LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[abingdonboy]

LSP 6 in a jig?

 

[Bleh]

Allow me to add some more:
> Sweep Angle (which result in the strength of primary leading-edge vortices)
> Position and steadiness of vortex breakdown (result in loss of vortex lift and upward pitching moment)
> Delta wing have inherently low L/D ratio hence require high angle of attack at low speed(See landing and take off)

Aerodynamics is far more complicated than it seems and I haven't even counted the airfoil thickness to chord ratio, the geometry of apex, and shocks-related stuff.

Bacche ko maroge kya!..........

Basically like porn being illegal in India

It is?... I did not know that. Ah, now it all makes sense.

 

[Vamsi]

Guys it's SP-22 ,tail no LA-5022

 

[Bleh]

No it was 21 that became 17

it's SP-22 in new nomenclature, hence 6th jet

I havd never been more confused on this forum!


.....and kiss IR's feet for saying that! AESA lagake handover karo. Koi jaldi nahi beta!

 

[vishnugupt]

This is a 6th FOC not 10th. Wondering how everybody got confused here perhaps due to excitement whenever we see a new Tejas airframe.

Initially FOC was started from SP 17 then IAF asked to change it from SP 21. I believe HAL is following later nomenclature.

Alfa defence guy previously made a video where he said IAF again adopted SP -17 for first FOC but I doubt that.... That's why he is calling it 10th jet.

Maybe HAL has pissed up so much that they start painting tail with new nomenclature and landing door with older nomenclature to save paint and whitener .

HAL is doing good job but after all it is a PSU so don't expect more than what is promised.

 

[abingdonboy]

This is a 6th FOC not 10th. Wondering how everybody got confused here perhaps due to excitement whenever we see a new Tejas airframe.

Initially FOC was started from SP 17 then IAF asked to change it from SP 21. I believe HAL is following later nomenclature.

Alfa defence guy previously made a video where he said IAF again adopted SP -17 for first FOC but I doubt that.... That's why he is calling it 10th jet.

Maybe HAL has pissed up so much that they start painting tail with new nomenclature and landing door with older nomenclature to save paint and whitener .

HAL is doing good job but after all it is a PSU so don't expect more than what is promised.

Confusion is the side of the cockpit still says SP26 (HAL’s internal series number ) whilst the tail number is IAF’s aka SP-22. If it was IAF-SP26 then they would make it the 10th not the 6th.

Just another thing to note going forward- HAL maintains its own numbering for their airframes (as a OEMs do) and they won’t align with the IAF tail numbers ever again.

so 6th is fully finished,7th and 8th are almost there too and apparently every single FOC up to 11/12 has had its metal cutting.

they look on track to produce all 16 FOC single seaters by the middle of 2022 not to mention the MK.2ground run by the end of 2022.

Want to know what’s the status of NP-5 now.

 

[The Shrike]

16 extra F404s ordered, 99 not 83.. Yea baby

@The Shrike see? That's how you do the deduction

AFAIK the total GE F404 IN20 orders are
2004: 17 (for LSP / navy prototype)
2007: 24 IOC/FOC
2021: 99 is the new order.
So total engines is 140. Total ordered airframes for IAF is 40+83=123. Now add the spares for IAF fleet (how many I don't know). Plus the 10 LSP + NP airframes most of which were powered by IN20 (was 8?). How many extra unaccounted engines does that leave?

 

[abingdonboy]

AFAIK the total GE F404 IN20 orders are
2004: 17 (for LSP / navy prototype)
2007: 24 IOC/FOC
2021: 99 is the new order.
So total engines is 140. Total ordered airframes for IAF is 40+83=123. Now add the spares for IAF fleet (how many I don't know). Plus the 10 LSP + NP airframes most of which were powered by IN20 (was 8?). How many extra unaccounted engines does that leave?

Good accounting.

that would only leave single digit 404s but then assume there will be spares for IAF included in the contract

absolutely no link to a production order for NLCA

 

[The Shrike]

NLCA has a loong way to go (in $$$ and dev/test resources) before it can become an operational fighter or trainer, we are yet to see if that commitment is made (at least AFAIK). And seriously after so many years of following Indian defence news people think government will spend 1 extra phooti kaudi than minimum needed?

 

[Spitfire9]

NLCA has a loong way to go (in $$$ and dev/test resources) before it can become an operational fighter or trainer, we are yet to see if that commitment is made (at least AFAIK). And seriously after so many years of following Indian defence news people think government will spend 1 extra phooti kaudi than minimum needed?

What exactly is the point of ordering NLCA when IN rejected it as unsuitable, there is MiG-29 available and an acceptable design is in the works? Furthermore, it would push back delivery of Mk1A to IAF, I presume.

 

[Ghost hale]

AFAIK the total GE F404 IN20 orders are
2004: 17 (for LSP / navy prototype)
2007: 24 IOC/FOC
2021: 99 is the new order.
So total engines is 140. Total ordered airframes for IAF is 40+83=123. Now add the spares for IAF fleet (how many I don't know). Plus the 10 LSP + NP airframes most of which were powered by IN20 (was 8?). How many extra unaccounted engines does that leave?

Count doesn't work. Already 17 PVs and TDs are there and 16+6+ 3 which are visible clearly and as per news all other FOCs are probably on jigs. So by your count FOCs will wait for engine to be delivered from 99 ordered now for completion. Count is wrong.
I am quite sure that extra engines are not for NLCA atleast not all r for NLCA. Some might be extra and can be used.

What exactly is the point of ordering NLCA when IN rejected it as unsuitable, there is MiG-29 available and an acceptable design is in the works? Furthermore, it would push back delivery of Mk1A to IAF, I presume.

NLCA can be produced faster than anything that we order. Any order will be 1 or 1.5 + 3 years minimum for order and delivery start. And as TEDBF are planned at about 100 in numbers there is no point of adding new a/c specifically. NLCA provide flexibility of carrier operations and point defence with training and can be shifted to pure training once TEDBF rolls out. So an order of 16-18 NLCA seems like the best scenario. And regarding production rate, that can be handled with increase in number of LCAs put in order. Thats how all industries work. You use money from the business to put back in business.

 

[abingdonboy]

What exactly is the point of ordering NLCA when IN rejected it as unsuitable, there is MiG-29 available and an acceptable design is in the works? Furthermore, it would push back delivery of Mk1A to IAF, I presume.

The 29K fleet has serious fundamental issues, having so NLCA (not that I expect them) will take some of the load off the 29Ks, especially for training/carrier qualification purposes

MK1A commitments are set in stone, HAL will honour that contract above all else. Any additional contracts will be serviced separately

 

[Spitfire9]

I understand why NLCA would be useful even if on paper it is the world's least capable carrier fighter in terms of load/range.

 

[Ghost hale]

I understand why NLCA would be useful even if on paper it is the world's least capable carrier fighter in terms of load/range.

Indigenous, roll out almost will take same or less time, point defence with anti ship missile possibility and training aircraft which can be shifted completely for training once u hv TEDBFs.

 

[Bleh]

Want to know what’s the status of NP-5 now.

Hasn't had 1st flight yet, I heard in June it was nearing completion.

Other than refueling probe there might be some changes on that. Probably will get an AESA & EW system integrated from start, plus might get the full MFDs of LIFT (it'll go to Murica for trials too).

 

[The Shrike]

Count doesn't work. Already 17 PVs and TDs are there and 16+6+ 3 which are visible clearly and as per news all other FOCs are probably on jigs. So by your count FOCs will wait for engine to be delivered from 99 ordered now for completion. Count is wrong.
I am quite sure that extra engines are not for NLCA atleast not all r for NLCA. Some might be extra and can be used.

NLCA can be produced faster than anything that we order. Any order will be 1 or 1.5 + 3 years minimum for order and delivery start. And as TEDBF are planned at about 100 in numbers there is no point of adding new a/c specifically. NLCA provide flexibility of carrier operations and point defence with training and can be shifted to pure training once TEDBF rolls out. So an order of 16-18 NLCA seems like the best scenario. And regarding production rate, that can be handled with increase in number of LCAs put in order. Thats how all industries work. You use money from the business to put back in business.

AFAIK the TDs and PVs used older versions of F404, it was only NP and most SPs that used the new IN20 version.

 

[rone]

I don't know if someone already posted this here before or not, new picture of LCA sp 26

The funny part is so many discussions going on whether it is 6 th FOC or 10 th, so I remember sp19 picture from past

Here we can see new nomenclature methodology adopted after sp17, so am sure sp26 is 10th FOC
Another interesting question is if it is 10 th FOC where is rest of 6 , to be honest any one who visited hal Bangalore knows hal LCA division don't have very big storage hanger for LCA, the current one they have already occupied by LSP and prototype LCA the most available space of ready to fly focs will be maximum 3 or 4,so is IAF inducted LCA FOC aircarfts under secrecy?

 

[Gandaberunda]

I don't know if someone already posted this here before or not, new picture of LCA sp 26
View attachment 106008
The funny part is so many discussions going on whether it is 6 th FOC or 10 th, so I remember sp19 picture from past
View attachment 106000

Here we can see new nomenclature methodology adopted after sp17, so am sure sp26 is 10th FOC
Another interesting question is if it is 10 th FOC where is rest of 6 , to be honest any one who visited hal Bangalore knows hal LCA division don't have very big storage hanger for LCA, the current one they have already occupied by LSP and prototype LCA the most available space of ready to fly focs will be maximum 3 or 4,so is IAF inducted LCA FOC aircarfts under secrecy?

May be they are in yelahanka airbase or HAL airport tarmac. HAL uses yelanka air base as well

 

[Bleh]

May be they are in yelahanka airbase or HAL airport tarmac. HAL uses yelanka air base as well

Absolutely.. SP-19 was standing exactly where the SP-26 is right now.. even the angle of the backgrounds and lightings match.

 

[Picard]

I understand why NLCA would be useful even if on paper it is the world's least capable carrier fighter in terms of load/range.

Depends on the purpose. Generally, carriers with ski jump ramp are used primarily for fleet defense, as lack of catapult limits the maximum load aircraft can carry. And for fleet defense, Tejas is perfectly adequate.