LOC, LAC & IB skirmishs

[F-14B]

Yes.

And if asked, they will whip out a 10,000 year old map and justify it saying that their heavens-knows-who emperor conquered it.

heck they will even take it back to emperor Chin if need bee

 

[hit&run]

I understand that the global times is supporting its government but the language that they are using is extremely immature.

Chinese know no other language but the language of contempt.

Their sense of playing victim is well scripted and they all know what and why they are doing it, with wink in their eyes.

Gradually encroaching lands and trespassing is the only national understanding they have and they will keep expending at your cost; the cost you incur being weak, sleeping on night watch and due to your compulsion of being good.

 

[Screambowl]

They know the entire 7th fleet will land up at their back door; nothing will happen, only crying and psyop trials.

But it is impressive to see Chinese are countering all alone. They have really built up at least courage to ' take panga' whatever the outcome of that panga would be.

 

[Filtercoffee]

But it is impressive to see Chinese are countering all alone. They have really built up at least courage to ' take panga' whatever the outcome of that panga would be.

Again they are stopped by the colors of the flags and armies I guess. So no rona only dhoom; lastly on a serious note a job well done.

 

[ezsasa]

But it is impressive to see Chinese are countering all alone. They have really built up at least courage to ' take panga' whatever the outcome of that panga would be.

It is not courage, it's a bluff , bluster and grand standing. It's fairly common in Chinese psyche.

Gambling with high stakes is very common in Chinese culture.

 

[mayfair]

But it is impressive to see Chinese are countering all alone. They have really built up at least courage to ' take panga' whatever the outcome of that panga would be.

Who says they are all alone? More than half the presstitutes, most of the commies and a significant chunk of opposition polity in India has been batting for the Chinese- subtly or not so subtly.

Likewise, with many "independent" western "intellectuals".

If someone's standing alone it's India. Regardless of the lip service of support that people claim is coming from around the world, when the push comes to shove, India will be standing alone against the PRC, just like Vietnam stood alone against PRC in 1979. Do not expect that like the West came to Israel's aid in 1967 and 1973,they'll come to ours. No one will come to our support- Not US, Not Russia, Not Japan, Not Israel, Not France, Not UK.

At most we may get some outdated, low resolution sat pics that's all.

 

[Mikesingh]

I am no expert but Why do you think they will only carry three days of supply? It is also possible that extra supplied is aerial dropped along with them.Even a 10 days of supply will keep Indian troops engaged for 20 days. Due to height advantage.

Indian army did the same in 84 during op Meghdoot.

Here are the answers, not in any particular order to the three valid points you have raised.

For aerial resupply to this PLA heliborne force, the Chinese air force would need to have complete air supremacy (not just superiority) in the Eastern theater which is impossible unless they destroy our air force which is far beyond their capabilities. You cannot have Chinese transport aircraft or HSTs (Helicopter support Teams) lumbering deep into Arunachal to drop supplies for their heliborne force with impunity. Our air defences including air force will shoot them out of the sky like ninepins!

During Op Meghdoot in the 80s, there was no interference from the PAF.

And lastly, regarding your point as to why can't the heliborne troops carry extra supplies, that's not possible. Each chopper has a 'load table' which cannot be exceeded. The load tables quantify the equipment that can be carried taking into account the load carrying capacity of the chopper. These load tables are the ideal combination of number of troops, weapons, ammunition, medical equipment, water, rations etc carried by each chopper for a particular heliborne operation. These load plans are carefully coordinated with the aviation elements and verified by the crew well before take-off.

 

[Kazah]

Great footage of today';s encounter

 

[mayfair]

well do to whoever did so..screwed Dujana twice over...

 

[Hari Sud]

Guys, may I suggest that you post your views also at Global Times website.

http://www.globaltimes.cn/

They probably will not let your views thru but at least they, the offials of the Communist Party will know that, we in India has muscular views too. Right now they think that the world is listening to them only. With your views, some will get thru official scrutiny will let them know how the general public feel in India.

 

[Screambowl]

This is what I want to discuss. What would be their diplomatic actions. Who will be supporting them? How it's going to effect Indian diplomacy.

The cold war doctrine of China on India, is there any?

Who says they are all alone? More than half the presstitutes, most of the commies and a significant chunk of opposition polity in India has been batting for the Chinese- subtly or not so subtly.

Likewise, with many "independent" western "intellectuals".

If someone's standing alone it's India. Regardless of the lip service of support that people claim is coming from around the world, when the push comes to shove, India will be standing alone against the PRC, just like Vietnam stood alone against PRC in 1979. Do not expect that like the West came to Israel's aid in 1967 and 1973,they'll come to ours. No one will come to our support- Not US, Not Russia, Not Japan, Not Israel, Not France, Not UK.

At most we may get some outdated, low resolution sat pics that's all.

It is not courage, it's a bluff , bluster and grand standing. It's fairly common in Chinese psyche.

Gambling with high stakes is very common in Chinese culture.

my post was a reply to that post which says 7th fleet of US would come. And then there are contradictions

 

[Jay99]

Great footage of today';s encounter

Looks like no Para SF boys were invovled they are all RR Troopers

 

[Screambowl]

For aerial resupply to this PLA heliborne force, the Chinese air force would need to have complete air supremacy (not just superiority) in the Eastern theater which is impossible unless they destroy our air force which is far beyond their capabilities.

Well they have intruded into Uttarakhand's airspace multiple times with helis without any air superiority and no flyzone. They have practiced it. There was no interception from Indian side. And I don't expect one. Next time they might take the advantage of it
Heli drop is all about timing.

The only solution for this, do it their way in some other sector of the same region. Or keep the features and surrounding features already well equipped to thwart any such misadventure. And I am sure IA has already done that since long ago in tawang region.

that's not possible. Each chopper has a 'load table' which cannot be exceeded. The load tables quantify the equipment that can be carried taking into account the load carrying capacity of the chopper.

Why do you think, they will send only one chopper?

 

[Why so serious?]

http://m.economictimes.com/news/def...claims-beijing-daily/articleshow/59861613.cms

Another rant by Global times.

 

[mayfair]

This is what I want to discuss. What would be their diplomatic actions. Who will be supporting them? How it's going to effect Indian diplomacy.

The cold war doctrine of China on India, is there any?

Diplomatic actions and Chinese do not go together...if you are expecting them to go for UN mediation etc. it's not going to happen. Heck the issue didn't even find a mention in the recent BRICS/SCO meeting on terrorism.

That's not how Chinese operate. Whatever diplomacy they WILL do is that in the event of hostilities, they will strongly push for Pakistan to needle India by heating up the LoC etc. without major fighting and heavily pressure Bangladesh and Myanmar to not allow any transit facilities.

At the same time they'll dispatch envoys to Russia asking them to refrain from aiding India in any manner whatsoever, reminding them of the Western sanctions and how China remains a solid bulwark against it. They'll "impress" upon Russia to stay "neutral" in the conflict. I do not believe that Russia will entirely disagree, though they may "impress" upon China in return not to push their luck too far and start believing that Siberia and Kamchatka are too up for discussion.

US/Japan/European states may offer some "moral and diplomatic support", even sell us some ammunition at a price of course. But that will be it.

Let us be very clear, when the push comes to a shove, we WILL stand alone.

 

[hit&run]

Great footage of today';s encounter

So he was the same sister fucker Pakistani who used to escape behind crowd of stone platters and hide under the legs of Kashmiri whores arranged by Huriyaat and its Kashmiri pimps ??

 

[mayfair]

BRF has a nice new name for Global times. Gobar Times

 

[hit&run]

So Chief of Islamic Republic who wage his tale to pork eating Chinese has spoken for his master, to fight together with India.


Pakistan, China joint efforts needed to defeat common challenges: Gen Bajwa

What kind of 'Chittar-chat' these people are ??

 

[Flame Thrower]

Well they have intruded into Uttarakhand's airspace multiple times with helis without any air superiority and no flyzone. They have practiced it. There was no interception from Indian side. And I don't expect one. Next time they might take the advantage of it
Heli drop is all about timing.

The only solution for this, do it their way in some other sector of the same region. Or keep the features and surrounding features already well equipped to thwart any such misadventure. And I am sure IA has already done that since long ago in tawang region.


Why do you think, they will send only one chopper?

Bhai, I am a defense enthusiast and pure amateur. I framed this scenario based on your threat perception. Gurus, please point out the flaws in the scenario(s).

A. India will prevent any intrusions by Chinese forces:

1. @Screambowl Bhai, during peacetime intrusion response and wartime response has no comparison.

2. For any Force to operate in any theatre, infrastructure of that particular theatre will play a major role.

3. Chinese do know what Brahmos is capable of and a regiment is specially built for them. This regiment's primary role is to convert any problematic Chinese infrastructure into rubbles. Given that we are a member of MTCR and Brahmos range can be used over 300km. I shall leave consequences to everyone's imagination

4. Narrowing down to Choppers, the best thing about them is they can simply land and take off from almost anywhere. But their major weakness is, they can be destroyed easily. Yes, I do know about ground hugging flights. Not much known about ground hugging flights is, it is very difficult to do such flights in mountain ranges, especially if blind spots are well known to defenders.

5. Choppers alone are no good until they are provided with required Cargo, fuel and spares. Infrastructure supporting and providing these resources are under constant threat from IAF.

B. Chinese deployed soldiers in Uttarakhand ranges while our forces are elsewhere:

1. Let's assume that 30 light choppers are allocated for future sorties. 120 soldiers with resources enough to continue for a full week. Choppers are gone back to their base for now.

2. Anyone advocating for Kargil like situation, I'd like to remind them that this is 2017 and situation is hell lot different than 1999. For example, during Kargil we didn't use Air Force to it's fullest potential.

3. Flankers will provide air supporting roles while Mirages, Jaguars will blow Chinese into bits and pieces using PGMs.

4. After the bombing run is over, Rudras and modified "ALHs to use machine guns" will shoot anything that moves providing coverfire to the IA marching towards Chinese position.

5. In short, Chinese after landing will be on the mercy of IA response. I doubt they would survive for 24 hrs after the IA response. The best part is Chinese know that aerial intrusions into India and holding them is next to impossible.

Thus I rest my case. One thing that never came into picture is PLAAF. When infrastructure is being blown and IAF having superiority in the region. PLAAF can't bring enough numbers to Challenge IAF. Any miscalculated move from PLAAF then, Korea is doomed for good. PLAAF presence in Beijing is the only thing that is stopping USN to strike North Korea. I believe that at best, China can use only 10% of it's air force in the TAR region

Gurus, if I made any factual errors (small or big), please do let me know.

 

[Mikesingh]

Can The PLA Cut Off The Siliguri Corridor?


Much has been said about PLA cutting off the Siliguri Corridor called the Chicken’s Neck from Doklam Basin Tri Junction area in the event of war with India, thereby cutting off North East India. Nothing can be farther from the truth. Let’s see why it is tactically and strategically unfeasible.

I will mainly touch upon the logistics angle.

During wartime logistical practice at the operational (or theater) level of war is in many ways the most critical. At higher levels of policy and grand strategy, logistic decisions generally revolve around force composition and destination. Once the political-military decision-making occurs, logisticians need to figure out how to get the materiel that their forces will need to the theater or theaters where those forces are to be committed.

They must also plan to build up the infrastructure in the theater to a point where the materiel can be distributed to the troops with regularity. It is this intermediate level at which much of the true heavy lifting occurs when it comes to logistic issues. A lack of infrastructure in a theater or the inability to create such infrastructure can greatly handicap tactical re-supply and thus cripple military efforts.

China is proceeding through a very narrow strip of land as it stretches its military presence towards India, it leaves it very vulnerable to artillery shelling and air attacks from either Sikkim or Bhutan. If Indian aerial and artillery assaults are carried out effectively on the Chinese supply lines easily identified in the Chumbi valley stretched in a linear North-South direction, it would reduce PLA’s capabilities to fight to an extent that it would become untenable for the PLA to advance any further.

This was one of the reasons why the Chinese withdrew from Arunachal Pradesh in the 1962 war with India as they ran out of supplies. All this nonsense coming out from the Chinese that they withdrew because their aim was only to ‘teach India a lesson’ is so much hogwash. During the later part of the conflict the Chinese troops had no water and drank from dirty streams causing disease and death. They even came down to eating shrubs and grass to survive and ran out of ammunition, according to extracts from the Henderson Brooks Report on the Sino Indian war of 1962.

Though logistics have improved considerably, it is still extremely difficult to wage even a limited war in mountainous terrain against a well armed and entrenched adversary.

The combat ratio needed for an offensive in mountains is 1:9 meaning the PLA would need approximately nine divisions to attack one Indian mountain division. There are three divisions, 17, 27 and 20 Mountain Divisions under 33 Corps in the general area of Sikkim – Bhutan. The PLA would need at least twenty or more divisions to capture this area!

Now, providing logistics to these Chinese Divisions would be an uphill task (pun unintended!) Each attacking division needs a daily tonnage of approximately 600 tons of ammunition, food, water, medical equipment, spares, fuel, etc to prosecute an offensive. There would therefore be a need for constructing a two way road through mountainous terrain to the Doklam/Bhutan sector. But then, that would be easier said than done as this road will be continuously interdicted by Indian arty and air attacks. Their forward logistics bases would be interdicted too. They would require 600 x 1-ton trucks daily, operating 24x7 to supply just one division over a tenuous road link over mountainous terrain. Whether road space for this is available is the moot question. Further, deployablilty around the Chumbi Valley being restricted due to the terrain configuration, it would be impossible to employ more than one division for an offensive. This is way below the combat ratio needed for an offensive against Indian troops deployed in the area which is 9:1.

That was up to the Doklam sector. Now let’s delve ahead. Assume the extreme case of the PLA succeeding in capturing and holding the Chumbi Valley and its shoulders. The distance as the crow flies from there to the Chicken’s Neck area is 20kms. A road winding along the mountains would be near 50kms. Even if they have a class 9 road building capability of 1 km a day, it would take approx 50 days to complete the road!

However, this road will be continuously interdicted by the Indian Air Force as well as artillery suitably deployed to destroy the road infrastructure as well as the PLA’s forward logistics bases along this axis. As mentioned earlier, even one PLA division will find it near impossible to launch an offensive into the Siliguri corridor along this tenuous line of communication. The PLA would need at least 20 divisions for an offensive to cut the Chicken’s neck from Doklam/Tri Junction.

In the near impossible scenario of some PLA formations succeeding in entering the Siliguri corridor, they would be cut off and disintegrate sooner than later. It would not be possible for the PLA to sustain this offensive.

In a nutshell it will be impossible for the PLA to even pose a threat to the Siliguri corridor.


mikesingh