Pakistan JIT says Pathankot attack was drama staged by India to malign Islamabad: Report

[garg_bharat]

If Pakistan is the enemy then wtf is Modi doing going over there hugging its leader?

If they are the enemy then treat them as such, instead Modi's policy is all over the place.

See I have already told you. There is optics and there is a try to start a dialog. Obviously it did not work.
Each new government tries to solve pending issues. Everybody takes an approach that he thinks may work.

You will have successes as well as failures in international relations. However an environment in which people are well disposed towards India will help immensely in trade and business. This is a fact.

If you think all countries will magically align with India by a clap, then sorry it would not happen. It often takes several decades of work to build an image.

 

[garg_bharat]

That's not even the point.

The point is that by doing so Modi has legitimised Pakistan's BS assertion about "non-state actors" outside of their control commiting these acts. Now that threshold is broken there is no going back. He has allowed the very crminals responsible to be allowed to investigate it and on Indian soil no less. He has destroyed India's long held postion that Pakistan's state is intertwined with these elements.

But if you think a ground visit to see the EXACT entry point of their assets and how those pigs were cornered and killed by the security forces provides no information of any value to the Pakis then you are being intentionally naive. No amount of time on Google Earth would compensate for a guided tour around an Indian airbase would it?

Nobody has any doubts. I am not sure what you mean by "non-state actors" and how Pakistan benefits. Any organization on Pakistani soil is its government's responsibility.

What guided tour? The attackers were kept limited to outside the technical area. If the visitors are taken to a perimeter or an admin building, in which way the security is compromised?

 

[abingdonboy]

See I have already told you. There is optics and there is a try to start a dialog. Obviously it did not work.
Each new government tries to solve pending issues. Everybody takes an approach that he thinks may work.

You will have successes as well as failures in international relations. However an environment in which people are well disposed towards India will help immensely in trade and business. This is a fact.

If you think all countries will magically align with India by a clap, then sorry it would not happen. It often takes several decades of work to build an image.

After 26/11 India already had that support and there was a clear understanding of what Pakistan was - especially after OBL being found in Abootbad but Modi has undermined this and by literally embracing Pakistan had entirely destroyed this narrative and seemingly recognised Pakistan as a legitimate state with a responsible government.

There will be success and failure on the international stage but Pakistan is not an area india can afford to fail in- failures with Russia or Iran will have some economic consequences, this failure with Pakistan has cost Indians their lives and has threatened India's national security.

 

[abingdonboy]

Nobody has any doubts. I am not sure what you mean by "non-state actors" and how Pakistan benefits. Any organization on Pakistani soil is its government's responsibility.

You don't understand what Pakistan has been saying then and India has now validated their postion.

 

[garg_bharat]

After 26/11 India already had that support and there was a clear understanding of what Pakistan was - especially after OBL being found in Abootbad but Modi has undermined this and by literally embracing Pakistan had entirely destroyed this narrative and seemingly recognised Pakistan as a legitimate state with a responsible government.

There will be success and failure on the international stage but Pakistan is not an area india can afford to fail in- failures with Russia or Iran will have some economic consequences, this failure with Pakistan has cost Indians their lives and has threatened India's national security.

You please tell us what will happen? How Indian lives will be lost due to this.

The narrative of a responsible Pakistani government is pushed by the West, specially by USA. You must explain your viewpoint to them.

Should we stop dealing with USA due to this viewpoint?

There is no "failure" with Pakistan. People like you have a hurt ego problem. Thats it.

The diplomacy is called "art of the possible" for a reason. Why diplomacy is not called "art of the impossible".

We have to maintain minimum relations with Pakistan. I know it is optics, but it is necessary.

 

[garg_bharat]

You don't understand what Pakistan has been saying then and India has now validated their postion.

I support building trust with people in Pakistan. If we have even 10% of the population with us, we have a massive 20 million people.

You cannot do this by calling them an enemy.

I would advise you to learn from Putin. While Ukraine President call Russians enemy (even own citizens who are Russian speakers), Putin calls all Ukrainians brothers. Do you know who will win this war??

 

[abingdonboy]

We have to maintain minimum relations with Pakistan. I know it is optics, but it is necessary.

So you support this mindless Modi policy of style of substance, no peace and no justice?

 

[abingdonboy]

The narrative of a responsible Pakistani government is pushed by the West, specially by USA. You must explain your viewpoint to them.

Should we stop dealing with USA due to this viewpoint?

India can and should change this by having a single narrative and polciy showing what Pakistan is to the rest of the world. By going over and hugging their PM then allowing their JIT to visit Modi has ensured Pakistan is legitmised and India's claims are diminished.

 

[abingdonboy]

I support building trust with people in Pakistan. If we have even 10% of the population with us, we have a massive 20 million people.

You cannot do this by calling them an enemy.

What is 10% being pro-Indian going to do?

 

[Screambowl]

I support building trust with people in Pakistan. If we have even 10% of the population with us, we have a massive 20 million people.

You cannot do this by calling them an enemy.

I would advise you to learn from Putin. While Ukraine President call Russians enemy (even own citizens who are Russian speakers), Putin calls all Ukrainians brothers. Do you know who will win this war??

achaa? In that case India should be supporting them in Balochistan, they are not as they should.

 

[abingdonboy]

I would advise you to learn from Putin. While Ukraine President call Russians enemy (even own citizens who are Russian speakers), Putin calls all Ukrainians brothers. Do you know who will win this war??

This is totally different, you can't compare Russia and India and Ukraine and Pakistan. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and uses this nuclear umbrella to wage an active proxy war agaisnt India, and this takes place with the acceptance of most of theor population.

And Putin actually has balls.

 

[Screambowl]

we must not compare Pakistan with other examples in the world. The India Pak rivalry is little N. Korea vs S. Korea. Same people but theological differences. And and in this case, India is surrounded by B'desh, pakistan and China. And China is nuclear power, Pakistan is a N weapon state, and so India is. So such comparisons have less weightage.

If you were 10K kms away from Pakis then you could even think of nutrilizing them but not being an immediate neighbour. The threat is big and will not go so easily.

 

[garg_bharat]

What is 10% being pro-Indian going to do?

If there is a war and you occupy some land, do you want its population to be 100% against you?

 

[abingdonboy]

If there is a war and you occupy some land, do you want its population to be 100% against you?

1) When is india ever going to occupy Pakistan?
2) A prolonged occupation will always turn the populace agaisnt the occupier so that 10% would become 0% fast enough.

A bizzare rebuttal, you first said I'm the one asking for total war (when i'm not) and now you're disucssing occupying that hellhole?

 

[garg_bharat]

This is totally different, you can't compare Russia and India and Ukraine and Pakistan. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and uses this nuclear umbrella to wage an active proxy war agaisnt India, and this takes place with the acceptance of most of theor population.

And Putin actually has balls.

You have no idea of what is going on. I have information that deaths have crossed 50K in Ukraine plus more than 10000 are missing. It is a very ugly conflict.

Please do not talk of nuclear umbrella. There are too many nukes in this world to be useful. Nobody gets scared any more.

India/Pakistan conflict is at much less intensity than Ukraine/Russia conflict.

 

[garg_bharat]

1) When is india ever going to occupy Pakistan?
2) A prolonged occupation will always turn the populace agaisnt the occupier so that 10% would become 0% fast enough.

A bizzare rebuttal, you first said I'm the one asking for total war (when i'm not) and now you're disucssing occupying that hellhole?

Not necessary. A tired population usually welcomes the aggressor.
Putin is preparing for Ukraine merger with Russia.
Yes if you behave like an occupation force, public will turn against you. But if you restore law and order and economy, public will like you. So depends.

 

[Bornubus]

For all those still under the FALSE illusion that Modi is working for India's interests:

http://indianexpress.com/article/in...t-encourages-india-pak-to-engage-in-dialogue/

Modi's "talks at all costs, "bhai bhai" BULLSHIT is directly inspired by this sentiment.

All he is doing is follwing what his big daddy in the Whitehouse is pushing, surprisingly in this instance it was PAKISTAN that stood up to the US and caled off talks.

There is no grand strategy at work here, no dots to connect- Modi has fucked his country.

Modi is also under pressure to buy US hardware even if it is obsolete F 18.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Look in the Indian media- they are all still trying to propogate this "brotherly nations", "we are one" BS. Do you think this is the shit they are being taught in their maddrassas?? When you have such a disconnect between the liberals/decsion makers in India and the ground realties in Pakistan no wonder you get such a useless policy towards them.

And others
Guys guys, please cool down.
If you know Modi has done some nice steps as well.
Isolation, putting under pressure and cancelation of talks etc..
Anybody can make mistakes but entire diplomatic posture doesn't spin around one mistake.
As @garg_bharat said, you guys are hyping it too much.
Pakis sent JIT, blocked NIA, they tried to play in our style guys.
Take amusement in it. And then, discuss what must be next political step (because even surgical strikes aren't easy).

Discuss play, not bashing government. It has also achieved much.
Who knows any policymaker uses to monitor our DFI as member or guest and may draw some inspiration from you guys?
Come on yaron. Future isn't determined by a mistake. Talk of strategy. And my apologies from all to that policymaker if anyone monitoring us.

 

[abingdonboy]

And others
Guys guys, please cool down.
If you know Modi has done some nice steps as well.
Isolation, putting under pressure and cancelation of talks etc..
Anybody can make mistakes but entire diplomatic posture doesn't spin around one mistake.
As @garg_bharat said, you guys are hyping it too much.
Pakis sent JIT, blocked NIA, they tried to play in our style guys.
Take amusement in it. And then, discuss what must be next political step (because even surgical strikes aren't easy).

Discuss play, not bashing government. It has also achieved much.
Who knows any policymaker uses to monitor our DFI as member or guest and may draw some inspiration from you guys?
Come on yaron. Future isn't determined by a mistake. Talk of strategy. And my apologies from all to that policymaker if anyone monitoring us.

As far as polcies go I have said it a number of times- treat Pakistan as what they are...the enemy. Act with one voice against them.

No peicemeal measures, no wishy washy statements- be clear and catergorical. Isolate Pakistan where possibe, cut all economic ties, all people-people ties no sportsmen/women, no Pak actors or musicans, no "traders". Every Pakistani on Indian soil is a security threat and should be treated as such and in tandem build Israeli style walls along the ENTIRE PAK-IND border. Impose a cost on the war Pakistan is ACTIVELY waging on India, right now they are the cat that has got the cream not only can they continue to bleed India but the rest of the world is engaging with them, selling military hardware and providing economic releif. India needs to grow some balls and stop playing this "bhai bhai" game.

Only then will the world see what Pakistan is.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

As far as polcies go I have said it a number of times- treat Pakistan as what they are...the enemy. Act with one voice against them.

No peicemeal measures, no wishy washy statements- be clear and catergorical. Isolate Pakistan where possibe, cut all economic ties, all people-people ties no sportsmen/women, no Pak actors or musicans, no "traders". Every Pakistani on Indian soil is a security threat and should be treated as such and in tandem build Israeli style walls along the ENTIRE PAK-IND border. Impose a cost on the war Pakistan is ACTIVELY waging on India, right now they are the cat that has got the cream not only can they continue to bleed India but the rest of the world is engaging with them, selling military hardware and providing economic releif. India needs to grow some balls and stop playing this "bhai bhai" game.

Only then will the world see what Pakistan is.

Two words.

"Uncle Sam".
Let us catch up with them.