INS Vishal (IAC- II) Aircraft Carrier - Flattop or Ski Jump

[Chinmoy]

And I thought it supposed to be VLSRSAM, not Barak 1 nor Barak 8.

Vikrant (and Vishal) needs SRSAM for CIWS. Long range AD should be taken care by P15A/B & NGD, or at least I thought so.

Barak 8 minimum engagement range is 500 mtr officially. How much more short you want it to be? Further there is 30mm CIWS after that.

 

[standard snowball]

Barak 8 minimum engagement range is 500 mtr officially. How much more short you want it to be? Further there is 30mm CIWS after that.

AK 630 you mean, that CIWS is as outdated as you can get, no independent targeting system, requires more space, heavier than its American counterparts, lower muzzle velocity, inferior elevation etc etc.
No serious Navy other the the Russians and Indians use them.
AK 630 along with the RBU 600 as the Bane of the Indian Navy.

Ideally we should be using something similar to Type 730 (as CIWS) and RIM 116 (which can double down as both anti air and anti submarine (RBU 6000) hunter)

 

[Chinmoy]

AK 630 you mean, that CIWS is as outdated as you can get, no independent targeting system, requires more space, heavier than its American counterparts, lower muzzle velocity, inferior elevation etc etc.
No serious Navy other the the Russians and Indians use them.
AK 630 along with the RBU 600 as the Bane of the Indian Navy.

Ideally we should be using something similar to Type 730 (as CIWS) and RIM 116 (which can double down as both anti air and anti submarine (RBU 6000) hunter)

MoD signs contract with BEL to supply indigenously developed 10 Lynx U2 Fire Control systems for Indian Navy

 

[standard snowball]

I just want to see following improvements
1. Slightly higher tonnage maybe 50k tons
2. An Indian Radar (the rumoured 6m radar)
3. Indian CIWS (please for the love of God, get rid of the ak 630) (preferably similar to type 730 or even 1130 if we want things to crazy)
4. Indian Equivalent to RIM 116.


there were some rumours about DRDO making an indigenous CIWS.

About RIM 116 equivalent, we can see a VSHORAD based missile, which can double down as both anti air (RIM 116) and anti submarine (RBU 6000) hunter

 

[jai jaganath]

I just want to see following improvements
1. Slightly higher tonnage maybe 50k tons
2. An Indian Radar (the rumoured 6m radar)
3. Indian CIWS (please for the love of God, get rid of the ak 630) (preferably similar to type 730 or even 1130 if we want things to crazy)
4. Indian Equivalent to RIM 116.


there were some rumours about DRDO making an indigenous CIWS.
View attachment 223284

About RIM 116 equivalent, we can see a VSHORAD based missile, which can double down as both anti air (RIM 116) and anti submarine (RBU 6000) hunter

Most importantly bigger lifts

 

[vin bharat mahan]

And I thought it supposed to be VLSRSAM, not Barak 1 nor Barak 8.

Vikrant (and Vishal) needs SRSAM for CIWS. Long range AD should be taken care by P15A/B & NGD, or at least I thought so.

VLSRAM is besically for smaller size frigate (4000 ton displacement approx) nd corvette. i dont think they will we used in our destroyer. coz barak 8 minimum engagement range is 500 meter. so it will be make first layer nd second layer will be made from upcoming LRSAM (150 km range) or XRSAM (250 km range). although there is also development going to make american SM 6 (250+ km range) nd SM 3 (1200 km range) type missiles which can counter ballistic missiles, from our BMD 2.
VLSRAM may be or not counter ballistic missiles..but barak 8 already blocked armenian Iskander missiles claimed by Azerbaijan. even our navy expert also claim barak 8 can counter brahmos also. so its far better sam missile than VLSRAM.

 

[binayak95]

cc: @binayak95

Will next one have bulbous bow .

Can Vikrant be refitted with one.

32 hi hai iirc.

Havent been onboard Vikrant yet - will ask around/

 

[NutCracker]

32 hi hai iirc.

Havent been onboard Vikrant yet - will ask around/

Please answer about bulbous bow too.
Other countries have opted that in their carriers but we did not.
G.Ford. Type002,003 all have them.

 

[Adm Kenobi]

500 mtr officially.

Mind sharing that?

 

[FactsPlease]

MoD signs contract with BEL to supply indigenously developed 10 Lynx U2 Fire Control systems for Indian Navy

Contract signed. And Vikrant is entering service in 12~18 months. Besides, I support @standard snowball for tiered defense, which almost every AC in the world does.

 

[Chinmoy]

Contract signed. And Vikrant is entering service in 12~18 months. Besides, I support @standard snowball for tiered defense, which almost every AC in the world does.

Facts for you here.

1. The Lynx-U2 fire control systems can monitor air/surface targets precisely, generate target data for determining weapon aiming locations, and engage targets.

Target combat is carried out using medium/short range gun mounts such as the Russian AK176, A190, and AK630, alongside the SRGM (Super Rapid Gun Mount) accessible aboard ships.

2. The Gun Fire Control System (GFCS) is developed with an open and scalable framework that allows for easy and flexible application in a wide range of setups.

3. The system has been in operation for over two decades, meeting the tactical needs of Indian Naval ships of different types such as destroyers, frigates, missile boats, corvettes, and so on.

Barak 8 can engage targets from 500 mtr to 70 km. It is a layered defence in itself.

Now is AK630 the best CIWS around? No. Do we need a better one? Yes. Are we working in it? Yes.

But till date we don't make a CIWS inhouse, AK630 is better option then anything out there as we are making the whole thing including the round indigenously.

 

[NutCracker]

Facts for you here.

1. The Lynx-U2 fire control systems can monitor air/surface targets precisely, generate target data for determining weapon aiming locations, and engage targets.

Target combat is carried out using medium/short range gun mounts such as the Russian AK176, A190, and AK630, alongside the SRGM (Super Rapid Gun Mount) accessible aboard ships.

2. The Gun Fire Control System (GFCS) is developed with an open and scalable framework that allows for easy and flexible application in a wide range of setups.

3. The system has been in operation for over two decades, meeting the tactical needs of Indian Naval ships of different types such as destroyers, frigates, missile boats, corvettes, and so on.

Barak 8 can engage targets from 500 mtr to 70 km. It is a layered defence in itself.

Now is AK630 the best CIWS around? No. Do we need a better one? Yes. Are we working in it? Yes.

But till date we don't make a CIWS inhouse, AK630 is better option then anything out there as we are making the whole thing including the round indigenously.

For surface drones, like being used by Ukraine 5000 RPM is better or 600 RPM with proximity fuse.

Can AK630 fire proximity fuse shells.

 

[Chinmoy]

For surface drones, like being used by Ukraine 5000 RPM is better or 600 RPM with proximity fuse.

Can AK630 fire proximity fuse shells.

600 RPM is more then enough.

It can fire if you want it to fire. Firing a proximity fuse shell is no big deal. We have to just some small modification.

 

[Adm Kenobi]

Facts for you here.

Barak 8 can engage targets from 500 mtr to 70 km. It is a layered defence in itself.

I'll ask again, please provide us with an official brochure or press release (a news article won't do) where the minimum range of 500m is stated for Barak-8 or MR-SAM.

And that's not what layered ADS means.


To others,
MR-SAM features an active gimballed seeker, and VL-SRSAM will feature an AESA seeker superior to that of MR-SAM, both feature hot launch & TVC, meaning a good minimum engagement range. MR-SAM is not some vastly superior missile, it has some inherent advantages given its size and dual pulse motor, other than that, VL-SRSAM meets or exceeds MR-SAM.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Navy still wants a 3rd 65,000 Ton Super carrier | हिंदी में

 

[Chinmoy]

I'll ask again, please provide us with an official brochure or press release (a news article won't do) where the minimum range of 500m is stated for Barak-8 or MR-SAM.

And I'll ask you for any official dossier where its mentioned that it can't intercept target at 500 mtrs.

And that's not what layered ADS means.


To others,
MR-SAM features an active gimballed seeker, and VL-SRSAM will feature an AESA seeker superior to that of MR-SAM, both feature hot launch & TVC, meaning a good minimum engagement range. MR-SAM is not some vastly superior missile, it has some inherent advantages given its size and dual pulse motor, other than that, VL-SRSAM meets or exceeds MR-SAM.

I very much know what a layered defence mean. And I am no where saying that MR-SAM is superior to VL-SRSAM. But is VL-SRSAM ready? If not, we have to make use of what we have and in that role, as of now, Barak-8 is doing good. When VL-SRSAM is ready, no one is saying here to ditch it for Barak-8.

 

[Adm Kenobi]

And I'll ask you for any official dossier where its mentioned that it can't intercept target at 500 mtrs.

Poor play, the responsibility to prove your statement lies with you.
The minimum engagement range with good pk is 1km. It would be good if you use correct figures.

The old poster for MRSAM
I won't always play along this nicely, be responsible next time.

And I am no where saying that MR-SAM is superior to VL-SRSAM. But is VL-SRSAM ready? If not, we have to make use of what we have and in that role, as of now, Barak-8 is doing good. When VL-SRSAM is ready, no one is saying here to ditch it for Barak-8.

To others,

 

[vin bharat mahan]

I'll ask again, please provide us with an official brochure or press release (a news article won't do) where the minimum range of 500m is stated for Barak-8 or MR-SAM.

And that's not what layered ADS means.


To others,
MR-SAM features an active gimballed seeker, and VL-SRSAM will feature an AESA seeker superior to that of MR-SAM, both feature hot launch & TVC, meaning a good minimum engagement range. MR-SAM is not some vastly superior missile, it has some inherent advantages given its size and dual pulse motor, other than that, VL-SRSAM meets or exceeds MR-SAM.

i hv some qus for u:-
1:- what about Azerbaijan claim, that they counter Armenia (russian) Iskander ballistic missile from barak 8 in war. even Armenia said they were not happy with iskander performance. if its true than barak 8 can counter a ballistic missile.
2:- its common claim by indianz, that only barak 8 can counter brahmos missiles. so india hv both "venom nd antidote". if that true, that mean barak 8 can counter a supersonic cruise missile also.
3:- if VLSRAM is more capable than barak 8 (with less range). than why in our destroyers nd frigate we hv no plan to replace some barak 8, out of 32 numbers with VLSRAM. we r only going to fit VLSRAM in our corvette.
now tell us, with all these how can u say VLSRAM is more superior than barak 8 or MRSAM?? so unlike barak 8, VLSRAM cant counter ballistic missile nd cruise missiles.

 

[Chinmoy]

Poor play, the responsibility to prove your statement lies with you.
The minimum engagement range with good pk is 1km. It would be good if you use correct figures.
View attachment 224482
The old poster for MRSAM
I won't always play along this nicely, be responsible next time.

From next time onwards, try to keep yourself updated on the Max range atleast.

The minimum range in the playcard is as true as the maximum range.

Try to talk with IAF or IN personnel regarding the minimum range at which interception has been done.

 

[Adm Kenobi]

From next time onwards, try to keep yourself updated on the Max range atleast.

View attachment 224488

The minimum range in the playcard is as true as the maximum range.

Try to talk with IAF or IN personnel regarding the minimum range at which interception has been done.

I was expecting a trash source, Wikipedia is even trashier.
The poster I shared mentioned events that happened after the Livefist article about LRSAM range extension, which was picked up by everyone thereafter.
MRSAM has an acceptable pk for 1-70km range, this is why it is mentioned in the poster.
Updated huh?
And yes, the minimum range in the playcard is as true as the maximum range.