Alternatives to Dassault Rafale

[smestarz]

We have right to refuse if and only if Dassault does not agree with the terms of RFP, it has been selected based on merits as claimed by IAF... How come suddenly we have become so wise and understood the chronic stupidity...

It is easy said than done... HAL will struggle to scale up the production of TEJAS from 6 to 12...

First HAL get the production line started for TEJAS then TEJAS Mark - II will not start production before 2018 / 2020 at earliest...

We have right to just delay the contract and cancel the RFP. We can cancel for N number of reasons for example
a) We do not want a 4th Gen plane when we are now looking at 5th gen plane sorry seems an obsolete design
b) "Were dassault not going to close the production lines without orders? hence is it not obsolete ?"
c) We do not have money to spend on different plane and mess our present defence budget.
d) Are you going to advice the kickbacks that Dassault paid for Mirage 2000 ?
e) Can Rafale fire Brahmos A ? if not, no use for us.
f) We want the plane at cost of what we get Su-30 MKI.. deal or no deal?

These are some of the reasons,

Selection done on basis of testing does not mean you have to purchase the plane, it is not an obligation.

What changed is that, pre 2014 we behaved like Beggars, and so we were not choosers, if it was the UPA govt, it would have been signed at US$ 35 billion already. But now we are choosers, and that is why even the IAF top brass have been ordered to toe the MoD line.

We are becoming the country of choosers, we choose what we want to buy, days of being beggars are over. Did you notice that during the UPA regime France and Dassault were threatening to offer products to Pakistan etc. and that is why we signed the expensive Mirage 2000 upgrade deal. Let Dassault try that now and see what happens.

We were always wise, earlier the deal was being driven for the kickbacks (political and top brass of service), and those jokers are more or less out. and now there is nothing with Dassault to tempt India to sign the deal.
Did you forget how the former Chief NAK Browne was p*mping around for Rafale wherever he went? He looked less like an IAF ACM and more like Dassault agent.

 

[smestarz]

The Dassault Rafale deal is going to be signed on Modi's up comming visit to France in April 2015.

Lets bet. want to?

 

[smestarz]

There is something other aircraft does not have.You want to know what it is?
Rafale is a omnirole flighter. I dont think you know this logic man.

Pray tell me what is Omni role? and how different is it from Multi role? now you have a chance to explain, I am waiting

 

[bose]

Lets bet. want to?

I do not get into betting business... It is my understanding... like it or not...

 

[smestarz]

There is something other aircraft does not have.You want to know what it is?
Rafale is a omnirole flighter. I dont think you know this logic man.

Just simple logic, why is that Rafale was never sold for export yet? and why is that the only order that it has, is with country that does not have a credible civilian govt (there is dictatorship in Egypt) and that the country selling it France, is paying for the planes.
When you go to a restaurant, and they pay you for eating their food, something is missing

 

[smestarz]

from wiki about the Structural change of F 15 to F 15 E config

Thousandth time for now I don't think the Su 30 can be the MMRCA

Then there is something that you do not know about Su-30 MKI,
Su-30 MKI was designed as air dominance plane, hence Air superiority and air dominance.
It has various avionics (LITTENING POD) and also missiles for A2G mission.
Also it is going to also have the ability to carry and fire Brahmos A (which Rafale cannot do)
As per what definition is available for MRCA. a plane that can handle air superiority, Strike and other roles is MRCA.,.
Now I really cannot help your thinking, there is something wrong with it when you cannot accept the obvious.

 

[bose]

We have right to just delay the contract and cancel the RFP. We can cancel for N number of reasons for example
a) We do not want a 4th Gen plane when we are now looking at 5th gen plane sorry seems an obsolete design
b) "Were dassault not going to close the production lines without orders? hence is it not obsolete ?"
c) We do not have money to spend on different plane and mess our present defence budget.
d) Are you going to advice the kickbacks that Dassault paid for Mirage 2000 ?
e) Can Rafale fire Brahmos A ? if not, no use for us.
f) We want the plane at cost of what we get Su-30 MKI.. deal or no deal?

These are some of the reasons,

Selection done on basis of testing does not mean you have to purchase the plane, it is not an obligation.

What changed is that, pre 2014 we behaved like Beggars, and so we were not choosers, if it was the UPA govt, it would have been signed at US$ 35 billion already. But now we are choosers, and that is why even the IAF top brass have been ordered to toe the MoD line.

We are becoming the country of choosers, we choose what we want to buy, days of being beggars are over. Did you notice that during the UPA regime France and Dassault were threatening to offer products to Pakistan etc. and that is why we signed the expensive Mirage 2000 upgrade deal. Let Dassault try that now and see what happens.

We were always wise, earlier the deal was being driven for the kickbacks (political and top brass of service), and those jokers are more or less out. and now there is nothing with Dassault to tempt India to sign the deal.
Did you forget how the former Chief NAK Browne was p*mping around for Rafale wherever he went? He looked less like an IAF ACM and more like Dassault agent.

I must admit you know too many things...

 

[smestarz]

I must admit you know too many things...

There are simple things, plane market is BUYERS MARKET, and here we are the buyers. So we sign it
IF WE WANT TO, WHEN WE WANT TO. It is upto Dassault if they accept our conditions (and in that case we can sign it)

There is absolute no shame in refusing to sign the deal, Switzerland and Brazil did sign for gripen even though they felt Rafale wa what they liked.

Also just to remind you, France is country which refused to deliver the Mistral which Russia has paid for, here we have not even signed the deal. so are they going to talk to us about Shame???
Guess not

 

[jaciunite2]

Pray tell me what is Omni role? and how different is it from Multi role? now you have a chance to explain, I am waiting

Man i dont have much time for this just google the differences between omnirole and multirole.I am not your teacher little boy.

 

[jaciunite2]

Just simple logic, why is that Rafale was never sold for export yet? and why is that the only order that it has, is with country that does not have a credible civilian govt (there is dictatorship in Egypt) and that the country selling it France, is paying for the planes.
When you go to a restaurant, and they pay you for eating their food, something is missing

Oh man did you know that F-18 super hornets only export customer is Australia. So in your logic it is also is not a good plane.

 

[warriorextreme]

Another IAF plane crashes

IAF plane crashes in Haryana, pilot safe - The Times of India

With this rate of crashes IAF will not be able to maintain it's fleet. Don't you guys think that we should buy some planes from USA(Since they are the powerhouse of manufacturing) without ToT to fill the gaps created by these crashes?

 

[smestarz]

Oh man did you know that F-18 super hornets only export customer is Australia. So in your logic it is also is not a good plane.

Firstly I doubt if you really understand english or you just write because you feel the compulsive need to write

You can read the post, I never said Rafale is not a capable plane, READ AGAIN before you reply to me boy

Second part is Australia, Canada, Finland, Malaysia, Kuwait, Spain and singapore to name a few are users of Hornet

F/A-18 E/F are evolutionary and more capable versions than A/B OR C/D versions but was not ordered by any except Australia. Thus F/A-18 has many users except Super Hornet version which has two users.
thus the total numbers of F/A 18 A-D Hornets is 1480 and those of F/A-18 super hornets is 500.
Thus the total production is about 1980 planes which is more than what the entire Rafale fleet is.

Now if you consider the price of F/A-18 E/F the flyway cost is about US$ 61 million which is almost 2/3 of the cost of Rafale, thus F/A 18 makes a more cost efficient choice. If countries have options of Su-35, F/A-18 E/F and Rafale, almost 100/100 Rafale would NOT BE SELECTED mainly due to cost issue.

Now if you see the situation of Egypt, they did not have money to buy the planes yet they want to buy inspite of having 200+ F-16 in their air force. So, here are two desperate countries one willing to buy even if it does not have money, and one desperate to sell even if has to pay for it.
Now what does that tell you? Height of desperation

READ MY POST FIRST, UNDERSTAND IT, AND THEN REPLY WITH AN ANSWER THATS RELATED TO MY POSTING, ELSE TRY NOT TO. I AM ALLERGIC TO STUPIDITY

 

[smestarz]

Man i dont have much time for this just google the differences between omnirole and multirole.I am not your teacher little boy.

So why do you have to post something that you do not understand? You do sound like a frog boy.
Omni role is only a term used by Dassault to showcase Rafale seperately. Same way as the washing powder and toothpaste companies use new improved formula, Germi check etc etc.

Su-30 MKI can handle the roles that Rafale can, in fact with its weapons, it can beat rafale black and blue, Su-30 MKI has missiles that are more longer ranged, and can be used well before the Su-30 MKI can come within the range of Rafale missiles.

Omni role is same as multi role, what you fail to understand is that a plane will have the role what its armed for,

If a Rafale is armed for Air superiority, can it do something against an enemy tank or ship? I guess not, Thus to be truly omni role as you try to make others believe, you have to put different weapons, A2G and A2A weapons. Thus what role the plane has to fly, is decided by the air staff and is armed accordingly. In that context, even Tejas Su-30 MKI can be termed as Multi or Omni role,
It is only marketing gimmick by Dassault, and well you fell for marketing trick, wow

 

[smestarz]

Man i dont have much time for this just google the differences between omnirole and multirole.I am not your teacher little boy.

Do not try to use a term that you do not know, and then give a lame excuse that you o not have the time to google it,
you are a classy idiot, are you related to IAF personal?
I assume you are.... the trend looks very promissing

 

[jaciunite2]

Do not try to use a term that you do not know, and then give a lame excuse that you o not have the time to google it,
you are a classy idiot, are you related to IAF personal?
I assume you are.... the trend looks very promissing

And now i am pretty much sure that you dont know anything about omnirole.Let me tell you boy:-
1)Rafale has 14 hardpoints compared to 12 in su-30mki.
2)Rafale can switch it mission type while airborne without reducing its combat effectiveness.
This is what omrirole is,You fool.

 

[jaciunite2]

So why do you have to post something that you do not understand? You do sound like a frog boy.
Omni role is only a term used by Dassault to showcase Rafale seperately. Same way as the washing powder and toothpaste companies use new improved formula, Germi check etc etc.

Su-30 MKI can handle the roles that Rafale can, in fact with its weapons, it can beat rafale black and blue, Su-30 MKI has missiles that are more longer ranged, and can be used well before the Su-30 MKI can come within the range of Rafale missiles.

Omni role is same as multi role, what you fail to understand is that a plane will have the role what its armed for,

If a Rafale is armed for Air superiority, can it do something against an enemy tank or ship? I guess not, Thus to be truly omni role as you try to make others believe, you have to put different weapons, A2G and A2A weapons. Thus what role the plane has to fly, is decided by the air staff and is armed accordingly. In that context, even Tejas Su-30 MKI can be termed as Multi or Omni role,
It is only marketing gimmick by Dassault, and well you fell for marketing trick, wow

Man do some research on Rafale and then talk harsh like an idiot by saying that it is for marketing purposes only.

 

[jaciunite2]

Firstly I doubt if you really understand english or you just write because you feel the compulsive need to write

You can read the post, I never said Rafale is not a capable plane, READ AGAIN before you reply to me boy

Second part is Australia, Canada, Finland, Malaysia, Kuwait, Spain and singapore to name a few are users of Hornet

F/A-18 E/F are evolutionary and more capable versions than A/B OR C/D versions but was not ordered by any except Australia. Thus F/A-18 has many users except Super Hornet version which has two users.
thus the total numbers of F/A 18 A-D Hornets is 1480 and those of F/A-18 super hornets is 500.
Thus the total production is about 1980 planes which is more than what the entire Rafale fleet is.

Now if you consider the price of F/A-18 E/F the flyway cost is about US$ 61 million which is almost 2/3 of the cost of Rafale, thus F/A 18 makes a more cost efficient choice. If countries have options of Su-35, F/A-18 E/F and Rafale, almost 100/100 Rafale would NOT BE SELECTED mainly due to cost issue.

Now if you see the situation of Egypt, they did not have money to buy the planes yet they want to buy inspite of having 200+ F-16 in their air force. So, here are two desperate countries one willing to buy even if it does not have money, and one desperate to sell even if has to pay for it.
Now what does that tell you? Height of desperation

READ MY POST FIRST, UNDERSTAND IT, AND THEN REPLY WITH AN ANSWER THATS RELATED TO MY POSTING, ELSE TRY NOT TO. I AM ALLERGIC TO STUPIDITY

Fool they are completely different. As an example boy:-
Mig-35 is a modified more capable version of mig-29.But right now it has no customar.

 

[Illusive]

So why do you have to post something that you do not understand? You do sound like a frog boy.
Omni role is only a term used by Dassault to showcase Rafale seperately. Same way as the washing powder and toothpaste companies use new improved formula, Germi check etc etc.

Su-30 MKI can handle the roles that Rafale can, in fact with its weapons, it can beat rafale black and blue, Su-30 MKI has missiles that are more longer ranged, and can be used well before the Su-30 MKI can come within the range of Rafale missiles.

Omni role is same as multi role, what you fail to understand is that a plane will have the role what its armed for,

If a Rafale is armed for Air superiority, can it do something against an enemy tank or ship? I guess not, Thus to be truly omni role as you try to make others believe, you have to put different weapons, A2G and A2A weapons. Thus what role the plane has to fly, is decided by the air staff and is armed accordingly. In that context, even Tejas Su-30 MKI can be termed as Multi or Omni role,
It is only marketing gimmick by Dassault, and well you fell for marketing trick, wow

Isn't the whole problem with MKI is reliability(sortie rate), engine issues?

 

[jaciunite2]

So why do you have to post something that you do not understand? You do sound like a frog boy.
Omni role is only a term used by Dassault to showcase Rafale seperately. Same way as the washing powder and toothpaste companies use new improved formula, Germi check etc etc.

Su-30 MKI can handle the roles that Rafale can, in fact with its weapons, it can beat rafale black and blue, Su-30 MKI has missiles that are more longer ranged, and can be used well before the Su-30 MKI can come within the range of Rafale missiles.

Omni role is same as multi role, what you fail to understand is that a plane will have the role what its armed for,

If a Rafale is armed for Air superiority, can it do something against an enemy tank or ship? I guess not, Thus to be truly omni role as you try to make others believe, you have to put different weapons, A2G and A2A weapons. Thus what role the plane has to fly, is decided by the air staff and is armed accordingly. In that context, even Tejas Su-30 MKI can be termed as Multi or Omni role,
It is only marketing gimmick by Dassault, and well you fell for marketing trick, wow

Rafale can be armed to all the scenario you described in a single mission because of its 14 hardpoints.

 

[jaciunite2]

Isn't the whole problem with MKI is reliability(sortie rate), engine issues?

Now that is something intelligent man. Yes,I also think same.