Kaveri Engine

[gb009]

Better post this on the LCA thread so that we don't go OT discussing it here

 

[Agantrope]

2 Questions to gyan gurus??

1) This is the one made by GTRE without snecma so what will this one future/scope of usage
2) WIll this is the one that will be upgraded to the Snecma JV?

 

[gogbot]

2 Questions to gyan gurus??

1) This is the one made by GTRE without snecma so what will this one future/scope of usage

This is the GTRE Kaveri MK-1 , the one with out help from SCHEMA.

This engine has been modified fro use by the navy on their boats

Its proposed as an engine for future UAV's

The Kaveri can also be used to make a Gas turbine engine for the Arjun MBT or any future MBT .

The engine can also be used on trainer aircraft.

But as far as the LCA is concerned , the engine has been de-linked from the project.

2) WIll this is the one that will be upgraded to the Snecma JV?

GTRE/Schema KAveri Mk-2 is new engine based on the Kaveri-Mk-1 .

The JV will generate more trust along the same lines as the GE-414.

This may see usage on the LCA -mk2 and mk3 and Rafael if selected.
However the engine development has yet to start

 

[BunBunCake]

I have a question to ask you knowledgeable people
Why does India want to use Kaveri for MCA and Tejas.... after all this work, the thrust for the Kaveri is only 51 KN. Shouldn't we be looking to develop better alternatives.

I don't get the concept of developing something indigenous, and using it even if the product is unsatisfactory.

 

[notinlove]

I have a question to ask you knowledgeable people
Why does India want to use Kaveri for MCA and Tejas.... after all this work, the thrust for the Kaveri is only 51 KN. Shouldn't we be looking to develop better alternatives.

I don't get the concept of developing something indigenous, and using it even if the product is unsatisfactory.

Please go through the thread.

India is not using the kaveri in its present form for anything. it has been delinked with the tejas project ,first 40 tejas will use ge f404 , and the rest will use either ej200 or the f414.
as for kaveri , a deal with french engine maker snecma has been struck , the core will be reworked and if reports are anything to go by the new engine will be ready in 5 years with a T/W ratio of 10:1.that is the engine which will be used for future projects such as mca or some future variant of tejas.

 

[Anshu Attri]

http://idrw.org/?p=1450

GTRE in race to provide Kaveri engines for Japanese stealth fighter prototypes

Japan has issued Request for information to major engine manufactures that include long list of major Engine manufactures that include General Electric, Snecma, Volvo and Gas Turbine Research Establishment for GTX-35VS Kaveri.
Japanese requires engine in 44 to 89KN thrust range. Responses are due to be submitted by 10 May. Engines will only power the prototype aircraft's and not the production aircraft's which will be built locally by the Ishikawajima-Harima Heavy Industries (IHI), this is done to give IHI enough time to develop the new engine.
Kaveri which is still in development has been de-linked from the Tejas program, and will carry out high altitude testing in Russia after which Tejas Pv-1 will be integrated with the Kaveri engine , Kaveri MK-1 will not power any Tejas aircraft but the Joint venture between GTRE and Snecma will lead to development of Kaveri- MK2 which will power India's fifth generation fighter aircraft project Advance medium combat aircraft (AMCA) ,its highly unlikely that Kaveri engines will be selected by Japan .
Japanese stealth fighter ATD-X Shinshin programme is still in the study stage, and Japan took the development of stealth fighter when America refused to sell them F-22 Raptor.

 

[gb009]

A question to more knowledgeable folks on the forum:
there is lot of info/talk on kaveri MK1 being used for a UAV. I was under the impression that since UAVs are smaller & lighter than normal jet fighters they would require lighter engines. So is this really the case or are jet engines used in fighters also used in UAVs?

 

[Sridhar]

Wankel engines are best suited for UAVs , Scaled down jet engines will be good for cruise missiles .

 

[RAM]

Development of Kaveri Engine

Kaveri Aero Engine being developed by Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) requires to be optimised for lower weight and higher performance so that it can be used for Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas and possibly for Indian next generation combat Aircraft.

The Government also proposes to import foreign engines for LCA. Technical evaluation of proposals received from two short listed vendors, i.e. M/s Eurojet (NETMA), Europe and M/s General Electric Company, USA is in progress.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri AK Antony in a written reply to Dr. M Thambidurai and others in Lok Sabha today.


http://pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=61314

 

[nitesh]

more info from chindits:

http://www.chhindits.blogspot.com/

The Government also proposes to import foreign engines for LCA. Technical evaluation of proposals received from two short listed vendors, Eurojet (NETMA), Europe and General Electric Company, USA is in progress.

About 1880 hrs on engine test has been completed on various prototypes of Kaveri Engine. A total of eight Kaveri Engines and four core engines have been manufactured, assembled and tested. High Altitude testing on core engine has been completed successfully.

 

[plugwater]

Kaveri Update

It seems like India's troubled jet engine program "Kaveri" is finally making some progress but the pace is still slow. Defense Minister AK Antony recently made comments on the engine in parliament. Meanwhile the efforts to install the Kaveri of a LCA seems to have been delayed.
In the parliament Defense Minister AK Antony said that there are issues with the weight of the Kaveri. Its more than 150 kgs heavy than planned and the performance of the engine has not reached 100% but is very near it. However the good news is that the tendency to throw blades is now rectified and the engine is safe. Another good news is that the engine sent to Russia for high altitude testing on-board a test bed has completed more than 100 hrs of "successful" testing. This brings the total testing hours close to the 2000 hrs mark.
However there are no plans to use the engine on-board the LCA and there is a very high possibility that the Kaveri Mk-2 would be reduced to just a technology demonstrator. However one LCA will definitely be powered by it and in future may be some UAV's and small naval vessels. The Japanese are also looking at the Kaveri to power their Stealth fighter prototypes but its highly unlikely that it would be chosen.

http://angle-of-attack.blogspot.com/2010/05/kaveri-update.html

 

[EagleOne]

hope kaveri mk2 should not be a TD

 

[jackfoster220]

good news dude.

Every One Should be Happy

 

[Strike]

Kaveri Update
.........However there are no plans to use the engine on-board the LCA and there is a very high possibility that the Kaveri Mk-2 would be reduced to just a technology demonstrator.

Doesn't sound like very good news to me if it is going to end as TD. But then what I know about engines would fit on the back of a visiting card.

Perhaps someone with more knowledge of the program can comment?

 

[Rahul Singh]

I believe this TD tag will surely go once NGFA gets official nod from PMO which i think will come only after Tejas gets IOC.

 

[nitesh]

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/74284/drdo-gets-iso-certification.html

The City-based Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) lab, Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) has been certified for ISO 9001:2008 Quality Management System standard by M/s LRQA.

GTRE was initially certified in 2002 and subsequently had successful recertifications.

GTRE is involved in the design and development of the Kaveri engine for the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA). The ISO 9001:2008 certification aids in the continual improvement of design and development activities of the establishment.

 

[nitesh]

cross post:

http://beta.thehindu.com/news/national/article453058.ece

Eager to join hands with the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and its associates in the development of India's Light Combat Aircraft 'Tejas-Mark II,' the Eurojet consortium is offering its engine that could be tweaked to work on its naval version.

"We are offering two variants of the EJ200, bidding for the India's LCA Mark-II which can be altered through a software change to suit the requirements for the naval version of the LCA," Eurojet Vice-President Sales Paul Hermann told a group of journalists here.

The Aeronautical Defence Agency (ADA), the nodal agency for the design and development of the LCA under the overall supervision of the DRDO, had sought a proposal from the EJ200 and the American GE414 engine. The order will be initially for 99 engines with 10 of these in ready-to-use condition. There is an option for additional 49 engines order.

Eurojet Chief Engineer Wolfgang Sterr said there were over 1,500 EJ200 engines for the 700-plus Eurofighter Typhoon aircraft under contract to six nations. He said the engine was suitable for the LCA and could be used for the naval variant that the ADA was working on.

The Eurofighter is in the race for the 126 Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft that the IAF is acquiring.

The naval version requirement of greater thrust for take-off from an aircraft carrier can be met without altering the hardware of the engine. With a switch of software the EJ200 can be used for the naval variant and vice-versa.

While the company preferred not to make any direct comment on the price tag, EJ Sales Director Adrian Johnson, said it would be competitive in many aspects through low life cycle costs, transfer of technology and offering partnership to India for future development and enhancement of the engine and its systems.

The officials said, "If the Eurojet makes the grade, the organisation could also share its expertise in India's quest to develop indigenous Kaveri engine. We have experienced the challenge India is facing, At Rolls-Royce, it took us 100 years to get where we are"¦,"Mr. Johnson said.

The Eurojet consortium includes Rolls-Royce (England), MTU (German), ITP (Spain) and Avio (Italy).

 

[nirmal]

Any news about final selection status of either GE414 orEJ200? Wasn't it exepected to be finalised by end Apr'10?

 

[vijay jagannathan]

It seems GTRE will never ever live up to the promises it makes to the taxpayer. It all gone cold and silent on the kaveri testing in russia. It was supposed to have been flight tested in the middle of may which is long gone and it was none other than GTRE big boss Mohana Rao who promised it would be in second half of may. Boy these guys really seem to know that art of delaying and tossing any date that comes to their mind to keep the media and public quiet..

 

[ajtr]

Negotiations for Tejas aircraft engines soon​

Financial Express

Bangalore: The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) is set to start commercial negotiations with aircraft engine makers Eurojet Turbo GmbH and General Electric Aviation for 99 aircraft engines for the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas.

The two engine manufacturers had been shortlisted after expressions of interest for an alternate engine for the LCA were issued last year. Eurojet, a European consortium, is offering its EJ200 engine, which powers the Eurofighter Typhoon fighter plane while the American firm has put in bids for its GE F414 engine used in the Boeing F/A-18 E/F Superhornet. The new engine will power the Mark II variant of the Tejas, which currently runs on F-404 engines made by GE.

"Soon, we should be starting commercial negotiations, probably in a couple of weeks," said PS Subramanyam, director, ADA. "The technical evaluation is over. I think both of them (companies) are good candidates." The Tejas aircraft ,with its current engine and configuration, is expected to be inducted into the Indian Air Force (IAF) from March next year with state-run military plane maker Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd supplying 20 planes initially. The proposal for a second batch of 20 planes has been cleared by the defence ministry and negotiations are on, Subramanyam said.

The IAF has indicated the need for five squadrons of the Mark-II, which will feature the alternate, more powerful engine and upgraded electronics. "Wherever there is obsolescence setting in, in terms of advancement of electronics, we are going for state-of-the-art electronics in the Mark-II," said Subramanyam. Even as the process of procurement of engines is on, ADA has begun two tracks of design based on the shortlisted engines so as to not lose time, he added. Meanwhile, a proposal by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) to co-develop the indigenous Kaveri engine with French engine house Snecma, is under consideration.

An upgraded and more powerful Kaveri engine is being seen initially as a replacement engine for the first batch of Tejas aircraft, Subramanyam added.

"Every aircraft in its lifetime needs two replacements. Some of those engines are already looking for that. By the time Kaveri gets developed and demonstrated, those engines can start coming as replacement engines for the first 20, 40 (aircraft)," he said. "There is full scope of what their profile is. It is very clear in our mind. The Kaveri engine profile for the next 30 years has a very strong dovetailing into the LCA programme," he added.