LOC, LAC & IB warfare

[AmoghaVarsha]

Funding militarily or having good defence relations (joint exercises) doesn't necessarily mean that they would stand up for a war for India. India is not even considered US's ally, stating the same in front of the media is different, but on ground it works a totally different way. Also, you talk in context of trade balances, China too is a major economic partner, US having a trade deficit with them is a different story, though. Both of them just talk and apply pressure, nothing more.

So you want India and US to have a defence pact?

Do you really think US will let china run riot in Asia?A chinese controlled India will mean China controlling Everything from the Cape of good hope to the Sea of Japan.Plus China will have control of a market as large as India with all its resources.In one leap China will go past US as the super power.

US cannot afford a Indian defeat at the hands of.China.

 

[Indian Sniper.001]

So you want India and US to have a defence pact?

Do you really think US will let china run riot in Asia?A chinese controlled India will mean China controlling Everything from the Cape of good hope to the Sea of Japan.Plus China will have control of a market as large as India with all its resources.In one leap China will go past US as the super power.

US cannot afford a Indian defeat at the hands of.China.

A defence pact with US will make us a subservient country to it. So, I would generally be against it. What I would prefer more is just buying their weapons and maintaining high operational efficiency of our troops.
So, coming to your next question. Forget about US, do you really think China will take on India in a full blown out war, and even if it does, it will exist to run over Asia? Any war with China will be a localised one. If US interferes, and other countries too interfere, it would be nothing but a WW. Now, hoping that other countries interfere is a deterrent by itself in case of plans of a fully-blown out war by China, not that it will happen.

 

[HimalyanRanger]

Arguments given by Jingos on War Threat by China
------------------------------------------------------------------
1. China can't afford to go to war, they will not go for war owing to multiple reasons like India-China trade, international pressure, US kya kahega, Russia kya kahega etc. etc.
2. Indian army is trained for war, while China has not fought war since last 38 years
3. We must make defence budget 5% of GDP. Go away with bureaucracy, and buy billions of dollars arms immediately
4. India is different than 1962, do not take us lightly.
5. Two nuclear nations cannot go to war
and some more alike reasons.

Fact of the matter is, China does not gives a dime to all these reasons. We go to China to buy their goods, they do not come here begging that buy our goods. Every single item is made in China, and there is no other option. They are the superpower now and compare themselves to USA. See how they keep on threatening USA on South China Sea issue.

What India do in this situation
-------------------------------------------
Accept the reality that as compared to China you are militarily, economically, industrially, financially weak. Let us say you are as good as Vietnam, or Sri Lanka. So does that mean that we will not fight them. No, not at all.
Once you accept the reality, ask yourself, that this Bully is your neighbor, and he will keep bullying you if you shy away. What to do to this Bully then. Answer is stand and fight for your land. Show them, that if it is war then let it be. Throw out the fears inside you, and once in for all show to them that they will pay heavy price if they impose war on us. Whatever resource we have, we will fight and teach them a lesson.

And stop taking refuge in silly arguments. Leave it to the creepy hindi news channels.

 

[square]

Arguments given by Jingos on War Threat by China
------------------------------------------------------------------
1. China can't afford to go to war, they will not go for war owing to multiple reasons like India-China trade, international pressure, US kya kahega, Russia kya kahega etc. etc.
2. Indian army is trained for war, while China has not fought war since last 38 years
3. We must make defence budget 5% of GDP. Go away with bureaucracy, and buy billions of dollars arms immediately
4. India is different than 1962, do not take us lightly.
5. Two nuclear nations cannot go to war
and some more alike reasons.

Fact of the matter is, China does not gives a dime to all these reasons. We go to China to buy their goods, they do not come here begging that buy our goods. Every single item is made in China, and there is no other option. They are the superpower now and compare themselves to USA. See how they keep on threatening USA on South China Sea issue.

What India do in this situation
-------------------------------------------
Accept the reality that as compared to China you are militarily, economically, industrially, financially weak. Let us say you are as good as Vietnam, or Sri Lanka. So does that mean that we will not fight them. No, not at all.
Once you accept the reality, ask yourself, that this Bully is your neighbor, and he will keep bullying you if you shy away. What to do to this Bully then. Answer is stand and fight for your land. Show them, that if it is war then let it be. Throw out the fears inside you, and once in for all show to them that they will pay heavy price if they impose war on us. Whatever resource we have, we will fight and teach them a lesson.

And stop taking refuge in silly arguments. Leave it to the creepy hindi news channels.

why not just close the nathula pass......

its this pass which is the center of all problum , chinese good enter india , bhutan and then to bangladesh though this route.....china want to build infrastructure around this area keeping in mind its future planes......

 

[valkyrie_1810]

Lets begin with simulation first,how will the domino fall? Will there be a declaration followed by chinese bombing the east coast? And will civilians be allowed to have weapons in that case? This is I think the biggest problem with our country we don't have men at disposal,how will we fight if we haven't even fired a bullet in our lifetime?

 

[Indian Sniper.001]

Arguments given by Jingos on War Threat by China
------------------------------------------------------------------
1. China can't afford to go to war, they will not go for war owing to multiple reasons like India-China trade, international pressure, US kya kahega, Russia kya kahega etc. etc.
2. Indian army is trained for war, while China has not fought war since last 38 years
3. We must make defence budget 5% of GDP. Go away with bureaucracy, and buy billions of dollars arms immediately
4. India is different than 1962, do not take us lightly.
5. Two nuclear nations cannot go to war
and some more alike reasons.

Fact of the matter is, China does not gives a dime to all these reasons. We go to China to buy their goods, they do not come here begging that buy our goods. Every single item is made in China, and there is no other option. They are the superpower now and compare themselves to USA. See how they keep on threatening USA on South China Sea issue.

Really? Do you think China actually reads the reasons we lay out? China will not go to war with India for other staring reasons, they are just a bully, they know if they fight it out, they will be beaten at some point, which would bring their influence down. Yes, they are economically strong, but see the geopolitical blunders they have made. Geopolitics is a game of chess, and you can't afford to keep making mistake after mistake and still expect to win. The war will not happen because the issue of SCS is hot, any mistake here will cost them territories elsewhere. A mistake here would create a civil unrest in regions where the PLA has been brutal, in such an instance, no govt. even China with all its muscle and money power can tackle. So, the only thing China can do is apply pressure and show that it is capable of war-mongering. Its like every Delhi'ite saying "Pata hai, mai kaun hun?". Even if there is a war, it will be in a limited theater of conflict and our Army are very much capable of beating them there in the current and future circumstances, unless there is a massive build-up from the Chinese side and we lag behind, we are having an upper hand.
Now, don't even for a sec doubt the capability of our force and say, we should accept the reality that China is stronger than us.

 

[Indian Sniper.001]

Lets begin with simulation first,how will the domino fall? Will there be a declaration followed by chinese bombing the east coast? And will civilians be allowed to have weapons in that case? This is I think the biggest problem with our country we don't have men at disposal,how will we fight if we haven't even fired a bullet in our lifetime?

Chill buddy, it won't come to that. If it comes, don't worry, your adrenaline will make sure you do what's necessary for you to survive.

 

[AmoghaVarsha]

A defence pact with US will make us a subservient country to it. So, I would generally be against it. What I would prefer more is just buying their weapons and maintaining high operational efficiency of our troops.
So, coming to your next question. Forget about US, do you really think China will take on India in a full blown out war, and even if it does, it will exist to run over Asia? Any war with China will be a localised one. If US interferes, and other countries too interfere, it would be nothing but a WW. Now, hoping that other countries interfere is a deterrent by itself in case of plans of a fully-blown out war by China, not that it will happen.

There.are many stages from being ally to being subservient.

So you yourself believe that at the most Chinese will go for a limited conflict and in that case we are more than capable of defending our land.

 

[airtel]

Chinese dont have balls to Fight Against India , in limited border skirmish Indians Have Good chance of winning and in the case of full fledged war .........Nukes will be used .

Chini will not take that risk ..................so they will have to back off .

 

[Project Dharma]

Defence spending needs to go up.5% of gdp at the least.Then and only then can we handle the 2 front war.

Plus the babudom in military acquisition need to be cut to minimum.Except the defence and finance secretary no babu should have a word on defence acquisition.

What good is 0.5% on defense spending going to do when you just squander it on expensive import products? India probably has the lowest dollar return value on money invested in defense.

 

[captscooby81]

If porki s try to get into jugalbandi with chinese for a two front war with us anytime we should make sure porkis get proper nasbandi forever ..Even if we are not going to make any dent on the chinese side and our losses are going to be heavy ..we should make sure we finish of Porki s once and forever ..Let them build from what ever left with chinese help after that ..At least we can have one headache less rather always be worried about getting banged on both fronts ...

Agreed!

Plus there is a Porki factor too. They wouldn't wait a minute to open the front. As these days they are listening to Chinese. Russia will be a neutral state they worry their business. But Russians wouldn't like too much US around India either.

This standoff is basically because of Modi's US visit. And most probably this will be down in a week or so. It was a strategic move by China to give a message.

India needs to lock Porki moves when India is engaged with China in any skirmish. Having two threats around you is not a good situation.

 

[AmoghaVarsha]

What good is 0.5% on defense spending going to do when you just squander it on expensive import products? India probably has the lowest dollar return value on money invested in defense.

0.5%?

5% i said.Thats close to 100bn usd.See no one is going to help us build a military industrial complex because neither the US nor the Russians know which side of the fence we are.Before anyone helps us with that kind of advance and sensitive technology they need to know for sure that it wont be used againist them someday.A fence sitter will always have these issues.We will have to figure out most technologies ourselves and until then to keep up our strength we have to spend on expensive imports.

 

[Project Dharma]

0.5%?

5% i said.Thats close to 100bn usd.See no one is going to help us build a military industrial complex because neither the US nor the Russians know which side of the fence we are.Before anyone helps us with that kind of advance and sensitive technology they need to know for sure that it wont be used againist them someday.A fence sitter will always have these issues.We will have to figure out most technologies ourselves and until then to keep up our strength we have to spend on expensive imports.

I thought you were saying that you wanted to increase it by 0.5% to 3%.

Either way, 3% or 5% beyond supplying the critical necessities like rifles and bullet proof vests for boots on the ground, I don't think raising the budget is the solution. We will just become a pawn for Western countries who will incite the Pakistanis to create tension on the borders to they can peddle their wares.

We should just privatize the public sector defense manufacturers and then force them to compete with Indian companies in the free market. Indian Army, Navy and Airforce need to be not so gently nudged to force them to buy Swadeshi.

 

[singhboy98]

Too all those baying for war, read a the book called "Dragon Fire" by Humphrey Hawksley. The book was written back in 2007 (or 2008 perhaps) but the situations in the book are chillingly similar to what we face now. The ending of the book is too painful for me to comprehend. War should be the last scenario. BUT, if it comes down to it, then our leaders must have balls of wurtzite boron nitride and do what is necessary. Even if it means becoming inhuman. Those who have read the book will know what I am referring to.

 

[sorcerer]

Chinese dont have balls to Fight Against India , in limited border skirmish Indians Have Good chance of winning and in the case of full fledged war .........Nukes will be used .

Chini will not take that risk ..................so they will have to back off .

slave china is trying to control the choke point near to India as a counter to appease its terrorist master pakistan.
I suppose china is very sure of an Indian show in J&K which it is unable to stop and pakistan must be shit worried about a preemptive Indian action.

chinese always had their way with bluff with all its neighbors. The chinese calculations for its economic corridors were always on the bearing that confusions on the boundaries will yield it the result it wanted by simple assertion. Be it CPEC or other spheres including its stratagem in South china sea.


if there is a war that will be the fall of china in total, an irrecoverable mess of china and communism which will be capitalized by a host of actors including the terrorist breeding pakistan against china.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2012/11/19/the-key-to-bringing-democracy-to-china/
For many years, Western leaders have couched the argument for greater political openness and democratization in China in moral terms, citing the universality of both human rights and the aspirations for freedom and independence.
It’s time for the United States topivot to a new approach toward influencing China’s political future: explaining that democracy produces concrete benefits such as balanced growth, stability, and personal security — even for top Communist Party officials. This performance-based argument will resonate with many of China’s economic and intellectual elites and may have a chance to influence the thinking of Xi Jinping and his fellow top officials.

 

[Screambowl]

If porki s try to get into jugalbandi

The only place to hurt both is cpec...............................

 

[Filtercoffee]

There is no demand by both types. What's the point in making it. They are not planners therefore it would be hard to continue with the current plan. Even the construction planning is far from being 100% chini or porky. Everything can be connected to military spacing. It seems its a coverup by southern design.

 

[Bloom17]

Too all those baying for war, read a the book called "Dragon Fire" by Humphrey Hawksley. The book was written back in 2007 (or 2008 perhaps) but the situations in the book are chillingly similar to what we face now. The ending of the book is too painful for me to comprehend. War should be the last scenario. BUT, if it comes down to it, then our leaders must have balls of wurtzite boron nitride and do what is necessary. Even if it means becoming inhuman. Those who have read the book will know what I am referring to.

I read that book. Trust me there are too many holes in that scenario. Secondly the Indian capability has been improved multi fold while pakistan army's have been further reduced to that of internal paramilitary forces over the decade. China is more or less the same in regards to chinese mountain warfare. For god sake's that book is almost 2 decades old.

 

[rock127]

What happened in Nanking was horrible.

Please don't glorify it.

The Chinese of that era and that stage were our friends and trusted neighbours.

Nanking massacre was inhuman.

Please do not incur the sins of condoning that horror for the fault of the present CCP which doesn't even let its own people live freely.

I am NOT glorifying it and i totally agree that it was horrible BUT Chinese should know that they need to control their arrogance and not act like some superhuman species which never tasted defeat and humiliation.They keep repeating how British ruled India and they should be shown some mirror.

At the moment you remind them about Nanking they gets silent.

They keep repeating 62 million times a day since 62 but forget they got a bloody nose in 67 by India.

As a FACT some paki cheergirl is saying on paki forum that Indians on their forum(means DFI) are spreading imaginary 67 battle win against Chinese.I guess he is talking about me.

 

[nongaddarliberal]

In my opinion, I don't think the Chinese are planning a full scale war. What they want to do is to make our Eastern borders as tense as LOC, which will require us to further divide our resources and spread them thin across both the borders. This would greatly hurt our capabilities on the western front, allowing for more infiltration, and a more aggressive pakistan.

Another factor may be that they WANT us to significantly increase our defence budget to 4-5% of our GDP. Hear me out. Our tax to GDP ratio is abysmal at only 17%. If we start spending 5% of GDP on defence, that would take up 30% of the budget, far more than the 12% that we're currently spending, which will mean that we will not have nearly enough to spend on Infrastructure and skill development, the two things which are absolutely necessary for us to grow in the medium to long term.

The biggest threat to China from India is our economic potential, which will force them to recognize us as their equals if we achieve our real potential. I think this is the first phase of a lot of different types of games China is going to play to do it's best to try and stop our growth.