LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Blademaster]

Ejection seats are extremely complex equipment requiring fail safe operation at all times. We haven't even developed a prototype and you're talking about replacing the MB one? Safest bet is to consider the American or Russian options that are proven and already in use.

Testing and qualification for ejection seats will take a LOT of time, lot of tests for which we don't have the infrastructure including the rail and tracks that simulate a high speed ejection.

True but when GoI puts in a large order for Mk 2, perhaps HAL would seek to capitalize on that order and seek to save money by coming up with an indigenous version.

 

[Flying Dagger]

True but when GoI puts in a large order for Mk 2, perhaps HAL would seek to capitalize on that order and seek to save money by coming up with an indigenous version.

Seats have nothing to do with Tejas order.... IAF already fields over a thousand trainers and combat fighter jets of different types.

There is already a huge demand.

 

[Blademaster]

Seats have nothing to do with Tejas order.... IAF already fields over a thousand trainers and combat fighter jets of different types.

There is already a huge demand.

Then HAL should go for it in order to make the LCA Tejas full exportable to any country without needing another country's permission with exception of US for the F404 engines.

 

[Flying Dagger]

Then HAL should go for it in order to make the LCA Tejas full exportable to any country without needing another country's permission with exception of US for the F404 engines.

They can employ American or Russian seats after verifying it with Tejas. There is no problem with that.

 

[Blademaster]

They can employ American or Russian seats after verifying it with Tejas. There is no problem with that.

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

 

[NutCracker]

Seats have nothing to do with Tejas order.... IAF already fields over a thousand trainers and combat fighter jets of different types.

There is already a huge demand.

Future trainer Aircrafts , yes.

But do those trainers/jet which already exist need new seats ? How frequently are seats replaced if replaced at all.

 

[Flying Dagger]

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

Yes but can't stall the production line for a decade or more.

Nor do we need to, it's just an ejection seat with plenty of verified suppliers already available.

 

[Flying Dagger]

Future trainer Aircrafts , yes.

But do those trainers/jet which already exist need new seats ? How frequently are seats replaced if replaced at all.

There is a service life for seats once it's over it is replaced.

The requirement will always remain and goes up and down . New fighter jets and trainers will be inducted periodically . Unless UCAV becomes the norm business will be there.

 

[Dark Sorrow]

Good it will drive HAL to come up with its own ejection seats and radome in order to sell the LCA to Argentina without coming across UK prohibitions.

You do realize HAL can't design a ejection seats and integration of new ejection seats will require ADA.
Designing ejection seats will require multiple laboratories effort from DRDO.
For MOD, ejection seats currently are not a high priority as it is not a mission critical component in an aircraft. Using off-the-shelf product is more economical.
Radome is a priority project due to uniqueness, confidentiality and criticality of radar. Hement Mounted Sight is another project we are looking into.

We have several different LRUs that we want to indigenize before we would even try to indigenize ejection seats.

 

[Dark Sorrow]

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

Currently it is not practical.
We have finite amount of resources and these resources are tasked to projects and sub-systems that have higher degree of criticality.
Even US, PRC or Russia doesn't have 100% indigenous content.

 

[Bleh]

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

Because it's inefficient... Putting a huge load of money after something to get it after 15years isn't an option when we need the money elsewhere. Critical component has to be desi, but as we see here, well have options.

 

[kamaal]

Before thinking about developing an ejection seat we should think about the market, cost benefit and supply blockage from manufacturers.
1. There will be very limited jets where this seats will be installed, only Indian jets will use it, but why would IAF allow it when MB ones are superior and cheaply available.
2. It will be expensive to design this system, lets accept that it'll require whole new ecosystem.
3. UK doesn't look like blocking supplies to India, it'll be huge loss for them.

Only solution is to use alternate ejection seat available in the market i.e Russian seats will do the job.

 

[Roland55]

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

As much as it would be nice to offer a 100% indigenous product, there are certain things that simply are too costly, complex and require long periods of time for it to be ready for use. Keep in mind that this situation with argentina could be one of many, where the buyer might want different choices in components (maybe something like the engine would be more desirable, but..yeah, it takes time)

Fitting a russian seat or an american one shouldnt be much of an issue.

 

[omaebakabaka]

As much as it would be nice to offer a 100% indigenous product, there are certain things that simply are too costly, complex and require long periods of time for it to be ready for use. Keep in mind that this situation with argentina could be one of many, where the buyer might want different choices in components (maybe something like the engine would be more desirable, but..yeah, it takes time)

Fitting a russian seat or an american one shouldnt be much of an issue.

Future is drones (atleast the 6th/7th gen hype) which require no ejection seats plus when private MIC picks up, hopefully if there is market they will invest. Just design it with russian alternative in mind in case the western mafia sanctions us.

 

[abingdonboy]

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

Ejection seats are actually very complex things to develop and you won’t be able to match someone like MB (arguably the world’s best) within 20 years, and remember you are chasing a moving target.

even the Chinese haven’t been able to get on par despite trying

 

[IndianHawk]

Why not make our own seats? Keep pushing & trying for 100% indigenous content.

Once we design system for our astronauts safety an ejection seat will follow from those technologies.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Once we design system for our astronauts safety an ejection seat will follow from those technologies.

How?

 

[IndianHawk]

How?

We are designing a whole crew recovery module that are designed to eject out of gaganyan at very High Speed. And land crew safely .

 

[abingdonboy]

We are designing a whole crew recovery module that are designed to eject out of gaganyan at very High Speed. And land crew safely .

Very different principle to an ejection seat in many ways, some similarities but mastering that doesn’t mean you can master the other necessarily

I recommend reading a noble anger by David Hill if you’re interested in this subject. It goes into great detail about the complexities and operations of ejection seats And MB in particular. It’s an incredibly niche and expert category of system that must be 100% trustworthy

 

[Dark Sorrow]

We are designing a whole crew recovery module that are designed to eject out of gaganyan at very High Speed. And land crew safely .

Very different principles.
The two projects are based on disjoint principal and technologies. Neither project would be much help for other.
Crew recovery module is designed for atmospheric re-entry. It will splash down in Indian ocean. The capsule itself will be protected/armored. Crew will never be exposed to the atmospheric elements.
Ejection seat is as name suggest for bailing out of lost aircraft. It will not be atmospheric re-entry. Pilot will be directly exposed to the atmospheric elements once rocket-power motor pushes him from the aircraft.