Al-Khalid MBT And Pakistani Armour

[Yusuf]

I will go little more. Tanks are irrelevant in wars now.They used to be imp 30 yrs back not in modern Warefare.

Wars in iraq prove you wrong. Armed forces know better than you that's why they are searching for FMBT.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

Kunal do you have any idea what engine the Pakistan T-80U bought from Ukraine have? Did they come with the Gas Turbine engine or the Diesel engine?

If Pakistan is stuck with the Gas Turbine engine which is proven to be the worst tank engine ever designed then most of their tank fleet is dead in the water already.

 

[p2prada]

Those 2A46M2/5 are Russian specifications not Indian..

Now why is something as basic as barrel life only a Russian requirement.

Let's see what a DFI guru has to say;
http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=208&p=158911&viewfull=1#post158911

120mm rifled guns are dinosaurs. Even with the 1pc ammuntion the gun it self is derived from the old L11A5 series of guns. Very accurate but limited velocities and short barrel life with modern ammunition. I'll take the T-90M's gun if equipped with the 42M over the Arjun's gun. The Arjun needs the new 120mmL55 from either Germany or South Korea.

Rifling is a disadvantage in modern tanks. modern computers and round designed has removed the need for the gun to be rifled. This means the positive effects of rifling- greater accuracy are cancelled out by its down sides- shorter barrel life, harder to clean negative spin imparted to apfsds rounds etc.

Known to be by you?
On T-90 not T-72..

We have gone through this before and discussing this with you has become more disappointing considering you are in contact active Army personnel.

http://fofanov.armor.kiev.ua/Tanks/
If you don't believe this link either, then I give up.

2A46M has a EFC of 800. Our auto frettage plant has increased life to 1700 EFC as it's critical fatigue life.

Ahh, Self made assumptions again..
Gud for you..

As usual, you still live in a well. Makes it even more disappointing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_explosive_squash_head

HESH shells are not specifically designed to perforate the armour of main battle tanks. HESH shells rely instead on the transmission of the shock wave through the solid steel armour.

http://www.wordiq.com/definition/HESH

eveloped and used only by the British originally as an anti-pillbox munition for spalling concrete, HESH was found to be surprisingly effective against armor as well. HESH was used for some time as a competitor to the more common HEAT round, and is effective against tanks from the 1950s and 1960s such as the T-55 and T-62.

Now I am providing links from a dictionary website to inform that HESH is outdated and obsolete. If you think Spalling is still state of the art, then I have to shoot myself.

So much for "information known only to me" and so much for "self made assumptions."

HESH is obsolete. Rifled is obsolete and is a nightmare for modern tank warfare.

 

[p2prada]

Kunal do you have any idea what engine the Pakistan T-80U bought from Ukraine have? Did they come with the Gas Turbine engine or the Diesel engine?

If Pakistan is stuck with the Gas Turbine engine which is proven to be the worst tank engine ever designed then most of their tank fleet is dead in the water already.

Google reveals 6TD-2 liquid-cooled diesel engine with 6 cylinders delivering 1200 HP of power.

Al-Khalid has 6TD-2 liquid-cooled diesel engine with 6 cylinders delivering 1200 HP of power. They are looking for a 1500 HP engine I guess.

Both Ukranian.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Now why is something as basic as barrel life only a Russian requirement.

Let's see what a DFI guru has to say;
http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=208&p=158911&viewfull=1#post158911

No disrespect to Mr zraver..
But his knowledge is limited abt technical data on Russian and British tanks but not American tanks..

http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=208&page=26

http://fofanov.armor.kiev.ua/Tanks/
If you don't believe this link either, then I give up.

We dont use Russian 2A46 or 2A46M or 2A46M2/5..
So no discussion abt it..

http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=208&page=28

HESH is obsolete. Rifled is obsolete and is a nightmare for modern tank warfare.

"information known only to me" "self made assumptions."

Indeed!

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Kunal do you have any idea what engine the Pakistan T-80U bought from Ukraine have? Did they come with the Gas Turbine engine or the Diesel engine?

If Pakistan is stuck with the Gas Turbine engine which is proven to be the worst tank engine ever designed then most of their tank fleet is dead in the water already.

6TD-2 liquid-cooled diesel engine as per most sites..

 

[JBH22]

pakistan can only acheive this semmingly impossible goal if china donates half its tank fleet to them.none of pakistani or chinese tank can stand up against the arjun mbt-hence it is most advisable to the army to induct the arjun in large no. to replace the obsolete t-72 and t-55 and stall the induction of junks called t-90.the main problem might arise if the pakistanis receive m1a2 abhrams tank(donated by US) which is certainly not impossible since one day US might feel that pakistan needs a m1 abhrams tank fleet to defeat the tank fleet of the
taliban.

Do you know 80% of Indian tanks are night blind,do you know that soldiers faint in these tin cans training in desert while the "we are better than others feeling is ok" we should not underestimate the opponents.

Zia Ul Haq died after watching the demo of Abrams M1A1 tanks in the 1980s,note that the so called invicible M1A2 Abrams tank success is mostly due to US air superiority they have A-10 and Apache covering their bum hence they kick ass like that. The Abrams once its APU is out its a junk, Russian have always relied on crude tech stark contrast from the west.Having said that i acknowledge its a great tank but certainly not super tank as its portrayed that thing needs 7trucks to keep its gas turbine engine on the move.

 

[Blackwater]

Do you know 80% of Indian tanks are night blind,do you know that soldiers faint in these tin cans training in desert while the "we are better than others feeling is ok" we should not underestimate the opponents.

Zia Ul Haq died after watching the demo of Abrams M1A1 tanks in the 1980s,note that the so called invicible M1A2 Abrams tank success is mostly due to US air superiority they have A-10 and Apache covering their bum hence they kick ass like that. The Abrams once its APU is out its a junk, Russian have always relied on crude tech stark contrast from the west.Having said that i acknowledge its a great tank but certainly not super tank as its portrayed that thing needs 7trucks to keep its gas turbine engine on the move.

I know that T-56 and T-72 are Non AC and night blind Tanks. Only T-90 has AC and night vision. dont know about pakiz tanks

 

[p2prada]

No disrespect to Mr zraver..
But his knowledge is limited abt technical data on Russian and British tanks but not American tanks..

I gave his quotes particularly about Challenger's rifled gun. He is a tankie. Him knowing more about American and less about British does not mean he is completely clueless on why the Rifled gun is obsolete.

We dont use Russian 2A46 or 2A46M or 2A46M2/5..
So no discussion abt it..

Sure. We don't use T-72 or T-90 either. Our tanks come from Santa's Toy Factory. *roll eyes*

 

[Kunal Biswas]

he is completely clueless on the Rifled gun

Fixed..

Sure. We don't use T-72 or T-90 either. Our tanks come from Santa's Toy Factory. *roll eyes*

Keep it rolling..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I know that T-56 and T-72 are Non AC and night blind Tanks. Only T-90 has AC and night vision. dont know about pakiz tanks

T-55 use IR lights from night hunting, Some of them are updated with thermal sights as per Project Gulmohar..
Main Majority of T-72M1 are updated with ERA and Night vision/thermal sights..
T-90S have Thermal sight So does the Arjun..
80% of MBTs night-blindness is a old story..

PA tanks have same capabilities and updated too..

 

[JBH22]

T-55 use IR lights from night hunting, Some of them are updated with thermal sights as per Project Gulmohar..
Main Majority of T-72M1 are updated with ERA and Night vision/thermal sights..
T-90S have Thermal sight So does the Arjun..
80% of MBTs night-blindness is a old story..

PA tanks have same capabilities and updated too..

iF i'm not mistaken the Indian army chief said so last year,as to T-72M1 not all of them are being upgraded under Project Rhino,T-90 still facing the problem of heating and its on DFI itself that i read the DRDO is now going to make the ARjun MK2 fit for fighting at night.

Btw does India has BTR-80 in service thanks?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

iF i'm not mistaken the Indian army chief said so last year,as to T-72M1 not all of them are being upgraded under Project Rhino,T-90 still facing the problem of heating and its on DFI itself that i read the DRDO is now going to make the ARjun MK2 fit for fighting at night.
Btw does India has BTR-80 in service thanks?

Op Rhino was planed at Early in 1987, It was implemented in late 96, Its a slow process, By Now, main majority of T-72M1 i know are updated with ERA & thermal imager integrated with the Drawa-T fire control system, supplied by Israel's El-Op and Poles..

http://www.knox.army.mil/center/ocoa/armormag/backissues/1990s/1998/mj98/3rhino.pdf



IA Operate no Btr-80, In 70s IA did have BTRs..


Arjun prototypes had thermal interegated with FCS, Its panoramic sight for the tank commander that will be updated with NV in MK2..

 

[Neil]

Btw does India has BTR-80 in service thanks?

what is a BTR.....??

 

[JBH22]

what is a btr.....??

google is your friend

 

[Godless-Kafir]

View attachment 3028


6TD-2 liquid-cooled diesel engine as per most sites..

But doesn't the exhaust look more like an Turbine outlet?

 

[Neil]

google is your friend

well my friend i know that.....just wanted the full form so makes it easier for me to google....

 

[pmaitra]

what is a BTR.....??

BTR-80 is an Armoured Personnel Carrier:

 

[p2prada]

Why u r telling me abt yourself?

I never intend to insult anyone and avoid at the best..

EDUCATE YOURSELF:

http://www.museumstuff.com/learn/topics/HESH::sub::History

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_best_tank_Challenger_2_or_Abrams_M1A2

...........................Don`t post Such Nonsense again!, Btw, u r reported..

You are embarrassing yourself.

You mainly gave advantages of Challenger 2 and use of HESH against bunkers(something that I have already mentioned and it is already something handled by Anti-Material rounds). Nothing in it what can substantiate your claim. Also, keep in mind we are talking about tanks.

Give me the reason for Rifled and HESH and I will kill it. Give me any reason that you can give supporting your claim and I will kill it. I am that confident. Either Put up or Shut up. It is as simple as that.

Reporting me does nothing considering I haven't done anything wrong.

 

[pmaitra]

I don't want to sounds patronising, nor do I claim to be above error, but p2prada and Kunal, you guys should disagree gracefully.