Know Your 'Rafale'

[nitesh]

Ah, so almost a year to play around:

France hopes to seal Indian jet fighter deal in 9 months - India - DNA

 

[hit&run]

[video]http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/fromndtv/222680[/video]

I never bother what people say about Ajay Shukla. But I must say he is a sell off dick.

 

[mayfair]

Somebody needs to remind cubicle kids that we field technologies on our f18 that is not shared with the world. Just like our raptors. Just because you get an aircraft does not mean you get all of the US LATEST add ons with it.

Precisely.

 

[Armand2REP]

Precisely, US does not share latest adds on while France does. US exports 24 Super Boogers while France exports 200 Rafale... see what you get.

 

[JAYRAM]

[video]http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/fromndtv/222680[/video]

I never bother what people say about Ajay Shukla. But I must say he is a sell off dick.

[video]http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/fromndtv/222680[/video]

Ajai shukla says no other plane other than F-35 is good for India. Think he is dreaming of F-35 24hours.

He has only one thing to say when opening mouth, " F-35, i want F-35, giveeeee mmeeee FFFFF---3333335555555??? :shocked:".

And his blog is also mostly about F-35!..

Doubt he is waking up daily seeing F-35 pic & worshipping it.!

Why he is so desperately tied to F-35???...

I surprise being a defence journalist he doesnt know about US sanctions, their ToT, maintenance & spare parts, the aggressive CISMOA clauses which says routinely checking of plane by US team and lock downs like 'not fly the plane this way, thereby complete control of F-35 of IAF'. Oh, what a situation that would have brought to IAF...!

Without knowing facts, our needs & strategy he is blowing what is coming from mouth..!. I never knew he was so dumb!!..

 

[trackwhack]

Precisely.

Made my day, thanks.

 

[pmaitra]

The next day we explode a new nuke, for example.

***************************************************

You did two times before and its a no-brainer you will do it again. And even if you say that US will not sanction India, we just cant take the risk...$ 20 billion and 174 fighters are too steep a price to take a risk..We trust Russia and France more than US because even when we were in a vulnerable position they did not sanction us and stood by us. That kind of trust is simply not got by demanding, but by cultivating.

US is now an important ally to India..but these are fair weather days..aint it..? The true importance will only be known in times of rough weather. We got to know about that from Russia and France. USA has still not passed the test.

Just accept our position and move on instead of fighting like a kid for a candy.

This is by far a gem of a post; precise, cogent, thoughtful and insightful.

I second that!

 

[sayareakd]

may be this news have some sort of relevance here

Katju warns against paid news in poll season - Hindustan Times

Katju warns against paid news in poll season

 

[KS]

may be this news have some sort of relevance here

Katju warns against paid news in poll season - Hindustan Times

Katju warns against paid news in poll season

:shocked: :shocked:

 

[sayareakd]

circus is has just started so just sit back and enjoy, first it was F35 now it is EF.

 

[KS]

Last tme I heard the Taurus missile was offered to IAF for outfitting the MKI..

Is Rafale also Taurus compatible ?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Is Rafale also Taurus compatible ?

Yes, It is..

 

[KS]

Yes, It is..

But will we actually get it as it violates the MTCR regulations ?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

 

[Kunal Biswas]

But will we actually get it as it violates the MTCR regulations ?

Non nuclear..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

London's MMRCA Fall Out
Ares, Feb 1

To no surprise, the decision by India to name the Dassault Aviation Rafale as the lowest cost bidder in its MMRCA fighter competition over the Eurofighter Typhoon is not going down well in London.

Although Germany led the Indian Eurofighter campaign, the disappointment among British political, military and industrial players is palpable. Speaking in the House of Commons today, David Davis, a conservative MP, expressed his dismay at the outcome particularly "given the fact that we give many many times more aid to India than France ever did."

David Cameron, who lobbied for Eurofighter along with German chancellor Angela Merkel concedes that "the decision is obviously disappointing."

However, he's holding out hope. "They have not yet awarded the contract," he says, adding that "I will do everything I can, as I have already, to encourage the Indians to look at Typhoon because I think it is such a good aircraft."

He tries to assure Davis that job losses in the U.K. are not expected as a result.

As to competitive landscape, Cameron says Typhoon is "a superb aircraft with far better capabilities than Rafale" (or Rafael as Cameron calls it).

From:
http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs...entId=blogDest

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Fighter punch stuns Britain

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh is expected in London "within weeks". So, the two Prime Ministers will have a great deal to discuss — there is the feeling in London that the UK is putting more into its relationship with India than the other way round. British pride — or at least British tabloid pride — is hurt. UK's Mail Online noted: "Well that's gratitude! We give India a £1bn in aid, THEY snub the UK and give France a £13bn jet contract."
The IAF decision is a personal embarrassment for Cameron, who made growing trade with India a key foreign policy issue. He chose India for his first prominent foreign tour as Prime Minister in July 2010, taking six cabinet ministers and 39 business leaders, including BAE representatives.
[...]
Reports from the other Typhoon consortium members — Italy, Spain and Germany — suggested they have not given up. Germany's Spiegel Online said the "deal could ultimately collapse — (for) in the past, all other talks to sell Dassault's Rafale aircraft abroad have failed."

If the scramble turns dirty, it won't be long before mutterings of bribes and honey traps surface.

from:
http://www.telegraphindia.com/112020...y_15082222.jsp



They are behaving just like Gripen team..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

French Company Dassault Wins Bid for IAF's 126 Fighters
Defense Aerospace, Feb 1

French Defense Minister Gérard Longuet said during a Feb. 1 interview on French television that the contract's value is approximately 11 billion euros. Dismissing concerns about the high level of technology transfer, and over the loss of French jobs to India, Longuet said that production in India will mostly involve local assembly of French-manufactured components and parts, which will generate substantial payments and royalties for France.
Involving Indian industry "is inevitable, and even desirable," as this will boost bilateral ties between the two countries.

From:
http://www.defense-aerospace.com/art...ca-winner.html

 

[Indianboy]

The British are whining because their military infrastructure does not have money for the future this was a last hope
to save their crumbling infrastructure. This will put them well behind France and Germany possibly a decade?? They
have not been able to produce anything worthwhile in decades.

It may be because their over-reliance on US. They thought they need not do anything since US is there and stopped being themselves. I like India's attitude to be one's own-self and rely less on US or other countries. Self-reliance is always the best policy. This was the main reason of India's past prosperity and why whole of the Europe was looking for INDIA during 15th century.

I'm happy with their unhappiness with India's decision. It in a way is proving India's comeback.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Ourview | A jet of limited use at best

Finally, India has set its sights on the Dassault Rafale as its medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA). The choice of the French fighter ends a chapter of suspense in one of the largest defence deals in recent times.

As with most such choices, this one too has raised many questions. The logic of the purchase—whatever be the merits of the decision—is questionable. And this is not only a question of the choice between the Eurofighter Typhoon—the other aircraft in the final round—and the Rafale. If anything, the entire selection process raises questions.

To begin with, deals of such magnitude—involving 126 aircraft to begin with and costs going up to Rs76,000 crore—involve many factors. Then there is the question of the plane's vintage and its ability to serve India's future needs. The last mainstay of the Indian Air Force— the MiG21—has lasted more than 47 years. It is safe to assume the Rafale will be around for a while. In the 21st century, however, advances in aircraft design and avionics have grown by leaps and bounds. Whether the Rafale, a fourth generation fighter plane that conceptually dates to the 1970s, can compete with newer generation aircraft is certainly an open question.

Then, there is the issue of larger, strategic, benefits from signing such a deal. It is doubtful, if there are any. Instead, if the deal were signed with the US or Russia, the political benefits to India would be of a very different magnitude. After the 2005 Indo-US nuclear deal, it made much more sense to go for a US fighter jet: it would have added depth to a strategic partnership that appears uncertain now. The issue of Americans offering "sub-standard" planes such as the F-16 (which Pakistan has) and the F-18 could have been resolved in a different manner. India should have shortlisted the Lockheed Martin F-22 "Raptor"—a fifth generation fighter plane—as an option and then held high-level political negotiations with the Americans to try and get it.

At one point, the US had indicated that India could have the F-35—another fine option. That was never explored seriously. The Rafale is no match for the F-22 and F-35. The strategic advantages of tying up such deals elude the hide-bound, committee-based decision making in such deals.

Even at a late stage—when the choice was a suboptimal one between the Eurofighter Typhoon and the Rafale—India could still have made the best of it, by choosing the Typhoon, a newer vintage plane that allows for future development. That option too has been closed. And in terms of cost—when seen in a holistic manner—the Typhoon and the Rafale are nearly equally priced: the difference being just Rs25 crore per plane. But then, the golden rule in the government of India is to chase pennies and not plug the larger costs. And the opportunity cost in choosing the Rafale is painfully high.

Ourview | A jet of limited use at best - Views - livemint.com