Modernisation of Indian Army Infantry

[Kumaoni]

Yeah even there some book starting with wellington
It's written there that some American general even suggested IA to look up at quality of officers being trained as in Iraq the Indian trained officers didn't perform well
That what I read through some open source

India stopped training Iraqi officers during the Iraq Iran war, as Iran was getting kinda angry at India. Most Indian trained officers would be dead or in retirement in desert hawk.

 

[Kumaoni]

Physical proof that the quality of officers has declined

 

[Love Charger]

Yeah their armor was superior in slim river, which led to a compleyerout of British and Indian forces from there

So ? One battle dosent count for shit .
You are making it as if they had better armour thorough out the war .
Most of brit armour was in N Africa fighting Germans .
Had they been intimated , even Singapore would not have fallen.

 

[Kumaoni]

So ? One battle dosent count for shit .
You are making it as if they had better armour thorough out the war .
Most of brit armour was in N Africa fighting Germans .
Had they been intimated , even Singapore would not have fallen.

I meant numerical superiority.

 

[Love Charger]

I meant numerical superiority.

Yes that might be a thing , but when brit and American armour rolled in and they got hold of their marbles , it was a rout for the Japs everywhere.

 

[Kumaoni]

Yes that might be a thing , but when brit and American armour rolled in and they got hold of their marbles , it was a rout for the Japs everywhere.

Yup, Indian army soldiers did wonders in the Burma front.

 

[Love Charger]

Yeah even there some book starting with wellington
It's written there that some American general even suggested IA to look up at quality of officers being trained as in Iraq the Indian trained officers didn't perform well
That what I read through some open source

Nothing to do with IA training , also provide the source for your info
I shall provide mine about experience of air Marshall Philip Rajkumar training iraqis in 80s. His experience is on bharat rakshak forum , you can easily Google it
.
At that time he was a mig 21 pilot and instructor along with a test pilot ( he also flew a Iraqi F 7 , the chink copy of mig 21 since Chinese too were providing arms to them and the Iraqi officer asked him to test the planes since he was a test pilot .
So when he went to iraq , he was there in al Walid air base I guess , on a 2 year tenure , they had only 1 month to train a new batch of pilots from scratch on mig 21 .due to ongoing war , since al Waleed was on Iraqis western border it was out of reach of iranian airforce, still atleast one massive air attack was mounted by their phantoms with many jets destroyed on ground and 0 Irani losses.
These bases were huge and had Iraqi bomber fleet of tu 22 and Mirage f 1 some of which too were destroyed in taht attack
Well back to training.
Air marshall wrote that the Iraqi pilots had poor grasp of English , and the instructions and instrument pannel was in Russian .
The only languge they understood was french thus some pilots of the team who were well versed imparted training in french including AM Rajkumar
Thus he was teching iraqi pilots about mig 21 a Soviet plane in french as an Indian pilot.
Also one month of training is very less anyway , from there they were directly sent to front line.
Air Marshall himself castes doubt about howmuch they learnt in just 1 month .
Anyway he was not given a single day extra before new batch arrived
He particularly wrote that since the sorrounding was plain desert , he and his student one lieutenant of Iraqi airforce were night flying a mig 21 , and due to some technical snag the throttle was stuck ،the Iraqi studnet asked many times to eject each time rajkuamr rejected and said they would not eject until he said so۔
He got the throttle to world again and landed the plane even when Al waleed airbase had better visibility at night than the airbase he flew from in india۔
He saved a Iraqi plane and that pilots life۔
He was even commended for it in written by Iraqi airchief. and saddam himself gifted each foreign pilot good amount of money and a watch when he visited al waleed
All in all the iraqis had poor grasp on English and were not the brightest on the block anyway , also they were also always quite fearful .

 

[jai jaganath]

Nothing to do with IA training , also provide the source for your info
I shall provide mine about experience of air Marshall Philip Rajkumar training iraqis in 80s. His experience is on bharat rakshak forum , you can easily Google it
.
At that time he was a mig 21 pilot and instructor along with a test pilot ( he also flew a Iraqi F 7 , the chink copy of mig 21 since Chinese too were providing arms to them and the Iraqi officer asked him to test the planes since he was a test pilot .
So when he went to iraq , he was there in al Walid air base I guess , on a 2 year tenure , they had only 1 month to train a new batch of pilots from scratch on mig 21 .due to ongoing war , since al Waleed was on Iraqis western border it was out of reach of iranian airforce, still atleast one massive air attack was mounted by their phantoms with many jets destroyed on ground and 0 Irani losses.
These bases were huge and had Iraqi bomber fleet of tu 22 and Mirage f 1 some of which too were destroyed in taht attack
Well back to training.
Air marshall wrote that the Iraqi pilots had poor grasp of English , and the instructions and instrument pannel was in Russian .
The only languge they understood was french thus some pilots of the team who were well versed imparted training in french including AM Rajkumar
Thus he was teching iraqi pilots about mig 21 a Soviet plane in french as an Indian pilot.
Also one month of training is very less anyway , from there they were directly sent to front line.
Air Marshall himself castes doubt about howmuch they learnt in just 1 month .
Anyway he was not given a single day extra before new batch arrived
He particularly wrote that since the sorrounding was plain desert , he and his student one lieutenant of Iraqi airforce were night flying a mig 21 , and due to some technical snag the throttle was stuck ،the Iraqi studnet asked many times to eject each time rajkuamr rejected and said they would not eject until he said so۔
He got the throttle to world again and landed the plane even when Al waleed airbase had better visibility at night than the airbase he flew from in india۔
He saved a Iraqi plane and that pilots life۔
He was even commended for it in written by Iraqi airchief. and saddam himself gifted each foreign pilot good amount of money and a watch when he visited al waleed
All in all the iraqis had poor grasp on English and were not the brightest on the block anyway , also they were also always quite fearful .

Yeah that's why I wrote open source
Take it as pinch of salt as they were discussing Indian trained officers so I recalled something regarding it
But sure there is a book by American general regarding it
Not saying what's written is right but it was his opinion

 

[mcpo117]

IA had similar gear in the late 80s-90s

We still do. Just minus the frontline troops.

 

[Kumaoni]

We still do. Just minus the frontline troops.

Sadly.

 

[Kumaoni]

Major Gaurav Arya:
“the issue is that we don’t have the funds, we have enough funds, it’s that we don’t know how to use those funds”.

 

[Tactical Doge]

Physical proof that the quality of officers has declined

It's usually a good move

Caste kanging in the Indian society mutates into regiment kanging in the Indian army higher ups

 

[MikeTheInfantryman]

The Army is spending upwards of 10 million dollars for 25 odd jetpacks alone. They absolutely have the money, they just don't care enough.

What the fuck?

They are buying it for real? For just 25 of that useless junk?

this video is sponsored by Manscaped. Has your brain ever felt useless? Try Manscaped using th code "therapy101" and get your deal today and help the world being less stupid

 

[nongaddarliberal]

All tanks are ass if used incorrectly, just look at what happened to the Pattons in 1965! The t series aren’t being used and modified correctly. But I prefer British tanks in general

That applies to all weapons. But it doesn't give a license to make bad design decisions the way the T series designers did, nor does it negate the advantages in western tanks.

Anyway, for our scenario, neither of our 2 enemies has western style tanks, rather both have the same T series style designs, so the T 90 is not at a disadvantage for our security situation.

Btw, T 90s and 72s have been getting stuck in the mud and gulleys just as much as the western tanks. More than 50 confirmed cases of them being abandoned due to being stuck, since the start of the war. This is a universal tank problem. The eastern European mud is unforgiving.

 

[JBH22]

Idk maybe Desert Storm, Iraq was the 4th most powerful military then so not like they were ragtag


Remind me again who won WW2.

Who won WW2? Enlighten us pls

 

[binayak95]

Hmm you're right about Iraq. Also didn't know we trained Iraqi officers. That's a fun fact for me


Not being offensive but on WW2 tho, that cracked me up. Britain mainly fought in South East Asia against the IJA. Hell, the IJA wouldn't probably would've cared if they lost those territories only. What did break them up really was the assault from US, mainly the Marines who Island hopped all the way from Midway and Philippines to Okinawa, freeing up the Pacific fron the IJN. Japan surrendered because Uncle Sam dropped two suns on them, not because Britain defeated them in SEA. British casualties in the "far east" theatre was 90k while the USMC casualties were at 669k. Fun fact the USMC fought only against the IJA in WW2, so I'm even excluding the US army casualties who served in the Pacific. In the Western Front in Europe, 70% of the casualties were American. During the Western Invasion of Germany, Most units deployed were American.


Regarding the Nazis, they were a professional army, and they were a peer to peer adversary for allied armies in Western Europe. After Operation Overlord, in which American forces did meet resistance, the only major counterattack was the Battle of the Bulge. After that the wehrmacht was constantly on the defensive. They did beat Soviets 1 to 1 though. Britian topped the Americans in the African theatre where British troops were mainly behind the rapid successes of the Allies in Africa.



Sometimes I wonder why I took history in school. Now I know why.

"british troops in africa" - you mean the Indians, the Aussies, the New Zealanders. The South Africans.

 

[binayak95]

So ? One battle dosent count for shit .
You are making it as if they had better armour thorough out the war .
Most of brit armour was in N Africa fighting Germans .
Had they been intimated , even Singapore would not have fallen.

Singapore fell through sheer cowardice on part of the British officers. The troops were well supplied and in strong position. Had they held out for few more weeks, the japs would have given up and left. Their own supply situation was shit.

 

[MikeTheInfantryman]

"british troops in africa" - you mean the Indians, the Aussies, the New Zealanders. The South Africans.

Yup, most troops in Africa came from commonwealth countries, and India made up the bulk of the British army in Africa. Overall command of commonwealth troops were under British commanders so that's why I said British troops

 

[MikeTheInfantryman]

Who won WW2? Enlighten us pls

Well I don't even know how to respond to that without coming off as offensive

In my humble knowledge I know that the Allies won WW2, mainly the US and Soviet Union, strategically and militarily. At this point British commanders we're deputies to American commanders in the overall allied command, and that says something on who did most of the work

 

[MikeTheInfantryman]

That applies to all weapons. But it doesn't give a license to make bad design decisions the way the T series designers did, nor does it negate the advantages in western tanks.

Anyway, for our scenario, neither of our 2 enemies has western style tanks, rather both have the same T series style designs, so the T 90 is not at a disadvantage for our security situation.

Btw, T 90s and 72s have been getting stuck in the mud and gulleys just as much as the western tanks. More than 50 confirmed cases of them being abandoned due to being stuck, since the start of the war. This is a universal tank problem. The eastern European mud is unforgiving.

Except the lack of APS in our tanks, we're pretty much on par with the PLA in tanks regarding their quality. In quantity though, we lack tanks, but again most of their old gen T-55 ripoffs are still in service even though they're being phased out. Even the type 96s are barely at par with the T-72s so I'm not much worried about tank quality


The only good tanks that have a good rep is the Abrams and Leopards. Most Western tanks outguns the T-series tanks in quality and technological prowess, with the only asian tank that has a good rep being the K2 black panther of SK.



Why not make a tank with the K9 chassis? Would be pretty good since half the work is kind of done, since only some changes are required