Arjun Main Battle Tank (MBT)

[omaebakabaka]

and the 152 mm gun also weighs more than 5 tons just as i guessed.
it also has 1/3 the life span of 2A82-1M.
i wanna see its turret traverse with a 5 - 5.5 ton gun. lel
you can barely have 10-15 rounds.


it cant be called an MBT. just a new category of ground weapon systems in warfare.
it will behave just like an Self Propelled artillery. only difference is it might move faster due to larger engine than typical SPAs. but turret traverse and stabilisation of gun will be so bad. they might have to remove even more turret armour.

it will look something like this

View attachment 92326


View attachment 92325

for some reason the armata hull looks similar to the above ones. hmm.. what could be the reason..hmmm

Not sure why you are dissing Russian tanks, I will concede that they downgrade export quality but not sure if its true against India? They are built to last in Siberian type climate which will be useful to us in Himalayan sectors, relatively light and easy to maintain vs western tanks. I don't see them as negatively as you seem to do....its not a one on one but strategy that influences the results in modern wars...I remember west dissed the smooth bore gun when theirs was rifled and now they all went smooth bore

 

[Fire and groove]

Weight is not a problem, it's just an excuse. all western MBT are heavy. Even next generation russian and Chinese MBT are heavy. Problem with Arjun is fck ups one after the other. With Mk1a there are some improvement but still pathetic for such a high price.

Those tanks aren't operating within Indian and potentially Pakistani infrastructure and geography. We need mobile tanks that are easily transportable, capable of crossing most bridges and operating in mountainous, hilly, urban and desert terrain comfortably. Instead we have a tank that struggles with transportation, has atrocious firepower and logistically problematic.

 

[Fire and groove]

Just curious but I can't help but wallow in others cringe fest like a pig.

What happened,I saw the matsimus video title for red affect vs alpha defence,I did not watch it.what happened there.

Also about the technique of baiting is that I was recommending it for general use against all anti national types and anti india types.lot of anti india types are not smart and are NPCs as I have noticed, especially the Pakis and this technique is especially effective against them as they always do not check and are eager to defame.

It is underhanded but I say it is perfect as it exploits your enemies weakness and should be done without consideration.

Mate you're having an argument with people on the internet, you're not holding the Khyber pass .
Leave the "enemies of India" to people better oriented for the job.

 

[airstrike99]

Not sure why you are dissing Russian tanks, I will concede that they downgrade export quality but not sure if its true against India? They are built to last in Siberian type climate which will be useful to us in Himalayan sectors, relatively light and easy to maintain vs western tanks. I don't see them as negatively as you seem to do....its not a one on one but strategy that influences the results in modern wars...I remember west dissed the smooth bore gun when theirs was rifled and now they all went smooth bore

Not sure why you are dissing Russian tanks

i only spoke about 1 specific armata tank t-14 with 152mm 2A83 gun

I will concede that they downgrade export quality but not sure if its true against India?

all the t-72 tanks of india are knocked down versions of T-72 A called as T-72 M1. they are literally made of plain RHA steel. even a ww2 panzerschreck can pretty much pen the steel tank from any side.
the only addition we have is ERA kontakt 5 mk2 on some 970 tanks and ERA mk1 on some 500 tanks and rest are just RHA steel.

They are built to last in Siberian type climate which will be useful to us in Himalayan sectors

but our soldiers are not built to last in himalayan sector with a steel tank that doesn't have any heater. they wear heavy clothing, with which you can't even get in or get out without squeezing your entire body. the reverse applies even in thar desert. 55-60 degree desert with a steel tank.

relatively light and easy to maintain vs western tanks.

true. reliability depends on simplicity & quality depends on our pockets.

I don't see them as negatively as you seem to do

your opinion. but i see them negatively because it kills our local R&D and industry.
do you want to train hard for 5 days to make a delicious chocolate cake.

or spend some Rs every time to buy this trash

its not a one on one but strategy that influences the results in modern wars

but that doesn't rule out the probability of a one on one tank battles.( by one on one i mean allied tank regiment vs enemy regiment)
how would two equally stealth fighters fight each other?? --- dog fights.
one stealth vs one ordinary fighter??--- BVR fights

one on one is basic requirement. everything else is a supplementary feature.

I remember west dissed the smooth bore gun when theirs was rifled and now they all went smooth bore

when were you born? how old are you? how did nikita khrushchev looked like? you must have a lot of memory (just kidding. pls don't take it srsly. no offense)

1)does our army have specialised bunker busting equipment?
2)can we spend extra money for those specialised bunker busting equipment?

now i think you can understand why arjun has a rifled gun and why army doesn't want any more arjun.
we have self propelled artillery like k9 vajra. but we don't have self propelled short range howitzer. our peacefool shantidoot terrorist work together with porky army. so we should have a tank that can behave both like an mbt and a howitzer. that's why more focus was on rifled barrel. hesh for sand/clay/gravel bunkered shantidoot , PCB for concrete bunker shantidoots and TB for open spaced shantidoots.

arjun is less of an mbt and more of an

 

[omaebakabaka]

i only spoke about 1 specific armata tank t-14 with 152mm 2A83 gun


all the t-72 tanks of india are knocked down versions of T-72 A called as T-72 M1. they are literally made of plain RHA steel. even a ww2 panzerschreck can pretty much pen the steel tank from any side.
the only addition we have is ERA kontakt 5 mk2 on some 970 tanks and ERA mk1 on some 500 tanks and rest are just RHA steel.

They are kind of old now...we have seen German, US and Israeli tanks got hit by ATGMs and burn, it is relatively easy to defeat armor....comparing t72 to more modern ones is like comparing mig-21 to 4th gen planes. Tanks in any country kinda get old as time goes on and one to one replacement usually does not happen at the same time. They have to overcome deficiencies that come with generation shifts by clever strategies and compensate somewhere else whether its rocket artillery and what not...we can't just scrap 1000s of them or replace or upgrade....no country can these days except rising super power like China perhaps

but our soldiers are not built to last in himalayan sector with a steel tank that doesn't have any heater. they wear heavy clothing, with which you can't even get in or get out without squeezing your entire body. the reverse applies even in thar desert. 55-60 degree desert with a steel tank.

They are soldiers not cargo truck drivers, they are expected to survive in minimal scenarios under fighting conditions....all northern countries survived fighting wars in colder climate....infantry fights in open vs tanks

true. reliability depends on simplicity & quality depends on our pockets.

Not necessarily, quality does not always have to be expensive....japanese cars vs German shit as an example

your opinion. but i see them negatively because it kills our local R&D and industry.
do you want to train hard for 5 days to make a delicious chocolate cake.

When I first heard about Arjun I had no grey hair and now I am probably 60% facially grey Hopefully we see home made soon in upgraded/newer versions....

but that doesn't rule out the probability of a one on one tank battles.( by one on one i mean allied tank regiment vs enemy regiment)
how would two equally stealth fighters fight each other?? --- dog fights.
one stealth vs one ordinary fighter??--- BVR fights
one on one is basic requirement. everything else is a supplementary feature.

Yes and no but clever commanders fig out ways to overcome deficiencies....lots of tank battles are full of these types of stories...our mig-21 downed f-16 against odds on paper as an example

when were you born? how old are you? how did nikita khrushchev looked like? you must have a lot of memory (just kidding. pls don't take it srsly. no offense)

No offence at all....I was trying to get into NDA when I first heard Arjun if I remember correctly and you can add 20 years minimum Thats how old I am

I think soviet tanks and Russian tanks have proved themselves in many wars, but the days of tanks being decisive stopped sometime when the jets came along....without air dominance tanks are vulnerable. Wars that India fights where it requires tanks is not like houthis vs saudis or Syria vs Isis or Hezb vs Israel....we will fight formal armies and we know who we will fight. When is the last time we have seen a tank battle? Perhaps India vs Pakistan in scale in 1971.....even Iran Iraq war was not like that?

 

[airstrike99]

according to trishul -trident blogspot, -- prasun k sengupta

after 118 Arjun MK1A (68 tons with ERA and all),
Arjun MK2 will be ordered & 7 pre-production units are already in testing phase. it seems.

Arjun MK2 features -
smoothbore 120mm gun
62 tons ( with ERA and all)
3 crew instead of 4.
auto loader
1500 hp cummins engine.

some 250 Arjun MK2s will be ordered according to his blog. also this blog was written on feb 25 2021 after the news of 118 MK1A order feb 16 2021

From Arjun Mk.1 to Mk.1A to Mk.2: An Evolving MBT Family

The 124 Arjun Mk.1s were delivered to the Indian Army between 2004 and 2012 at a rate of 15 MBTs per annum and each MBT had 63% imported con...

trishul-trident.blogspot.com

what do you guys think?
is it possible to have an MK2 apart from NGMBT/GNMBT/FMBT (all are probably the same)

 

[t 90s]

according to trishul -trident blogspot, -- prasun k sengupta

after 118 Arjun MK1A (68 tons with ERA and all),
Arjun MK2 will be ordered & 7 pre-production units are already in testing phase. it seems.

Arjun MK2 features -
smoothbore 120mm gun
62 tons ( with ERA and all)
3 crew instead of 4.
auto loader
1500 hp cummins engine.

some 250 Arjun MK2s will be ordered according to his blog. also this blog was written on feb 25 2021 after the news of 118 MK1A order feb 16 2021

From Arjun Mk.1 to Mk.1A to Mk.2: An Evolving MBT Family

The 124 Arjun Mk.1s were delivered to the Indian Army between 2004 and 2012 at a rate of 15 MBTs per annum and each MBT had 63% imported con...

trishul-trident.blogspot.com

what do you guys think?
is it possible to have an MK2 apart from NGMBT/GNMBT/FMBT (all are probably the same)

That should have been the natural evolution for arjun. The tank still has better potential for growth than all other tanks in subcontinent. take chorgupta words with a pinch of salt though.

 

[omaebakabaka]

according to trishul -trident blogspot, -- prasun k sengupta

after 118 Arjun MK1A (68 tons with ERA and all),
Arjun MK2 will be ordered & 7 pre-production units are already in testing phase. it seems.

Arjun MK2 features -
smoothbore 120mm gun
62 tons ( with ERA and all)
3 crew instead of 4.
auto loader
1500 hp cummins engine.

some 250 Arjun MK2s will be ordered according to his blog. also this blog was written on feb 25 2021 after the news of 118 MK1A order feb 16 2021

From Arjun Mk.1 to Mk.1A to Mk.2: An Evolving MBT Family

The 124 Arjun Mk.1s were delivered to the Indian Army between 2004 and 2012 at a rate of 15 MBTs per annum and each MBT had 63% imported con...

trishul-trident.blogspot.com

what do you guys think?
is it possible to have an MK2 apart from NGMBT/GNMBT/FMBT (all are probably the same)

More important for me would be to deliver signed contracts on time and deployed and see some time in big excercises short of war against imported ones and what not....if its domestic build then upgrades are probably easier over time atleast on paper.

 

[airstrike99]

That should have been the natural evolution for arjun. The tank still has better potential for growth than all other tanks in subcontinent. take chorgupta words with a pinch of salt though.

keep your salt to yourself

 

[airstrike99]

someone made a 3d rendering model of MK1, MK2( now called as MK1A), MK3(could be what trishul blogspot mentioned as MK2)

this was made in 2013

image belongs to the same person, that made the video. speculation image.
initially this could be called as MK3 , but since MK2 is being called as MK1A, then MK3 could be called as MK2.

it still has 7 road wheeled hull. same hull as MK1, MK1A. so i guess weight could be around 60 - 62 tons. with 3 crew and autoloader and blow off panels with individual shutters and much more.

 

[airstrike99]

the Arjun MK2 mentioned according to the blog might be similar to k2 black panther in terms of configuration.

1500 hp engine
120mm 55 caliber length smoothbore.
3 crew, autoloader
55tons


Arjun MK1, MK1A have 120mm 55 caliber length rifled.
so MK2 could have 120 mm 55 caliber smooth bore. unlike Abrams M1A2 120 mm 44 caliber length smoothbore. Arjun MK1, MK1A guns are already longer and heavier than Abrams M1A2 gun, so no need to focus on weight part for traverse motors and stabilisation components for a 120mm L55 smoothbore gun.

while GNMBT/FMBT is likely to have a 152 mm gun

 

[shuvo@y2k10]

Arjun MK1, MK1A have 120mm 55 caliber length rifled.

The current gun is 52 caliber.

while GNMBT/FMBT is likely to have a 152 mm gun

Iit will be 125 mm smoothbore.

 

[airstrike99]

The current gun is 52 caliber.



Iit will be 125 mm smoothbore.

do you have any official info or atleast interview video apart from trishul blog info about MK2

 

[airstrike99]

there is a defence expo from 15th - 17th june i.e in 16 days. could it be possible that MK2 will be shown directly. or atleast the model will be put around in the def expo?

 

[Bleh]

there is a defence expo from 15th - 17th june i.e in 16 days. could it be possible that MK2 will be shown directly. or atleast the model will be put around in the def expo?

View attachment 92469

MSME bad, so maybe not..

 

[airstrike99]

MSME bad, so maybe not..

yooo!! bleh, you dog. you are actually back on tank thread. what do you think of trishul blog on Arjun MK2
have you found any articles or interviews on MK2 with above mentioned qualities?

i remember watching one interview ~2019 with some army colonel, where he mentioned that arjun project is still alive along with GNMBT/FMBT

however i couldn't find that video on youtube now.

also DRDO is under MOD right? so it is possible for DRDO to showcase its products.

i suspect even OFB might surprise everyone with their FICV. it seems they are working joints with military college of engineering. so they might actually come up with a good one( maybe first time in their life)

either DRDO, OFB will suprise everyone or they haven't progressed that much.

my main hope is MK1A took 2013- 2015 (2 yrs)
so lets assume 2016 is the start date of MK2. that gives them 4-5 yrs of development. not too much for a design of turret. What do you think.

 

[not so dravidian]

yooo!! bleh, you dog. you are actually back on tank thread. what do you think of trishul blog on Arjun MK2
have you found any articles or interviews on MK2 with above mentioned qualities?

i remember watching one interview ~2019 with some army colonel, where he mentioned that arjun project is still alive along with GNMBT/FMBT

however i couldn't find that video on youtube now.

also DRDO is under MOD right? so it is possible for DRDO to showcase its products.

i suspect even OFB might surprise everyone with their FICV. it seems they are working joints with military college of engineering. so they might actually come up with a good one( maybe first time in their life)

either DRDO, OFB will suprise everyone or they haven't progressed that much.

my main hope is MK1A took 2013- 2015 (2 yrs)
so lets assume 2016 is the start date of MK2. that gives them 4-5 yrs of development. not too much for a design of turret. What do you think.

In the same trishul blog me and bleh asked some questions on mk2
For my question, he said the turret is re-engineered,

 

[Bleh]

yooo!! bleh, you dog. you are actually back on tank thread. what do you think of trishul blog on Arjun MK2

Completely baseless. No info. No indication of any such thing in 10 years.. I asked him a bunch of questions, to which he gave very contradicting answers that made sense. I wouldn't trust it able any "redesigning & reengineering".. CVRDE Chief confirmed in interview there won't be any more Arjun orders but only age NGMBT os operational. 464 Tandoor-90s to keep the line running

Read from here: https://defenceforumindia.com/threads/arjun-main-battle-tank-mbt.9558/post-1862809

 

[airstrike99]

In the same trishul blog me and bleh asked some questions on mk2
For my question, he said the turret is re-engineered,

View attachment 92482

yeah i do know bleh has asked about it. however, my question was where did prasun sengupta got his info.
insider info from DRDO?

 

[Bleh]

yeah i do know bleh has asked about it. however, my question was where did prasun sengupta got his info.
insider info from DRDO?

If he's named his rectum as DRDO then yes, from right inside it.