 

[Blood+]

. The operation was doomed from the start The enemy knew that a heliborne attack was coming knew where it would land .

They knew an attack was coming but not the when or where!! And they certainly had no idea where the LZ would be since the first sortie had taken them by complete surprise.
And even then, it wouldn't have become a disaster of such epic proportions had the Major not been so foolhardy about 'holding the LZ'. In the end, he held nothing and lost everything, including his own life.

One pack per soldier so 120 per company I'm guessing.

Yeah, good luck procuring that many.

 

[karn]

They knew an attack was coming but not the when or where!! And they certainly had no idea where the LZ would be since the first sortie had taken them by complete surprise.
And even then, it wouldn't have become a disaster of such epic proportions had the Major not been so foolhardy about 'holding the LZ'. In the end, he held nothing and lost everything, including his own life.

Yeah, good luck procuring that many.

Who knows how many will get procured in the end . They already bought those British ones for performance benchmarking now they want a local sasta version which they will use in exercises to validate the concept . After that the number maybe from 0-800

 

[Blood+]

Who knows how many will get procured in the end . They already bought those British ones for performance benchmarking now they want a local sasta version which they will use in exercises to validate the concept . After that the number maybe from 0-800

Don't hold your breath.

 

[Tridev123]

Do follow the russia ukraine war . The whole defensive strategy on both sides is totally built around mines . Breaching equipment are large vehicles that can be disabled/destroyed causing the whole assault to stall.

I am not trying to undermine your argument.
But still wondering how would it work on the battlefield.
Do you envisage moving a company strength force across the minefield or even a battalion strength force.
What would be the cost implications for a company size or a battalion size being equipped with jetpack.

And God help us if after successfully crossing/flying over the minefield(is it anti tank or anti personal mines or a mixture of both)the jetpack of a few soldiers break down. What happens now.How can they return to base when an uncleared minefield stands between them and the home base.
Will they ride piggyback/ shoulder back on the other members of the force whose jetpack are still working. Can one jetpack support 2 soldiers.

I am not rejecting the idea of jetpacks totally.
I believe it can be used by very small contingents of well trained Special Forces to launch surprise attacks if they are able to fly undetected. Probably an smoke screen using gas cannisters can be created to hide the movement. Am a bit sceptical whether it will work in practical.

One comical angle to the debate.
If the jetpack soldier is flying a hundred or more metres above the ground can an heat seeking shoulder fired SAM be fired to bring him down or a simple Assault Rifle/LMG fire is sufficient.

I really don't know how the concept would work on the actual battlefield.Maybe the US Army could set an example by using it for Green Beret operations against the Houthi Militia.