AMCA - Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (HAL)

[Indx TechStyle]

AMCA - 29,000 kg

@pmaitra
It's updated to be 36000Kg.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_AMCA

 

[pmaitra]

@pmaitra
It's updated to be 36000Kg.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_AMCA

Which number is correct? BTW, I think we might be a bit early, or the numbers might be speculative?

 

[tsunami]

AMCA design has been changed after 2013. It is finalized now or may be still some work is pending. But you should not expect every single details available in public domain regarding internal fuel, empty weight, max. take off weight, internal weapon bay and thrust to weight ration before at least 1st flight of the prototype. Before that all are just speculation.

 

[tsunami]

@pmaitra
It's updated to be 36000Kg.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_AMCA

This page shows same wing area as LCA Tejas. Despite AMCA being much larger so wrong.
These are all just speculative figures.

 

[Superdefender]

Source ??

FYI - b'cos Fund bas not yet been released.

Sajiv Jino is a defence expert. He runs a blog (sajivpearlj.blogspot.in) and also has a page (Indian Defence) in Facebook. On 14 Feb 2015, he posted a blog (New update on AMCA). When people asked him source of facts in facebook comments, he simply commented, "Last known facts.....extracted from credible source".

Now I have earlier exchanged query messages with him a lot of times. He is not bluffing. He ofcourse has some source, like some in defence ministry. But he can't release those details to us for obvious reasons. So we can trust his facts.

Just google " Life of a soldier - Update on AMCA". It is written in the last paragraph.

 

[Superdefender]

AMCA design has been changed after 2013. It is finalized now or may be still some work is pending. But you should not expect every single details available in public domain regarding internal fuel, empty weight, max. take off weight, internal weapon bay and thrust to weight ration before at least 1st flight of the prototype. Before that all are just speculation.

I did not know that final design had been cancelled. If that is the case, then it is better to wait for 1st prototype to fly which will happen in 2019/20. I just hope that AMCA performance will match or exceed that of F-35. By the way, can you give me the link which shows cancellation of 2013 final design?

 

[Superdefender]

This page shows same wing area as LCA Tejas. Despite AMCA being much larger so wrong.
These are all just speculative figures.

Oh, thanks man. Yes, it has been updated to 36,000 kg. Also they have edited the engine section. I have saved an earlier page of AMCA in wiki (LOLZ). That's why I had mentioned wrong MTW of AMCA.

 

[PaliwalWarrior]

It is like Rafale and Su 30 MKI. MKI is heavy and has lot more internal fuel so it can go further. Rafal can carry even more load but can not to a distance where Su 30 can go.

More load of rafale comes at a compromise of range

 

[myana]

Need to wait till AeroIndia 2017 to get updated specs of amca

 

[Indx TechStyle]

This page shows same wing area as LCA Tejas. Despite AMCA being much larger so wrong.
These are all just speculative figures.

Which number is correct? BTW, I think we might be a bit early, or the numbers might be speculative?

Obviously speculative, otherwise these numbers put AMCA(36 tonnes, 2.5 Mach speed and 4600km) ahead of F-35 and at par with F-22(38 tonnes, 2.25 Mach, 3300km range, 12000 kg fuel) and J-20(36 tonnes, 11000kg fuel capacity).

Sorry, because some of data for J-20 and AMCA is still unavailable.
But I really wish we could develop such a fighter in one it two decades.

 

[Superdefender]

Obviously speculative, otherwise these numbers put AMCA(36 tonnes, 2.5 Mach speed and 4600km) ahead of F-35 and at par with F-22(38 tonnes, 2.25 Mach, 3300km range, 12000 kg fuel) and J-20(36 tonnes, 11000kg fuel capacity).

Sorry, because some of data for J-20 and AMCA is still unavailable.
But I really wish we could develop such a fighter in one it two decades.

We will have it in one decade. We can safely assume mtw to be 30,000 kg. Nobody will accept 36,000 kg for a medium fighter!

 

[Anupu]

The threads on the subjects of the Tejas and AMCA can be summed up by this individual's observation that "The Indians make idle boasts and delusional forecasts and then vegetate: no one seemed to have taught them that the cart shouldn’t come before the horse".

........................................................................................

 

[cannonfodder]

India to use GE’s Engine for possible co-development of 110kN thrust engine for AMCA

Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar during his visit to the United States last year held a crucial meeting with Us officials on possible co-development of a jet engine which can power India’s indigenously developed 5th generation Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA).

Proposed AMCA fighter jet will be twin-engined Stealth fighter jet, and according to its developers will require engines which can generate 110kN of thrust but for India such engine is not available for off the shelf purchase and will require uprating of existing engines to deliver required thrust.

General Electric Aviation (GE) and DRDO have already been engaged in talk of uprating F414-INS6 engine which currently has been selected to power LCA Tejas Mk.II . Talks have been held to take the current thrust of the F414-INS6 engine which is currently generating 97.9 kN thrust with afterburner to 110kN of thrust.

General Electric Aviation (GE) as per its Internal R&D can uprate its F414 by executing it under two programmes. Under F414-EDE (Enhanced Durability Engine) new engine will be able to generate up to 20% more thrust by increasing fan airflow with the EDE hardware configuration. the new engine will be redesigned to have 6 stages, down from 7.

General Electric is also working on new F414-EPE (Enhanced Performance Engine) which will have a new core and a redesigned fan and compressor. The enhanced engine will offer up to 20 percent thrust boost, increasing it to 26,400 pounds (120 kN).

While F414 EDE is billed as an upgrade – not a new centerline engine – but it promises significant performance improvement which will improve fuel efficiency, while F414-EPE involves much deeper design changes including a new core which will an ideal project which will excite Indian scientist.

Interestingly India’s Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) and Russian JSC Rosoboronexport/JSC Klimov have entered into a memorandum of understanding (MoU) for joint development of Multi-Axis Thrust Vectoring Nozzle for future generation aero-engine applications.

According to Sources close to idrw.org Klimov have offered to develop thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) technology based on the universal KLITV (Klimov Thrust Vector) technology which can be customised for fitment on any jet engines.

Sources also informed that thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) technology offered can be matted with engines of any OEM’s even if engines are from United states. India will commence development work on Homegrown 5th generation fighter aircraft project which as per IAF request will have thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN).

http://idrw.org/india-to-use-ges-engine-for-possible-co-development-of-110kn-thrust-engine-for-amca/

 

[HariPrasad-1]

India to use GE’s Engine for possible co-development of 110kN thrust engine for AMCA

Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar during his visit to the United States last year held a crucial meeting with Us officials on possible co-development of a jet engine which can power India’s indigenously developed 5th generation Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA).

Proposed AMCA fighter jet will be twin-engined Stealth fighter jet, and according to its developers will require engines which can generate 110kN of thrust but for India such engine is not available for off the shelf purchase and will require uprating of existing engines to deliver required thrust.

General Electric Aviation (GE) and DRDO have already been engaged in talk of uprating F414-INS6 engine which currently has been selected to power LCA Tejas Mk.II . Talks have been held to take the current thrust of the F414-INS6 engine which is currently generating 97.9 kN thrust with afterburner to 110kN of thrust.

General Electric Aviation (GE) as per its Internal R&D can uprate its F414 by executing it under two programmes. Under F414-EDE (Enhanced Durability Engine) new engine will be able to generate up to 20% more thrust by increasing fan airflow with the EDE hardware configuration. the new engine will be redesigned to have 6 stages, down from 7.

General Electric is also working on new F414-EPE (Enhanced Performance Engine) which will have a new core and a redesigned fan and compressor. The enhanced engine will offer up to 20 percent thrust boost, increasing it to 26,400 pounds (120 kN).

While F414 EDE is billed as an upgrade – not a new centerline engine – but it promises significant performance improvement which will improve fuel efficiency, while F414-EPE involves much deeper design changes including a new core which will an ideal project which will excite Indian scientist.

Interestingly India’s Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) and Russian JSC Rosoboronexport/JSC Klimov have entered into a memorandum of understanding (MoU) for joint development of Multi-Axis Thrust Vectoring Nozzle for future generation aero-engine applications.

According to Sources close to idrw.org Klimov have offered to develop thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) technology based on the universal KLITV (Klimov Thrust Vector) technology which can be customised for fitment on any jet engines.

Sources also informed that thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) technology offered can be matted with engines of any OEM’s even if engines are from United states. India will commence development work on Homegrown 5th generation fighter aircraft project which as per IAF request will have thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN).

http://idrw.org/india-to-use-ges-engine-for-possible-co-development-of-110kn-thrust-engine-for-amca/

I recommend a 120 KN engine for reserve power for any change in design or weight. I think we must bring AMCA by 2018. Design is almost ready. Initially we may use under power i.e 98 KN engine subsequently shift to 110 or 120 KN engine with thrust victor. Russian did that with PAKFA. US is doing that with F 35.

 

[garg_bharat]

I recommend a 120 KN engine for reserve power for any change in design or weight. I think we must bring AMCA by 2018. Design is almost ready. Initially we may use under power i.e 98 KN engine subsequently shift to 110 or 120 KN engine with thrust victor. Russian did that with PAKFA. US is doing that with F 35.

How do you know design is almost ready? I would wait until a prototype has been built. Remember a fighter aircraft has many technical challenges. I appreciate the work of ADA but they need to improve project management skills.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

How do you know design is almost ready?

I had read in news. ...................

 

[Superdefender]

Now read this,
https://m.reddit.com/r/GlobalPowers/comments/36roli/event_germany_israel_to_help_india_on_gtre_kx/

 

[Gessler]

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[nitish.sarangi]

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Nice, did not know our labs had anechoic chambers for RCS testing. ADA is really working hard on the stealth aspect here.. Hope to know about the RAM development as well.
But fifth gen planes re really costly to develop.. I doubt we would be sole investor on this project. If Israel comes in for joint development, it would be cutting edge fighter for sure.

 

[Gessler]

Nice, did not know our labs had anechoic chambers for RCS testing. ADA is really working hard on the stealth aspect here.. Hope to know about the RAM development as well.
But fifth gen planes re really costly to develop.. I doubt we would be sole investor on this project. If Israel comes in for joint development, it would be cutting edge fighter for sure.

Anechoic chambers are not just for assessing RCS values...they're also used for analysing & calibrating electromagnetic emissions of all kinds. Even DRDO and ISRO have dedicated chambers for missiles, satellites etc.

However, the most effective method of evaluating RCS is when a 1:1 scale (or lower) model of the aircraft in question is hoisted about 50 feet or so above the ground in an open space on a stand and then radar is fired at it.