Sukhoi PAK FA

[scatterStorm]

T-50-5 (1-05) taxies from cannon fire testing facility with cannon port hatch took off:

Weapon trials are ongoing this means, when can we see some air launched missiles from it's IWBs?

 

[gadeshi]

Weapon trials are ongoing this means, when can we see some air launched missiles from it's IWBs?

Sure!
As soon as RUMOD will publish them.

 

[Kshithij]

I disagree, any Defence system isn't useless, take the example of Yemeni's shooting down an F16 Advanced variant with a surface launched R27ER recently, that is hilarious considering that missile isn't meant to be highly maneuverable and is dedicated to destroying large aerial targets like tankers or AWACS systems because of it's extended range. I would also say that depends on certain factors to why that F16 was shot but you get my point.

So like the western propaganda machine, they are still living in utopia, air defence systems are real threat even to Stealth planes or whatever. We just don't know what a S300 could do, since not much of action it has seen but there's enough evidence that a puny R27 can do such thing, this reflects the prowess of Russians in terms air defence systems. They didn't perfected Fighter jets, because Russian geography wan't in favour of them so they took rather cheap approach and perfected air defence systems.

On the other hand, Western philosophy was all about cutting edge air supremacy, this is the very reason they perfected Stealth tech.

Besides, we are also missing the point of an air-to-air battle at Himalayas, it's not possible because of geography. Even Americans know this.

Firstly, China and India are enemies only in Wester propaganda. Reality is that NATO and Islam are the two big and real enemies. China has always behave in a mature manner. I would not even go into the propaganda.

Next, the Air Defence has become very advanced with the advent of AESA radars and PESA radars. Indian Rajendra radar, for example is used in Swathi Weapons locating Radar and can accurately determine the flight path of artillery shells which are a small target. The radars for Air defence is generally much larger and powerful. There is nothing called stealth fighter. They are just low observable fighters. These fighters can also be easily spossted from a distance of a hundred kilometres with most modern radars. Indian radars are not any inferior t Russian ones. We don't need S400 to lcate fighter jets.

That being said, S400 has some technology which can be beneficial to India. The missile technology that will be obtained can be useful in making our own XR SAM. As of now, India has only Akash missile. I am sure that range of Akash has been downplayed to be 30km whereas it might be 50km+ with most of the range being a no escape zone. S400 may give additional technology needed to increase the range without compromising on the accuracy.

Himalayas can have air to air battle and even SAM. But in China border, the Himalayas are further extended into Tibet which is a hostile and difficult to inhabit terrain. Hence, the number of target for India will be limited and the logistics will be difficult for China. But the Himalays between Pakistan and India can see a lot of action and lot of SAM, aircrafts are likely to be deployed there.

Russian philosophy does not prohibit fighter development. In fact, the best 4th generation fighter between USA and Russia is Su30/Su35. It is better than F18/F15/F16. USA's fifth generation fighters focus more on stealth while compromising maneverability and speed whereas Russia doe not emphasise on stealth and instead goes for maneuverability. Here, Russian philosophy is more sensible as all stealth will become obsolete when the radars get improved. F35 may have been designed to be stealth in 1990 but its is not stealth in 2015 radar technology. As a result, F35 ended up being a fat and useless plane. In this way, it was the UA that aild, not Russia

 

[Steven Rogers]

Firstly, China and India are enemies only in Wester propaganda. Reality is that NATO and Islam are the two big and real enemies. China has always behave in a mature manner. I would not even go into the propaganda.

Next, the Air Defence has become very advanced with the advent of AESA radars and PESA radars. Indian Rajendra radar, for example is used in Swathi Weapons locating Radar and can accurately determine the flight path of artillery shells which are a small target. The radars for Air defence is generally much larger and powerful. There is nothing called stealth fighter. They are just low observable fighters. These fighters can also be easily spossted from a distance of a hundred kilometres with most modern radars. Indian radars are not any inferior t Russian ones. We don't need S400 to lcate fighter jets.

That being said, S400 has some technology which can be beneficial to India. The missile technology that will be obtained can be useful in making our own XR SAM. As of now, India has only Akash missile. I am sure that range of Akash has been downplayed to be 30km whereas it might be 50km+ with most of the range being a no escape zone. S400 may give additional technology needed to increase the range without compromising on the accuracy.

Himalayas can have air to air battle and even SAM. But in China border, the Himalayas are further extended into Tibet which is a hostile and difficult to inhabit terrain. Hence, the number of target for India will be limited and the logistics will be difficult for China. But the Himalays between Pakistan and India can see a lot of action and lot of SAM, aircrafts are likely to be deployed there.

Russian philosophy does not prohibit fighter development. In fact, the best 4th generation fighter between USA and Russia is Su30/Su35. It is better than F18/F15/F16. USA's fifth generation fighters focus more on stealth while compromising maneverability and speed whereas Russia doe not emphasise on stealth and instead goes for maneuverability. Here, Russian philosophy is more sensible as all stealth will become obsolete when the radars get improved. F35 may have been designed to be stealth in 1990 but its is not stealth in 2015 radar technology. As a result, F35 ended up being a fat and useless plane. In this way, it was the UA that aild, not Russia

What if stealth improves, with advent of wide band Radar absorbing materials, metamaterials and other skins. It's not easy to locate as it is easy to say at 100kms. A low frequency radar need to focus on the stealth fighter in order to track but will attract a lot of clutter.

Sent from my Aqua Ace II using Tapatalk

 

[Kshithij]

What if stealth improves, with advent of wide band Radar absorbing materials, metamaterials and other skins. It's not easy to locate as it is easy to say at 100kms. A low frequency radar need to focus on the stealth fighter in order to track but will attract a lot of clutter.

Sent from my Aqua Ace II using Tapatalk

There can never be 100% stealth. The edges of wings have to be made from metals, RAM coating gets worn off by friction. Even otherwise, the RAM coating does not make RCS to 0. It only reduces it by absorbing and deflecting.

In addition, other factors like radars of planes emitting signals, the movement of air around the plane, heat generated etc will give lot of signals for detection.

 

[Steven Rogers]

There can never be 100% stealth. The edges of wings have to be made from metals, RAM coating gets worn off by friction. Even otherwise, the RAM coating does not make RCS to 0. It only reduces it by absorbing and deflecting.

In addition, other factors like radars of planes emitting signals, the movement of air around the plane, heat generated etc will give lot of signals for detection.

I'm not talking about the coating but materials embedded in the body.

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[Kshithij]

I'm not talking about the coating but materials embedded in the body.

Sent from my Aqua Ace II using Tapatalk

RAM is not sturdy material to be able withstand stress while supersonic flight, landing, take-off and hence embedded RAM composite will not be used in making the airframe

 

[scatterStorm]

Firstly, China and India are enemies only in Wester propaganda. Reality is that NATO and Islam are the two big and real enemies. China has always behave in a mature manner. I would not even go into the propaganda.

Next, the Air Defence has become very advanced with the advent of AESA radars and PESA radars. Indian Rajendra radar, for example is used in Swathi Weapons locating Radar and can accurately determine the flight path of artillery shells which are a small target. The radars for Air defence is generally much larger and powerful. There is nothing called stealth fighter. They are just low observable fighters. These fighters can also be easily spossted from a distance of a hundred kilometres with most modern radars. Indian radars are not any inferior t Russian ones. We don't need S400 to lcate fighter jets.

That being said, S400 has some technology which can be beneficial to India. The missile technology that will be obtained can be useful in making our own XR SAM. As of now, India has only Akash missile. I am sure that range of Akash has been downplayed to be 30km whereas it might be 50km+ with most of the range being a no escape zone. S400 may give additional technology needed to increase the range without compromising on the accuracy.

Himalayas can have air to air battle and even SAM. But in China border, the Himalayas are further extended into Tibet which is a hostile and difficult to inhabit terrain. Hence, the number of target for India will be limited and the logistics will be difficult for China. But the Himalays between Pakistan and India can see a lot of action and lot of SAM, aircrafts are likely to be deployed there.

Russian philosophy does not prohibit fighter development. In fact, the best 4th generation fighter between USA and Russia is Su30/Su35. It is better than F18/F15/F16. USA's fifth generation fighters focus more on stealth while compromising maneverability and speed whereas Russia doe not emphasise on stealth and instead goes for maneuverability. Here, Russian philosophy is more sensible as all stealth will become obsolete when the radars get improved. F35 may have been designed to be stealth in 1990 but its is not stealth in 2015 radar technology. As a result, F35 ended up being a fat and useless plane. In this way, it was the UA that aild, not Russia

I agree on most of the points, I would like to add few words here, the Russian philosophy I wrote about was back in Cold War era. At that time, missile developments like ICBMs with MIRVs, short range, long range and medium range AAMs and SAMs were emphasised more than on long range bombers or jets. Jet R&D came into picture almost at the end of cold war, I could be wrong here, but I am saying this because of what I saw in documentaries especially in "wings of Russia", where they mentioned that Missile development was way advanced than any nation, In contrast US had advanced jet programs.

Nevertheless, In modern era, the development has shifted to multi spectrum but the core still lies to Missile Development programs. Recently Putin disclosed new weapons which didn't involved any sixth gen jet, but slew of Missiles including a hyper-sonic missile and autonomous subs.

 

[prohumanity]

[QUOTE="Kshithij,
]Firstly, China and India are enemies only in Western propaganda. Reality is that NATO and Islam are the two big and real enemies. China has always behave in a mature manner. I would not even go into the propaganda.[/QUOTE]

Glad to know that someone understands this truth. Of Course, the fake news franchise wants to create this illusion that somehow China and India will automatically become enemies ...just because warmongers in West desire so.
So they can keep selling weapons and keep the crazy hegemony over the world.
..let China and India both rapidly equip themselves with extremely powerful Nuclear and all other kinds of weapons , so if a day of bullying finally comes...they go down but take evil western warmongers along with them.
Say No to hegemony...Yes to peaceful MultiPolar World...

 

[gadeshi]

RAM is not sturdy material to be able withstand stress while supersonic flight, landing, take-off and hence embedded RAM composite will not be used in making the airframe

No, you are wrong here.
There is a mainstream trend now to use construction embedded RAMs in favour of RAM coatings.

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[gadeshi]

======================================

RAM coated dielectric mesh on canopy back that covers air conditioning system stubs:

 

[scatterStorm]

@gadeshi what can you tell me about the new hyper sonic Kenzal missile launch test. It was tested on a Mig 31 under it's belly pylons? Please also do translate what this pops is speaking at the end of the video.

 

[gadeshi]

Kinjahl (Dagger) is an aero-ballistic hypersonic missile based on Iskander OTBM missiles adapted for air launch.
Missile is capable of 2000km range with a cruise speeds up to 10M on altitude up to 50km.
Missile is capable of hitting ground and sea stationary and moving targets homing on them with AESA homing seeker augmented by multi-spectral optical IIR/UV system.

GRAU index (like 3M55/E/I for Onyx/Yakhont/BrahMos) is unknown for now.
There are only MiG-31DZ special anti-satellite version and Tu-22M3M/M4 can carry it.

 

[scatterStorm]

Kinjahl (Dagger) is an aero-ballistic hypersonic missile based on Iskander OTBM missiles adapted for air launch.
Missile is capable of 2000km range with a cruise speeds up to 10M on altitude up to 50km.
Missile is capable of hitting ground and sea stationary and moving targets homing on them with AESA homing seeker augmented by multi-spectral optical IIR/UV system.

GRAU index (like 3M55/E/I for Onyx/Yakhont/BrahMos) is unknown for now.
There are only MiG-31DZ special anti-satellite version and Tu-22M3M/M4 can carry it.

Thank @gadeshi once again, I cannot fathom how the seeker would be still functional at those speeds, reaching even at mach 8 produce a plasma cloud which technically could shield ability of AESA on-board, does it uses some sort of analog feedback system that let's the missile on it path at such higher speeds.

So the Mig-31DZ would be the special plane carrying this heavy payload to destroy sats. What about SU57 carrying them, I saw RT also said SU57 will be carrying it in special mission configuration, but from the looks of the missile, it's heavy, I mean are they sure?

And what about TU-22M3M version of the missile, is it meant for a ground penetrating standoff missile? Because it's has large fin system installed.

 

[gadeshi]

Thank @gadeshi once again, I cannot fathom how the seeker would be still functional at those speeds, reaching even at mach 8 produce a plasma cloud which technically could shield ability of AESA on-board, does it uses some sort of analog feedback system that let's the missile on it path at such higher speeds.

So the Mig-31DZ would be the special plane carrying this heavy payload to destroy sats. What about SU57 carrying them, I saw RT also said SU57 will be carrying it in special mission configuration, but from the looks of the missile, it's heavy, I mean are they sure?

And what about TU-22M3M version of the missile, is it meant for a ground penetrating standoff missile? Because it's has large fin system installed.

Kinjahl is air-to-ground missile only.
It cannot hit sats (there is another one for this).
Tu-22M3M carries the same missile for CAG destroy missions.

Su-57 will not carry it anyway.

Missile is 10M on route only, towarding target area on inertial nav only.
Then missile breaks to 4,5-5M performing AA evasive maneuvers and targets using AESA.

 

[sjmaverick]

@gadeshi there is lot discussed here for upcoming visit to Russia by India's Defense Minister....S 400 contract is one, Contract for Helicopter is second, Frigates is third and of course fourth one is a bleak hope of some progress on su57 (Fourth one is my personal hope though) is there any such discussion/confirmation at your end ?

 

[gadeshi]

@gadeshi there is lot discussed here for upcoming visit to Russia by India's Defense Minister....S 400 contract is one, Contract for Helicopter is second, Frigates is third and of course fourth one is a bleak hope of some progress on su57 (Fourth one is my personal hope though) is there any such discussion/confirmation at your end ?

No as I know.
Russians are tired of "indian dances" around the contracts. All believe the ball is on Indian side.

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[gadeshi]

Unique photo of the "old" pre-repair T-50-5 landing with engine fire upon IAF delegation showcase:

 

[bhramos]

The engine test for the Su-57 fighter was completed

The final meeting of the State Commission for the AL-41F-1 was concluded by the solemn presentation of the PJSC "UDK-UMPO" with the completion of the state bench tests of the experimental engine, the company said.
"AL-41F-1 performs the function of the first stage engine for the fifth generation fighter Su-57 (PAK FA). The first test flight of PAK FA with AL-41F-1 took place on January 29, 2010, "the UDK reminded.
The program of the Su-57 fighter (PAK FA) provides for the creation of the first serial samples with the engine AL-41F-1 of the first stage. From the engine for the Su-35S (product 117C) it is distinguished by increased traction, a sophisticated automation system, a completely digital control system, a new turbine and improved flow characteristics.
The engine of the second stage (product 30) must provide the fighter with cruising supersonic speed, higher maneuverability, and range of flight. The first flight of the Su-57 with this engine took place in December last year.
https://tvzvezda.ru/news/opk/content/201804171253-sqis.htm

 

[Armand2REP]

The engine test for the Su-57 fighter was completed

The final meeting of the State Commission for the AL-41F-1 was concluded by the solemn presentation of the PJSC "UDK-UMPO" with the completion of the state bench tests of the experimental engine, the company said.
"AL-41F-1 performs the function of the first stage engine for the fifth generation fighter Su-57 (PAK FA). The first test flight of PAK FA with AL-41F-1 took place on January 29, 2010, "the UDK reminded.
The program of the Su-57 fighter (PAK FA) provides for the creation of the first serial samples with the engine AL-41F-1 of the first stage. From the engine for the Su-35S (product 117C) it is distinguished by increased traction, a sophisticated automation system, a completely digital control system, a new turbine and improved flow characteristics.
The engine of the second stage (product 30) must provide the fighter with cruising supersonic speed, higher maneuverability, and range of flight. The first flight of the Su-57 with this engine took place in December last year.
https://tvzvezda.ru/news/opk/content/201804171253-sqis.htm

It has been flying with that engine the whole time. When are they going to finish the second stage?