Arjun Main Battle Tank (MBT) Mark II

[Dejawolf]

I asked you to mark the dimensions in number

Write the how many mm occupied by each of your colored blocks in your own words.

i did. 600+600+300+760 = 2260.

 

[ersakthivel]

i did. 600+600+300+760 = 2260.

O.K then,

mark all the same four dimensions on the drawing below,and lets see where they start and and where they end,

Then only we can check the correctness of your dimensions against mine because I also used the same line drawing to get my dimensions.

Since you are claiming from the star that you used the same line drawing for your side view, it should not be very difficult to do it.


Then only we can check it with photos and verify where the Tc's seat head rest and gunner seat back rest is located with reference to the inside crew compartment opening for vision block and arrive at a mutually agreeable LOS for armor brhind main sight.

Strictly based on the line drawing and photos, Since no one has seen the inside of the production version Arjun, we discuss what we know of the prototype photo we have seen.

 

[Dejawolf]

O.K then,

mark all the same four dimensions on the drawing below,and lets see where they start and and where they end,

Then only we can check the correctness of your dimensions against mine because I also used the same line drawing to get my dimensions.

Since you are claiming from the star that you used the same line drawing for your side view, it should not be very difficult to do it.

Since you failed to notice, that exact drawing is already part of my picture above, and the dimensions have already been marked.
it's at the bottom with all of those lines you put in.

 

[ersakthivel]

Since you failed to notice, that exact drawing is already part of my picture above, and the dimensions have already been marked.
it's at the bottom with all of those lines you put in.

Extend the turret tip blue line and YOUR 250 cm blue line till they reach the scale.

Why you have stopped both of them midway through?

Any particular reasons for that?

i did. 600+600+300+760 = 2260.

Already your first 760 mm red rectangular segment measures more than 800 mm on scale,


The vision block in front of the gunner, How many mm is it from the tip of the turret front?

It is going to be great fun from now on.

Any worthwhile explanations from the some one who holds 12 trophies and hunting for the 14th,(may be 13th is not so lucky perhaps, infact it is being proved here. So 13 must be real unlucky number)



So should I frame this screen shot and hang it on my wall too?



mark my words, I am going to rip your clownish ideas apart from now on.

The above is the picture of the main sight optics,


See where the eyepiece is with respect to the whole box?

to the left of the optics situated in the cutaway,

Where is it in your 3D model?

 

[ersakthivel]

i did. 600+600+300+760 = 2260.

We all accept that below is the photo of the Arjun turret,

To the bare eye the distance between the back wall of main sight cutaway and the start of the vision block

is almost equal to the

crew entry hole for TC or the vertical standing hatch cover width

SO it must be 500mm plus at bare minimum,

How come you got 300 mm measurement?

If your 300 mm measurement is true then the Tc must saw both his hands off before entering the tank.

The below is the original drawing , observe the position of the pivot base for the hatch cover,

compare it to the position of the pivot base in your drawing above,


Do you notice anything different?

You have intentionally placed them well behind their original position to suit your fancy 300 mm LOS behind main sight needs.

Look at the picture below of Arjun firing away,

Now do you know where those pivot base for the hatch cover is and how it operates?

 

[methos]

The above is the picture of the main sight optics,

It's the German EMES-15, NOT USED in the Arjun.

 

[ersakthivel]

It's the German EMES-15, NOT USED in the Arjun.

I posted it just to get the idea of where the main sight optic on the top and where the eye piece is,

Why you are you so upset about that,
If you have the pic of the optics for Arjun's main sight please post.

 

[methos]

Why you are you so upset about that,

Because, like every time you try to make a point, you simply ignore dozens of things. Saying "i have studied something somewhere but ain't gonna prove it" is all you do for arguing. Mentioning that the sight is not that of the Arjun's is something you don't do (because you did not know that it was the EMES-15).

If you had payed ANY attention to this whole debate which already is running since a few MONTHS, you would have noticed that the Arjun does not look like the Leopard 2. The designs are not similar, the layout is not similar, so why the hell should the main sight of the Arjun look like that of the Leopard 2?

If you have the pic of the optics for Arjun's main sight please post.

 

[ersakthivel]

Because, like every time you try to make a point, you simply ignore dozens of things. Saying "i have studied something somewhere but ain't gonna prove it" is all you do for arguing. Mentioning that the sight is not that of the Arjun's is something you don't do (because you did not know that it was the EMES-15).

If you had payed ANY attention to this whole debate which already is running since a few MONTHS, you would have noticed that the Arjun does not look like the Leopard 2. The designs are not similar, the layout is not similar, so why the hell should the main sight of the Arjun look like that of the Leopard 2?

if you have an source that this is the main sight optics of the Arjun please post.

By the way where is the eye piece?

If you can't post any drawing to counter the debate on measurement you don't have to quote me,

Or

In case you have any counter arguments for the points i raised in posts 205 , please post.

Most of your posts on Arjun are stupid rants with no purpose at all .like your factually incorrect claims about Arjun tank's height in the Arjun MBT thread which was conclusively rebutted by Kunal,

If you don't even know the height how are you supposed to know ,the diagram of Arjun's main sight?


I have no business with chinese average face width measuring experts trying to muddy the water.

 

[Dejawolf]

I posted it just to get the idea of where the main sight optic on the top and where the eye piece is,

Why you are you so upset about that,
If you have the pic of the optics for Arjun's main sight please post.

15th trophy for me. Ershaktivel doesn't know what the Arjun optic looks like
if you want to know, take a look at my 3d model.

i think the troll has been fed enough for today. back under your bridge with you.

 

[methos]

By the way where is the eye piece?

Just look at the first 5 pictures...

 

[ersakthivel]

Just look at the first 5 pictures...

Looking at the five pictures , What I am suposed to know,

For months I have suffered at the hands of few imbeciles here,

Now it is pay back time,

Don't try to divert me,

Every word i posted was countered with continuous rants, Thats why I asked for dimensions from Dejawolf,

Now let me see how he fares in answering a few inconvenient questions,

I did not ask him to willfully misrepresent each and every available drawing on Arjun to raise a bogus 300 mm LOS behind the main sight claim,

I am 100 percent sure that neither he nor a few bunch of imbeciles who advanced fancy 300 mm LOS claim have never even came within 1000 Km of the tank called Arjun. then why rant for months?

So you have no need to front for them.

 

[Dejawolf]

We all accept that below is the photo of the Arjun turret,

To the bare eye the distance between the back wall of main sight cutaway and the start of the vision block

is almost equal to the

crew entry hole for TC or the vertical standing hatch cover width

SO it must be 500mm plus at bare minimum,

How come you got 300 mm measurement?

If your 300 mm measurement is true then the Tc must saw both his hands off before entering the tank.



The below is the original drawing , observe the position of the pivot base for the hatch cover,

compare it to the position of the pivot base in your drawing above,


Do you notice anything different?

You have intentionally placed them well behind their original position to suit your fancy 300 mm LOS behind main sight needs.
Look at the picture below of Arjun firing away,

Now do you know where those pivot base for the hatch cover is and how it operates?

since you've failed to notice, the arjun hatch is not circular.
yes i know where the pivot bases are, they are where i put them in the model. the pivot even lines up perfectly with the BR image.
and as i've told you over the past 100 or so pages, of facepalming until my forehead bleeds, the back of the TCs chair is located under the pivot of the TC hatch, not the back of the cupola ring. thats why i'm not using the "full length" as you put it.
and i'm not adding the extra cm of the gunshield, because after all, we're measuring the armour thickness of the turret.

 

[ersakthivel]

since you've failed to notice, the arjun hatch is not circular.
yes i know where the pivot bases are, they are where i put them in the model.
and as i've told you over the past 100 or so pages, of facepalming until my forehead bleeds, the back of the TCs chair is located under the pivot of the TC hatch, not the back of the cupola ring. thats why i'm not using the "full length" as you put it.
and i'm not adding the extra cm of the gunshield, because after all, we're measuring the armour thickness of the turret.

SO a few muddled sentences that doesn't mean a shit is all you got at the end!!!!!!

I know you are faking it from the start,

No one can understand any shit from the few lines you posted above,

If you want to jump off , i am ready to stop,

Don't strut your fake 300 mm LOS anymore here as if you have measured it all by your hand!!!!!!!

I know you won't last more than a couple of posts,

Arjun's hatch is circular or triangular is not the point,

Whatever the shape, the pivot base is right below the hatch cover,

And that pivot base is 2500 mm behind the turret front tip is the point.

Which you know very well , since you know about tanks ,

Still you managed to successfully fake it until now,

but there is a proverb in tamil,

"Kettikaran pulugu ettu nallaiku thangum"

means a clever man can uphold a lie for 8 days,

you have done exceedingly well by lasting months,

Congrats,

bye.

 

[methos]

Looking at the five pictures , What I am suposed to know,

Maybe you should look at the location of the eye-piece, because that was what you asked for...

I know you are faking it from the start,

Says the guy who thought that 10.638 m is the hull length of the not of the total length of the tank - then uses this value to come up with an insanely huge turret, just to (after being told that the hull length is less than 10.638 m) making up some different "measurement" to come up with the same insane value.
Then you took the hatch diameter, told people it would be insanely large just to again come up with "values" for an insanely huge turret, but after being told that the hatch is not being as large as suggested by you, you again manipulate numbers to come up with an insanely huge turret.
Every single of your posts has been nothing than randomly pulling up numbers completely out of your mind and "bending" them to match your imagination. You said that a human face would be a feet wide, after I posted official data on the average human face, you simply manipulated your "calculation" to end up with the same results that you got using the pan-cake faces.

 

[pmaitra]

@ersakthivel, I hate to say this, but you should have specified that the eye piece is not from Arjun. If you are going to use the article 'the' to qualify the following noun, takin in context, it appears as if you are talking about Arjun. No harm admitting your error.

 

[ersakthivel]

@ersakthivel, I hate to say this, but you should have specified that the eye piece is not from Arjun. If you are going to use the article 'the' to qualify the following noun, takin in context, it appears as if you are talking about Arjun. No harm admitting your error.

That pic was posted by miltrysta , so that I took it to be the main sight optics,

So I thought all main sight arrangements will be like that.

But methos too has no clue about the main sight of Arjun as well,

So a pic of a crumbled scan of the main sight doesnot qualify his claims as right as well.

He is trying to divert the issues most of the time, for example the pictures he posted were already discussed to death,

Still he posted it without any single sentence of explanation, What is the purpose?

But no one knows for sure what is the main sight arrangement in arjun,

but still that does not have any implications to the matter that was discussed

Anyway I should have qualified that statement by saying that it is just a just a general arrangement for main sight and not pertaining to Arjun.

 

[ersakthivel]

Maybe you should look at the location of the eye-piece, because that was what you asked for...






Says the guy who thought that 10.638 m is the hull length of the not of the total length of the tank - then uses this value to come up with an insanely huge turret, just to (after being told that the hull length is less than 10.638 m) making up some different "measurement" to come up with the same insane value.

First of all unlike many of the trolls who purposefully give a false representation of info regarding Arjun,

while claiming to be tank experts,

I am no tank expert ,

and I never said so

But I know what is the purpose of machine design, So knew most of your claims of leaving a weak area behind main sight is not exactly true,

Why?

When a team of scientists design a tank nothing is left to chance, that too under the ever raising requirement creep by IA.

So what is the purpose of the bunch of guys who without even seeing the tank pretended to know everything about Arjun?

I still don't know!!!!!!


People who haven't designed a simple lawn mower in life deriding technical persons who spent most of their life designing this tank!!!!!!!!!

ofcourse I thought that 10.63 does not include the gun , But when Pmaitra posted the picture did I repeatedly counter him saying he is false?

I accepted and used his scales and drawing through out the thread for calculation,

But I don't remember you using that line drawing even once to make any post,

On the contrary you made a stupid claim that turret height of Arjun is more or less same as that of LEO months after seeing the drawing!!!!!!!!!

I thought the crew hole would be large to facilitate easy exit in emergency as a common sense measure,

But once a respected member told me it is somewhere between 450 mm and 500 mm ,

I accepted it even before using the face width calculation to check it .

So what is your problem with that?

Then you took the hatch diameter, told people it would be insanely large just to again come up with "values" for an insanely huge turret,

but after being told that the hatch is not being as large as suggested by you, you again manipulate numbers to come up with an insanely huge turret.

Tell me where i manipulated which number to arrive at 3100 mm plus turret width at the turret center,

You don't even know that the height mentioned by DRDO included the height the gun as well and

wondered aloud that Arjun cannot be any shorter than LEO,

But you have the gall to sermon us that Arjun should not be compared to LEO , just because it looks like it,

You had the gall to suggest to using "CHINESE " average face width to meausure the turret font of Indian Arjun!!!!!! to suit your argumnets ,

You said just a couple of post before that i was unfairly using photos taken at,"DIFFERENT " angles to base my extravagant claims,

Then you posted five photos all of a sudden and asked me to look at me,

WHY?

After saying photos taken at different angles should not be used for measurement , why did you post photos?

And why did you ask to use the average chinese face width to measure Arjun turret?

The angles don't count then?

So were you fair angel of all?

Every single of your posts has been nothing than randomly pulling up numbers completely out of your mind and "bending" them to match your imagination. You said that a human face would be a feet wide, after I posted official data on the average human face, you simply manipulated your "calculation" to end up with the same results that you got using the pan-cake faces.

I said in general terms a human face is a feet wide,So in real world analogy is it three feet wide?


No it is somewhere around 250 mm, and i used the same corrected figure for calculation after that,

What is wrong with that?

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!

when you wanted me to accept your chinese facewidth claim?

Please refer where I manipulated your noble data to end up with wrong results with the intention of cheating you,

I will try my best to clarify,

Will you?

First you make a single convincing post backed with drawing evidence to prove your fancy 300 mm LOS claim,

then speak,

You are one of the original masters of double speak here,

Do you know the meaning of the words manipulation and bend?

I posted stuff without checking , as i was not faking to be tank expert then, then when someone corrected it i accepted , it all happened within the first few posts of my self after that i havenot willfully misrepresented anything here,

If I have show me proof,

and I will apologize for it, lets see when you find it and post it,

This is not manipulation,

What is manipulation is claiming with

purposely falsified drawing ,

and repeated rants

without knowing anything about a product,

till the last few hours , something that was patently untrue,

You know very well who did that, Not me.

 

[pmaitra]

That pic was posted by miltrysta , so that I took it to be the main sight optics,

Do you have a link? I think I have seen it too.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

@ersakthivel, This is old FCS of MK1, May help..

======================

There is amount of Gap available from the optics located front of turret to the eye piece of the gunner ..

Gunner seat is behind its 'GAS' optics which is also used for engagement if main sight fails ..

=======================
@Dejawolf, ??