Know Your 'Rafale'

p2prada

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The French seem to have reduced final Rafale numbers from 286 to 225.

@halloweene

Any idea why? I suppose cost is a factor.

Will this be the final number or are there plans for a new project?

So india would get most probably this engine M88 -4E package with TCO pack :D
Don't know if the French will have it fleet-wide, but India will have this engine fleet-wide.
 
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Armand2REP

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The French seem to have reduced final Rafale numbers from 286 to 225.

@halloweene

Any idea why? I suppose cost is a factor.
They are throwing numbers around. At the current production cost of 11 per year, the budget can only afford 225 to meet all procurement goals. If and when other orders come, costs would go down and the number of 286 can be met. The long term budget expected foreign orders, of which has yet to be seen. India's order would break that wide open.

Will this be the final number or are there plans for a new project?
Depends on exports. If we don't get enough to lower cost, we will switch to more UCAVs and upgrade more M2000s to keep squadron numbers.

Don't know if the French will have it fleet-wide, but India will have this engine fleet-wide.
All F4 Rafales get M88-4E, all previous models will be re-engined with it when the time comes.
 
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p2prada

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They are throwing numbers around. At the current production cost of 11 per year, the budget can only afford 225 to meet all procurement goals. If and when other orders come, costs would go down and the number of 286 can be met. The long term budget expected foreign orders, of which has yet to be seen. India's order would break that wide open.
Are you sure this 225 won't be etched in stone even with Indian orders?

All F4 Rafales get M88-4E, all previous models will be re-engined with it when the time comes.
I think you mean F3+, because it seems F4 is a Super Rafale version with 90KN engine for UAE.
 

Drsomnath999

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AESA news
According to Guillaume Steuers (who writes for Air&Cosmos), at the end of the last month, an AESA equiped Rafale has fired a Mica, as part of its OPEVAL.



More recently, the only AESA available for OPEVAL was installed onboard a twin seater Rafale, the B305. The quick operation lasted 2 hours.

Rafale News: AESA news


AASM laser for Mali

News from Air & Cosmos : Operation Serval, in Mali, demonstrated the need for a weapon capable of engaging a fast moving target.

This is the reason why a crash program was launched, and as a result, the AASM laser (capable of hitting a target moving at 80kmph) is going to be declared operational on Rafale in a few days, months earlier than initially planned.



Rafale News: AASM laser for Mali
 

halloweene

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F4 standard isnt fixed. Next one is F3R in 2018. UAE standard was internally called F3S.
The real question about engines is the implementation (and when ) of THEO program features.
 

halloweene

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The French seem to have reduced final Rafale numbers from 286 to 225.

@halloweene

Any idea why? I suppose cost is a factor.

Will this be the final number or are there plans for a new project?



Don't know if the French will have it fleet-wide, but India will have this engine fleet-wide.
There's been lots of speculations about budget cuts... It appears that there wont be real cuts, but inflation finally (aka about 2% cut/year for the next 2 years).
Target is still 286, i guess we will know more within weeks with the publication of whitebook.
 
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arnabmit

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Deal to procure Rafale planes highest priority: Air Chief Browne - Indian Express Mobile

India's agreement to buy 126 Rafale fighter jets from France's Dassault Aviation, is of the "highest priority" in the Budget for the upcoming financial year that begins in April, Air Chief Marshal NAK Browne said on Thursday.

The French machine was shortlisted for exclusive negotiations over a year ago after a hotly contested bidding war with rival manufacturers, but is still to finalise the $10.4 bn deal. France's Dassault Aviation hopes to conclude its $12-billion deal to sell Rafale jets to India this year, with negotiations set to be taken up by President Francois Hollande next week.

The deal will have to pass through "six or seven layers" of vetting before being presented to the finance ministry and the cabinet committee on security.

The French group has also formed a joint venture with the Indian conglomerate Reliance, which has no former military production experience but will be involved as a supplier.

Said the air chief in response to a question that, "The contract between Dassault and Reliance does not bother us, as per the RfP production has to be carried out in India jointly with Hindustan Aeronautics Limited."

In response to a question, Browne, who earlier in the week had called for imposing financial penalties on laggard design and production centres said, "World over when you slip in the production time there are big penalties. These need to be introduced here in India. We need to increase the liabilities."

"We need to execute financial penalties in case of poor performance of work centres by withholding payments and recovering some of the money spent."

Apart from 'tweaking' the present project management practices of the public sector agencies that design and manufacture military hardware, "We have to stop importing and start doing things more and more indigenously" as the IAF moved to become a force to reckon with, he said.

The IAF depended on Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. for its fighters, trainer aircraft and helicopter fleet. The company had slipped on delivering the required number of Sukhoi-30 fighters, Hawk advanced trainers and in completing the Intermediate Jet Trainer. The IAF which is the main customer for the ight Combat aircraft ` Tejas' has been waiting for over a decade to induct Light Combat Aircraft Tejas, which was yet to qualify for induction.

"As part of its modernisation plan, the IAF would acquire 350-400 aircraft in the current 12th and 13th Plan and these include both fixed and rotary wings and helicopters too, " he said.

The MMRCA (medium multirole combat aircraft) will be finalised in fiscal 2013-14. Some of the recent purchase deals include 10 Boeing C-17 transport planes; six C-130J special operations planes, Pilatus PC7 MkII trainers, 22 Boeing Apache strike helicopters and the Agusta 101 VVIP helicopters.
 

anoop_mig25

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When they are really going to sign the deal. why it is taking them so long :mad:

or its is true that after taking into account the amount of ToT , Rafale is costlier then all
 

p2prada

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F4 standard isnt fixed. Next one is F3R in 2018. UAE standard was internally called F3S.
The real question about engines is the implementation (and when ) of THEO program features.
Great. Then do you know the internal designation for Indian Rafales. F3I, F337. :p
 

halloweene

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No i dont :rolleyes:
F3I would be fairly logical.
@anoop the main problems within negociation werent the cost of ToT but the cost of upgrades for "F3I" and responsabilities/penalties in case of production slip.
upgrade cost issue seem to have been solved. It's been stated recently that one of major drabacks was solved. We're close.
 

arnabmit

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MoD wants HAL, who is unable to serial produce LCA, to assemble Rafale, and penalize Dassault if HAL lags behind in production?

:fp:

Will HAL undertake parts production or will just assemble KDK & SKDK?
 

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