China Economy: News & Discussion

MiG-29SMT

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The one doing propaganda is you, because you have a bullshit belief system that all countries are equally good/bad ( except China according to you coz its system is something you dislike).



You are the one who is doing the bullshit of conflating American government with a random american individual. Tractor was not made by the US govt. So it has no bearing on trying to evaluate which nation is better/worse in terms of government.

I didnt say America is totally evil. I said America is the worst nation on the planet, due to its actions towards its own people and foreigners. You aredoing bullshit propganda of trying to make all nations 'equally good/bad' due to your bullshit anti-factual belief system.

According to you, is Nazi Germany equally good/bad as Mexico ? If so, why ? if not so, why ?
You still try to hide your hate.

I am a person with some values get it, If you ask me there is in history of Mexico a mexican government like nazi germany I can tell you yes.
1718143136196.png


Aztecs had policies of capturing people in war, sacrificing them and eating them, thousends die during their ritual celebrationbs, that was a bad ideology get it.

1718143256962.png


Drug traffickers are making human sacrifices to ‘Saint Death’
By
Fox News
Published July 17, 2017, 3:42 p.m. ET

Ok some idiots and bad people in Mexico are doing the same, drugs and Human sacrifice, in our times.

That is a bad ideology from mexico, will I deny that?
No way.

However this is a china economy thread and since these scum from my country do not help any one I can tell you the Chinese Government sends fentanyl ingridients to them.

If you think the CCP is good well, i also know there are american mafias in the USA even policies that support that.

Buit I also know there are many good americans because also in the USA lives 45% of my family, I have family in the USA and I lived in the USA in the past and I have american friends. so cut it up no nation is perfect but Ideology is what destroys, a child becomes a good or bad person due to education basically ideology
 

GaudaNaresh

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You still try to hide youyr hate.
I am not hiding my hate. I am giving valid reasons for my hate. you are the one trying to make it all equal-equal due to your bullshit belief system

I am a person with some values get it, If you ask me there is in history of Mexico a mexican government like nazi germany I can tell you yes.
View attachment 257613

Aztecs had policies of capturing people in war, sacrificing them and eating them, thousends die during their ritual celebrationbs, that was a bad ideology get it.
Typical bullshit of idiots like you are in display. Aztecs are NOT mexican government- they never were, given that they never exercised state control over mexico. I also categorically said in modern times. So why did you ignore that ?

Ok some ideots and bad people in Mexico are doing the same, drugs and Human sacrifice, in our times.

That is a bad ideology from mexico, will I deny that?
No way.
But you are trying to say that this is the same as Nazi ideology? No difference ?

However this is a china economy thread and since these scum from my country do not help any one I can tell you the Chinese Government sends fentanyl ingridients to them.

If you think the CCP is good well, i also know there are american mafias in the USA even policies that support that.

Buit I also know there are many good americans because also in the USA lives 45% of my family, I have family in the USA and I lived in the USA and I have american friends. so cut it up no nation is perfect but Ideology is what destroys, a child becomes a good or bad person due to education basically ideology
So in other words, you have a bias for america because your family lives there. Thats not a rational argument. I think CCP is a better government than American government due to track record: america has killed far more of its own people and foreigners than CCP has in my lifetime.

again,we dont have to be perfect to say that you are worse. Your ideology being anti-truth is at full display here.
 

MiG-29SMT

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I am not hiding my hate. I am giving valid reasons for my hate. you are the one trying to make it all equal-equal due to your bullshit belief system



Typical bullshit of idiots like you are in display. Aztecs are NOT mexican government- they never were, given that they never exercised state control over mexico. I also categorically said in modern times. So why did you ignore that ?



But you are trying to say that this is the same as Nazi ideology? No difference ?



So in other words, you have a bias for america because your family lives there. Thats not a rational argument. I think CCP is a better government than American government due to track record: america has killed far more of its own people and foreigners than CCP has in my lifetime.

again,we dont have to be perfect to say that you are worse. Your ideology being anti-truth is at full display here.
I can give you many reasons from technology, family and culture why I like The USA

I never claimed the USA is perfect, but I can mention

1718144044201.png


first reason no nation in modern times has shaped more modern life than the USA.

My family lives there, yes but they live well, they are living well.

Aztecs were the empire where mexico takes its name, so technically they are the government of ancient Mexico, mexico city was founded by them.

So when i balance the good traits of USA versus the bad traits, i consider it is a great nation but it has sins too.

has China built the technology it uses? no they are basically manufacturing american inventions and use Comunism a Western Idea, rejected by the west already, even Russia is not communist any more.

Can China, india, Mexico develop technology, yes we can but the american society has a social system that promoted invention and democracy and saddly communism only promotes military technology.

CCP is totalitarian in nature
 

GaudaNaresh

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I can give you many reasons from technology, family and culture why I like The USA

I never claimed the USA is perfect, but I can mention

Technology isnt reason to like/dislike a country, since technology is an individual accomplishment. National policies, social structure, etc- they are to evaluate a country, since they are societal and government accomplishments.
Your family being in USA isnt a reason to like USA for us. Thats called your bias.

first reason no nation in modern times has shaped more modern life than the USA.
UK. The inventor of modern age, with industrial revolution.

My family lives there, yes but they live well, they are living well.
That is bias, not reason. 'i like a country coz my family lives there' is a bias, not a reason why that country is objectively good.

Aztecs were the empire where mexico takes its name, so technically they are the government of ancient Mexico, mexico city was founded by them.
No. Technically they are not the government of mexico at any point, because aztecs did not have concept of nation-state.
I also said that the US is the worst nation in the modern era. So aztecs do not enter the equation.

So when i balance the good traits of USA versus the bad traits, i consider it is a great nation but it has sins too.
Thats called bias. You are balancing US society & government's actions with the individual people's inventions. Not comparable or equal.

has China built the technology it uses? no they are basically manufacturing american inventions and use Comunism a Western Idea, rejected by the west already, even Russia is not communist any more.
China is a bigger inventor now than USA and has been for the last 4-5 years: China files more patents than USA does.

Can China, india, Mexico develop technology, yes we can but the american society has a social system that promoted invention and democracy and saddly communism only promotes military technology.
Except facts show that China is already ahead of USA in inventions for the past 5-6 years.

CCP is totalitarian in nature
But far more humane than US society and government. hence they are better country.

You seem to be too ignorant to actually compare and come to a conclusion as to whether A>B or B>A and rely too much on your bias and bullshit ideology.
 

MiG-29SMT

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Technology isnt reason to like/dislike a country, since technology is an individual accomplishment. National policies, social structure, etc- they are to evaluate a country, since they are societal and government accomplishments.
Your family being in USA isnt a reason to like USA for us. Thats called your bias.



UK. The inventor of modern age, with industrial revolution.



That is bias, not reason. 'i like a country coz my family lives there' is a bias, not a reason why that country is objectively good.



No. Technically they are not the government of mexico at any point, because aztecs did not have concept of nation-state.
I also said that the US is the worst nation in the modern era. So aztecs do not enter the equation.



Thats called bias. You are balancing US society & government's actions with the individual people's inventions. Not comparable or equal.



China is a bigger inventor now than USA and has been for the last 4-5 years: China files more patents than USA does.



Except facts show that China is already ahead of USA in inventions for the past 5-6 years.


But far more humane than US society and government. hence they are better country.

You seem to be too ignorant to actually compare and come to a conclusion as to whether A>B or B>A and rely too much on your bias and bullshit ideology.
In technology there are evolutionary steps and revolutionary ones do you understand that?

The solar panel is an american invention, however there are patents by many nations for improvements of the technology get it, some many of the patents done else where are like that.

So cut it up.


1718145099376.png


gurgel designed an electric car in the 1960 he was a brazilian inventor

tell me why I will believe that BYD has made any thing new?

Gurgel for starters was not the inventor of electric cars.


The Chinese have many patents because they recieved many forced tech transfers, so they need to nationalize those technologies to use them, plus there is a lot of frauds in fact the most hilarious one was a research in prostate cancer where a Chinese researcher claimed 50% of prostate cancer is in women.


Of course there are true research every where and the Chinese have scientist but do not exagerate, Globalization has made the western world weaker since now we live in global village.

No nation is truelly independent, all are basically dependant upon other nations.
Even DSI intakes are american inventions
1718145509184.png


Will America decay? of course, a modern civilization is emerging a global one therefore a world government is emerging, and the leader is Germany, but well time will show you that.
 

GaudaNaresh

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In technology there are evolutionary steps and revolutionary ones do you understand that?

The solar panel is an american invention, however there are patents by many nations for improvements of the technology get it, some many of the patents done else where are like that.

So cut it up.

That is not relevant. what is relevant is that every improvement IS a new technology. I can cite you the fact that China does more inventing these days than USA does and has been for the past 4-5 years.

gurgel designed an electric car in the 1960 he was a brazilian inventor

tell me why I will believe that BYD has made any thing new?

Gurgel for starters was not the inventor of electric cars.
Because the world patent authorities recognize it for making something new. Duh.


The Chinese have many patents because they recieved many forced tech transfers, so they need to nationalize those technologies to use them, plus there is a lot of frauds in fact the most hilarious one was a research in prostate cancer where a Chinese researcher claimed 50% of prostate cancer is in women.
Same for USA- USA could get ahead because of forced transfer of tech from UK as incentive to enter WW2.

Of course there are true research every where and the Chinese have scientist but do not exagerate, Globalization has made the western weaker since now we live in global village.

I am not exgaggerating: Its a citable fact that China does more inventing than USA does. Globalization has made the west weaker because the west never had the work ethic and family ethics to compete with us and in globalisation they have to.


Will America decay? of course, a modern civilization is emerging a global one therefore a world goivernment is emerging, and the leader is Germany, but well time will show you that.
There wont be a world government. Because we and China will not allow it. America will decay because its a shit country, shit society and shit people, worse than almost all the world in modern times, as objective data shows.
Germany isnt the leader of anything, its already declining thanks to being american poodle and cutting off its cheap gas from Russia to please its yankee masters.
 

MiG-29SMT

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That is not relevant. what is relevant is that every improvement IS a new technology. I can cite you the fact that China does more inventing these days than USA does and has been for the past 4-5 years.



Because the world patent authorities recognize it for making something new. Duh.




Same for USA- USA could get ahead because of forced transfer of tech from UK as incentive to enter WW2.




I am not exgaggerating: Its a citable fact that China does more inventing than USA does. Globalization has made the west weaker because the west never had the work ethic and family ethics to compete with us and in globalisation they have to.




There wont be a world government. Because we and China will not allow it. America will decay because its a shit country, shit society and shit people, worse than almost all the world in modern times, as objective data shows.
Germany isnt the leader of anything, its already declining thanks to being american poodle and cutting off its cheap gas from Russia to please its yankee masters.
Germany is the world leader, saddly you can not see it, and technology has revolutionary steps and evolutionary steps.

Solar panels use the same principle now and 60 years ago, cars the same, Chips the same.

The improvements you see are evolutionary in nature, not a new technology for such a reason Mexico can build electric cars or Solar panels, we did not create anything new we copy.
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we can built electric cars so what, we are original? not my friend we copied and many components are bought and so has been China

Argentina can build helicopters and tractors too, but the technology is not revolutionary they copied the basic design.


Copying is not designing, revolutionary technology means totally new principles.

basically it is highly dependant in science.
 

GaudaNaresh

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Germany is the world leader, saddly you can not see it, and technology has revolutionary steps and evolutionary steps.
Show us proof then that Germany is the world leader in technological innovation. What is the # of patents filed in Germany ?

Solar panels use the same principle now and 60 years ago, cars the same, Chips the same.

The improvements you see are evolutionary in nature, not a new technology for such a reason Mexico can build electric cars or Solar panels, we did not create anything new we copy.


we can built electric cars so what we are original? not my friend we copied and many conponents are bought and so has been China


If you copy a component, it does not qualify for patent. You can patent something only if its new. Your hillbilly uneducated view on technology isnt relevant. What is relevant, is patent filings.


Argentina can build helicopters and tractors too, but the technology is not revolutionary they copied the basic design.


Copying is not designing, revolutionary technology means totally new principles.

basically it is highly dependant in science.

If you copy, you cant patent. If you patent, it means you made something new. Its just that simple. As of now, China is significantly ahead of USA in innovation, given patent filings data.
 

GaudaNaresh

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Copying is not designing, revolutionary technology means totally new principles.

basically it is highly dependant in science.

here you go, total number of inventions done by the world in 2022:


China invented 1.619 million new things, which represents a whopping 46.8% of all things invented that year.
USA is almost 3 times back, with just 0.594 million inventions and a paltry 17.2% of the world.
India invented more things that year than Germany.
 

rockdog

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Biggest infrascture in Brazil obtained by China State grid!



Brazil's Largest Infrastructure Power Transmission Project Secured by China

China and Brazi
l have sealed a 30-year franchise agreement for the Brazil northeast ultra-high-voltage direct current (UHVDC) power transmission line project. The signing ceremony, attended by dignitaries including Chinese Ambassador to Brazil Zhu Qingqiao and Brazil's Minister of Mines and Energy Alexandre Silveira, marks a significant step towards fostering clean and low-carbon energy transformation on a national scale.





China to build 1,468km transmission line in Brazil

China and Brazil last week signed a 30-year franchise agreement for a new, 1,468km high-voltage transmission line to bring renewable power from Brazil’s remote northeast to the more populated centre of the country.




According to Reuters news on May 27, Brazil has surpassed Belgium to become China’s largest exporter of new energy vehicles (including pure electric vehicles and hybrid vehicles). Citing data from the China Passenger Car Association, the report said that in April, China exported 40,159 new energy vehicles to Brazil, a year-on-year increase of 12.02%, making Brazil the largest export market for China's new energy vehicles for the second consecutive month.
 

MiG-29SMT

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Show us proof then that Germany is the world leader in technological innovation. What is the # of patents filed in Germany ?



If you copy a component, it does not qualify for patent. You can patent something only if its new. Your hillbilly uneducated view on technology isnt relevant. What is relevant, is patent filings.




If you copy, you cant patent. If you patent, it means you made something new. Its just that simple. As of now, China is significantly ahead of USA in innovation, given patent filings data.
it will give you a simple concept

Culture is based upon ideas, ideas are learned behaviour thus are not instictive, nor innate, they are learned.


All humans have that ability, thus ideas influence the solutions societies have thus wealth is based upon ideas.

The west has declined because the global village means all humans are contributing to the global civilization.

Technology spreads since ideas spreads by learning.

1718150080999.png


these are solar panels powering the lights in Mexico city.

The solar panel is not a Mexican invention nor the lamp however technology has spread so a Mexican company can built them and even improve them.

Germany is the world leader because Germany is the leader of a new concept a globalized village
1718150270453.png


airbus exemplifies it is an international effort by many nations and many companies from all around the world.

The concept is all we are dependant upon each other, thus the best company is a global company that pools efforts, investment, design, manufacturing and markets upon a globalized concept.

Germany is the leader of the EU, an economic concept of a globalized government.

Thus Germany can not build everything or invent everything, they just lead an international effort as a financial concept where they lead pooling resources and spreading wealth in a way a world governement and a multinational monopoly emerges.

That is the reality of modern world.
 
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GaudaNaresh

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it will give you a simple concept

Culture is based upon ideas, ideas are learned behaviour thus are not instictive, nor innate, they are learned.


All humans have that ability, thus ideas influence the solutions societies have thus wealth is based upon ideas.

The west has declined because w global village means all humans are contributing to the global civilization.

Technology spreads since ideas spreads by learning.
West has declined because west has shit values compared to Asia. West rose on the back of racism to confine technology and science to itself ( after learning science and tech from us) and looting the shit outta the entire world.
We rose, like China, via peaceful competition and as such, have stronger work ethic, learning culture and family dynamics than the west- all of which are apparent in comparing us Asians to westerners in the west- we beat the westerners in every single good metric known to mankind.



these are solar panels powering the lights in Mexico city.

The solar panel is not a Mexican invention nor the lamp however technology has spread so a Mexican company can built them and even improve them.
You seem to uneducated about science and technology and think inventions are 'who made the first solar panel', when in reality, its about who made the first semi-conductor cheap enough to hold charge. Currently, China is the 2nd largest innovator in solar tech. Meaning, chinese inventions in solar panels = 2nd in the world.

Germany is the world leader because Germany is the leader of a new concept a globalized village


airbus exemplifies it is an intyernational effort by many nations and many companies from all around the world.

The concept is all we are dependant, thus the best company is a global company that pools efforts, investment, manufacturing and markets upon a globalized concept.

Germany is the leader of the EU, a economic concept of a globalized government.

Thus Germany can not build everything or invent everything, they just lead an international effort as a financial concept where they lead pooling resources and spreading wealth in a way a world governement and a multinational monopoly emerges.

That is the reality of modern world.
Yet, Germany for all its leadership, has a declining economy, declining industrial output and invents less stuff per year than India does.
 

MiG-29SMT

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West has declined because west has shit values compared to Asia. West rose on the back of racism to confine technology and science to itself ( after learning science and tech from us) and looting the shit outta the entire world.
We rose, like China, via peaceful competition and as such, have stronger work ethic, learning culture and family dynamics than the west- all of which are apparent in comparing us Asians to westerners in the west- we beat the westerners in every single good metric known to mankind.





You seem to uneducated about science and technology and think inventions are 'who made the first solar panel', when in reality, its about who made the first semi-conductor cheap enough to hold charge. Currently, China is the 2nd largest innovator in solar tech. Meaning, chinese inventions in solar panels = 2nd in the world.



Yet, Germany for all its leadership, has a declining economy, declining industrial output and invents less stuff per year than India does.
Time will prove who is right your ideas or my ideas, but germany will rule as a world government, not as a nation state, the world government is here.

You are free to think as you think and I will not try to convince you.
 

GaudaNaresh

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Time will prove who is right your ideas or my ideas, but germany will rule as a world government, not as a nation state, the world government is here.

You are free to think as you think and I will not try to convince you.
There is no 'time will tell ' on ideas- ideas are right/wrong based on the logic and facts presented in them, not how popular they are. Germany is a declining country. Dying people who cant breed, with economy in recession and continuously declining share of global innovations ( along with all of the west).
So how will germany rule anything ?
The world govt isnt here. Because the world isnt the declining minority of the world known as 'western world'. Last i checked, the center of human civilisation and population is Asia and there is zero movement there towards 'world government'. So no world government.Unless ofcourse, you are a typical euro-centric retard who thinks 'world' means western world.


I literally gave you proof how China invents more stuff than USA and Germany put together currently. Its not my problem if you can't accept facts.
 

MiG-29SMT

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There is no 'time will tell ' on ideas- ideas are right/wrong based on the logic and facts presented in them, not how popular they are. Germany is a declining country. Dying people who cant breed, with economy in recession and continuously declining share of global innovations ( along with all of the west).
So how will germany rule anything ?
The world govt isnt here. Because the world isnt the declining minority of the world known as 'western world'. Last i checked, the center of human civilisation and population is Asia and there is zero movement there towards 'world government'. So no world government.Unless ofcourse, you are a typical euro-centric retard who thinks 'world' means western world.


I literally gave you proof how China invents more stuff than USA and Germany put together currently. Its not my problem if you can't accept facts.
itis easy to show you you are wrong.

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by human development the Europeans americans and comonthwealth are the most developed.

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salaries

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globalization means common consumption of the same goods and their manufacturing on international basis among different countries.
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1718192377719.png


1718192418770.png


world government means international institutions dictate national policies for example Agenda 2030

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world Army means ganging of several countries to impose policies as an international force

1718192212076.png


internacional justice court.

If you can not see i will not force my points .
 

MiG-29SMT

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EU to hit Chinese electrical vehicles with extra tariffs of up to 38%
Philip Blenkinsop
Updated Wed, June 12, 2024 at 9:29 PM GMT+9·4 min read
By Philip Blenkinsop

BRUSSELS (Reuters) -The European Commission told automakers on Wednesday it would impose extra duties of up to 38.1% on imported Chinese electric cars from July, in a move that China called protectionist but its car industry dismissed as one without a major impact.

Less than a month after Washington quadrupled duties quadrupled duties for Chinese EVs to 100%, Brussels said it would set additional tariffs of 17.4% for BYD, 20% for Geely and 38.1% for SAIC, on top of the existing 10%, over what it said were excessive subsidies.


That equates to billions of euros of extra costs for the carmakers at a time they are struggling with slowing demand and falling prices at home, according to Reuters calculations based on 2023 EU trade data.

The move comes as European automakers are being challenged by an influx of lower-cost EVs from Chinese rivals.

Shares in some of Europe's biggest carmakers which make a big portion of their sales in China, fell on fears of Chinese retaliation. Some like BMW will also now incur duties on their EVs made in China and sold in Europe.

"This anti-subsidy investigation is a typical case of protectionism," said Chinese foreign ministry spokesperson Lin Jian, adding the tariffs would damage China-EU economic and trade cooperation and the stability of the global automobile production and supply chain.

Lin said China urged the EU to support free trade, adding Beijing would take all necessary measures to "firmly safeguard" its legitimate rights and interests.

The Chinese Passenger Car Association seemed less concerned.

"The EU's provisional tariffs come basically within our expectations, averaging around 20%, which won't have much of an impact on the majority of Chinese firms," CPCA Secretary General Cui Dongshu said.

"Those exporting China-made EVs that include Tesla, Geely and BYD still have huge potential for development in Europe in the future," Cui said.

China's commerce ministry said it would closely monitor the development and take all necessary measures to safeguard the legitimate rights of Chinese companies.

Beijing has already launched an anti-dumping investigation into mostly French-made imports of brandy. It also passed a law in April to strengthen its ability to hit back should the United States or EU impose tariffs on exports of the world's No. 2 economy.

The EU provisional duties are set to apply by July 4, with the anti-subsidy investigation set to continue until Nov. 2, when definitive duties, typically for five years, could apply.

The Commission said it would apply rates of 21% for companies deemed to have cooperated with the investigation and of 38.1% for those it said had not.

Western producers such as Tesla and BMW that export cars from China to Europe were considered cooperating companies.

Margaritis Schinas, a Commission vice president, told a news conference that Chinese-built cars were benefiting from unfair levels of subsidies, threatening EU producers.

"On this basis the Commission has reached out to Chinese authorities to discuss these findings and explore possible ways for resolving the issues identified," he told a news conference.

The indicative tariffs are above expectations of analysts of between 10% and 25% on Chinese EVs.

BYD, Geely, SAIC and Tesla did not immediately respond to Reuters' queries on the report.

CHALLENGED

Some economists said the immediate effect of the additional duties would be very small in economic terms because the EU imported around 440,000 EVs from China in the 12 months ending in April worth 9 billion euros ($9.7 billion) or around 4% of household expenditure on vehicles.

"But the anti-subsidy duties are intended to limit the future growth in EV imports which would otherwise take place rather than to block existing trade," said Andrew Kenningham, chief Europe economist at Capital Economics.

"The decision marks a big change in EU trade policy because, although the EU has used trade defence measures regularly in recent years, including against China, it has not previously done so for such an important industry. And Europe has been reluctant to engage in the kind of protectionism that the US has deployed since Donald Trump’s presidency," he said.

($1 = 0.9296 euros)

(Reporting by Philip Blenkinsp, Jan Strupczewski, Disha Mishra and Abinaya Vijayaraghavan in Bengaluru; Editing by Kim Coghill, Jamie Freed and Emelia Sithole-Matarise)


BRUSSELS (AP) — The European Union moved Wednesday to hike tariffs on Chinese electric vehicles, escalating a trade dispute over Beijing's subsidies for the exports that Brussels worries is hurting domestic automakers.

The European Commission, the EU's executive arm, said it would impose provisional tariffs that would result in Chinese automakers facing additional duties of as much as 38%, up from the current level of 10%
.

The commission said it reached out to Chinese authorities to discuss the findings of its investigation into the subsidies and “explore possible ways to resolve the issues.”


“Should discussions with Chinese authorities not lead to an effective solution,” the new rates would take effect on a provisional basis by July 4, the commission said in a press release.

Electric cars are the latest flash point in a broader trade dispute over what Brussels says is China's unfair state support for green tech exports that also include solar panels, batteries and wind turbines.

Imports of Chinese-made EVs to the European Union have skyrocketed in recent years. They include vehicles from Western brands that have auto plants in China, including Tesla and BMW.

But EU officials complain that Chinese automakers like BYD and SAIC are increasing market share and undercutting European car brands on price thanks to Beijing's massive subsidies.

The commission said an investigation it opened last year into China's EV subsidies found that China's battery electric vehicle value chain “benefits from unfair subsidization, which is causing a threat of economic injury to EU BEV producers.”

The extra tariffs would vary by company. BYD would face an additional 17.4% charge. Geely, which owns Sweden's Volvo, would be hit with a further 20%. For SAIC, it would be 38.1% extra.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Lin Jian, speaking at a daily briefing, blasted the EU's investigation as ”typical protectionism" and said Beijing would "take all measures necessary to protect our legitimate rights and interests.”

U.S. President Joe Biden slapped major new tariffs on Chinese electric vehicles, advanced batteries, solar cells, steel, aluminum and medical equipment last month. Biden said that Chinese government subsidies ensure the nation’s companies don’t have to turn a profit, giving them an unfair advantage in global trade.

 

helin

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EU to hit Chinese electrical vehicles with extra tariffs of up to 38%
Philip Blenkinsop
Updated Wed, June 12, 2024 at 9:29 PM GMT+9·4 min read
By Philip Blenkinsop

BRUSSELS (Reuters) -The European Commission told automakers on Wednesday it would impose extra duties of up to 38.1% on imported Chinese electric cars from July, in a move that China called protectionist but its car industry dismissed as one without a major impact.

Less than a month after Washington quadrupled duties quadrupled duties for Chinese EVs to 100%, Brussels said it would set additional tariffs of 17.4% for BYD, 20% for Geely and 38.1% for SAIC, on top of the existing 10%, over what it said were excessive subsidies.


That equates to billions of euros of extra costs for the carmakers at a time they are struggling with slowing demand and falling prices at home, according to Reuters calculations based on 2023 EU trade data.

The move comes as European automakers are being challenged by an influx of lower-cost EVs from Chinese rivals.

Shares in some of Europe's biggest carmakers which make a big portion of their sales in China, fell on fears of Chinese retaliation. Some like BMW will also now incur duties on their EVs made in China and sold in Europe.

"This anti-subsidy investigation is a typical case of protectionism," said Chinese foreign ministry spokesperson Lin Jian, adding the tariffs would damage China-EU economic and trade cooperation and the stability of the global automobile production and supply chain.

Lin said China urged the EU to support free trade, adding Beijing would take all necessary measures to "firmly safeguard" its legitimate rights and interests.

The Chinese Passenger Car Association seemed less concerned.

"The EU's provisional tariffs come basically within our expectations, averaging around 20%, which won't have much of an impact on the majority of Chinese firms," CPCA Secretary General Cui Dongshu said.

"Those exporting China-made EVs that include Tesla, Geely and BYD still have huge potential for development in Europe in the future," Cui said.

China's commerce ministry said it would closely monitor the development and take all necessary measures to safeguard the legitimate rights of Chinese companies.

Beijing has already launched an anti-dumping investigation into mostly French-made imports of brandy. It also passed a law in April to strengthen its ability to hit back should the United States or EU impose tariffs on exports of the world's No. 2 economy.

The EU provisional duties are set to apply by July 4, with the anti-subsidy investigation set to continue until Nov. 2, when definitive duties, typically for five years, could apply.

The Commission said it would apply rates of 21% for companies deemed to have cooperated with the investigation and of 38.1% for those it said had not.

Western producers such as Tesla and BMW that export cars from China to Europe were considered cooperating companies.

Margaritis Schinas, a Commission vice president, told a news conference that Chinese-built cars were benefiting from unfair levels of subsidies, threatening EU producers.

"On this basis the Commission has reached out to Chinese authorities to discuss these findings and explore possible ways for resolving the issues identified," he told a news conference.

The indicative tariffs are above expectations of analysts of between 10% and 25% on Chinese EVs.

BYD, Geely, SAIC and Tesla did not immediately respond to Reuters' queries on the report.

CHALLENGED

Some economists said the immediate effect of the additional duties would be very small in economic terms because the EU imported around 440,000 EVs from China in the 12 months ending in April worth 9 billion euros ($9.7 billion) or around 4% of household expenditure on vehicles.

"But the anti-subsidy duties are intended to limit the future growth in EV imports which would otherwise take place rather than to block existing trade," said Andrew Kenningham, chief Europe economist at Capital Economics.

"The decision marks a big change in EU trade policy because, although the EU has used trade defence measures regularly in recent years, including against China, it has not previously done so for such an important industry. And Europe has been reluctant to engage in the kind of protectionism that the US has deployed since Donald Trump’s presidency," he said.

($1 = 0.9296 euros)

(Reporting by Philip Blenkinsp, Jan Strupczewski, Disha Mishra and Abinaya Vijayaraghavan in Bengaluru; Editing by Kim Coghill, Jamie Freed and Emelia Sithole-Matarise)


BRUSSELS (AP) — The European Union moved Wednesday to hike tariffs on Chinese electric vehicles, escalating a trade dispute over Beijing's subsidies for the exports that Brussels worries is hurting domestic automakers.

The European Commission, the EU's executive arm, said it would impose provisional tariffs that would result in Chinese automakers facing additional duties of as much as 38%, up from the current level of 10%
.

The commission said it reached out to Chinese authorities to discuss the findings of its investigation into the subsidies and “explore possible ways to resolve the issues.”


“Should discussions with Chinese authorities not lead to an effective solution,” the new rates would take effect on a provisional basis by July 4, the commission said in a press release.

Electric cars are the latest flash point in a broader trade dispute over what Brussels says is China's unfair state support for green tech exports that also include solar panels, batteries and wind turbines.

Imports of Chinese-made EVs to the European Union have skyrocketed in recent years. They include vehicles from Western brands that have auto plants in China, including Tesla and BMW.

But EU officials complain that Chinese automakers like BYD and SAIC are increasing market share and undercutting European car brands on price thanks to Beijing's massive subsidies.

The commission said an investigation it opened last year into China's EV subsidies found that China's battery electric vehicle value chain “benefits from unfair subsidization, which is causing a threat of economic injury to EU BEV producers.”

The extra tariffs would vary by company. BYD would face an additional 17.4% charge. Geely, which owns Sweden's Volvo, would be hit with a further 20%. For SAIC, it would be 38.1% extra.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Lin Jian, speaking at a daily briefing, blasted the EU's investigation as ”typical protectionism" and said Beijing would "take all measures necessary to protect our legitimate rights and interests.”

U.S. President Joe Biden slapped major new tariffs on Chinese electric vehicles, advanced batteries, solar cells, steel, aluminum and medical equipment last month. Biden said that Chinese government subsidies ensure the nation’s companies don’t have to turn a profit, giving them an unfair advantage in global trade.

Now it's time for Chinese cars to be exported to Europe,

No one would have thought 20 years ago,
 

helin

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This is an article from China's Economic Daily in 2006

Title: Writing a New Chapter for China's Automotive Industry (Economic Daily)
Date: January 9, 2006, 14:20 Source: Ministry of Science and Technology [Font size: Large, Medium, Small]
On December 20, 2005, 112 "Happy Messenger" pure electric cars, developed and produced independently in China, were shipped from Tianjin Port to the United States, marking the first large-scale export of electric vehicles from China; after more than two years of demonstration operations, 20 electric vehicles in Wuhan have collectively traveled 1.8 million kilometers, allowing more than 3 million passengers to experience the convenience of "green" transportation; the fuel cell car "Beyond No. 2," completely developed by Chinese, competed alongside well-known international brands at the World Clean Car "Mount Everest Challenge" in October 2004 in Jiading, Shanghai, achieving the highest grades in 5 out of 7 individual categories, including high-speed slalom, noise, emissions, energy consumption, and greenhouse gas reduction...
This demonstrates that China has become one of the few countries in the world to master the core technologies of research, development, manufacturing, and testing of vehicle fuel cell engines. The Chinese automotive industry is experiencing a strong "clean breeze." Behind this is the solid support of the "Tenth Five-Year" national major science and technology project —— the electric vehicle special project.
Seizing the Future Heights of Technology
Automobiles are becoming the main consumer product for Chinese residents, and the sharp increase in car ownership has also caused serious urban pollution. Developing energy-saving and environmentally friendly cars has become an inevitable choice for China's automotive industry to embark on a new path of industrialization.
Electric vehicles integrate mechanical, electrical, electronic, digital, information, and intelligent technologies, embodying modern high technologies, and are of extraordinary significance for promoting the independent development of the automotive industry. Electric vehicles, especially fuel cell vehicles representing the new generation of cars, are still in the early stages of industrialization both domestically and internationally, and China has the potential to achieve leapfrog development. As said by Wan Gang, the group leader and chief scientist of the 863 electric vehicle special project: "To fundamentally solve the problem of the rise of China's automotive industry, vigorously promoting the development of electric vehicles is a path we have to take."
In July 2001, this largest automotive technology special project in China's history was officially launched. A total of 2.4 billion yuan was invested, including 880 million yuan in national funding.
Careful Planning and Arrangement
As one of the earliest major science and technology special projects in China, the electric vehicle plan has shown a meticulous and scientific framework from the beginning.
The carefully planned and meticulously arranged "three horizontal and three vertical" research and development layout is clear and specific —— "three horizontal" refers to the common technologies of batteries, motors, and control systems, while "three vertical" refers to fuel cell vehicles, hybrid electric vehicles, and pure electric vehicles. The electric vehicle special project follows the laws of automotive research and industrialization and the characteristics of major special project management, establishing fair, open, and just competitive principles and inspection and evaluation mechanisms, providing a scientific basis for rolling project initiation. Research institutions and development companies are evaluated through an "arena" approach, with the fittest surviving.
According to this competitive principle, in 2003, the special project successfully completed the acceptance of the first phase of contracts and the rolling initiation of the second phase of research and development topics. By the end of 2004, the special project had completed the acceptance of the second round of development topics and began to start the third round of research and development.
Technical standards have been elevated to a very important position. To date, China has completed the drafting of 6 new standards for electric vehicle products and test methods, revised 5 standards, and researched 2 inspection and test methods. By September 2005, standards for pure electric vehicles in China were basically complete, and the standardization work for hybrid vehicles had been finished, with the standards soon to be announced.
During the "Tenth Five-Year" period, China has initially formed a talent pool for electric vehicles. More than 2000 scientific and technical personnel have participated directly in the research and development of the electric vehicle special project, establishing a high-level team.
Completing in Four Years What Others Did in Eight
According to the introduction, Chinese researchers, relying on independent innovation, completed in just over 4 years the technological progress that developed countries achieved in 8 years, using only 5% of the national R&D funding that foreign countries invested during the same period. In a very short time, China achieved faster technological progress with much less investment than foreign countries —
Fuel cell vehicle research and development has entered the world's advanced ranks. China's independently developed fuel cell buses and cars have significantly improved in terms of overall control performance, driving performance, safety performance,
 

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