Small arms and Light Weapons

When picking a gun, what would your primary consideration be?


  • Total voters
    85
  • Poll closed .

Aditya Ballal

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2020
Messages
2,677
Likes
15,885
Country flag
Barrel for *39 is longer than that of *51?
Barrel length of an AKM/AK-103= 16.3 Inches.
Barrel Length of Sig 716= 16 inches.
This is hardly surprising.
Anyways the barrel length for both the versions is the same at 409mm. Since the 7.62x51 version has that extra padding on the buttstock it looks longer.
 
Last edited:

Johny_Baba

ΰ€…ΰ€œΰ₯ΰ€žΰ€Ύΰ€¨ΰ₯€
Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
2,323
Likes
9,999
Country flag
Found this rare one lying in our bell of arms
it was supposed to replace Lee-Enfield due to various performance issues observed with that during (second) Boer War. They made their own mauser-action rifle after observing South African Boers' Mauser rifles and designed this one and so, was supposed to become standard issue of then British Empire but they had already issued thousands of SMLE pattern rifles back then and as world war 1 approached there wasn't much time and resources left to completely replace already mass issued SMLEs so they just stuck together and...they won the war so Lee-Enfield survived the purge that way and continued to be in service.

sometimes all you need is that one chance...
 

Flying Dagger

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2019
Messages
3,104
Likes
8,278
Country flag
View attachment 155332
IMO if we’re really desperate for a Kalashnikov pattern rifle, this is the way to go.
Commonality with existing AK pattern magazines, 5.56 STANAG pattern magazines, and 7.62 NATO SR-25 pattern magazines of the Sig 716 across the variants.
Well they quoted 1600 dollars for this as per some sources in the forum. In anycase weren't the lower bid. Though Vietnam produced it for around 1000 dollars .

M4 meets Ak that's Galil. Advantage is we can have side folding buttstock too without paying for additional price of Sig MCX.

In factory settings it comes with most of the aftermarket changes one may lookout for in a Ak203 we were getting.

Having said that i do wish we opt for a AR 15 carbine production line too and possibly mcx.

ACR Bushmaster Scar etc were also good rifles which i wish we license produce or copy.

Now since money is already spent to buy tools machineries and build infra in Amethi that line need to be started soon.
 

Johny_Baba

ΰ€…ΰ€œΰ₯ΰ€žΰ€Ύΰ€¨ΰ₯€
Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
2,323
Likes
9,999
Country flag
i just got this idea of, "what if IA decides to modernise their Sterling ;Carbines; with rails and stuff", i mean it seems highly unlikely that they would be getting any replacement carbine in near future so...maybe ?

anyway just googled about it and some pics i got...

😏 say, whatya say if IA gets their Sterlings upgraded like this...with a muzzle brake plus bottom rail for verticle grip and top rail for optical sight and of course JVPC-esque collapsible buttstock...
1652397655517.png

1652397663254.png

1652397673128.png

1652397689052.png

and this is how it would appear to a soldier while aiming down in say, kashmir region in winters lol
1652397700853.png

( pics credit & source =>Naudaff3d at https://www.artstation.com/artwork/oADoQq )

and if you think this is all just brain farts-imagination of some artist,
there indeed are some users who've done this kind of ;mod; on their Sterlings, for e.g.
1652398144331.png

1652398176310.png

1652398210425.png


and this vdo (seems like gopro recorded one, starting is kinda meh but after a while you could clearly see this user blasting targets with his Sterling + reddot combo)

So, whatya say ?
 

NotASussyBoi

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2021
Messages
769
Likes
2,077
Country flag
i just got this idea of, "what if IA decides to modernise their Sterling ;Carbines; with rails and stuff", i mean it seems highly unlikely that they would be getting any replacement carbine in near future so...maybe ?

anyway just googled about it and some pics i got...

😏 say, whatya say if IA gets their Sterlings upgraded like this...with a muzzle brake plus bottom rail for verticle grip and top rail for optical sight and of course JVPC-esque collapsible buttstock...
View attachment 155441
View attachment 155442
View attachment 155443
View attachment 155444
and this is how it would appear to a soldier while aiming down in say, kashmir region in winters lol
View attachment 155445
( pics credit & source =>Naudaff3d at https://www.artstation.com/artwork/oADoQq )

and if you think this is all just brain farts-imagination of some artist,
there indeed are some users who've done this kind of ;mod; on their Sterlings, for e.g.
View attachment 155446
View attachment 155447
View attachment 155448

and this vdo (seems like gopro recorded one, starting is kinda meh but after a while you could clearly see this user blasting targets with his Sterling + reddot combo)

So, whatya say ?
sorry sir but i cannot approve gun heresy in this server
 

Tactical Doge

π•±π–”π–”π–‘π–˜ π–—π–šπ–˜π– 𝖆𝖓𝖉 π–†π–“π–Œπ–Šπ–‘π–˜ π–‹π–Šπ–†π–—
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2019
Messages
7,907
Likes
47,717
Country flag
i just got this idea of, "what if IA decides to modernise their Sterling ;Carbines; with rails and stuff", i mean it seems highly unlikely that they would be getting any replacement carbine in near future so...maybe ?

anyway just googled about it and some pics i got...

😏 say, whatya say if IA gets their Sterlings upgraded like this...with a muzzle brake plus bottom rail for verticle grip and top rail for optical sight and of course JVPC-esque collapsible buttstock...
View attachment 155441
View attachment 155442
View attachment 155443
View attachment 155444
and this is how it would appear to a soldier while aiming down in say, kashmir region in winters lol
View attachment 155445
( pics credit & source =>Naudaff3d at https://www.artstation.com/artwork/oADoQq )

and if you think this is all just brain farts-imagination of some artist,
there indeed are some users who've done this kind of ;mod; on their Sterlings, for e.g.
View attachment 155446
View attachment 155447
View attachment 155448

and this vdo (seems like gopro recorded one, starting is kinda meh but after a while you could clearly see this user blasting targets with his Sterling + reddot combo)

So, whatya say ?
Beautiful
 

BlackViking

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2019
Messages
973
Likes
3,861
Country flag
i just got this idea of, "what if IA decides to modernise their Sterling ;Carbines; with rails and stuff", i mean it seems highly unlikely that they would be getting any replacement carbine in near future so...maybe ?

anyway just googled about it and some pics i got...

😏 say, whatya say if IA gets their Sterlings upgraded like this...with a muzzle brake plus bottom rail for verticle grip and top rail for optical sight and of course JVPC-esque collapsible buttstock...
View attachment 155441
View attachment 155442
View attachment 155443
View attachment 155444
and this is how it would appear to a soldier while aiming down in say, kashmir region in winters lol
View attachment 155445
( pics credit & source =>Naudaff3d at https://www.artstation.com/artwork/oADoQq )

and if you think this is all just brain farts-imagination of some artist,
there indeed are some users who've done this kind of ;mod; on their Sterlings, for e.g.
View attachment 155446
View attachment 155447
View attachment 155448

and this vdo (seems like gopro recorded one, starting is kinda meh but after a while you could clearly see this user blasting targets with his Sterling + reddot combo)

So, whatya say ?
Delete this before some MoD babu and/or IA General sees this. πŸ˜‚
I would definitely not like this abomination of a creation coming to reality.
 

Johny_Baba

ΰ€…ΰ€œΰ₯ΰ€žΰ€Ύΰ€¨ΰ₯€
Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
2,323
Likes
9,999
Country flag
Delete this before some MoD babu and/or IA General sees this. πŸ˜‚
I would definitely not like this abomination of a creation coming to reality.
...So you're saying you won't approve of my idea of modernising Sterling like something this way :sed: 😐
sterling modernized by johny_baba.jpg

features
- converted to closed bolt now (yes it's possible), blowback operated
- iron sights removed, now given a rail on top, optimised for optics but if needed a pair of backup iron sights can be mounted on it
- pdw-length AR style length adjustable (plus foldable too if done that way, not shown here) buttstock (here the one is from LMT's PDW kit)
- free-floating handguards replacing older one, now with top rails and 3-6-9 position M-Lok slots
- barrel free-floated now, also muzzle is threaded now with a flash hider installed on it, alternatively can also accept silencers (alternatively an internally silenced version could also be made from those silenced sterlings we have in service)
- fire selector is made ambidextrous now, with markings painted in bright red and white colours for better visibility
 

NotASussyBoi

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2021
Messages
769
Likes
2,077
Country flag
...So you're saying you won't approve of my idea of modernising Sterling like something this way :sed: 😐View attachment 155523
features
- converted to closed bolt now (yes it's possible), blowback operated
- iron sights removed, now given a rail on top, optimised for optics but if needed a pair of backup iron sights can be mounted on it
- pdw-length AR style length adjustable (plus foldable too if done that way, not shown here) buttstock (here the one is from LMT's PDW kit)
- free-floating handguards replacing older one, now with top rails and 3-6-9 position M-Lok slots
- barrel free-floated now, also muzzle is threaded now with a flash hider installed on it, alternatively can also accept silencers (alternatively an internally silenced version could also be made from those silenced sterlings we have in service)
- fire selector is made ambidextrous now, with markings painted in bright red and white colours for better visibility
my good man its practically applying medicine to a dead man,albeit sterling is still nice,porki terrorists will need alot more than 9mm imo once they get their american gucci gear
 

Marliii

Better to die on your feet than live on your knees
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2020
Messages
4,481
Likes
25,033
Country flag
So with the sig 716 deal dead and ak203 in a cold storage according to me now going for IWI ace in 7.62x51 for battlerifle ,5.56 variant for carbine and 7 .62x39 is a sound one .we are incapable of standardising ammo so just standardise the rifle
 

Spindrift

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 29, 2011
Messages
2,052
Likes
6,127
...So you're saying you won't approve of my idea of modernising Sterling like something this way :sed: 😐View attachment 155523
features
- converted to closed bolt now (yes it's possible), blowback operated
- iron sights removed, now given a rail on top, optimised for optics but if needed a pair of backup iron sights can be mounted on it
- pdw-length AR style length adjustable (plus foldable too if done that way, not shown here) buttstock (here the one is from LMT's PDW kit)
- free-floating handguards replacing older one, now with top rails and 3-6-9 position M-Lok slots
- barrel free-floated now, also muzzle is threaded now with a flash hider installed on it, alternatively can also accept silencers (alternatively an internally silenced version could also be made from those silenced sterlings we have in service)
- fire selector is made ambidextrous now, with markings painted in bright red and white colours for better visibility
1652457854673.png
 

Johny_Baba

ΰ€…ΰ€œΰ₯ΰ€žΰ€Ύΰ€¨ΰ₯€
Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
2,323
Likes
9,999
Country flag
DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA, YOU WON'T GET THIS INFO FROM ANYWHERE!

So, do you guys know that there existed a very special "export" variant of INSAS ?!
i mean everybody knows we exported INSAS to Oman, Nepal, Swaziland etc but from all the very limited pics i've seen of these exported INSAs, they all seemed like typical 1B//1B1 pattern ones that we're also using here in our armed forces and so,

BUT BUT WAIT, as i said, there DID exist a special export variant of INSAS, yes,

aannndd it looked like...

...

...

somewhat like,

this,
1652477534857.png

...you guys must be thinking like, eh ?
but notice the handguards here, goes full length upto the gas block, and seems pinned down to front iron sight post (very Excalibur like), oh and notice front iron sight post, it's fully hooded one like that's there on chinese Type-56 and no top handguard cover above gas tube...

...hhmm but this matchbox sized pic...what to even conclude from it ?

...well i happen to have another...graphic of it ?
1652477680243.png

...so apart from things mentioned above, notice four white ;dots; around the fire selector, denoting four separate fire mods on it that must have been Safe-Semi-3 round burst and Full Auto...

furthermore, this is what the author had to say about it from where i got it,
1652477796209.png


Source = Jane's Infantry Weapons, 2000 edition,
Author = Terence "Terry" J. Gander

Now, some of my own comments - hypothesis etc,
first of all it would be really silly to even say anything from such matchbox sized pics and some lame kwality graphic and so, but being into guns things and so i could try to think some things,
> I believe this variant didn't have gas cut-off switch on it plus was not meant to launch rifle grenades from it (besides rifle grenades and things were already becoming outdated sort of things due to emergence of underbarrel grenade launchers and such things), alebit they still used same 'long pattern' muzzle device on it with probably gas rings as well so if someone had tried it back then he could've launched rifle grenades off that variant i believe, albeit with also cycling the weapon due to lack of gas cut-off
> long handguards hhmm, probably also of slimmer profile, this seems overall better idea than current INSAS pattern handguards to be honest, also the shape of handguards make me think if it was designed based on L1A1 SLR's handguards in mind or what...i mean just look at it
1652478421243.png

similar long profile, affixed with gas block at front (here screwed upon instead of using cross-pin) and has long circular-rectangular cutouts as probably air vents, on INSAS Export variant those cutouts are kinda front ahead and are 4 on each sides plus the remaining part has straight line patterned grip-design in remaining parts hhmm
> front iron sight block is of hooded one type with hole in centre for adjustments, very reminiscent to chinese Type 56's iron sight block, something like this
1652478796441.png

> rest as i mentioned before, seems like having Safe-Semi-3 round burst-Full Auto thus 4 positions on fire selectors as evident from that graphic around fire selector part


Sooo...What happened to this variant ? Did anybody adopted it ? Oman ? Swaziland ? Nepal ?
My best hypothesis regd it is,
This "INSAS Export variant" later became "INSAS Assault Rifle"...
DO NOTE that what i am saying here is NOT 1B1 but "Assault Rifle", i mean on older days of OFB there was a mention of certain "5.56mm Assault Rifle" variant of the INSAS with Semi-3 round burst and Full auto modes , for more info refer to '5.56mm Assault Rifle (Fixed Butt).pdf' in attachments,
as for INSAS they, OFB, always mentioned it as "RIFLE 5.56mm INSAS (Fixed Butt)" (or Folable Butt in that config) on their catalog on their website...

but that raises question how did this "5.56mm Assault Rifle" variant of INSAS looked now ? there exist some good enough pics of that one and here they are,
1652479932588.png

1652480668579.png

(not sure with this next pic though but judging from fire selector shape that's different from regular 1B ones i believe this one is also "5.56mm Assault Rifle" variant)
1652480505205.png


So coming back to INSAS Export variant,
my hypothesis, as i said,
This "INSAS Export variant" later became "INSAS Assault Rifle" variant...
and later "INSAS Assault Rifle" variant became bases for INSAS Excalibur and so,
so It could've happened this way, i believe,
1652481513590.png


=======================================================================

This is all the info i have gained so far regd to INSAS Export variant and some of my own thoughts-hypothesis etc,
now i need some help,
as i mentioned above the pic of INSAS Export variant was taken by certain "Terence 'Terry' John Gander",
i tried to look around and found out...
He's from the United Kingdom, worked as a Defense Journalist for years, was also affiliated with Royal Military Academy of Sandhurst, mostly wrote defense related stuff for IHS Jane's for many years, now mostly retired and lives at this address,

9 Le Bourgage
Alderney
Channel Islands
GY9 3TL

so, my personal request to anybody from the UK here, please please try to be in contact with Mr. Terry Gander and inquire about this particular export variant of the INSAS, if possible please also try to source a complete pic from him :pray:
I tried my best to contact him, i mailed to Royal Military Academy but they never responded back,
I also tried to ask my <sensei> on teligram who's into actual defense dealings and stuff, all he informed to me was that, well, Terry is now 83+ years old 😐 (probably trying to say he's retired now and too old to even bother with such petty things etc)...
but i do still want to know, he's the only person i know of who could provide some solid info about this all, and if he kicks the bucket before revealing it all, it'll be buried with him forever...
so please please please anybody from the UK here do try to reach this fella and ask around for info as well as pics he took back in 2000, my very humble request to you :pray:
 

Attachments

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top