INS Vikramaditya (Adm Gorshkov) aircraft carrier

[Armand2REP]

That aft tower is a real eye-soar on what is a nice looking ship. I bet it has something to do with counterweight as well as more radar coverage. You can see in the picture how much to port they extended the deck.

Nimitz sortie generation is 130+ while CdG is 90+. With an airwing half the size of CdG and a deck you can't recover while launching on... that is going to be a pretty low generation rate; even without catapults.


.

 

[Payeng]

What are those sticks on either sides of the boat? anyone......

 

[p2prada]

Nimitz sortie generation is 130+ while CdG is 90+.

Sortie generation means the number of aircraft that take off and land at a time. You are talking about air complement.

CDG is not 90+. It is a 45K ton carrier like Gorky and Vicky. Heck Gorky is actually bigger than CdG; weight, length, beam and draught.

In a realistic scenario, CDG can carry 10 aircraft more than Gorky's 30.

 

[p2prada]

What are those sticks on either sides of the boat? anyone......

Those seem to be safety nets...


or fishing poles.

 

[Armand2REP]

What are those sticks on either sides of the boat? anyone......

They are comm antennas. When carrier operations commence, they go down so nothing hits them.

 

[Armand2REP]

Sortie generation means the number of aircraft that take off and land at a time. You are talking about air complement.

CDG is not 90+. It is a 45K ton carrier like Gorky and Vicky. Heck Gorky is actually bigger than CdG; weight, length, beam and draught.

In a realistic scenario, CDG can carry 10 aircraft more than Gorky's 30.

Sortie generation rate means the number of aircraft that can be launched and recovered in a day. I am not talking about air compliment but that is a part of how high the generation rate will be. CdG can carry twice what Gorky does.

 

[p2prada]

Sortie generation rate means the number of aircraft that can be launched and recovered in a day. I am not talking about air compliment but that is a part of how high the generation rate will be. CdG can carry twice what Gorky does.

Ok. I got the point you were making.

CdG can carry 1.5-2 times more fighters in an operational sense, considering IN will never leave without it's 10 helicopters. As air complement(fighters + helicopters), Gorky will carry 30 while CdG will carry 40 at most.

I won't disagree that CdG is a full fledged carrier as compared to Gorky's air defence nature especially with the E-2 on board the CdG.

The sortie generation for a single squadron would be 30/day at an operating radius of 300-350Km at 2 sorties for every aircraft considering mission availability is 75-80%. This would be what Gorky would do.

CdG with 2 squadrons would manage twice that. So, let's say 60/day. I guess only Vicky would match it.

Nimitz would do twice that, 120/day, considering there are 4 squadrons of fighters on board.

I have not included helicopters and support aircraft.

However we know that the sortie generation is heavily dependent on the aircraft's capabilities. The Hornets on Nimitz have done 4 sorties/day on an average which brings the theoretical capability to 240 sorties/day. 200 sorties/day and greater have been achieved on Nimitz.

While CdG can carry 36 Rafales and still generate sorties of 2-3/day, however the Libya war saw only 10 Rafale-Ms participating. Technically Gorky can also carry two squadrons of Mig-29Ks, but will sacrifice the special mission helicopters.

 

[Shaitan]

 

[Apollyon]

Sortie generation rate means the number of aircraft that can be launched and recovered in a day. I am not talking about air compliment but that is a part of how high the generation rate will be. CdG can carry twice what Gorky does.

INS Vikramaditya's Hanger Dimensions : 130mx23mx6m

Mig-29K : Length: 17.3 m (57.76 ft)
Wingspan: 11.99 m (39.34 ft) [without folding wings]

Currently, a project conversion, "Admiral Gorshkov" in full AB for the Indian Navy. Expected to dismantle all weapons and radar "Mars-Passat", the length of the flight deck to increase up to 280 meters and fitted in the bow ramp. Increase the size of the hangar (to 130h23h6, 6 m) and width of the aft elevator, will be installed arresting gear and visual landing system at the corner deck. All of this will be placed on board the aircraft 34 - 21 MiG-29K and 13 helicopters. Defensive armament will make SPAR 6 "Dirk." It is expected that the modernization will be undertaken in the near future, "Sevmash" at Severodvinsk.

Link :"Àäìèðàë Ãîðøêîâ"

also refer to this picture :

INS Vikramaditya can accommodate (21 Fighters + 13 Helo) vs (12 Rafale-M + 16 Super-Etendard + 2 E2C + 2 Eurocopter Dolphin + 1 Aérospatiale III ... ) for Charles de Guella





although i know for you if it's not from France than it's not the best but Russians do make some good stuff ...
So Armand please Cut the Crap Cut the Crap Cut the Crap Cut the Crap ....

 

[Armand2REP]

INS Vikramaditya's Hanger Dimensions : 130mx23mx6m

It is a very narrow hanger...

Mig-29K : Length: 17.3 m (57.76 ft)
Wingspan: 11.99 m (39.34 ft) [without folding wings]

SEM Length: 14.1m
Wingspan: 7.8m folded

It is far more compact than a MiG-29K.

refer to this picture :

The hanger only holds 12 fighters and 5 helos. CdG hanger holds 10 Rafale, 14 SEM, 2 E2-F and 4 helos.

INS Vikramaditya can accommodate (21 Fighters + 13 Helo) vs (12 Rafale-M + 16 Super-Etendard + 2 E2C + 2 Eurocopter Dolphin + 1 Aérospatiale III ... ) for Charles de Guella

Gorky can only take 12-13 fighters for transit since you can't leave them on the deck in bad weather. We already had this discussion months ago. If you load up CdGs deck you can still fit 36 Rafales, 2 E2-Fs and 4 helos. If you mix it up with SEMs, you can make it over 40 fighters. Any way you cut it, CdG is still carrying twice the fighters.

although i know for you if it's not from France than it's not the best but Russians do make some good stuff ...
So Armand please Cut the Crap Cut the Crap Cut the Crap Cut the Crap ....

You think putting crap crap crap in bold makes you right?

Yeah, the hanger is really narrow.

 

[Apollyon]

It is a very narrow hanger...

See the Pic again, it's taken from the narrower section towards the broader section of the hanger

The hanger only holds 12 fighters and 5 helos. CdG hanger holds 10 Rafale, 14 SEM, 2 E2-F and 4 helos.

dont bring Super Etendard in this equation as we both know how good it is ..

CdG hanger can carry (18 Rafale + 4 Helo's + 2 E2C) vs (12 Mig-29 + 5 Helo's) for INS Vikramaditya
it's no where close to half as you were claiming in another post

Gorky can only take 12-13 fighters for transit since you can't leave them on the deck in bad weather. We already had this discussion months ago. If you load up CdGs deck you can still fit 36 Rafales, 2 E2-Fs and 4 helos. If you mix it up with SEMs, you can make it over 40 fighters. Any way you cut it, CdG is still carrying twice the fighters..

INS Vikiramaditya can carry in total 34 (21 Mig-29K's + 13 helo's) aircraft's on board, still no where close to half ...

 

[p2prada]

The CdG hangar is 140mx30mx6.1m vs Gorky's 130mx23mx6m. CdG's floor space would be 4200sqm as compared to 3000sqm for Gorky. For a Rafale that is 15x5m(with folded wings), we can have 56 Rafales in the hangar in the CdG and 40 in Gorky. If you divide that by two for all the extra stuff in the hangar(like elevators, tools, maintenance kits and the fact that they are not perfect rectangles) we still get 25(as advertised)for CdG while we get 20 for Gorky. Similarly, with Mig-29s(17mx6m), we can have 15 Mig-29s in Gorky. Since we do not have Rafale's, but Mig-29s the difference between Gorky's and CdG's internal space would be 40%. With same dimension aircraft the difference would be 20% which makes sense. All approximate calculations.

CdG carries 24 SEMs, 10 Rafale-Ms, 2 E-2Cs and 2 helicopters. This is the regular air complement. We know for sure 10 Rafale-Ms flew during the Libya operations too.

Gorky's air complement is yet to be seen.

 

[Payeng]

The CdG hangar is 140mx30mx6.1m vs Gorky's 130mx23mx6m. CdG's floor space would be 4200sqm as compared to 3000sqm for Gorky. For a Rafale that is 15x5m(with folded wings), we can have 56 Rafales in the hangar in the CdG and 40 in Gorky. If you divide that by two for all the extra stuff in the hangar(like elevators, tools, maintenance kits and the fact that they are not perfect rectangles) we still get 25(as advertised)for CdG while we get 20 for Gorky. Similarly, with Mig-29s(17mx6m), we can have 15 Mig-29s in Gorky. Since we do not have Rafale's, but Mig-29s the difference between Gorky's and CdG's internal space would be 40%. With same dimension aircraft the difference would be 20% which makes sense. All approximate calculations.

CdG carries 24 SEMs, 10 Rafale-Ms, 2 E-2Cs and 2 helicopters. This is the regular air complement. We know for sure 10 Rafale-Ms flew during the Libya operations too.

Gorky's air complement is yet to be seen.

A Rafale with folded wings huh :confused2:

 

[Apollyon]

The CdG hangar is 140mx30mx6.1m vs Gorky's 130mx23mx6m. CdG's floor space would be 4200sqm as compared to 3000sqm for Gorky. For a Rafale that is 15x5m(with folded wings), we can have 56 Rafales in the hangar in the CdG and 40 in Gorky. If you divide that by two for all the extra stuff in the hangar(like elevators, tools, maintenance kits and the fact that they are not perfect rectangles) we still get 25(as advertised)for CdG while we get 20 for Gorky. Similarly, with Mig-29s(17mx6m), we can have 15 Mig-29s in Gorky. Since we do not have Rafale's, but Mig-29s the difference between Gorky's and CdG's internal space would be 40%. With same dimension aircraft the difference would be 20% which makes sense. All approximate calculations.

CdG carries 24 SEMs, 10 Rafale-Ms, 2 E-2Cs and 2 helicopters. This is the regular air complement. We know for sure 10 Rafale-Ms flew during the Libya operations too.

Gorky's air complement is yet to be seen.

Rafale-M dont have fold-able wings ....

Rafale-M wingspan : 10.80m
Mig-29K wingspan : 7.80m (after folding wings)

 

[p2prada]

A Rafale with folded wings huh :confused2:

Oops, my Rafale must be broken then. My bad.

Revision, that would give 14 Rafales instead of 25 on CdG.

At 17x8 for Mig-29 that would give 12 Mig-29s or 10 Rafales on Gorky. I wonder if the extra 5 helis fill fit on top of the Mig-29s. That would mean the Gorky's hangar dimensions are wrong. Maybe the breadth is greater than 23m.

 

[Zebra]

 

[pankaj nema]

Indian aircraft carrier “Vikramaditya” in the trials in the White Sea has exceeded the required handling characteristics | idrw.org

Some GOOD News regarding INS Vikramaditya

 

[Armand2REP]

CdG doesn't have two elevators cutting into its hanger space so it has quite a bit more room to store aircraft. SEM is hardly ineffective...

Start at 11:07

And if I want to add 30 helos to CdG then I can still run twice as many as Gorky so please cut the crap. Fixed wing it is still carrying twice as many.

 

[Payeng]

OT but to heat up the debate

 

[pmaitra]

^^
So CdG doesn't even have a ski jump?

How is that a smart design? For an aircraft carrier, this is disappointing; but for an aviation cruiser that Gorshkov was, the conversion to Vikramaditya deserves accolades. However, one has to admire someone who would stand by his own (own?) country.