LOC, LAC & IB warfare

[Hiranyaksha]

Movie script likh rahe ho ? Prophechies and all. Bhai movie, fantasy novel wagerah likho , acha kamaoge.

 

[captscooby81]

Thanks Mods finally i can think of replying in the thread too much mental Diarrhea from morning ..Thanks to trespassing of young piglet into the forum from west

@aditya10r Let us know whats the mood in the state reports are coming that sikkim CM chamling has made some statements about pro china after the chinese Toilet paper GT said they will strive for sikkim indepence from india ..Do the people their hate so much being in indian union ????

@Tshering22 Sir i think you are from sikkim could you throw some light on it ..

And all others can we start now discussing the other serious things ..Whats our strength right now in LAC how many armoured brigades we deployed what about our Air defences and also about out Strategic Forces command deployments ...Because looks like Commie pigs have started this stand off with a bigger plan in mind and they are now even said no bilateral meeting in G20 summit and they are asking all their mouthpieces to rake up nationalism and bring unconditional support to PLA ...As i said before all these is just to cement Xi jingping as the greatest and tallest leader of PRC even one level above Mao ...So lets not take the Chinese threats any lesser ..

@hammer head Sir someone quoted in another thread that our SFF boots are on ground doing Recce ..Are we prepared fully sir to give a deterrence if they go for offence ?

Edit : @Tarun Kumar @square Bhai log please can you take this theory and discuss in chit chat thread i will also join to listen what you both saying ...plzzzzzzzz

 

[Hiranyaksha]

Allow private citizens to have weapons . I will sell the shit load of weapons to my fellow citizens

 

[Razor]

Thanks Mods finally i can think of replying in the thread too much mental Diarrhea from morning ..Thanks to trespassing of young piglet into the forum from west

@aditya10r Let us know whats the mood in the state reports are coming that sikkim CM chamling has made some statements about pro china after the chinese Toilet paper GT said they will strive for sikkim indepence from india .. Do the people their hate so much being in indian union ????

No such thing afaik, GT is just whining to cook shit up.

 

[aditya10r]

@aditya10r Let us know whats the mood in the state reports are coming that sikkim CM chamling has made some statements about pro china after the chinese Toilet paper GT said they will strive for sikkim indepence from india ..Do the people their hate so much being in indian union ????

Been to sikkim N number of times and i have met Indians only never met anyone advocating freedom from india.

About chamling,people said that the unrest in darjiling affects their businesses of the local people as darjiling is the only way one can get here.Given the fact that SDF is allied with NDA,the locals want NDA-BJP in the centre to take actions and normalise everything.

BUT everyone condemned his comments.

 

[aditya10r]

Allow private citizens to have weapons . I will sell the shit load of weapons to my fellow citizens

I can become your sales partner,any opening tho.????

 

[Razor]

I can become your sales partner,any opening tho.????

He can't compete with local private manufacturers , if he operates from Sweden.
I'm in fact itching to start small arms manufacturing, but currently it ain't profitable in India.

 

[square]

Thanks Mods finally i can think of replying in the thread too much mental Diarrhea from morning ..Thanks to trespassing of young piglet into the forum from west

@aditya10r Let us know whats the mood in the state reports are coming that sikkim CM chamling has made some statements about pro china after the chinese Toilet paper GT said they will strive for sikkim indepence from india ..Do the people their hate so much being in indian union ????

@Tshering22 Sir i think you are from sikkim could you throw some light on it ..

And all others can we start now discussing the other serious things ..Whats our strength right now in LAC how many armoured brigades we deployed what about our Air defences and also about out Strategic Forces command deployments ...Because looks like Commie pigs have started this stand off with a bigger plan in mind and they are now even said no bilateral meeting in G20 summit and they are asking all their mouthpieces to rake up nationalism and bring unconditional support to PLA ...As i said before all these is just to cement Xi jingping as the greatest and tallest leader of PRC even one level above Mao ...So lets not take the Chinese threats any lesser ..

@hammer head Sir someone quoted in another thread that our SFF boots are on ground doing Recce ..Are we prepared fully sir to give a deterrence if they go for offence ?

Edit : @Tarun Kumar @square Bhai log please can you take this theory and discuss in chit chat thread i will also join to listen what you both saying ...plzzzzzzzz

http://thediplomat.com/2017/07/chinas-creeping-invasion-of-india/

this morning the diplomat has writen in detail about indian army capabilities in the sector......intresting read...

 

[Chinmoy]

Thanks Mods finally i can think of replying in the thread too much mental Diarrhea from morning ..Thanks to trespassing of young piglet into the forum from west

@aditya10r Let us know whats the mood in the state reports are coming that sikkim CM chamling has made some statements about pro china after the chinese Toilet paper GT said they will strive for sikkim indepence from india ..Do the people their hate so much being in indian union ????

@Tshering22 Sir i think you are from sikkim could you throw some light on it ..

And all others can we start now discussing the other serious things ..Whats our strength right now in LAC how many armoured brigades we deployed what about our Air defences and also about out Strategic Forces command deployments ...Because looks like Commie pigs have started this stand off with a bigger plan in mind and they are now even said no bilateral meeting in G20 summit and they are asking all their mouthpieces to rake up nationalism and bring unconditional support to PLA ...As i said before all these is just to cement Xi jingping as the greatest and tallest leader of PRC even one level above Mao ...So lets not take the Chinese threats any lesser ..

@hammer head Sir someone quoted in another thread that our SFF boots are on ground doing Recce ..Are we prepared fully sir to give a deterrence if they go for offence ?

Edit : @Tarun Kumar @square Bhai log please can you take this theory and discuss in chit chat thread i will also join to listen what you both saying ...plzzzzzzzz

Hope you are talking about this.......

Sikkim did not merge with India to become a sandwich between China and Bengal: CM Pawan Chamling

http://www.hindustantimes.com/kolkata/sikkim-did-not-merge-with-india-to-become-a-sandwich-between-china-and-bengal-sikkim-cm-pawan-chamling/story-UQjMKOoTUhtH7vF45Xcc2K.html

Please note that there is nothing Pro-Chinese in this report. But yes, Sikkim is facing heat because of Maa-Maati-Maanush brigade. Actually not only Sikkim, the whole of North East development had got stuck up for last 70 odd years because of political parties of one particular state.

 

[Satybharat]

We must adopt a culture to live without Chinese products as much possible...that would be enough to control these small eyes and small dick assholes....

 

[F-14B]

this is an article posted by Wangcha Sangey on his blog, who I believe to be a Bhutanese working with Bhutan News Network as a reporter. very informative and insightful, it detailed how india manipulated its neighbor to gain its own interest.


http://wangchasangey.blogspot.kr/2017/07/understanding-sino-bhutan-border-issues.html?m=1

Monday, July 3, 2017

Understanding Sino - Bhutan Border issues at Doklam. Search for truth

The recent Doklam event has many versions. The Indian media naturally had the versions of their Government though they shared what the Chinese also said.



More than the Indian media, it was Tenzing Lamzang of The Bhutanese who attempted to expound the Indian Government positions/ views upon the Bhutanese public through his lengthy article titled " Understanding the Doklam border issue ".


The best way to seeve the truth is to visit history of various events relating to Sino- Bhutan Border and compare with this recent inflated and manipulated Doklam incident. So now another lengthy article in response to Indian media and Tenzing Lamsang article.


1. Initially from late 1960s and through 70s, the Government of India made attempts to discuss with China on the issue of China- Bhutan international border demarcation.


2. China rejected all such attempts by India. China maintained that Bhutan which is a sovereign Kingdom should stand for herself and deal directly with China.


3. So India had to permit Bhutan to directly deal with China on the border issue. That was how the Border Talks began between Bhutan and China from the 1980s. Since then 24 rounds of Talks have taken place in most cordial manner. And much progress have been achieved. India was always kept in the loop by Bhutan.

4. It is possible that the public of Bhutan feel that the Talks are taking too long. Similar views also have been aired in the National Assembly of Bhutan . I understand the innocent frustrations. Under the past absolute Monarchy system, people are used to instant decisive decision of a King. Many do not understand the complexities involved in international boundary demarcation. The case is more perplexing since the Government is in no position to bare all the uncomfortable truths including heavy pressures from India to demand more strategic land from China.

5. Also the Indo- Bhutan international boundary in the South was demarcated so quietly. The public did not hear anything about Bhutan negotiating with India regarding her international border in the South with India. It is possible that Bhutan was in no position to negotiate. Bhutan is more vulnerable to a takeover by India than by China. Also Bhutan has no access to outside world except through India. And moreover, Bhutanese economy and commerce are totally dependant on India including travel from West Bhutan to East Bhutan in the South of the Kingdom. Against such geopolitical constrictions, Bhutan probably had to accept at where ever, the Survey of India decided to lay the Indo- Bhutan international boundary pillars. Thus the quiet smoothness and the speed when one side makes decision for two sides.

6. The fact that China is willing to negotiate with Bhutan on the international boundary of the two nations is I believe a giant step forward for Bhutanese sovereignty. I am grateful to China for this sovereign courtesy. I am even more grateful to India for all the economic assistance and freedom of trade and transit that enabled Bhutan to develop thus far. But I do love Bhutan ever more.

7. There is no doubt in my mind that Bhutan would want to finalise the Sino- Bhutan Border Talks and sign the Agreement. Bhutan has to be fully aware of the limitations of demands we can make upon China. And at the same time Bhutan is in no position to ignore the strategic interests of India. There is too much pressure. That is why Doklam the tri-junction Plateau is drawing multi attentions. It will be a blessing in disguise if China or India forcefully just takeover Doklam Plateau. The so called status quo is endangering the status of whole of Bhutan.

8. For Bhutan, Doklam holds no extra strategic significance than any other part of the Kingdom. But for both India and China, this Tri- junction is considered most vital. Unfortunately for India, the international boundary between Sikkim India and Tibet China at the Doklam Tri-Junction was decided long time back. So as vital as whole of Doklam Plateau is for Indian military strategic interest, there is not much that India can do through her State of Sikkim. The Sikkim door which India possessed is closed.

9. India, therefore, is pushing Bhutan to claim as much as possible the part of Doklam Plateau in the Sino- Bhutan Border Talks. India knows that she has the clout to use Bhutanese territory to serve her strategic interest. So what India herself had forfeited in negotiation with China, she now wants Bhutan to re-claim. This places Bhutan in a very difficult position. Every inch of Bhutanese land is sacred. To claim land for our own is justifiable. But to demand disputed land from China for Indian strategic purposes could endanger Bhutan. In demanding more, Bhutan loses the moral ground to even claim what is rightfully hers.



9. Bhutan is placed in a near impossible position. China will never surrender the strategic position that she had already gained at Doklam Plateau during negotiation on international boundary with India ( State of Sikkim ). And India is insisting upon Bhutan to wrest from China larger portion of Doklam Plateau that India could not get whilst negotiating with China on Sikkim-Tibet international boundary.



10. China wants to have better relation with the sovereign Kingdom of Bhutan. And wants to settle the border dispute in the interest of promoting closer ties including diplomatic relationship. And China has shown willingness to accommodate Bhutanese requests/ stand in other parts of the northern border. But not at the Tri-Junction where China shares border with Indian State of Sikkim and Bhutan. It seems that China had made her position clear to India in regards to Doklam status even when negotiating with India on the internal boundary of the State of Sikkim which borders Doklam along with Tibet and Bhutan. There is no way that China will give in to India through Bhutan front. The Government of Bhutan knows this and wants to be realistic and conclude the negotiations without further adieu and sign the Sino- Bhutan Border Agreement. But Bhutan does not dare to sign the Agreement without the nod from India. In the end, China will keep exercising jurisdiction over Doklam Plateau and Bhutan always at merciful generosity of India.



11. India is worried about the security of her so called chicken neck of the Siliguri corridor and thereby, the Eastern Frontier States. Maybe that was the reason of takeover of Sikkim. In the same manner, China is worried about the future security of her narrow Chumbi Valley stretch and thereby the whole of Tibet. China seems to considers Doklam Plateau as vital to her as Sikkim is to India. Even then China was willingly to share a part of Doklam Plateau with Bhutan so as to enable an amicable settlement. I feel we have to face the reality. China may not wait forever for Bhutan to get Indian clearance. Chinese security concerns would out weigh any ties including with Bhutan.



12. Presently the international boundary in eastern Bhutan has not been demarcated even with India . The sticking point is that Arunachal Pradesh is on the other side. And China claims part of Arunachal. So later, like Doklam, there is bound to be similar Tri- Juction situation. And there, too, China would not be compromising her national security for friendship with Bhutan. So considering all aspects, it may be also in India's interest to let Bhutan sign the Sino-Bhutan Border Agreement. The gesture could contribute towards reaching reasonable agreement towards drawing the Sino- India Arunachal border demarcation. Confidence building is a must in negotiation.



13. China will not budge in Sino - Bhutan Border negotiation where Bhutan is deemed to act as a proxy for Indian strategic interests. At times during Sino - Bhutan Border Talks, China may have been suspicious of India directing the negotiations from Bhutan side. And this time with India openly declaring that she had interferred on behalf of Bhutan at Doklam confirms that all along Bhutan has been actually acting as a proxy for Indian Doklam interest. This will harden Chinese resolve.



14. The Bhutanese Army at Doklam would not approach the Indian Army stationed on the Sikkim side in regards to any issue with China. Bhutan is well aware that directly involving India is an act of surrendering sovereignty to another nation. It took many years and much diplomatic and political maneuvering to convince India to let Bhutan negotiate directly with China. Bhutanese leaders must demonstrate more courageous wisdom and resolve if Sino- Bhutan Border Agreement is to be successfully signed.



Response to The Bhutanese.



Tenzing Lamsang the Editor of The Bhutanese, in his lengthy article claimed that Bhutanese Army tried unsuccessfully to stop the road construction by the Chinese Party and then Indian Army got involved in stopping the construction. I really doubt that Indian Army can ever stop China from doing anything on the land that she claims as her own. Tenzing Lamsang may or may not care of the implication of what he related or claimed. But for sure he does not seem to recognise or acknowledge how much Bhutan wants to keep Sino- Bhutan Border Talks a sovereign affair of Bhutan.



Tenzing Lamsang may have been just a student studying in a Tibetan School in New Delhi when major incursion by China happened into Bhutan ( northern boundary of Haa Dzongkhag with China Tibet ). Understandably, Tibetan Schools in India would not have any good things to teach about China. They may even target Bhutan for the troubles Bhutan had with Tibetans in early 1970s. Any way whether Tenzing Lamsang was born or already a studenr, when that Chinese incursion took place, IMTRAT was very much there in Haa. And yet, Bhutan did not seek Indian Army help.



The King of Bhutan did not turn to Indian Army stationed in Haa Wangchuk LoDzong to confront the Chinese force. In fact, I believe the IMTRAT in Haa was in disarray probably packing up to leave Bhutan when the Chinese incursion happened. His Majesty commanded a Captain of Royal Bhutan Army to lead an unarmed small RBA force to march up to the extreme northern border of Haa with Tibet. A symbolic act to maintain the integrity of Bhutanese land. And this Captain accomplished the Command of his Supreme Commander. That was how a crisis was averted. Today that Captain is the Chief of Operations of Royal Bhutan Army. As a novice junior RBA Officer, he and his soldiers faced the Chinese troops and paved their way to the border. Now as a General, he can never direct his soldiers at the outpost at Doklam to seek Indian Army help. Not way. Not at all.



So Tenzing Lamsang, my views are not based on " desktop musing " as inferred by you ( my response in your fb post has been deleted by you but it's OK. I have my blog as you have your Newspaper. So I have answered your article in full here ).



I know for a fact that Bhutanese soldiers at Border out -posts take their responsibility sincerely and courageously and independent of Indian Army. It is an insult to RBA and the nation to even insinuate that Bhutanese officers and soldiers, on their own, cannot deal with Chinese forces at the border. I had, therefore, objected to Tenzing Lamsang's narration to the Bhutanese public the foreign propaganda materials that glorifies Indian Army at the expense of Royal Bhutan Army. RBA may be trained and funded by India but our Defence Force has independant Bhutanese national heart and responsibility. RBA has always fulfilled the task of securing Bhutanese Borders and cleansing the nation of any intruders including from India.



Conclusion:



Royal Bhutan Army outposts at the Sino- Bhutan border are there to carry out their defence tasks. Our officers and soldiers are not posted there to warm the chilly mountain air with their breath. They do not run to Indian Army to seek help to execute their own national defence task. Numerous Sino- Bhutan incidents have taken place in the past. And in all those incidents, the Royal Bhutan Army, the Chief of Operations or the Supreme Commander has never sought help of Indian Army to face Chinese troops at the Sino- Bhutan Border. Now if China invades Bhutan, probably His Majesty may seek Indian help. Likewise if India invades Bhutan, His Majesty may seek Chinese assistance. Maybe both will come without even inviting. Until then, Bhutan will deal with what are deemed to be containable conflicts on its own whether in the South or in the north.



For general readers. I have one point of clarification. It is true that within Bhutan, there are Indian military presences as declared by India. And yes, Bhutanese Army is trained by India and even funded by India. But all this is not for defence of Bhutan. It is for the security of India. In the defence strategy plan of India against China, India counts on Bhutan's ability to secure her international borders with China. So Indian military is in Bhutan for defence of India. And likewise Indian Army's recent action at Doklam Plateau has nothing to do with Bhutanese national interest or with Bhutanese Security Force at Doklam.



The demarche issued on 20th June by Bhutan Embassy in New Delhi to Chinese Embassy is a normal happening. Both China and Bhutan follow this diplomatic procedure to air any misgivings or clear any misunderstandings at the borders. The soldiers of China and Bhutan do not engage in unruly jostling or play kapadi kind of pushing and catching game at the Sino- Bhutan border. It must also be noted that the Bhutanese Government referred to road being built in "disputed area". Not " inside undisputed " Bhutanese territory. It said " maintain status quo" which is different from allegation of encroachment into Bhutanese Security Force manned Bhutanese territory.



The Press Release by Bhutanese Foreign Ministry on 29th June is out of norm. A kind of political " cry Wolf ". Bhutan usually acts quietly with dignity. Who was Bhutan appealing to in the Press Release with all the history ? If it was China whom we were addressing then there was no need of history as they are party to all the history. This unusual propaganda type of Press Release may have been issued at Indian request to consolidate their weak stand in the international arena. Unfortunately, in so doing, the Bhutanese Government may have further complicated a complex issue. Maybe we need to prayer harder and sincerely for the guidance of Pelden Drukpa.


May Tsawa Soum be in continuous good health. Pelden Drukpa Gyel Lo!

@nimo_cn in a way it is good that this affair is going on this affair only shows the duplicity and hypocrisy of the CCP as with communist everywhere you cry about unequal treaties when it hurts you and use the same when it suits you which is shown buy Chinese members of this esteemed forum and your media referring treaties like the 1890 Kolkata convention and the Panchsheel agreement but at the same time you refuse to acknowledge the 1914 Shimla convention which settled the the boundaries between the Republic of China your predecessor state and the Indian Empire our predecessor state according to the rule of succession treaties both China and India are bound to follow the 1914 agreement as this agreement supersedes the Calcutta convention of 1890 and Chinese obligations under Article 3 of the 1890 agreement is released under schedule vi of the 1914 convention so I wonder What is the big deal India by virtue of its Treaty obligations to Bhutan is bound 2 protect Bhutan I would father like to remind you that Royal bhutanese Army had asked your local forces to stop construction activities on the plateau as they were flagged off the royal government of Bhutan under Treaty provisions requested the Indian Army to intervene so please tell me logically who is the aggressor here I think that your government is confused and doesn't know what to do

 

[Kazah]

Can anyone tell us what's currently happening on LAC, we can grab updates from LoC(through twitter feeds) but it's pretty difficult to get what's happening in that side

is the situation tense?

 

[square]

Hope you are talking about this.......

Sikkim did not merge with India to become a sandwich between China and Bengal: CM Pawan Chamling

http://www.hindustantimes.com/kolka...an-chamling/story-UQjMKOoTUhtH7vF45Xcc2K.html
http://www.hindustantimes.com/kolkata/sikkim-did-not-merge-with-india-to-become-a-sandwich-between-china-and-bengal-sikkim-cm-pawan-chamling/story-UQjMKOoTUhtH7vF45Xcc2K.html
Please note that there is nothing Pro-Chinese in this report. But yes, Sikkim is facing heat because of Maa-Maati-Maanush brigade. Actually not only Sikkim, the whole of North East development had got stuck up for last 70 odd years because of political parties of one particular state.

democratic procces will require the node from WB assambly to make gorkhaland a reality.....
initially even mulayam singh was not ready , but utrakhand now a statel..
all constitutional demand of the people will be fullfilled.


.

 

[Chinmoy]

Can anyone tell us what's currently happening on LAC, we can grab updates from LoC(through twitter feeds) but it's pretty difficult to get what's happening in that side

is the situation tense?

Right now its just eye ball to eye ball.......... Chinese are not as foolish as Pakistani. There Army is holding the ground and IA too is doing the same.
No statement has been issued from any side. Right now its just media who is playing the game.

 

[Kazah]

Right now its just eye ball to eye ball.......... Chinese are not as foolish as Pakistani. There Army is holding the ground and IA too is doing the same.
No statement has been issued from any side. Right now its just media who is playing the game.

i just hope we are not doing aggressive posturing for this fuckwit

 

[Project Dharma]

2. China rejected all such attempts by India. China maintained that Bhutan which is a sovereign Kingdom should stand for herself and deal directly with China.

What stake does China have in the affairs of a sovereign country? When they want to be a protectorate of India? Who the fuck is China to tell Bhutan on what terms they will talk?

But to demand disputed land from China for Indian strategic purposes could endanger Bhutan. In demanding more, Bhutan loses the moral ground to even claim what is rightfully hers.

Strawman, I don't lose the rights to my house even if I rob my neighbor (which Bhutan is not).

I really doubt that Indian Army can ever stop China from doing anything on the land that she claims as her own

What's the fuss about then? That's exactly what China is claiming.. That they were stopped from construction in their land. Why are they then asking the Indian Army to leave?

 

[Chinmoy]

i just hope we are not doing aggressive posturing for this fuckwit

Sorry, but tweet is not loading. facing this issue for last couple of days. Unable to see any tweet posted in the forum.

 

[Tarun Kumar]

Movie script likh rahe ho ? Prophechies and all. Bhai movie, fantasy novel wagerah likho , acha kamaoge.

Bhai movie ka director (Maharishi Ved Vyas) to 3000 saal pehle sab likh ke chala gaya. Ab mein kya likhoon. Bas kahani mein twist and turns dekhte jaao. Kurukshetra phir se lahoo luhan hone wala hai.

 

[square]

Right now its just eye ball to eye ball.......... Chinese are not as foolish as Pakistani. There Army is holding the ground and IA too is doing the same.
No statement has been issued from any side. Right now its just media who is playing the game.

there is no eyeball to eyeball there....

as per the treaty , no solid construction allowed in the vacinity of 2km on either side of border......
bankers from both sides are removed and road construction stoped......
armymen from bothside alresdy return to their original posts.....

Can anyone tell us what's currently happening on LAC, we can grab updates from LoC(through twitter feeds) but it's pretty difficult to get what's happening in that side

is the situation tense?

 

[Tarun Kumar]

there is no eyeball to eyeball there....

as per the treaty , no solid construction allowed in the vacinity of 2km on either side of border......
bankers from both sides are removed and road construction stoped......
armymen from bothside alresdy return to their original posts.....

If you believe this sh** on agreements then I can only laugh. In china today , all agreements flow from emperor Xi himself and right now he is choreographing everything from NoKo to Indo-China border. This is new China , better focus on guns than agreements while dealing with it.