Sukhoi PAK FA

[scatterStorm]

Where is AMCA? At present its just a paper plane, We are not sure about its engine, or avionics or its actual design) some day the design is frozen, but honestly see the frozen design and then later compare with prototype, it might be a lot different.

If you look at it, PAKFA is flying, AMCA is not even close to prototype, so better go for at least Su-30 MKI way, Take a few PAKFA with Item 30 engines and test them and then suggest what upgrades we need and do these upgrades in India for indian indigenous content,

On other hand,Whatever we learn from PAKFA MKI (FGFA) the lesson learnt should be incorporated in AMCA.

Honestly I would love AMCA to be a Naval plane, very like F/A-18, as you know that each F/A-18 can fly from a carrier by addition of tail hook. Each F/A-18 is identical unlike Rafale which has different version and hence Rafale B cannot fly or take off from Carrier. This can be harmful in a way but also have an advantage where the carrier can be used as advance refueling and rearming base to conduct seaborne Air dominance on pakistan. This way the nuimber of planes that can be used from carrier will not be limited to the capacity of carrier to carry, but depend on the carrier capacity to refuel and rearm them.

I've already discussed on this issue somewhere on the forum, I'd also have the same opinion as you've right now ... Buy some SU50s of-the-shelf with some tweaks in avionics from Israel ... buy them with there new engines, give to our boys, let them fly for good few hundred sorties, now pick some experience pilots ... send them to AMCA research facility at HAL, get there inputs and allow them to fully express there concerns in the manufacturing phase ... just like what Russians do. As of somebody said on the forum, that 6 of our top pilots are already there getting to know the jet and fly it.

Meanwhile, FGFA is not dropped, take the inputs from there, apply to AMCA. Prototype by prototype improve the jet just like we are doing with Tejas.

Regarding Naval FJP, I think MIG-29Ks are good enough for now, unless the US does give us the F18s E and G variant along with F414 engines with 18% improved T/W ratio, yes there latest engine ... everyone's happy and finally we have a proven plane, or even better, by 2 squadron worth of there block 3 variant ... the advanced super hornets and 1 squadron worth of growlers ... everyone is extremely happy and we get make PAF and PLAF shit in there pants. The growlers would pave the way by SEAD ops and Advanced F18s carrying the strike ops.

Even better drop some MIGs with us already and be the badass Naval Power Projector in the entire Asia... the only Naval air super power with both western and Russian tech onboard.

 

[TPFscopes]

Somebody please share actual pic/video of T-50's IWB. No graphic plz

 

[gadeshi]

Somebody please share actual pic/video of T-50's IWB. No graphic plz

I would pay a Courvoiseur bottle for that info
But it's still a secret.

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[smestarz]

Fullback design is mostly the cockpit part only.
Russians and the Americans for their Bombers and strike designated strike craft prefer Side by side seating so that the controls are not duplicated. IAF do not prefer so, maybe they feel that this way the pilots might indulge in sharing popcorn when flying.

I've already discussed on this issue somewhere on the forum, I'd also have the same opinion as you've right now ... Buy some SU50s of-the-shelf with some tweaks in avionics from Israel ... buy them with there new engines, give to our boys, let them fly for good few hundred sorties, now pick some experience pilots ... send them to AMCA research facility at HAL, get there inputs and allow them to fully express there concerns in the manufacturing phase ... just like what Russians do. As of somebody said on the forum, that 6 of our top pilots are already there getting to know the jet and fly it.

Meanwhile, FGFA is not dropped, take the inputs from there, apply to AMCA. Prototype by prototype improve the jet just like we are doing with Tejas.

Regarding Naval FJP, I think MIG-29Ks are good enough for now, unless the US does give us the F18s E and G variant along with F414 engines with 18% improved T/W ratio, yes there latest engine ... everyone's happy and finally we have a proven plane, or even better, by 2 squadron worth of there block 3 variant ... the advanced super hornets and 1 squadron worth of growlers ... everyone is extremely happy and we get make PAF and PLAF shit in there pants. The growlers would pave the way by SEAD ops and Advanced F18s carrying the strike ops.

Even better drop some MIGs with us already and be the badass Naval Power Projector in the entire Asia... the only Naval air super power with both western and Russian tech onboard.

Umm, is it based on "Fullbacks" design mostly the fuselage part?

 

[smestarz]

That would be the sane thing to do.
Dassault is spinning a lot about Rafale and that they are going for 6th Gen plane ignoring 5th Gen.
Rather I dont think Dassault is capable to design a 5th Gen plane., They had invested a lot on 4th gen plane which like Eurofighter came in too late, and by that time the likes of Su-30 MiG-29 and F/A-18 did their business. YES Rafale and Eurofighter are good, but they are a Generation too late.

One of the point that I might really add to Gen 6 requirements might be the cost.

I am even contemplating developing and making plane like Dornier 335 PFEIL and with two powerful engines and 4 pylons on each wing (and wingtip pylon for heat seeking missile) this could be a cheap CAS plane that money can buy. and with its twin engine config, it can carry a heavy load required and can give a good account of itself for limited A2A envelope but provide a good firepower for CAS. Further it being Turbo prop, it might be both cheap to buy , use and maintian.. just a thought

I've already discussed on this issue somewhere on the forum, I'd also have the same opinion as you've right now ... Buy some SU50s of-the-shelf with some tweaks in avionics from Israel ... buy them with there new engines, give to our boys, let them fly for good few hundred sorties, now pick some experience pilots ... send them to AMCA research facility at HAL, get there inputs and allow them to fully express there concerns in the manufacturing phase ... just like what Russians do. As of somebody said on the forum, that 6 of our top pilots are already there getting to know the jet and fly it.

Meanwhile, FGFA is not dropped, take the inputs from there, apply to AMCA. Prototype by prototype improve the jet just like we are doing with Tejas.

Regarding Naval FJP, I think MIG-29Ks are good enough for now, unless the US does give us the F18s E and G variant along with F414 engines with 18% improved T/W ratio, yes there latest engine ... everyone's happy and finally we have a proven plane, or even better, by 2 squadron worth of there block 3 variant ... the advanced super hornets and 1 squadron worth of growlers ... everyone is extremely happy and we get make PAF and PLAF shit in there pants. The growlers would pave the way by SEAD ops and Advanced F18s carrying the strike ops.

Even better drop some MIGs with us already and be the badass Naval Power Projector in the entire Asia... the only Naval air super power with both western and Russian tech onboard.

 

[sjmaverick]

News does not throw any light w.r.t. development stage of new engine nor does it provide any deadline for the same...@gadeshi any concrete news on new engines ground tests ?

RUSSIA'S T-50 SUPER JET PREPARING TO SOAR WITH NEXT-GEN ENGINE

Flight tests of Russian newest PAK FA (T-50) fighter aircraft with a standard engine will start in the near future, General Designer of the United Aircraft Corporation (UAC) Sergei Korotkov said Wednesday.
MOSCOW — So far the prototypes of the aircraft have been equipped with the so-called Izdeliye 117 — an engine of the "first stage," which has already been put into production, while the engine of the "second stage" is being developed.

A Conceptual art of the new advanced turbofan engine
"Testing of T-50 aircraft with the next-generation engine, which was initially created for this aircraft, will start in the near future," Korotkov said.
Russian Sukhoi T-50 (PAK FA) is the fifth-generation stealth fighter. It is a single-seat, twin-engine multirole jet fighter designed for air superiority and attack roles. The first flight of the aircraft took place in 2010.

 

[gadeshi]

======================================

 

[smestarz]

Looks very much like the wooden left over after sharpening a pencil using sharpener
Just maybe a better sharpener..

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/Sharpener_with_Pencil.jpg

======================================

 

[scatterStorm]

======================================

I am curious, looks like the nozzle has more trapezoidal design unlike in most fulcrum engines as if the diamond edges improving reduction in thermal radiation, the modifications seem to have a new 3D TVC? or maybe I am just over speculating.

 

[gadeshi]

I am curious, looks like the nozzle has more trapezoidal design unlike in most fulcrum engines as if the diamond edges improving reduction in thermal radiation, the modifications seem to have a new 3D TVC? or maybe I am just over speculating.

This was one of the options for Item 30.

 

[gadeshi]

Stage II airframe continues its tests on T-50-8 (1-08) prototype:

 

[lcafanboy]

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/19..._PAK_FA_T_50_5th_Gen_Fighter_Jet#.WQy_IRlCTqA

New Engine Developed For Russia's PAK FA T-50 5th Gen Fighter Jet
Our Bureau
07:21 AM, May 4, 2017
791 views

New engine for Russian PAK-FA Jet in 2018
- A +
Russia is likely to complete first stage trials of next-generation engine that it has developed for the PAK FA (T-50) fighter jet by 2018.

"Today the next-generation engine has been actually developed and soon trials will begin for it together with the T-50, for which it has been created.” United Aircraft-Building Corporation Chief Designer Sergei Korotkov said at a TASS press conference on Wednesday.

The 5th-generation fighter jet is currently equipped with 117S first-stage engine. The new engine has not yet received its name but is known as the second-stage engine.

The design bureau is carrying out specific work. We are working on these projects together with them," the chief designer said.

The first stage of trials is expected to be completed in 2018.The T-50 with the new engine would perform its first flight in the fourth quarter of 2017.

The T-50 serial production will begin in 2017, after which the fighter jet will enter service with Russia’s Aerospace Force. The fighter jet made its debut flight in 2010.

 

[scatterStorm]

Stage II airframe continues its tests on T-50-8 (1-08) prototype:

Looks like I was right, the item30 engine will have much better TVC nozzels. Hey @gadeshi

When I saw a Jap F35 video on the forum in full HD, it's RAM coating is way smooth, I assume the prototype 08 in picture haven't been RAM coated, right? Do SU50s are using some kind of special nano-tech fused RAM coating? I was not able to find any research papers or patent publications especially from Russia, or I may be looking in the wrong direction?

 

[TPFscopes]

______________________________________

 

[bhramos]

T-50 PAK-FA ПАК-ФА

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

[gadeshi]

I Think We Should Import Some Prototypes Of PAK-FAs From Russia And Manufacture It Here In India....or use its tech in AMCA

This is the point of FGFA programne, isn't it?
You will get your 3 PMI prototypes in 2019-2020.

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[cobra commando]

Indo-Russian 5th gen fighter takes shape as deal on design to be inked soon

 

[Prashant12]

India, Russia to ink deal on 5th-gen fighter design

New Delhi, May 7 () After years of delay, India and Russia are likely to soon ink a "milestone" pact to finalise the detailed design for the fifth-generation fighter aircraft (FGFA) and move ahead with the multi-billion dollar co- development project.

Government sources said almost all the ground work has been completed to finalise the deal for design of the jet as well as some other critical issues.

"The contract for the detailed design would be signed soon and that will be a major milestone. It should be signed in the second half of the year," a top official involved in the negotiations with Russia on the project said.

Asked whether India has linked the project to full-scale transfer of technology, the official, who requested anonymity, said both the countries are co-developers and India will have equal rights over the the technology.

"We are co-developers. There is nothing called technology transfer in this project. India has equal rights. We will have the wherewithal to continue production. We are equal partner in the project," he said.

In the negotiations for the project, India had insisted that it must get all the required codes and access to critical technology so that it can upgrade the aircraft as per its requirements.

In February last year, India and Russia had revived talks on the project after a clearance from then Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar.

Since then, a lot of issues related to work share, IPR and technology transfer among others have been sorted out between the two sides, along with the monetary commitments.

In 2007, India and Russia had inked an inter-governmental pact for the FGFA project.

In December 2010, India had agreed to pay USD 295 million towards the preliminary design of the fighter, which is called in India as the 'Perspective Multi-role Fighter' (PMF). However, negotiations faced various hurdles in the subsequent years.

Sources said the work on various co-development projects have been expedited following the government's renewed focus on modernisation of the armed forces.

In March, India and Russia had signed two key agreements for long-term maintenance and technical support for Russian- made Su-30MKI fighter jets of the Indian Air Force.

Currently, the IAF operates around 230 Su-30MKI fighter jets and, as per the agreements, Russian defence majors United Aircraft Corporation and the United Engine Corporation will render technical support and provide maintenance services and spares for the fleet for a period of five years.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...h-gen-fighter-design/articleshow/58560788.cms

 

[WolfPack86]

As predicted, India and Russia will sign the final development contract for the Sukhoi T-50 derived fifth generation fighter aircraft soon.
https://twitter.com/SJha1618?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author

 

[kunal1123]

NOW THAT WHAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR .........................???????????
India, Russia to ink deal on 5th-generation fighter aircraft design
3 minutes


SOURCE: PTI

After years of delay, India and Russia are likely to soon ink a “milestone” pact to finalise the detailed design for the fifth-generation fighter aircraft (FGFA) and move ahead with the multi-billion dollar co-development project.

Government sources said almost all the ground work has been completed to finalise the deal for design of the jet as well as some other critical issues. “The contract for the detailed design would be signed soon and that will be a major milestone. It should be signed in the second half of the year,” a top official involved in the negotiations with Russia on the project said.

Asked whether India has linked the project to full-scale transfer of technology, the official, who requested anonymity, said both the countries are co-developers and India will have equal rights over the the technology.

“We are co-developers. There is nothing called technology transfer in this project. India has equal rights. We will have the wherewithal to continue production. We are equal partner in the project,” he said.

In the negotiations for the project, India had insisted that it must get all the required codes and access to critical technology so that it can upgrade the aircraft as per its requirements.

In February last year, India and Russia had revived talks on the project after a clearance from then Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar.

Since then, a lot of issues related to work share, IPR and technology transfer among others have been sorted out between the two sides, along with the monetary commitments.

In 2007, India and Russia had inked an inter-governmental pact for the FGFA project.

In December 2010, India had agreed to pay USD 295 million towards the preliminary design of the fighter, which is called in India as the ‘Perspective Multi-role Fighter’ (PMF). However, negotiations faced various hurdles in the subsequent years.

Sources said the work on various co-development projects have been expedited following the government’s renewed focus on modernisation of the armed forces.

In March, India and Russia had signed two key agreements for long-term maintenance and technical support for Russian- made Su-30MKI fighter jets of the Indian Air Force.

Currently, the IAF operates around 230 Su-30MKI fighter jets and, as per the agreements, Russian defence majors United Aircraft Corporation and the United Engine Corporation will render technical support and provide maintenance services and spares for the fleet for a period of five years.