DRDO Phalcon style AWACS

[asianobserve]

Can someone please request the Def Ministry on my behalf to acquire a dozen Boeing 737 series (bearing in mind their life cycle) from the Jet Airways to convert half of them to AWACS and the other half into tankers. This will be an effective stop gap arrangement for IAF as well as help SBI off load its burden.

If we can think of getting used fighters (Malaysian Mig 29's + French Jags etc) and refurbish them for the front line role that a fighter / strike aircraft are meant to undertake then why not look at used Jet Airways Boeing that will anyway be taking over the role of forece multipliers and secondary assets. I for one think it will be a win-win for IAF/SBI and MoD

Boeing's Wedgetail is the perfect choice for India since it already operates Poseidon. It can buy those Jet Airways B737s and ask Boeing to convert them to Wedgetails.

 

[Punya Pratap]

Or DRDO could look into this and mount their own systems with Boeing in C & C role

Boeing's Wedgetail is the perfect choice for India since it already operates Poseidon. It can buy those Jet Airways B737s and ask Boeing to convert them to Wedgetails.

 

[Armand2REP]

Boeing's Wedgetail is the perfect choice for India since it already operates Poseidon. It can buy those Jet Airways B737s and ask Boeing to convert them to Wedgetails.

737 isn't the preferred choice of anybody right now, just ask Ethiopa how that turned out.

 

[captscooby81]

In that case why not get the A330 from Jetairways they have 4 of them and 2 are already parked in chennai for months without flying . We get a bigger better range aircraft so that we can mount the Phalcons AWACS

Can someone please request the Def Ministry on my behalf to acquire a dozen Boeing 737 series (bearing in mind their life cycle) from the Jet Airways to convert half of them to AWACS and the other half into tankers. This will be an effective stop gap arrangement for IAF as well as help SBI off load its burden.

If we can think of getting used fighters (Malaysian Mig 29's + French Jags etc) and refurbish them for the front line role that a fighter / strike aircraft are meant to undertake then why not look at used Jet Airways Boeing that will anyway be taking over the role of forece multipliers and secondary assets. I for one think it will be a win-win for IAF/SBI and MoD

 

[Punya Pratap]

All I am saying is that there are options available... Jet Airways or SBI both wouldn't mind offloading

 

[Wisemarko]

Boeing's Wedgetail is the perfect choice for India since it already operates Poseidon. It can buy those Jet Airways B737s and ask Boeing to convert them to Wedgetails.

Wedgetail 737 are specialty products derived from 737-700ER: ie they are not the same airframe as commercial 737. Therefore, Jet Airways 737 cannot be converted to this platform.

I do think that Wedgetail is outstanding plate-form for AWACS.

 

[Armand2REP]

All I am saying is that there are options available... Jet Airways or SBI both wouldn't mind offloading

I think picking up one cheap for testing is a good idea, but when it comes to production you will want new A330s. Commercial aircraft used by airlines have way too many flight hours on them to be a good buy.

 

[Wisemarko]

737 isn't the preferred choice of anybody right now, just ask Ethiopa how that turned out.

737 has 5000 orders pending. Issues are with MAX not Wedgetail or P-8 both of which are made from NG version. Learn before malign.

 

[Armand2REP]

737 has 5000 orders pending. Issues are with MAX not Wedgetail or P-8 both of which are made from NG version. Learn before malign.

737 NG has the same MCAS system that is crashing the MAX... don't you know anything?

Boeing is a world class company and the world would not be flying the way it is without it.

The Boeing name is mud now.

 

[garg_bharat]

In that case why not get the A330 from Jetairways they have 4 of them and 2 are already parked in chennai for months without flying . We get a bigger better range aircraft so that we can mount the Phalcons AWACS

Your idea is excellent but unlikely to be adopted as India always goes for most expensive option; the one which keeps everybody happy. I hope you get the drift.

 

[asianobserve]

737 isn't the preferred choice of anybody right now, just ask Ethiopa how that turned out.

That's an aberration. B737 has been in service for 50 years. It wouldn't reach that milestone if it were a bad aircraft.

 

[Armand2REP]

That's an aberration. B737 has been in service for 50 years. It wouldn't reach that milestone if it were a bad aircraft.

MCAS flight management software has only been in service since 2016, it isn't the aircraft that is bad, it is the poor programming of Boeing engineers cutting corners and disregarding the safety of passengers and crew.

 

[Wisemarko]

How Wedgetail is made: after regular assembly just like any other 737-700ER, the aircraft is shipped to special mission integration facility. There aircraft is disassembled to add ventral fins, sensors and radar mount among other things. The interior is also completely mission specific.

 

[scatterStorm]

737 NG has the same MCAS system that is crashing the MAX... don't you know anything?



The Boeing name is mud now.

True dat but if the Jet airways jets are rusting, it might be a good idea to atleast test them as you said earlier.

 

[Punya Pratap]

Jet Airways also has 10 Boeing 777-300ER so I suggest these instead

 

[Wisemarko]

737 NG has the same MCAS system that is crashing the MAX... don't you know anything?



The Boeing name is mud now.

No, I don’t know the inaccurate information which you seem to possess: NG and MAX have completely different MCAS software, just like both have very different engines and landing gear designs.

MCAS is a generic term for FCS software in Boeing world. Just like Windows is for Microsoft. One bad version has little bearing on previous stable versions. FYI: MCAS exists in other Boeing models as well.

We will see what Boeing’s name is. As I see, you are not placing or cancelling any aircraft orders anywhere anytime soon.

 

[abingdonboy]

Can someone please request the Def Ministry on my behalf to acquire a dozen Boeing 737 series (bearing in mind their life cycle) from the Jet Airways to convert half of them to AWACS and the other half into tankers. This will be an effective stop gap arrangement for IAF as well as help SBI off load its burden.

If we can think of getting used fighters (Malaysian Mig 29's + French Jags etc) and refurbish them for the front line role that a fighter / strike aircraft are meant to undertake then why not look at used Jet Airways Boeing that will anyway be taking over the role of forece multipliers and secondary assets. I for one think it will be a win-win for IAF/SBI and MoD

Sorry but this isn’t a practical solution.

1) second hand converted civil airliners are not an economical nor safe option
2) the 737 is TOTALLY inadequate for the AWACS (INDIA) as a platform. It doesn’t have the power generation capabilities and very well may not have the performance figures to support the full 360* sensor. There’s a reason why only flat arrays are used on the 737 and the large 360* dishes are fitted on larger wide bodies like the 707.

Most of these reasons apply to the tanker role too, just compare the MTOW figures for the two jets, the A330 MRTT is just on another planet. The 737 could almost fit inside the fan of the 777 widebody. The entire point of a tanker is having substantial excess capacity, I don’t see the 737 as a credible option for this role and again there’s a reason why NO ONE has ever ordered it for that role and the standard is widebody aircraft.

 

[abingdonboy]

Boeing's Wedgetail is the perfect choice for India since it already operates Poseidon. It can buy those Jet Airways B737s and ask Boeing to convert them to Wedgetails.

Totally a$$backwards I have to say. These platforms are selected based on the ANTENNA, you don’t select the platform them go searching for a suitable antenna to fit on top.

The A330 has been selected by DRDO as the optimal platform considering power generation requirements (the most important factor for these birds), endurance, range, cabin capacity etc etc.

The 737 might be an option for the LRDE’s flat antenna used on the Netra considering how well the system performed recently but that there’s now a ban on buying more EMB-145s so a new platform is needed if the IAF wants anymore but it doesn’t seem they are interested in anything but 360* systems now.

 

[abingdonboy]

All I am saying is that there are options available... Jet Airways or SBI both wouldn't mind offloading

I wouldn’t worry about the planes of Jet, the Indian aviation market is growing so fast that all these assets will quickly gobbled up by their competitors. Already Spice Jet and Air India have taken a number of Jet’s planes.

 

[abingdonboy]

Jet Airways also has 10 Boeing 777-300ER so I suggest these instead

Another issue about this is that I’m certain to mount an sort of sensor on these planes would require special permission from the USG and this would be accompanied by end use agreements and monitoring by the US. Do you really want your most sensitive assets to be under US control like that? Want to give them all your signatures and tech?

Airbus offers flexibility and freedom.