Main Battle Tanks and Armour Technology

[Damian]

In terms of concept, Anders program is very much alike..

Future Combat Systems Manned Ground Vehicles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I must make a small correction here Kunal, and perhaps it will be interesting for people interested in armored ighting vehicles subject.

The WPB "Anders" was only a technology demonstrator designed as a demonstration what industry can do and eventuall offer for customers. However it was not designed per any requirements, this is why Polish Army rejected it however it was not wasted program. Polish Army analized the whole concept and formed new requirements for two new universal platforms under program codenamed "Rydwan" or Charriot in english.

The new program focuses on designing two new platforms, first will be basic 25 tons platform for lighter combat vehicles like IFV's, APC's, SPAAG's, C2V's, MEDEVAC's and such types. But there is also heavier platform, 50 tons heavy planned, for new MBT, ARV, CMV and such types, and I think they perhaps will plan to adapt it also for heavy IFV, APC and eventually SPH.

In recent interview, our vice minister of defense, general Waldemar Skrzypczak, said that Polish Army plans to completely scrap T-72, T-72M, T-72M1, T-72D and PT-91 tanks as soon as possible, scrapping will start more or less when Leopard 2A4's will be modernized to Leopard 2PL, and eventually around 120 more Leopard 2's will be purchased and also upgraded to Leopard 2PL standard. Complete removal of T-72 based tanks will end when new 50 tons universal combat platform will enter service.

Of course these are plans and plans tend to change, yet it seems that finally our MoD is determined to modernize ground forces.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

That is unfortunate, though What will be the Priorities in new project compare to Anders ? And how it will be different from Anders ? Given that Anders came out with almost all types of versions in track form ? Does Polish Army prefer Wheeled concept for its terrain, Or more suited word is terrain specific hardware..

this is why Polish Army rejected it however it was not wasted program. Polish Army analized the whole concept and formed new requirements for two new universal platforms under program codenamed "Rydwan" or Charriot in english.

 

[volna]

south Sudanese Type-96 vs Sudanese T-72.....

I thought there is no proof that this T-72 was knocked out by Type -96 tank,this accident with out any official report.

 

[Akim]

south Sudanese Type-96 vs Sudanese T-72.....

If this Ukrainian tanks, which were delivered in Kenya, but why were you in Sudan, it is not a modernized T-72A. Not too difficult a "target". They may also to break new 105-mm ammunition.

 

[Akim]

yep, its t-72M1 with K-1 ERA

In Ukraine, there has never been "export" tanks. The Armed Forces of getting rid of old stocks. All this tanks of series "A" (AV).

 

[Dazzler]

In Ukraine, there has never been "export" tanks. The Armed Forces of getting rid of old stocks. All this tanks of series "A" (AV).

I agree, these are (AV) or M1 variants, the tanks were supplied by Ukraine, SIPRI has reported it


Transfers of major conventional weapons: sorted by supplier. Deals with deliveries or orders made for year range 2000 to 2011
Note: The 'No. delivered/produced' and the 'Year(s) of deliveries' columns refer to all deliveries since the beginning of the contract. Deals in which the recipient was involved in the production of the weapon system are listed separately. The 'Comments' column includes publicly reported information on the value of the deal. Information on the sources and methods used in the collection of the data, and explanations of the conventions, abbreviations and acronyms, can be found at URL <http://www.sipri.org/contents/armstrad/at_data.html>. The SIPRI Arms Transfers Database is continuously updated as new information becomes available.
Source: SIPRI Arms Transfers Database
Information generated: 18 February 2013


Supplier/ Year Year(s) No.
recipient (R) No. Weapon Weapon of order/ of delivered/
or licenser (L) ordered designation description licence deliveries produced Comments


China
R: Sudan (10) Type-85-IIM Tank (2001) 2002-2003 (10) Sudanese designation Al-Bashier
(12) A-5C/Fantan FGA aircraft (2002) 2003 (12) No. could be up to 20
(10) WZ-551 APC (2003) 2004 (10)
(12) K-8 Karakorum-8 Trainer/combat ac (2004) 2005-2008 (12) Incl for combat role
(50) FN-6 Portable SAM (2005) 2006 (50)

Ukraine
R: South Sudan (11) BM-21 Grad 122mm Self-propelled MRL (2006) 2007-2009 11 Ex-Ukrainian; last 6 held ransom in 2008 by Somali pirates while being delivered by ship from Ukraine to Kenya; originally claimed to be for Kenya
(77) T-72M1 Tank (2006) 2007-2008 (77) Ex-Ukrainian (33 more held ransom in 2008 by Somali pirates while being delivered by ship from Ukraine to Kenya and held-up used by Kenya since 2008)
Sudan (12) AI-25/DV-2 Turbofan (2004) 2006-2008 (12) For 12 K-8 trainer aircraft from China
(2) BTR-3U Guardian IFV (2009) 2010 2
(55) T-55 Tank (2009) 2010 55 Ex-Ukrainian
(60) T-72M1 Tank (2009) 2010 60 Ex-Ukrainian

 

[Damian]

That is unfortunate, though What will be the Priorities in new project compare to Anders ? And how it will be different from Anders ? Given that Anders came out with almost all types of versions in track form ? Does Polish Army prefer Wheeled concept for its terrain, Or more suited word is terrain specific hardware..

Well the new platforms developed under pogram "Rydwan" are more similiar to th "Kurganets" and "Armata" concepts from Russia.

The lighweight/mediumweight chassis for Rydwan will have basic 25 tons weight and will be amphibious, the heavyweight chassis will have weight of 50 tons in basic configuration.

Both will be modular, just like WPB "Anders", so for example on 25 tons chassis you can have IFV, APC, Light Tank, SPAAG, Automatic Mortar C2V, MEDEVAC vehicle, Medical Treatment vehicle and many other variants, just like Anders. The heavy weight chassis will be more optimizd for new MBT and also ARV, CMV an eventually probably as I said earlier, it will have potential to be new chassis for Krab SPH.

So this is not scrapping the idea of multirole, modular combat platform, is is jut further evolution of concept that created Anders.

As for tracked or wheeled, Polish Army do not have such problem, it's aim it to have balanced force, so we allready have wheeled Rosomak, there is technology demonstrator of Hipopotam heavy amphibious APC for special tasks, and there is concept of Rosomak 2 APC.

The 25 and 50 tons heavy platforms, developed under project "Rydwan" are fully tracked as they are needed to replace all obsolete tracked platforms used by Polish Military, the obsolete wheeled platforms are more or less allready replaced by Rosomak, mostly the old SKOT APC's.
@Kunal Biswas as a side note, I want also to say, that industry allready agreed on who is doing what, the leader of heavy chassis will be Bumar-Łabędy + other companies, light/medium chassis will be mainly developed by Huta Stalowa Wola, the whole consortium have two leaders, these are Bumar and Huta Stalowa Wola, and there is a big chance that there will be foreing partner to help in research and development phase, most probably Krauss Maffeii Wegmann or Rhinemetall, perhaps even other big western company specialized in armored fighting vehicles development.

 

[Damian]

IDEX-2013.

Improved M1A1 (most probably this vehicle represents Army National Guard M1A1SA Standard) with fully stabilized SCWS commander cupola with thermal sight, and ballistic shields for loader machine gun + other non visible improvements. GDLS also presented improved Saudi Arabian M1A2, the M1A2S.

UAE Leclerc, it seems that UAE purchased AZUR uparmor kit.

Improved T-90MS.

BM "Oplot".

 

[Dazzler]

IDEX-2013.

Improved M1A1 (most probably this vehicle represents Army National Guard M1A1SA Standard) with fully stabilized SCWS commander cupola with thermal sight, and ballistic shields for loader machine gun + other non visible improvements. GDLS also presented improved Saudi Arabian M1A2, the M1A2S.

UAE Leclerc, it seems that UAE purchased AZUR uparmor kit.

Improved T-90MS.

BM "Oplot".

M1A1 lacks commander's panoramic vision?

LecLerc upgrade for me is a show stopper, excellent side protection.

BM Oplot is certainly making space for itself among BIG players.

 

[Damian]

M1A1 lacks commander's panoramic vision?

It does not need panoramic CITV like M1A2 use, it have new fully stabilized commander cupola with remotely controlled machine gun and thermal sight.

Here you have Saudi Arabian improved M1A2, the M1A2S, you can see panoramic sight the CITV and a bit different commander cupola, the ICWS.

There are four generations of commander cupolas for M1 tanks, the CWS used in original M1, Improved CWS used in M1A1's, ICWS for M1A2's and SCWS for improved M1A1's.

The M1A2's do not need SCWS because they receive CROWS remotely controlled weapon module.

LecLerc upgrade for me is a show stopper, excellent side protection.

It represents typical western up armor kit, similiar to American TUSK, British TES(H) and German PSO/UrbOp kits.

BM Oplot is certainly making space for itself among BIG players.

IMHO it lacks mostly in digital stuff, also I would wish a bit better solved problem with it's PNK-6 and remotely controlled machine gun mount that use PNK-6 as it's sighting system.

K21 IFV based light tank armed with 120mm RUAG CTG smoothbore gun.

 

[Dazzler]

Looking forward at news regarding Pakistan stalls, GIDS had this news piece on their site...

"GIDS along with its commercial organizations is going to participate in 11th International Defence Exhibition and Conference (IDEX-2013), being held from 17 - 21 February 2013 at Abu Dhabi, UAE. GIDS stand is located in Pakistan Pavilion in Hall 12, Stand No. D32."


:: GIDS - DETAIL ::

 

[Dazzler]

IDEX 2013 - Pakistan Displays Defence Systems

As many as 10 high profile and 14 auxiliary defence production companies of Pakistan are participating at IDEX.

Jamil Ahmad Khan, Pakistan's Ambassador to the UAE, while briefing the media, said that it was a "matter of great pride for us that for the first time in the history of IDEX Pakistan has added a new dimension to this exhibition by displaying its indigenously modified and upgraded submarine KHALID. Besides the submarine, a Multi-Purpose Auxiliary Craft (MPAC), JURRAT, fabricated in Pakistan with full integration of weaponry and the destroyer SHAHJAHAN modified as per our own requirement and integration of warfare will be on display."

He said that Pakistan is indigenously meeting the defence production requirements of its Armed Forces besides exporting to 40 countries across the globe.

"We are offering affordable solutions for the defence needs of all countries, especially the countries which are looking for low cost affordable solutions. This is what the 52 participating countries and more than 6,000 attendees of this exhibition can benefit from," he added.

He emphasised that Pakistan is a peace-loving country and desires to live in peace and harmony with the world but the regional security situation has become complex and uncertain.

He said that Pakistan's defence industry is compelled to develop a response that is proportionate to challenges that confront the country.

"Events like IDEX-2013 provide a unique opportunity for Pakistan's defence related industries both in public and private sectors to display their products and interact directly with the defence industry of the developed world. This also creates a good opportunity to reinforce the diplomatic efforts in the domain of defence diplomacy," he said.

Major Pakistani defence companies displaying their wares at IDEX include the Defense Export Promotion Organization (DEPO), Global Industrial and Defense Solutions (GIDS), Heavy Industries Taxila, Karachi Shipyard and Engineering Works, National Radio and Telecommunications, and Pakistan Ordinance Factories (POF), among others.

The IDEX exhibition is significant for Pakistan for a number of reasons. As Khan noted, given the increasing number of piracy attacks in the region, maritime defence ships have an increased importance for nations border the Arabian Sea and Indian Ocean and Pakistani warships are an affordable military defence option.

The PNS KHALID will undoubtedly attract the most attention, as a diesel-electric submarine being exported by a Muslim nation. PNS KHALID is an AGOSTA 90B class submarine designed by France's DCN International. In Sept. 1994, the Pakistani government and DCN International signed a contract for the supply of three AGOSTA 90-B submarines. The contract stipulated for the second and third AGOSTA 90Bs to be built Karachi under a technology transfer program.

The first AGOSTA 90B, PNS Khalid, was built at DCN's Cherbourg yard and commissioned in 1999. The PNS SAAD, assembled at Karachi Naval Dockyard under a DCN-Pakistani joint venture, was launched in August 2002 and was commissioned in December 2003, while the third AGOSTA 90B class boat, PNS HAMZA, constructed in Karachi, was launched in August 2006 and was commissioned in September 2008.

MILITARY TECHNOLOGY: IDEX 2013 - Pakistan Displays Defence Systems

 

[Dazzler]

Russian Terminator?

 

[Damian]

Russian Terminator?

Yes this is BMPT "Terminator".

Greek Leopard 2HEL with RWS.

 

[Dazzler]

 

[Dazzler]

 

[methos]

K21 IFV based light tank armed with 120mm RUAG CTG smoothbore gun.

Cockerill 105 mm gun, not RUAG CTG!

 

[Damian]

Cockerill 105 mm gun, not RUAG CTG!

Thanks, both looks similiar.

 

[Akim]

I

.

Should a photo from another angle, when you can see that he "shoots" Ukrainian ATGMs.

 

[Dazzler]

Most likely for AK-2...

KIEV, February 18 (RIA Novosti) - Ukraine will deliver 110 tank power plants – engines and related parts – to Pakistan under a $50 million contract, state-run arms exporter Ukrspetsstroi said on Monday.

The power plants will be manufactured at the Kharkov-based Malyshev Plant, a state-run enterprise specializing in armored vehicles and their components, under a four-year contract that was signed "several days ago," Ukrspetsstroi said in a statement on its website. It did not provide any technical specifications.

Ukraine previously delivered more than 300 power plants to Pakistan for its al-Khalid main battle tank, Ukrspetsstroi's acting deputy general director Vadim Kozhevnikov said, adding that Ukraine also supplies tank engines to China.

The statement cited Kozhevnikov as saying he believed Ukraine is in a good position to compete with the world's leading tank power plant manufacturers, in particular Germany.

"We are direct competitors of German engine manufacturers. Our models are every bit as good as theirs in terms of technical characteristics but are significantly cheaper," Kozhevnikov said.


Ukraine to Deliver 110 Battle Tank Engines to Pakistan | Business | RIA Novosti