MrPresident
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I Dont seem to hear lot of things on Kaveri front. Any insider news from ur side guys?
Kaveri Engine
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Butter Chicken
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Britain's engineering major Rolls Royce and DRDO have been working on developing an engine for military jets and the UK is keen on many such joint projects, British Defence Secretary Sir Michael Fallon said today.
After holding talks with Defence Minister Arun Jaitley, he said Britain has also agreed to having defence equipment cooperation with India for collaboration in developing military hardware, including air defence missile systems.
Sir Michael said the two sides also agreed to cooperate in readying aircraft carriers, which are under construction, for sea trials. The cooperation will cover technical aspects, training regimes and doctrines on deployment of the aircraft carriers.
On the jet engine project, Stephen Phipson, head of the UK's defence and security organisation in the departnment of international trade, said the gas turbine engine will have high-class military technology without elaborating on details.
"Together we can build one of the most efficient jet engines," he said.
Sir Michael, here on a four-day visit, stressed on deeper bilateral ties in defence production notwithstanding UK's strict export control regime. He said the British government had approved 99 per cent of all export licences for defence supplies to India last year.
"We want to see collaboration between our defence companies so that they can use India as launchpad for export to third countries," he said.
Replying to a question, he said there was no specific talks on fighter aircraft.
The Defence Secretary said the two countries agreed to continue bilateral defence exercises. Army, navy and air force of the two nations will have exercises this year.
The British Defence Secretary said the two sides resolved to ramp up cooperation to contain cyber crime, particularly in the financial services sector.
Identifying terrorism as a major threat, he said Britain wants to deepen cooperation with India in fighting the menace.
Referring to Afghanistan, he said the UK will work with India and other governments in the region to bring down tension in the war-ravaged country.
Asked about alleged corruption involving a British defence firm which is active in India, he refused to comment.
(This story has not been edited by Business Standard staff and is auto-generated from a syndicated feed.)
http://www.business-standard.com/ar...ng-together-on-jet-engine-117041301162_1.html
After holding talks with Defence Minister Arun Jaitley, he said Britain has also agreed to having defence equipment cooperation with India for collaboration in developing military hardware, including air defence missile systems.
Sir Michael said the two sides also agreed to cooperate in readying aircraft carriers, which are under construction, for sea trials. The cooperation will cover technical aspects, training regimes and doctrines on deployment of the aircraft carriers.
On the jet engine project, Stephen Phipson, head of the UK's defence and security organisation in the departnment of international trade, said the gas turbine engine will have high-class military technology without elaborating on details.
"Together we can build one of the most efficient jet engines," he said.
Sir Michael, here on a four-day visit, stressed on deeper bilateral ties in defence production notwithstanding UK's strict export control regime. He said the British government had approved 99 per cent of all export licences for defence supplies to India last year.
"We want to see collaboration between our defence companies so that they can use India as launchpad for export to third countries," he said.
Replying to a question, he said there was no specific talks on fighter aircraft.
The Defence Secretary said the two countries agreed to continue bilateral defence exercises. Army, navy and air force of the two nations will have exercises this year.
The British Defence Secretary said the two sides resolved to ramp up cooperation to contain cyber crime, particularly in the financial services sector.
Identifying terrorism as a major threat, he said Britain wants to deepen cooperation with India in fighting the menace.
Referring to Afghanistan, he said the UK will work with India and other governments in the region to bring down tension in the war-ravaged country.
Asked about alleged corruption involving a British defence firm which is active in India, he refused to comment.
(This story has not been edited by Business Standard staff and is auto-generated from a syndicated feed.)
http://www.business-standard.com/ar...ng-together-on-jet-engine-117041301162_1.html
kunal1123
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Did India just dumped United States and Signed up Eurojet EJ200 for AMCA with U.K? Published April 14, 2017 SOURCE: VISHAL KARPE / FOR MY TAKE / IDRW.ORG U.K. Secretary of State for Defence Sir Michael Fallon literally dropped a bomb when he said that India’s Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and British Aerospace engine major Rolls-Royce are collaborating in co-development of a new gas turbine engine. Fallon just fell short of naming the engine which he was referring to but added that gas turbine engine in development will be highest thrust gas turbine engine developed by the company. Fallon also confirmed that the technology demonstrator of the co-developed engine will be ready in 12 months. idrw.org in an article posted (Trump Effect: Indo-US Joint defence collaboration in jet engines technology on Back Burner ?? ) few days back had hinted at discord and lack of any positive movement on proposed Indo-US collaboration on developing an uprated engine based on General Electric Aviation developed F-414 jet engines under Trump Administration. EuroJet Turbo Company who at Aero India 2017 had confirmed to idrw.org that they are still willing to offer Eurojet EJ200 engine for AMCA just clinched the deal? EuroJet Turbo GmbH had offered to co-develop EJ2x0 which has potential to generate 30% more power compared to the original EJ200 with a reheated output of around 120 kN from current 90kN developed by Eurojet EJ200 engine. AMCA India’s proposed 5th Generation Multi-role fighter jet has engine thrust requirements of 110kN. India’s shelved Kaveri project is being revived with help from Safran of France, which might power LCA-Tejas MK1A fighter in the future. Just to add a word of caution Indian media or DRDO is yet to confirm if India and UK are actually co-developing EJ2x0 engines for AMCA, we will have to wait to get official confirmation or clarity. Disclaimer : Articles published under ” MY TAKE ” are articles written by Guest Writers and Opinions expressed within this article are the personal opinions of the author. IDRW.ORG is not responsible for the accuracy, completeness, suitability, or validity of any information on this article. All information is provided on an as-is basis. The information, facts or opinions appearing in the article do not reflect the views of IDRW.ORG and IDRW.ORG does not assume any responsibility or liability for the same. article is for information purposes only and not intended to constitute professional advice .
idrw.org . Read more at India No 1 Defence News Website http://idrw.org/did-india-just-dump...igned-up-for-eurojet-ej200-for-amca-with-u-k/ .
idrw.org . Read more at India No 1 Defence News Website http://idrw.org/did-india-just-dump...igned-up-for-eurojet-ej200-for-amca-with-u-k/ .
Dark Lord
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Aren't we already working with Safran for Kaveri revival?(part of Rafale's offset) GE's contract for F414 is for LCA.
EuroJet? Seriously? Its been ages since we even considered EuroJet.
Article doesn't seem credible at all.
HariPrasad-1
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If they have done that than it is a right choice. EJ 230 is a great engine which weighs less than 1000 KG and still generates a great power of 72 KG dry and 108 afterburner. That includes Thrust victor also. If we incorporate it into Tejas, Tejas will become a super plane or super tejas.
UK is the most unreliable partner as defence supplier. Without tot and indigenous manufacturing capability attained as a result of tot you can not believe UK . Perhaps so gov keeps all ongoing projects or stating near future projects as low profile .
But sometime they deliver also as they give ds blade tech in hawk ajt deal these blades later used in Kaveri and 2011 Kaveri which undergone high altitude tests in Russia was on ds blades .
HariPrasad-1
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It is not a question of reliable or unreliable. We need them and they need us. Currently we are not in a position to to afford the luxury of what is and who is reliable and who is not. We need to focus on our interest. We have a fierce competition with china who has a very dirty design for us and we need a dignified place in international arena. We must everything which increases our power whether economic or strategic. As you said we got the we got DS blade technology which went into Kaveri, we need similar benefits. Now imagine if we get SBC and other engine technology which is there in EJ 230, we may certainly take a giant step in aviation technology. We can fully indiginize our engine tejas and AMCA project.
smestarz
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With Trump as President, he will want USA to produce the engines etc and with India to be a purchaser, India also wants jet engines to be produced in India. When Obama was president, it was Trump who questioned why Obama wanted to give away F-16 tech to India, so in a way, we know where this is going.
With Brexit, UK needs more friends and business partners.
Safran is already helping India for Kaveri, which might be used for 4th Gen planes like Tejas 1A which is also going to be exported to friendly countries,
Now we need engines for MK2 and AMCA which both possibly might be in VLO/Stealth regime,
EJ230 has better Thrust and thrust to weight ratio than SNECMA M-88 and which might be what we require for plane like AMCA and LCA Mk2, and these might come with Thrust vectoring which we are big fans of.
Thus it might seem
Kaveri (with snecmas help) Tejas Mk1A
new engine (EJ-230 ) with DRDO for AMCA and Tejas Mk2,
Perhaps India might be worried about Item 30 of PAKFA and it might want their own developed engines to be installed on FGFA instead of item 30 (a speculation)
It all depends on how Item 30 performs and if Russia can give complete ToT for that engine, , else in order to advance our Aerospace industry we have to take these steps,
Further UK has a small requirement of planes, but that also forbids them to develop and produce something for themselves in small nos which might actually make cost per unit, high, but on other hand, India has big requirements and so making a JV with India does help them to get the small nos at significantly lower rate per unit as R&D expense will also get distributed.
With Brexit, UK needs more friends and business partners.
Safran is already helping India for Kaveri, which might be used for 4th Gen planes like Tejas 1A which is also going to be exported to friendly countries,
Now we need engines for MK2 and AMCA which both possibly might be in VLO/Stealth regime,
EJ230 has better Thrust and thrust to weight ratio than SNECMA M-88 and which might be what we require for plane like AMCA and LCA Mk2, and these might come with Thrust vectoring which we are big fans of.
Thus it might seem
Kaveri (with snecmas help) Tejas Mk1A
new engine (EJ-230 ) with DRDO for AMCA and Tejas Mk2,
Perhaps India might be worried about Item 30 of PAKFA and it might want their own developed engines to be installed on FGFA instead of item 30 (a speculation)
It all depends on how Item 30 performs and if Russia can give complete ToT for that engine, , else in order to advance our Aerospace industry we have to take these steps,
Further UK has a small requirement of planes, but that also forbids them to develop and produce something for themselves in small nos which might actually make cost per unit, high, but on other hand, India has big requirements and so making a JV with India does help them to get the small nos at significantly lower rate per unit as R&D expense will also get distributed.
Dark Lord
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I too will be shocked if RR shares full TOT of their engine. Most people on this forum don't understand that there are more commercial usage of gas turbine engines and it is not just for military planes. If they part with this technology then it would be a giant blow to many of their own industry.
Now coming to UK's reliability, No country can be 100% reliable because they have their own vested interests. Right now UK, which is already on a downward slop since 1945 is facing major economic problems because of Brexit. This leaves them with little or no options. We can take advantage of this situation and maybe able get some crucial tech from them but I am not expecting full TOT.
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the most intresting part is that the country which is nowhere in the top 5 arms exporter to india ,is actually coming out to give the engine tech for which we run from russia , france to US....
also according to the article ,UK is working with drdo for the last one year ln engine , ...
it means the talks with US failed even in obama time...
also according to the article ,UK is working with drdo for the last one year ln engine , ...
it means the talks with US failed even in obama time...
MrPresident
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No one will give COMPLETE TOT for there newest technology (Read item 30). Its just a plain stupidity to expect that. Even UK will not be sharing it nor France nor US.
lcafanboy
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New RM Arun Jaitly wants DA to integrate the Safran-Kaveri Engine in Rafale, which was recommended by Manohar Parrikar who wanted all new Jets in India should have Indian Engines as much as possible.
This could delay Rafale procurement by 1 year or beyond depending on the success of Safran-Kaveri.
Safran-Kaveri program would see the single engine eventually going to LCA variant, twin engines powering Rafale and an upgraded version to AMCA. This will help in real Make In India with 50% of offsets in 36 Flyaway giving us component level manufacturing and with Engines and other things, the custom build Rafale for India will easily cross more than 50% with target of more than 70% for Indian parts.
As I have stated earlier with all the fighter engines (3000-5000 engines) required over a 20-30 years period Rafales will be actually free for India. 100% of Kaveri IPR will be with India and we will make the engine from raw material stage with zero imported parts.
This could delay Rafale procurement by 1 year or beyond depending on the success of Safran-Kaveri.
Safran-Kaveri program would see the single engine eventually going to LCA variant, twin engines powering Rafale and an upgraded version to AMCA. This will help in real Make In India with 50% of offsets in 36 Flyaway giving us component level manufacturing and with Engines and other things, the custom build Rafale for India will easily cross more than 50% with target of more than 70% for Indian parts.
As I have stated earlier with all the fighter engines (3000-5000 engines) required over a 20-30 years period Rafales will be actually free for India. 100% of Kaveri IPR will be with India and we will make the engine from raw material stage with zero imported parts.
Flame Thrower
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Is it possible, It sounds good to have Kaveri on Rafale but dia of Kaveri is over 20 cm bigger than M 88. Integrating Kaveri into rafale might result in re desining end part of rafale. I am a bit skeptical about this news.
I don't think the dia should be an issue, Kaveri in its current form is not the final product version and there should be a Upgrade as per aircraft. One design and size fits all is not the right approach at least for fighter aircraft with different roles and category..
lcafanboy
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Even during MMRCA deal France & Dassault had offered Rafale integrated with Kaveri Engines. And the stakes now are just too HIGH. 200+ Rafales for IAF alone and more for IN if it is selected (with Kaveri engine only Rafale will be available to IN), Rafale NG development, Neuron, Scorpenes follow ups, (actually France can easily ride on Indian economy for next 30-40 years).
Can anybody please clarify. ......is it essential that an engine and aircraft body have to be completely matched? as a layperson, I would imagine that all engines would dlightly differ in length and diameter so is there some flexibility around these? I remember reading that lca pv4 or 6 was made for kaveri but ended up having ge404. So what is the amount of flexibility aircraft bodies have for enfines?
thanks
thanks
When u are at the verge of making on your own .....every one will come to your help.
Ask about tot for new gen SC blades,blisk,thermal barrier coating every one will just disappear as a dream.
Now it is that britan want India, rather the opposite.
After the Brexit the picture will be much better.
Anyways tot is ......good along with some assistance during beginning of making kaveri engines.French or British there should be some competition.
Britan has some good edge when it comes to engines for airlines and military transport aircraft.
O my god!!! I asked Vijyes before...
if at all if we purchase the rafale it should be with kaveri only.
This 200 rafales will also be a myth...max may be 50-80.we really
will not produce rafale for next 20 yrs .....rafale, a fourth gen bird is almost a sunset bird due to its high cost.
If we are producing 2000 - 3000 engines also it will be kaveri engine only with some improvement...that's with some imported parts where saffran and eurojet come into picture....
Welcome amca, a true fifth gen
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