ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

Which role suits LCA 'Tejas' more than others from following options?

  • Interceptor-Defend Skies from Intruders.

    Votes: 342 51.3%
  • Airsuperiority-Complete control of the skies.

    Votes: 17 2.5%
  • Strike-Attack deep into enemy zone.

    Votes: 24 3.6%
  • Multirole-Perform multiple roles.

    Votes: 284 42.6%

  • Total voters
    667
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s_bman

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cross posting from brf from sameer_shelavale's post

Bharat Rakshak • View topic - LCA news and discussion

here are speeds of fighters at sea-levels

JAS-39 A/B Gripen ( reference )
Maximum Speed at Sea Level - 1,225 km/h

EuroFighter Typhoon ( reference )
# At sea level: Mach 1.2[173] (1470 km/h / 913.2 mph) [174]

Su30MKI ( reference )
(a 1350 km/h ground-level speed)

F-22( reference )
at sea level: 920 mph (1,480 km/h), Mach 1.2

Rafale ( reference )
at sea level: 864 mph (1,390 km/h), Mach 1.135

Mig29K ( reference )
at sea level: 670 knots (771 mph; 1240 km/h) - sea level.

F-18SH ( reference )
at sea level: 835 mph (1,350 km/h), Mach 1.1

J-10 ( reference )
915 mph (1,470 km.h), Mach 1.2

Mig-21 ( reference )
at sea level: 800 mph (1,275 km/h), Mach 1.05
 

AJSINGH

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I think it would work for both Argentina & Brazil, & could even be bought out by their air forces. The LCA could well find a home in South America but would best be fitted with non-US engines, preferably the M88-3 would be the engine of choice. If I was in charge of HAL, I would promote 24 for the Brazilian Navy & 48 for the Brazilian Air Force, & a similar package to Argentina (18-36 for Navy/Air Force) along with the M88-3 engine with the M88-2E4 being used as a stop-gap.

Still I can imagine France may want to transfer Mirage 2000s for cheap & the Argentines & Brazilians may well opt for that cheaper option. Still for the carriers there's hope.
 

bengalraider

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Successful flight flutter test for Tejas

fullstory
STAFF WRITER 14:14 HRS IST
INS Hansa Base (Goa), Dec 9 (PTI) The aircraft dived towards the sea as the pilot lifted his hands off the control stick for five seconds. In such a short duration, it had plummeted from four kilometres above sea level to just 900 metres before the pilot hit to the throttle again to take to the skies.

The 'flight flutter test', a mandatory procedure for fighter crafts, was conducted off the Goa coast on Tejas in maritime environment by the agencies, which are testing this technology, a senior Indian Air Force officer said today.

The successful flight flutter test on the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas, was an important step towards developing of this craft, labelled as the first supersonic fighter plane manufactured in India, the officer said.
 

Quickgun Murugan

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Successful flight flutter test for Tejas

fullstory
STAFF WRITER 14:14 HRS IST
INS Hansa Base (Goa), Dec 9 (PTI) The aircraft dived towards the sea as the pilot lifted his hands off the control stick for five seconds. In such a short duration, it had plummeted from four kilometres above sea level to just 900 metres before the pilot hit to the throttle again to take to the skies.

The 'flight flutter test', a mandatory procedure for fighter crafts, was conducted off the Goa coast on Tejas in maritime environment by the agencies, which are testing this technology, a senior Indian Air Force officer said today.

The successful flight flutter test on the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas, was an important step towards developing of this craft, labelled as the first supersonic fighter plane manufactured in India, the officer said.

Ok. I am not following LCA's developments closely but I just had a few questions in my mind.

I don't understand why they are conducting so many tests? The engine is going to change and if GE is chosen, then so will the airframe. Why conduct tests now if the entire model is apparently going to change?

Why didn't we choose a Russian engine?

LCA is supposed to replace IAF's Mig 21, Jaguar, Mirages right? I thought MMRCA was given similar justifications too.
 

Pintu

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Tejas aircraft trials end successfully - Goa - City - The Times of India

Tejas aircraft trials end successfully
TNN 9 December 2009, 05:28am IST

VASCO: The trials of Tejas, the light combat aircraft (LCA), which lasted for two weeks have successfully ended. The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) had introduced three aircraft in Goa for conducting various sea-level flight tests. P S Subramanyam, programme director of LCA, on Tuesday morning, while speaking at a press conference in INS Hansa, Dabolim, said, "LCA is on its way for induction into the IAF after achieving the initial operational clearance in December 2010."

The LCA is the first supersonic fighter being manufactured indigenously by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited. When 20 such LCA will be manufactured it will be given to the Air force and the other 20 to the Navy, it is a package of 40 LCA.
 

ppgj

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I don't understand why they are conducting so many tests?
remember it is india's first true attempt at building a jet fighter. there are a number of parameters which require validation regarding

1. airframe.
2. avionics integration.
3. software glitches.
4. weapons integration.
5. altitude and flutter tests.

each has subgroup of tests whcih need to be checked, corrected and validated. this takes a number of tests. as i said before, being the first attempt - they are conservative and it is a learning curve as for as testing is concerned. that is why they involved EADS to reduce unwanted tests.
once it passes all of this our next attempt will have much less testing.

The engine is going to change and if GE is chosen, then so will the airframe. Why conduct tests now if the entire model is apparently going to change?
the change will not be huge. it is not going to result in a completely new aircraft. the aircraft retains its dimensions with only changes in the engine section (not major) as the dimensions of f-414 to f-404 is not huge.
yes it will flight tested but not like the way it is being done because lot of tests will be redundant as they are already validated.
however if EJ 200 is selected, EADS says they don't need any design changes. fits in the existing aircraft. considering it a brand new engine with future compared to f-414, i support EJ 200.

Why didn't we choose a Russian engine?
remember LCA has been designed to be light. russian engines are dimensionally and by weight do not suit LCA.
only RD-33 comes close but loses on the thrust as compared to EJ 200 and F-414.

LCA is supposed to replace IAF's Mig 21, Jaguar, Mirages right? I thought MMRCA was given similar justifications too.
initially it was planned for mig 21 replacement but now has potential to replace others too.
 

Sridhar

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Successful flight flutter test for Tejas

Published by: Yateesh Kukreti
Published: Wed, 09 Dec 2009 at 13:05 IST

INS Hansa Base (Goa): The aircraft dived towards the sea as the pilot lifted his hands off from the control stick for five seconds. In such a short duration, it had plummeted from four kilometers above sea level to just 900 metres before the pilot took off towards the skies again.

The successful flight flutter test on the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), Tejas, was an important step towards developing of this craft, labelled as the first supersonic fighter plane manufactured in India.

Tejas, conceived by the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), is undergoing sea-level flight tests including flutter clearance, weapon firing, performance, stability and avionics validation off the shores of Goa.

The flight flutter test, a mandatory procedure for fighter crafts, was conducted off the Goa coast in maritime environment by the agencies, which are testing this technology.

The flight, which went eight kilometers above sea level, came down to six kilometers taking a five degree dip and later dipped further to ten degrees to reach four kilometers, a senior Indian Air Force officer stated.

When the aircraft reached to four kilometers level above the sea, within seconds, the pilot initiated a self test wherein he left the hands from the control stick leaving the aircraft on its own.

"The flight was left out of control for five seconds by the pilot and it went on diving down to the sea," Commander Rohit Varma, Project Director (flight test), National Flight Test Centre, told PTI.

At the end of five seconds, when the pilot held on the control stick again, he was just 900 metres above the sea level. "He immediately pulled out from there again and took to the skies," Varma said.

With this, the flight flutter test, one amongst the 3,000-odd test points conducted on LCA before launching it formally, was successful.


The LCA's air force version is in its final phase while the naval version is progressing at rapid pace despite certain glitches which are being overcome, the officer said.

The LAC can perform in air to air combat and also hit the target on the ground with 1,000 pound bombs installed on it.

Varma said that the aircraft was tested with basic air to ground using carrier bomb light stores. "The actual 1,000 pound bomb would be tested at a desert range like Pokhran," he said.

Successful flight flutter test for Tejas :: Samay Live
 

Sridhar

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Tejas LCA goes supersonic
09 December 2009


INS Hansa, Dabolim, Goa: The ongoing sea-level flight trials of India's Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), which were carried out for two weeks over Goa air space, have been brought to a successful conclusion with the aircraft zooming around at a speed of 1,350 kmph (approx. Mach1.1). In the process it clocked its fastest speed ever, a top IAF officer said on Tuesday. The aircraft has steadily been crossing one critical milestone after another on the way to initial operational clearance in December 2010.
''The aircraft went past its ultimate speed of 1350 kmph on 7 December over the skies in Goa
after takeoff from the naval air station INS Hansa,'' Air Commodore Rohit Varma, project director (flight test), National Flight Test Centre, told reporters here.
''This is the fastest speed ever achieved by an Indian- made fighter aircraft,'' he said.

The aircraft also cleared the flight flutter test, diving from an altitude of four kilometres to near sea level at 900 feet.
''Tejas has already passed high-altitude tests in Leh, the desert rigours in Rajasthan and now it has proved its worth over the maritime space in Goa,'' Air Cmde Varma said.
The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), the nodal agency for the development of the aircraft, had inducted three Tejas prototypes for these sea-level flight tests in Goa.
The IAF has already ordered 20 LCAs from HAL at a cost of Rs2701.70 crore. The first lot, or Mark I fighters, will be delivered by 2013.
The aircraft will also have a navalised version.
''It can fly from a base and also from an aircraft carrier,'' PS Subramanyam, director, ADA, and programme director (combat aircraft) said.
According to Subramanyam, the LCA-naval will have capability to take off from ski jump platform of aircraft carriers. ''The development of the naval version is progressing very fast. There are a few glitches but we will overcome them.''
The IAF is likely to base the lightweight multi-role jet fighters at Sulur in Coimbatore. ''They are earmarked for 45 squadron which will be the first LCA squadron,'' Air Cmde Varma said.
According to Subramanyam, "LCA is on its way for induction into the IAF after achieving the initial operational clearance in December 2010."
This was confirmed by air vice marshal Shankar Mani who told reporters that the first consignment of four operational aircraft would be delivered by January 2011, followed by eight in 2012 and another eight in 2013.
Meanwhile, N Shyama Rao, project director at ADA, said Tuesday that HAL had undertaken a massive recruitment drive in order to expand the scope of production of the fighter planes, given the fact that it could only manufacture eight LCA on an annual basis.
'Currently we can manufacture eight aircraft per annum, which is extendable up to 12,' Rao said.

The IAF will order an additional 20 Tejas fighters, which are likely to be the Mark II version.
The LCA will primarily replace the IAF's ageing MiG-21 fleet, while the naval version of the LCA will replace the Navy's fleet of Sea Harriers.
'Even the Indian Navy will be ordering the LCA once the ski jump trials are validated,' air vice marshal Shankar Mani said. The ski jump enables the fighter craft to land and take off from the deck of aircraft carriers.
'After spending some initial years on shore bases, the LCAs will also be posted onboard the Gorshkov, once it joins the Indian fleet,' Mani said.
He added that the naval version was still in the prototype phase.
According to ADA director, PN Subramanium, the LCA represented fourth generation technology. 'The LCA is contemporary in every sense, whether it is in terms of sensors, electronic systems, technology, weaponry, etc,' he said.

domain-b.com : Tejas LCA goes supersonic
 

ppgj

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@sridhar.
thanks for the posts. LCA is making great progress. i just wanted if you can tell/find me the specs for the mark 2 version of LCA?
 

Rahul Singh

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Seems as if i'm missing much.

Congrats and good luck to ADA and DRDO.

@ppgj
There is nothing final on what will go inside MK-2 except high thrust engine. Many related reports had floated during this year aero-India. I remember people claiming that ADA wants to test future technologies like Modular Avionics Suit, LO, optic fibre controlled FCS, etc on Mk-2. However they quoted Mr Subramaniam saying that these are thrust areas doesn't necessarily mean that they will be go in for sure.
 

Rahul Singh

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@Dark Sorrow

LO means 'Low Observable' or poor man's stealth.
Following features may fall in for the purpose.
1. AESA - helping auto-terrain following flight profile
2. Dedicated EW suit for soft kill and self defence.
3. Onboard passive sensors.
4. Full NCW capability.
5. RAM paints.
6. Emission control / IR signature reduction.

@ Sridhar and P2P.

All news regarding Mk-2 suggests that if all go well then there will be no major aerodynamic alteration. In worst condition only 'jet air intake' will be touched. However minor alterations are expected to reduce drag and probably weight.
 

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By Murdo Morrison

The consortium behind the Eurofighter Typhoon's engine has hinted strongly that it could partner a non-European country - possibly India - to develop and demonstrate a thrust-vectoring version of the EJ200 as part of a technology-sharing deal.

Eurojet is keen to source funds to test its thrust vectoring nozzle (TVN) on a flight demonstrator. It believes if it can obtain enough in-flight data, it will be able to prove the lifecycle cost benefits of the technology - which has been in development for over a decade - to current and future customers.

However, military budget pressures facing the four Eurofighter launch nations - Germany, Italy, Spain and the UK - and scepticism about the advantages of a capability associated more with spectacular air show manoeuvres than operating prudence will make it difficult to secure backing from existing customers.

Instead, the four-nation industrial combine and Eurofighter plan to discuss with possible export customers offset and technology transfer packages that would include "growth potential" for the fighter.

"We are evaluating future markets and a number of RFPs [requests for proposal] have asked for potential growth," says Adrian Johnson, senior vice-president sales for Eurojet. "TVN is in there. It might be that a customer outside Europe could come on board and embrace that technology."

Although Eurofighter has secured Austria and Saudi Arabia as export customers and is pitching the Typhoon at countries such as Greece, Japan, Romania, Switzerland and Turkey, India is the most likely partner because of the size of its requirement and the fact that it is determined to develop its aerospace industrial base.

Another factor is that Eurojet is separately bidding against General Electric to supply the EJ200 for an improved version of India's single-engine Tejas light combat aircraft. A combined offer could provide sufficient economies to persuade India to fund a demonstration programme.

Johnson says Eurojet could be ready for a flight demonstration within 18-24 months, but stresses that the emphasis will be on obtaining data that backs the TVN's economic benefits rather than its enhanced dogfighting capability.

"Increasing agility isn't going to cause [potential customers] to back TVN," he says. "What will cause them to back it is a reduction in lifecycle costs. That's what we have to demonstrate and build a cast-iron case around."
 

Rahul Singh

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All around the world India is taken as 'easy money'. I think India should finance only when EADS make us a profit sharing partner. Unless this happens we should stay away from financing.

It hurts, when i see Russia making money by selling different variants of SU-30MKI whose development was entirely financed by us.
 

abhi

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Tejas engine offset offers come in

Bangalore: European aerospace company Eurojet and America's General Electric submitted offset proposals for their bids for light combat aircraft Tejas engines to the ministry of defence on Friday, a day before the deadline expires -- December 12.The Indian government invites offset proposals from bidders of defence and civil aircraft deals.

An offset obligation is expected to be discharged through direct purchases or by executing export orders for defence products and components manufactured by or services provided by Indian defence industries. In many instances, it also involves technology transfer and training for military requirements.

As per the defence procurement policy 2006, 30-50% offset obligation is mandatory for the winner of the defence deal. There are two offset proposals -- technical and commercial -- submitted by each bidder, which are opened after completion of technical and commercial evaluations. For instance, technical offset proposal is opened after the technical evaluation and commercial offset offer after commercial evaluation.

Since the offset programme of the Indian government will require transfer of the key technology, the two aerospace companies need clearances from their respectively governments or regional economic organisations.

Apparently, Eurojet, which will be supplying its EJ200 for the new LCA Tejas, has got clearance from Nato Eurofighter and Tornado Management Agency (Netma) for the transfer of "key technology" under the offset programme.

"In their proposal, they (Eurojet) have accepted to transfer key technology. They have also mentioned in the same note they can discuss transfer of other technologies too," the source said.

According to him, if the European engine maker offers 100% transfer of technology, the price of its bid would shoot up; "Then its bid would not be competitive."Eurojet has said it would form a joint venture with Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd or some private company to fulfill its offset obligation.

GE, which will supply the F-414 engine, is also said to have acquired the approval of the US government for technology transfer for the LCA programme. The two companies that have bid for the $750 million order for 99 engines for Tejas.

http://www.dnaindia.com/money/report_tejas-engine-offset-offers-come-in_1322774
 

pankaj nema

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the latest news is that kaveri engine is being revived.
GOI is not satisfied with licenced production of EJ 200 OR GE 414

Snecma is offering joint development.
GTRE is hoping to get atleast two latest technologies which can onlycome about if Kaveri is kept alive
 

nitesh

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cross posting:

Shape Memory Alloys

Currently, the technology for the manufacture of Ni-Ti-Fe alloys and heat shrinkable sleeves are under transfer to Foundry & Forge Division of HAL, Bengaluru, where a plant dedicated to this purpose is being set up. When operational, this plant will be the only one in the country and amongst a few worldwide that manufacture shape memory alloys and heat shrinkable fasteners. Other components currently under development for application in LCA include heat shrinkable hydraulic coupling and thermally actuated valves.
 

Agantrope

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A powerful Kaveri (95/125KN) is needed for Tejas Mk-2 :goodstuff:

I love to see the Tejas mk-2 with canards like EF and a large wingspan :dfi-1:

It is nice to hear joint production with snecma for kaveri. A engine similar like M88 with a powerful thrust in the range of AL-31F :connie_running:
 

Rahul Singh

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A bit confusing even thought article doesn't speak directly about dumping EJ200 or F-414.

I have a firm belif that new Kaveri will not be a reality anytime before 2016-17. And if they are trageting MK-2 then i will say Tejas program is in real mess! So in my openion. It would be much better if MOD brings some clarity. Might be by saying that new Kaveri will only go into last batch(MK-3) of Tejas.
 
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