LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[HariPrasad-1]

as SFDR is coming into fruition French are becoming ready to integrate meteor on all Indian platforms fitted with indegeneous radar. within 5 yrs this meteor saga will be over .

Our Astra Mk2 will be a great air to air missile. It will almost match meteor in range and performance.

 

[abhay rajput]

Which Gripen are you talking about? Gripen C/D or Gripen NG? Tejas Mk1 A will be comparable or even better than Gripen C/D and Tejas Mk2 shall atleast match Gripen E in performance including sensors and EW if not better. Meteor option will remain open for Indian fighters. France is ready to integrate Meteor provided radar is Indian.

Ofcourse I am talking about Gripen Ng. Tejas mk1a is still 3 years away. And even then Gripen Ng will be better than Tejas mk1a. And it's not only about meteor but Gripen has many other technologies that Tejas mk1a will not have.

 

[abhay rajput]

Our Astra Mk2 will be a great air to air missile. It will almost match meteor in range and performance.

How can you compare dual pulse motor missile with ramjet motor missile. The difference is quite big. Astra mk2 will not match meteor at all. Sfdr will match meteor

 

[Kchontha]

Ofcourse I am talking about Gripen Ng. Tejas mk1a is still 3 years away. And even then Gripen Ng will be better than Tejas mk1a. And it's not only about meteor but Gripen has many other technologies that Tejas mk1a will not have.

What are the technologies Tejas will not have!? Please illuminate.....

 

[Shekhar Singh]

Ofcourse I am talking about Gripen Ng. Tejas mk1a is still 3 years away. And even then Gripen Ng will be better than Tejas mk1a. And it's not only about meteor but Gripen has many other technologies that Tejas mk1a will not have.

Please name few technologies which Gripen has and MK1A will not have.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

How can you compare dual pulse motor missile with ramjet motor missile. The difference is quite big. Astra mk2 will not match meteor at all. Sfdr will match meteor

Why cant they be compared? Can you please explain. Do you even know that upgadded version of ramjet powered Akash Mk1 is duel pulse motor powered Akash Mk2 with greater range ? Meteor is currently best but the difference between Astra mk2 and meteor will not be so great that both can't be compared. And the important things to be kept in mind is that meteor is not famous and deadliest because of ramjet engine only. it is famous and deadly because of a lots of high quality sensors , data links and seeaker etc it uses.

 

[Bleh]

What are the technologies Tejas will not have!? Please illuminate.....

Please name few technologies which Gripen has and MK1A will not have.

Other than supercruising ability, Gripen C/D platform is comparable to Tejas Mark 1/A. And F414 powered, more fuel carrying Gripen-NG is of the level of MWF (assuming that gets the AMCA tech available as HVT suggested).

Tejas Mark1/A will get only ECM pod, but doesn't even get MAWS ot inbuilt IRST.
But Gripens have highly elaborate intergrated MFS-EW system (Multi Functional System-Electronic Warfare) that can misguide or swamp enemy radars and FriendorFoe Indentification systems, reducing enemy's situational awareness as well as target-acquisition capacity. ThaiAF Gripens whitewashed Chinese flankers by hiding radar signature while carrying missiles. Swedish Gripen-C/D even ambushed Eurofighter Typhoons. NG got dedicated Electronic Attack Jammer Pod (EAJP) to cutoff SAM/BVRs from guiding radar.

Even direct energy weapons like EMP and laser weapons are reportedly under trial. India has a lot of catching up to do techwise. It is high time Tejas looks beyond FC-1 as its primary competition.

 

[scatterStorm]

ThaiAF Gripens whitewashed Chinese flankers by hiding radar signature while carrying missiles. Swedish Gripen-C/D even ambushed Eurofighter Typhoons. NG got dedicated Electronic Attack Jammer Pod (EAJP) to cutoff SAM/BVRs from guiding radar.

Even direct energy weapons like EMP and laser weapons are reportedly under trial. India has a lot of catching up to do techwise. It is high time Tejas looks beyond FC-1 as its primary competition.

I need some source on this NG went out of radar against the Chinese flankers, it interesting if they can do it. NG is a very capable platform, because SAAB as a weapon platform manufacturer has years of butt-load experience. They aren't scared of some radical idea, I mean look at the Draken then.

NG avionics and ECM is way advanced. PAF sole Awacs is there product.

 

[Bleh]

I need some source on this NG went out of radar against the Chinese flankers, it interesting if they can do it. NG is a very capable platform, because SAAB as a weapon platform manufacturer has years of butt-load experience. They aren't scared of some radical idea, I mean look at the Draken then.

NG avionics and ECM is way advanced. PAF sole Awacs is there product.

Just google it up & read multiple sources. In case of information of like this, its hard to tell which how much they are exaggerating for PR.

Still here are two;

Stories | Saab

Get to know our business and our people by reading our latest stories. Feel free to share the stories!

saab.com

Against Eurofighter Typhoon

Sweden says it built a Russian fighter jet killer - and stealth is totally irrelevant

Sweden's Air Force says its Gripen E fighter jets are designed to kill Russia's fearsome Sukhoi fighter jets, and that they have a "black belt" in that type

www.businessinsider.com

 

[Kchontha]

Other than supercruising ability, Gripen C/D platform is comparable to Tejas Mark 1/A.

Gripen c/d are powered by a Volvo RM12 turbofan engine (now GKN Aerospace Engine Systems), a licence-manufactured derivative of General Electric F404 which also powered Tejas mk1 and will also be powering mk1a. That means that both the aircraft have similar powerplants. Despite these gripen c/d can supercruise while Tejas couldn't, I still wonder, illuminate @ Bleh.

 

[Bleh]

Gripen c/d are powered by a Volvo RM12 turbofan engine (now GKN Aerospace Engine Systems), a licence-manufactured derivative of General Electric F404 which also powered Tejas mk1 and will also be powering mk1a. That means that both the aircraft have similar powerplants. Despite these gripen c/d can supercruise while Tejas couldn't, I still wonder, illuminate @ Bleh.

Aerodynamics... Gripen is much sleeker with smaller & simpler wings, logically making it less unstable than cranked compound winged Tejas. Which is why Mark1/A has similar maneuverability as C/D with canards.

Tejas wings are much more complex wing design with 3 dimensional curves, probably most complex of all existing fighter jets, mimicking a fixed-canard (which is why canards of MWF were reported to produce limited effect) but also more draggy.

 

[Kchontha]

The only variant of gripen that can supercruise or claimed to be supercruise is gripen NG or E, that is because of its powerplant i.e F414G, similar verson of this will also be powering MWF. So MWF should also be able to supercruise like gripen ng/e. That means there shouldn't be comparision between apples with oranges at the first instance or there shouldn't be mixed up. Better we compare mk1/mk 1a with c/d or MWF with e/ng.

 

[Saichand K]

Other than supercruising ability, Gripen C/D platform is comparable to Tejas Mark 1/A. And F414 powered, more fuel carrying Gripen-NG is of the level of MWF (assuming that gets the AMCA tech available as HVT suggested).

Tejas Mark1/A will get only ECM pod, but doesn't even get MAWS ot inbuilt IRST.
But Gripens have highly elaborate intergrated MFS-EW system (Multi Functional System-Electronic Warfare) that can misguide or swamp enemy radars and FriendorFoe Indentification systems, reducing enemy's situational awareness as well as target-acquisition capacity. ThaiAF Gripens whitewashed Chinese flankers by hiding radar signature while carrying missiles. Swedish Gripen-C/D even ambushed Eurofighter Typhoons. NG got dedicated Electronic Attack Jammer Pod (EAJP) to cutoff SAM/BVRs from guiding radar.

Even direct energy weapons like EMP and laser weapons are reportedly under trial. India has a lot of catching up to do techwise. It is high time Tejas looks beyond FC-1 as its primary competition.

As far as I know, MK-1A gets D-29 pod. D-29 pod does have MAWS in it.

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2018/12/indigenous-ew-system-ignored-for-tejas.html

 

[Bleh]

As far as I know, MK-1A gets D-29 pod. D-29 pod does have MAWS in it.

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2018/12/indigenous-ew-system-ignored-for-tejas.html

Pretty sure Elta jammer was chosen over it... Or was that news for FOC?

Also I may have been (partially) wrong. There were unconfirmed claims of Mark1A to sport EW system with "radar warning receiver” (RWR), “missile approach and warning system” (MAWS), & “self-protection jammer” (SPJ).
And if it get only a ECM pod, it is still a Radar Jamming system (with questionable effectiveness against AESA). MAWS needs alleast 3-4 separate sensors placed around the jet's fuselage. Cannot be a single wing-tip pod.

Anyways it is our first homegrown EW system. Almost no chance that, or even the Elta pod, is of comparable quality as Saab's integrated one.

 

[WARREN SS]

Anyways it is our first homegrown EW system. Almost no chance that, or even the Elta one, is of comparable quality as Saab's.

SAAB Is Decade Behind Elta in EW
Only Northrop Grumman & Thales are comparable And Italian ECI

 

[Bleh]

SAAB Is Decade Behind Elta in EW
Only Northrop Grumman & Thales are comparable And Italian ECI

Actually I don't know too much about that, and they have never been pitched against each other. So no comments on it.

 

[WARREN SS]

Also D-29 is a Radar Jamming system (with questionable effectiveness against AESA)

D-29 Basically use Virgilius Elt system Modules

Virgilius AESA-Based Internal EW Suite For MiG-29UPG & Tejas Mk2

trishul-trident.blogspot.com

 

[WARREN SS]

Actually I don't know too much about that, and they have never been pitched against each other. So no comments on it.

SAAB is just entered into the game EW development

While Elta Along With Raytheon And Northrop are Selling EW's For Decades
they Sold USAF ,multiple system

https://www.iai.co.il/p/ell-8222sb

https://www.iai.co.il/p/ell-8251

This is Next gen AESA Version Of 8222 EW Which We Use on MKI

 

[Bleh]

SAAB is just entered into the game EW development

While Elta Along With Raytheon And Northrop are Selling EW's For Decades
they Sold USAF ,multiple system

https://www.iai.co.il/p/ell-8222sb

https://www.iai.co.il/p/ell-8251

No, i meant an Elta external pod on Tejas, against a fully integrated EW system of Saab Gripen.
Recently Su-30's EW pods were discussed to not be fully compatible with Indian support tech and being limited in its effectiveness.

But I retract my statements on D-29. ADA India have made very good progress on AESA radar, avionics, FCS software etc. EW and AI are being stressed upon, we have the basic experience & talent base.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Tejas, against a fully integrated EW system of Saab Gripen. Recently Su-30's EW pods were discussed to not be fully compatible with Indian avionics and being limited in its effectiveness

I'm a little skeptical about this SU-30 Israeli not working cause IAF officials never claimed that on record we don't have a proper source.
Anyway in SU-30 one can think that is because of mix match of Israeli and Russian radar.
But i don't think that their will be a mix match between Israeli radar and Israeli jammers