DRDO 155mm Artillery Program

[airtel]

It's a wonderful news if true but chances are that this record will be short lived as M777-ER is claiming a better range.

this is the record >> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/G6_howitzer

Can anyone tell me about the production lines of ATAGS? Will both Tata & Bharat Forge produce the winning design or will the loser go home empty handed?

OFB will make gun barrel , rest of the parts will be made by both companies & their designs are different .............Bharat forge (left one )design is more Advanced, it has Auto-loader ( Israeli technology ) & Mercedes APU.

TATA has Indian APU ,
both will be produced,

.

 

[sthf]

@airtel That's for V-LAP bro, not base bleed. Also G5 is the right equivalent not G6.

It is my understanding that unique features of prototypes will be merged as the base design is still DRDO ATAGS. So we can look forwards to ATAGS with Tata's APU and Bharat Forge/ Elbit's autoloader.

But I am glad that two assembly lines will carry on the production.

 

[airtel]

@airtel That's for V-LAP bro, not base bleed. .

read that First line , 50km with base bleed .

It is my understanding that unique features of prototypes will be merged as the base design is still DRDO ATAGS. So we can look forwards to ATAGS with Tata's APU and Bharat Forge/ Elbit's autoloader.

But I am glad that two assembly lines will carry on the production.

i think bharat forge ATAGS is superior & costly , we dont need that advanced system at every place so to reduce cost Desi TATA product will be manufactured too .

 

[sthf]

read that First line , 50km with base bleed .

Yep, my bad.

~~~~~~~~~~||~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Vinod DX9]

G6 is SPH, ATAGS is towed...different isn't it. I believe it made record in towed class

 

[patriots]

mera desh badal rahahay ...we have our own attack helo...own fighter jet ....own tank .own artillery..own bvraam ...own atgm .....own aircraft carrier (will be inducted in future).... own nuclear submarine ...own conventional submarine ....own luh(will be inducted).... …..now we can say .....we can fight a long war ...as we have our own weapons.... stilll a long way to go .

 

[devhensh]

mera desh badal rahahay ...we have our own attack helo...own fighter jet ....own tank .own artillery..own bvraam ...own atgm .....own aircraft carrier (will be inducted in future).... own nuclear submarine ...own conventional submarine ....own luh(will be inducted).... …..now we can say .....we can fight a long war ...as we have our own weapons.... stilll a long way to go .

True ....and the Proof of the pudding is in the eating....Quantifiable results speak for themself.....Good Job DRDO and Team !

 

[Vinod DX9]

Two ATAGS models.........

 

[cobra commando]

______________________________

 

[ezsasa]

View attachment 19940
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If this is a recent event....

Baba was pursuing a defined policy for testing arty guns from private industry since 2014 and before, let's hope that's sorted now.

I wonder who pays for the arty trials?
firing 2000 shells for trails any Indian Pvt company will go kangaal...

 

[Hari Sud]

Snag dogging Indian howitzer seen in original Bofors too


NAGPUR: Preliminary findings of the probe into the muzzle hit, a malfunction which has been dogging the Dhanush, Indian version of Bofors howitzers, say the incident was due to defect in the shell. During both test fires in May and July, a shell hit the gun's muzzle. There is a muzzle brake at the tip of the barrel, and the shell cannot fly to its full range if it hits this part.

The report submitted for the incident in May says that the muzzle hit took place due to premature explosion of the shell. This means, the defect has to be in the shell and not the gun's design, says sources having knowledge of the affair. Further investigation is continuing, with the final report yet to be put up. The snag has pushed back induction of the guns into the Army.

However, data accessed by TOI shows that as many as 40 incidents of muzzle hit have been reported even in the original Swedish Bofors. This took place after the Army had inducted the gun. The findings into these incidents blamed the shell for the malfunction.

The latest incident took place in February 2015. The findings say the incident can be attributed to 'old ammunition'. According to the data with TOI, around eight muzzle breach incidents took place in 2002 and 2003. A high number of incidents were seen in the Bofors guns during 2008 and 2009 too. In 2008, a barrel split into two pieces during training at the School of Artillery at Deolali, Maharashtra. This incident was attributed to premature explosion of the shell.
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In Dhanush, one case of barrel burst and two of muzzle hit have been reported. In 2013, the barrel burst during trials at Pokharan. This was followed by muzzle hit in May and June this year.
Dhanush is being made by the Gun Carriage Factory (GCF), Jabalpur, which comes under the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB). Reasons of the muzzle hit in the gun are being probed. Sources following the development say muzzle hit cases are not new in artillery guns.

Last week, an incident of barrel burst was reported in the K-9 Thunder guns, which India is buying from Korea. Two soldiers of the Korean army were killed in the incident. The Korean army has stopped training with this gun.

Data shows that the incident is also seen in guns of other makes, apart from 155mm howitzers like Bofors and Dhanush. Even in the 130mm guns with the Army, as many as 60 cases of muzzle hit have been reported.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...-original-bofors-too/articleshow/60298344.cms

Just hold on for a minute, Indian Army is already busy finding defects. They have already found defects in Dhanush and soon with DRDO's ATAG gun.

They are hell bent on imports hence testing is skewed in such a way that a defect comes to the surface after massive testing. That is what they are after.

This is a bunch of spoiled generals whose luxury retirement is guaranteed by arms merchants if local product is rejected in favour of imports.

 

[Prashant12]

Indigenous artillery gun sets new record in range

The Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System at the 68th Republic Day Parade. | Photo Credit: R.V. Moorthy


NEW DELHI: An indigenous artillery gun, Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System (ATAGS), being jointly developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and the private sector has set a new world record in range by hitting targets at a distance of 48 km.

“During trial firings at Pokhran ranges last week, ATAGS registered the longest ever distance of 48.074 kms, surpassing the maximum ranges of 35-40 kms fired by any artillery gun system in this category,” an industry source told The Hindu.

ATAGS is a 155mm, 52 calibre towed artillery gun being developed in mission mode by DRDO as a part of the Army’s artillery modernisation programme. The record was achieved with special ammunition, “high explosive – base bleed” (HE – BB) by the ATAGS variant developed by Kalyani Group.

The development is being done through a consortium based model, similar to that adopted for the Pinaka multi-barrel rocket launch system. It was designed by DRDO’s Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune. In addition, Bharat Forge Limited of Kalyani Group, Tata Power Strategic Engineering Division and Mahindra Defence Naval System from the private sector are involved in a big way along with the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB). For instance, the barrel and breech mechanism, on both variants of ATAGS, was developed at Kalyani Group.

Summer trials are currently underway and the next round of trials are likely to held in Sikkim in December.

“The trials are progressing well. Additional prototypes are being made to speed trials,” one official said.

The gun has several significant features including an all-electric drive, high mobility, quick deployability, auxiliary power mode, advanced communication system, automated command and control system. It has a six round magazine instead of a standard three round magazine. Also, the gun weighs slightly more than normal due to the larger chamber.

The Army has not inducted any new artillery gun since the Bofors in the 1980's. After decades of failed attempts, the service is gearing up to induct the Dhanush artillery gun which is an indigenously upgraded variant of the Bofors gun. In addition, last November India signed a contract for 145 M-777 Ultra-Light Howitzers from the US.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...-sets-new-record-in-range/article19693728.ece

 

[Prashant12]

Indigenous artillery gun sets new record in range

The Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System at the 68th Republic Day Parade. | Photo Credit: R.V. Moorthy



NEW DELHI: An indigenous artillery gun, Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System (ATAGS), being jointly developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and the private sector has set a new world record in range by hitting targets at a distance of 48 km.

“During trial firings at Pokhran ranges last week, ATAGS registered the longest ever distance of 48.074 kms, surpassing the maximum ranges of 35-40 kms fired by any artillery gun system in this category,” an industry source told The Hindu.

ATAGS is a 155mm, 52 calibre towed artillery gun being developed in mission mode by DRDO as a part of the Army’s artillery modernisation programme. The record was achieved with special ammunition, “high explosive – base bleed” (HE – BB) by the ATAGS variant developed by Kalyani Group.

The development is being done through a consortium based model, similar to that adopted for the Pinaka multi-barrel rocket launch system. It was designed by DRDO’s Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune. In addition, Bharat Forge Limited of Kalyani Group, Tata Power Strategic Engineering Division and Mahindra Defence Naval System from the private sector are involved in a big way along with the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB). For instance, the barrel and breech mechanism, on both variants of ATAGS, was developed at Kalyani Group.

Summer trials are currently underway and the next round of trials are likely to held in Sikkim in December.

“The trials are progressing well. Additional prototypes are being made to speed trials,” one official said.

The gun has several significant features including an all-electric drive, high mobility, quick deployability, auxiliary power mode, advanced communication system, automated command and control system. It has a six round magazine instead of a standard three round magazine. Also, the gun weighs slightly more than normal due to the larger chamber.

The Army has not inducted any new artillery gun since the Bofors in the 1980's. After decades of failed attempts, the service is gearing up to induct the Dhanush artillery gun which is an indigenously upgraded variant of the Bofors gun. In addition, last November India signed a contract for 145 M-777 Ultra-Light Howitzers from the US.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...-sets-new-record-in-range/article19693728.ece

 

[Adioz]

Indigenous artillery gun sets new record in range

The Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System at the 68th Republic Day Parade. | Photo Credit: R.V. Moorthy



NEW DELHI: An indigenous artillery gun, Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System (ATAGS), being jointly developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and the private sector has set a new world record in range by hitting targets at a distance of 48 km.

“During trial firings at Pokhran ranges last week, ATAGS registered the longest ever distance of 48.074 kms, surpassing the maximum ranges of 35-40 kms fired by any artillery gun system in this category,” an industry source told The Hindu.

ATAGS is a 155mm, 52 calibre towed artillery gun being developed in mission mode by DRDO as a part of the Army’s artillery modernisation programme. The record was achieved with special ammunition, “high explosive – base bleed” (HE – BB) by the ATAGS variant developed by Kalyani Group.

The development is being done through a consortium based model, similar to that adopted for the Pinaka multi-barrel rocket launch system. It was designed by DRDO’s Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune. In addition, Bharat Forge Limited of Kalyani Group, Tata Power Strategic Engineering Division and Mahindra Defence Naval System from the private sector are involved in a big way along with the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB). For instance, the barrel and breech mechanism, on both variants of ATAGS, was developed at Kalyani Group.

Summer trials are currently underway and the next round of trials are likely to held in Sikkim in December.

“The trials are progressing well. Additional prototypes are being made to speed trials,” one official said.

The gun has several significant features including an all-electric drive, high mobility, quick deployability, auxiliary power mode, advanced communication system, automated command and control system. It has a six round magazine instead of a standard three round magazine. Also, the gun weighs slightly more than normal due to the larger chamber.

The Army has not inducted any new artillery gun since the Bofors in the 1980's. After decades of failed attempts, the service is gearing up to induct the Dhanush artillery gun which is an indigenously upgraded variant of the Bofors gun. In addition, last November India signed a contract for 145 M-777 Ultra-Light Howitzers from the US.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...-sets-new-record-in-range/article19693728.ece

As early as 10 years ago, the field arty rationalization plan to procure ~4000 guns was expected to be fulfilled in a 20 year period with either outright purchase of guns, or local licensed production.
10 years later, we now know that only a very small fraction of the 4000 guns would be foreign (M 777 and Mounted Gun System). Most of the towed artillery will be replaced by world class Indian guns designed and manufactured in India.

The pace of maturity of our defence industry has now begun to pick-up, and consequently, so has the pace of modernisation. And this is despite the indecision during the UPA tenure. I can't wait to see how the Indian Defence Industry will grow in the next 10 years, and how it will surpass all our expectations. I can only imagine what the Indian Armed Forces will look like in 2030 with a defence budget increase of $100 billion which will seem like an increase of $200 billion due to the immense rise in capital outlay, backed by a much much stronger Indigineous arms industry (which will save forex and be cheaper) and a more robust MoD. Even replacing our entire Armour, which seems to be a herculean task right now, would be much easier once FMBT, FICV and its family of tracked vehicles come online in late 2020s.

 

[SanjeevM]

Indigenous artillery gun sets new record in range

The Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System at the 68th Republic Day Parade. | Photo Credit: R.V. Moorthy



NEW DELHI: An indigenous artillery gun, Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System (ATAGS), being jointly developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and the private sector has set a new world record in range by hitting targets at a distance of 48 km.

“During trial firings at Pokhran ranges last week, ATAGS registered the longest ever distance of 48.074 kms, surpassing the maximum ranges of 35-40 kms fired by any artillery gun system in this category,” an industry source told The Hindu.

ATAGS is a 155mm, 52 calibre towed artillery gun being developed in mission mode by DRDO as a part of the Army’s artillery modernisation programme. The record was achieved with special ammunition, “high explosive – base bleed” (HE – BB) by the ATAGS variant developed by Kalyani Group.

The development is being done through a consortium based model, similar to that adopted for the Pinaka multi-barrel rocket launch system. It was designed by DRDO’s Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune. In addition, Bharat Forge Limited of Kalyani Group, Tata Power Strategic Engineering Division and Mahindra Defence Naval System from the private sector are involved in a big way along with the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB). For instance, the barrel and breech mechanism, on both variants of ATAGS, was developed at Kalyani Group.

Summer trials are currently underway and the next round of trials are likely to held in Sikkim in December.

“The trials are progressing well. Additional prototypes are being made to speed trials,” one official said.

The gun has several significant features including an all-electric drive, high mobility, quick deployability, auxiliary power mode, advanced communication system, automated command and control system. It has a six round magazine instead of a standard three round magazine. Also, the gun weighs slightly more than normal due to the larger chamber.

The Army has not inducted any new artillery gun since the Bofors in the 1980's. After decades of failed attempts, the service is gearing up to induct the Dhanush artillery gun which is an indigenously upgraded variant of the Bofors gun. In addition, last November India signed a contract for 145 M-777 Ultra-Light Howitzers from the US.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...-sets-new-record-in-range/article19693728.ece

We should start production right now. Army should place an order in large numbers. Let the trials continue to take place at its own pace. In case any modifications are required, they can be done later as well. Trials should not hold us from producing the guns right now.

We need to act fast and prepare fast. Stronger India will itself be a deterrent for enemies.

 

[ezsasa]

We should start production right now. Army should place an order in large numbers. Let the trials continue to take place at its own pace. In case any modifications are required, they can be done later as well. Trials should not hold us from producing the guns right now.

We need to act fast and prepare fast. Stronger India will itself be a deterrent for enemies.

That is not the way to do things.
Mistakes not corrected in the beginning will haunt us for 3-4 decades.

 

[cobra commando]

______________________________

 

[Prashant12]

Advanced artillery gun passes user trials in deserts: DRDO


Pune: The country's first fully integrated Advanced Towed Artillery Gun System (ATAGS), being developed by the Defence Research and Developed Organisation (DRDO), has successfully completed user assisted technical trials for desert terrain at the Pokhran firing range in Rajasthan.

P K Mehta, DRDO's director general for armament and combat engineering system, told TOI on Wednesday, "We have achieved the desired results in the user assisted trials and the gun is now poised for further trials (for other terrains) in the coming months."

The trials in the deserts were carried out by DRDO scientists and the Indian Army's director general for artillery from August 24 to September 7. A large number of extended range full bore artillery ammunitions were successfully fired from the gun during the trials.


Project director S V Gade of the Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE) in Pune, who anchored the trials, said, "The users (Indian Army) fired all type of ammunitions and achieved the desired range and consistency for the live ammunition. In fact, the gun successfully hit a target at 48km distance. No other contemporary artillery guns are able to achieve a range of more than 40km so far." The ATAGS is capable of firing a Bi-Modular Charge System (BMCS) Zone 7 propellant, which no other country is able to fire as on date, he added.

Gade said, "We have also validated firing table in a limited way of the gun, which was very crucial task for us."


The ATAGS has an all-electric drive which gives advantage over traditional hydraulic drives which exists in other towed guns. The electric drives of the ATAGS gives controls in handling ammunition, opening and closing the breech mech. and ramming the round into firing chamber, Gade added.


"The gun will undergo refinements and will be ready for high altitude trials which are likely to be conducted at Sikkim in December, depending on a confirmation from the army authorities," Gade said. The gun is expected to be inducted in the Indian Army by 2020, sources in DRDO said.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ials-in-deserts-drdo/articleshow/60861956.cms

 

[EXPERT]

Article of 2014, please delete if already posted

Why the Indian Artillery lacks the indigenous Bi Modular Charge System (BMCS)?

The foundation stone of the fortieth Ordnance Factory for manufacture of Bi Modular Charge System(BMCS) for the Indian army’s artillery was laid at Rajgir in Nalanda on April 14, 1999 by the then Prime Minister of India. The factory was expected to be completed by November 2005. Since the sanction of the project, a lot of otherwise grueling positives have happened, which include acquisition of approximately 2,650 acres of land, rehabilitation of 1,191 families[ii] that were displaced, conclusion of contracts for Transfer of Technology (ToT) and construction of manufacturing plants with some of the biggest firms in the world like Denel of South Africa, Israel Military Industries (IMI), Biazzi of Switzerland and Bowas of Austria; after several rounds of tendering[iii]. As on January 01, 2012 the Ordnance Factory Nalanda had on its roll 142 employees[iv] and till May 31, 2014 over Rupees 910 crores have been expended on the project. Despite pressing user demand, commitment of the country’s executive, colossal investment of public money and all the activity, the factory isn’t producing as yet. What makes matters worse is the fact that in response to a recent parliament question, the Government has informed that no time line has been fixed for completion of construction of Ordnance Factory at Nalanda in view of the uncertainties in procurement/fabrication of the BMCS plant[v].

Many have referred to the project as jinxed but on the other hand the story of factory at Nalanda tells all about the pitfalls involved in building indigenous defence capability through the public sector route. Apart from failings in project planning and procedural inadequacies; reaction to corruption, fear of corruption and corruption contribute the most towards system’s failing. An analysis of the activities and decisions taken regarding the factory in past 15 years throws up some very good deductions with respect to our capability accretion process.

The Ordnance Factory Nalanda needs three plants to operationalize. The foremost being the BMCS main plant which constitutes of five sub plants. These include the Combustible Cartridge Case Plant, Single Base Propellant Plant, Triple Base Propellant Plant, Nitro-cellulose/Nitro-glycerin paste Plant and Propellant Charge Assembly Plant. The two secondary plants are those which manufacture primary ingredients - Nitro-glycerin and Nitro-cellulose. Interestingly, these three plants were tendered separately. The project of setting up of the factory was thus effectively converted into three independent and uncoordinated procurement decisions. The current reality is that while the feeder plants are raring to go, the main BMCS plant is nowhere in sight. The feeder plants may even waste out even before the factory sees some real action! Sound Project planning is pivotal to any infrastructure creation. Things may have been entirely different if the three plants were tendered as a package deal.

The reaction to corruption is next area of concern which needs to be analysed pragmatically. The Army after extensive trials recommended procurement of BMCS from Somchem, a division of Denel, South Africa, in 1998-99. The company was the only known manufacturer of BMCS at that time. A contract was concluded with Denel for procuring 4 lakh BMCS modules in April 2002 along with TOT for indigenous production. The contract envisaged delivery of TOT documents which comprised of product specifications including detailed dimensional drawings and designs, quality and inspection procedures, process descriptions and production methods in respect of raw materials, intermediate products and final products. The total cost of the TOT package was of US $ 13.99 million. Tender Enquiry for construction of the BMCS plant was issued for the first time on March 29, 2004. The technical bids were opened on July 12, 2004 and price bids on October 26, 2004. IMI Israel emerged as the L-1 firm at a cost of Rupees 571.71 crore. However, the Ministry of Defence in June 2005 decided to cancel all contracts with Denel due to allegations of corruptions in some other case. The Nalanda project was also kept in abeyance from June 2005 to July 2006, even though Denel had supplied the necessary ToT documents and payment for it had been made. The decision to hold the project in abeyance as also subsequent delay in finalizing contracts led to considerable cost and time overrun. The estimated cost as per revised sanction increased to Rupees 2,160.51 crore in February 2009 from Rupees 941 crore originally sanctioned. The reaction to corruption in the instant case had no effect on Denel but the army suffered immensely.

After the project was restarted in July 2006, IMI asked for price increase from the originally quoted price of Rupees 571.71 crore to Rupees 654.79 crore. OFB did not accept the increased price and issued fresh global tender enquiry on February 26, 2007 with a view to generate more competition. Out of the five companies to whom tenders were issued, only three responded. Later, only two companies remained in consideration since the third refused to sign the integrity pact. The price bid was opened on 28 January 2008. The offer of IMI Israel was the lowest at Rupees 1,090.83 crore and the next higher quote was at Rupees 1,885 crore. During the earlier negotiations, the escalation demanded by the IMI was 15 per cent over a period of two years from July 2004 to August 2006. Against the fresh tender, the escalation was 67 per cent over a period of one year. Refusal to accept the asking price of Rupees 654.79 crore proved very costly. One actually wonders what prompted retendering, when it was known that firms capable and willing to supply BMCS plant are very few. Playing too safe in almost all cases adds to costs.

The contract for the BMCS plant with IMI Israel was finally concluded in March 2009 at the total cost of Rupees 1,175 crore. Advance amounting to Rupees 174 crore was also paid to IMI, which remained idle as all the transactions with IMI were put on hold in June 2009 by the Ministry of Defence. Finally, corruption took its toll and the contract was cancelled post investigation of allegations relating to illegal gratification. IMI was debarred from doing any further business dealing with Ministry of Defence for a period of ten years.

Having failed to procure the plant it was decided to fabricate the BMCS plant indigenously. Despite claims of competence by DRDO and the OFB the required plants haven’t materialized till date. Interestingly, DRDO had claimed to have addressed the requirement way back in 2006. To quote from the December 2006 issue of Technology Focus, a bulletin of the DRDO, “DRDO has developed BMCS for 39 caliber 155 mm guns, which can also be used for 45/52 caliber 155 mm guns. … … … Dynamic trials have established that indigenous BMCS are equivalent to imported BMCS in all respects like muzzle velocity and range[vi].” Currently, a Project Monitoring Board at the level of the Ministry of Defence and a steering committee at the level of the OFB, are in place to monitor the project. Both are unable to indicate a timeline for completion of the project, as on 15 July 2014.

It is very apparent from the case that the public sector entities which form the Indian defence supply chain have failed to procure from foreign manufacturers/indigenously fabricate the BMCS plant. This is despite the fact that the country has purchased the requisite technology to include product specifications, detailed dimensional drawings and designs, quality and inspection procedures, process descriptions and production methods in respect of raw materials, intermediate products and final products. In the last fifteen years we have made repeated attempts to address failings in operationalization of Ordnance Factory at Nalanda by repeating steps of the procedure for capital procurement. It is time for decision makers to stop reinforcing failures. It is time to redefine the Indian army’s supply chain for BMCS. If we fail to exploit the domestic private sector defence industry to execute the project, our state will not change. It is time to privatise or at least corporatise.


http://www.claws.in/1242/why-the-in...-modular-charge-system-bmcs-sanjay-sethi.html

 

[Kunal Biswas]

We are now exporting Bi-modular charges to UAE ..