Indian Special Forces (archived)

[IndiaRising]

They fell into that ditch all at the same time?? Man, what happened to the age old basic most tactic of employing a pointman??!! If anything, this should be even more disconcerting than lack of proper gear!!

inclement weather made it difficult to retrieve them in time. 2 of them died in hospital, while 3 were dead on the spot.

 

[ArgonPrime]

inclement weather made it difficult to retrieve them in time. 4 of them died in hospital, while one was dead on the spot.

How is any of this even remotely relevant to what I just said??

 

[IndiaRising]

How is any of this even remotely relevant to what I just said??

that not all of them died on the spot. Some had minor casualties but died due to not being evac on time. It doesn’t mention anything about all 5 falling together. Maybe one or two fell and while the other three were in process of retrieving their mates, the jihadis opened fire waiting for all 5 to come in close range. We don’t know the possibilities but this is an operation where enemy always had element of surprise

 

[ArgonPrime]

that not all of them died on the spot. Some had minor casualties but died due to not being evac on time.

Definitely not 'minor' injuries if those lead o your death but still, this has got nothing with what I was trying to say.

 

[IndiaRising]

Definitely not 'minor' injuries if those lead o your death but still, this has got nothing with what I was trying to say.

they are fighting in minus degree celsius. Even minor wounds become a major headache at those temps.

 

[IndiaRising]

Here confirmation from news report from the other thread. 3 fell into the nullah after the snow cracked while the other 2 were able to hold on. The 3 who fell were in point blank range of the terrorists while the other 2 rushed into battle zone ASAP. 3 died on spot while other 2 died at 92 BH.

 

[ArgonPrime]

Here confirmation from news report from the other thread. 3 fell into the nullah after the snow cracked while the other 2 were able to hold on. The 3 who fell were in point blank range of the terrorists while the other 2 rushed into battle zone ASAP. 3 died on spot while other 2 died at 92 BH.

Yeah, saw that one, whatever happened to the age old maxim - "maintain proper spread".

 

[Snowcat]

Yeah, saw that one, whatever happened to the age old maxim - "maintain proper spread".

Jeez man, if you are really doubting on their tactics, why not go and join the SF and be the change.
It's easier to sit behind a smartphone and tell them to do this and that, firefight is a highly dynamic environment where things change within a second.

 

[ArgonPrime]

Jeez man, if you are really doubting on their tactics, why not go and join the SF and be the change.
It's easier to sit behind a smartphone and tell them to do this and that, firefight is a highly dynamic environment where things change within a second.

Wow, really nice way to downplay the other side, my man.

Mind telling me then why even have a "defence forum" in the first place if that's how you gonna play it??

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Yeah, saw that one, whatever happened to the age old maxim - "maintain proper spread".

There was. JCO In the company too they are experienced people. He probably could have been part of tons of ops.
Do you think that they didn't know about this pointman thing? What does the information tell us that they fell into the nallah in life such tragedy can happen in - temperatures and snow falling into such trap can happen.

 

[Underground Soldier]

Should be not Using CRPF CoBRA Guys for Such Operations? They have been doing much tougher Operations against Naxals and have a lot of experience. If we can train them a bit, there is no reason in my opinion that they won't be able to conduct such operations. See for example CRPF QAT, now it has become a SF Unit and has conducted some of the toughest Ops in Valley. It's about giving them a chance!!

 

[Tactical Frog]

Really sorry to hear about the bad news. Rest in peace, brave men of India.

So much anguish and pain when the very best of the nation die fighting worthless terrorists. They gave their life for a good cause.
French special forces suffered similar blow just 11 months ago. Freeing hostages .
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-benin-idUSKCN1SG11M

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

As India Fights Covid19, 5 Special Forces Men Die Fighting Terrorists
In a frantic, terrifyingly close quarter fight, 5 Pakistani terrorist infiltrators were killed in the Jumgund area of north Kashmir’s Kupwara sector on Sunday, the biggest incursion attempt since the snows have begun to melt. The encounter has also become one of the most costly for the Indian Special Forces, with 5 men of the elite 4 Para (SF) killed in action.

The five men have been identified as Subedar Sanjeev Kumar and Paratrooper Bal Krishan from Himachal Pradesh, Havildar Davendra Singh and Paratrooper Amit Kumar from Uttarakhand, and Paratrooper Chhatrapal Singh from Rajasthan.

The terrorists had infiltrated across the Line of Control last week. Movement had been noticed near fence on Wednesday from drone imagery. On Saturday, two squads of the 4 Para (Special Forces) were deployed for a forward staging to the nearest battalion headquarters, and from there to Rangdoori, Guguldara and Teen Behak areas of Jumgund. They needed to chopper it in as the battalion remains cut off by winter snow.

Intermittent exchanges of fire continued from 2 locations, and then narrowed down to just one location. Tracking movements across two days, it became clear that the terrorists had been cornered into a part of Kupwara’s dense Zurhama forest, not far from the Jumgund village. Tracking footsteps in the snow, one of the 4 Para squads in the snow tragically realised too late that they were on a cornice — an overhanging mass of hardened snow at the edge of a mountain precipice. It broke under their weight and they fell into a nallah, a frozen mountain stream, right into where the terrorists were hiding. This led to a close quarter fight in the most literal sense.

In the words of an officer familiar with details, “As luck would have it, where they fell, the militants were sitting right there. This led to a firefight at virtually point blank range. I have to give it to the training standards of the SF guys. Inspite of the fall, all five terrorists were killed. The complete squad was lost.”

Two soldiers succumbed to their injuries on Sunday evening after being airlifted to Srinagar’s Army hospital. The remains of the other 3 commandos and the terrorists were found within just three meters of each other.

The 4 Para (Special Forces) is the Army unit that undertook the 2016 surgical strikes in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir in which 38 terrorists were killed.

Paratrooper Amit Kumar of the 4 Para Special Forces

https://www.livefistdefence.com/202...ecial-forces-men-die-fighting-terrorists.html

Paratrooper Chhatrapal Singh

 

[ArgonPrime]

There was. JCO In the company too they are experienced people. He probably could have been part of tons of ops.
Do you think that they didn't know about this pointman thing? What does the information tell us that they fell into the nallah in life such tragedy can happen in - temperatures and snow falling into such trap can happen.

Ok, my bad, these folks can't do no wrong......ever.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Ok, my bad, these folks can't do no wrong......ever.

First get proper proofs that they didn't used a point man and then make judgements other than that you pretty much making arguments like a troll.
You should go with your nibba abraj and t use AC-130 to throw some nukes on the nalla.

 

[ArgonPrime]

First get proper proofs that they didn't used a point man and then make judgements other than that you pretty much making arguments like a troll.
You should go with your nibba abraj and t use AC-130 to throw some nukes on the nalla.

My man, I told you, you won!! I already admitted that these folks are infallible, I repeat, INFALLIBLE. Now walk it off.

 

[12arya]

Horrible news guys....5 SF guys from Daggers KIA

5 Soldiers, 5 Militants Killed as Army Fights Infiltrators in J&K

Five Indian Special Forces personnel and five militants were killed in a fierce gun battle between the forces and a terrorist group that had infiltrated from across the Line of Control (LoC) in Keran sector of north Kashmir, officials said in Srinagar late on Sunday, 5 April.

The five men of the elite 4 Para (SF) killed in action have been identified as Subedar Sanjeev Kumar and Paratrooper Bal Krishan from Himachal Pradesh, Havildar Davendra Singh and Paratrooper Amit Kumar from Uttarakhand, and Paratrooper Chhatrapal Singh from Rajasthan.

A Srinagar-based defence spokesperson had earlier said that three army personnel had fallen to the bullets of the militants in the higher reaches of Keran, which falls under Kupwara district.

However, later, the officials said that the number of soldiers killed in the gun battle was five and an equal number of terrorists had also been killed in the operation that had been going since the intervening night of 3 and 4 April.


The terrorists are believed to have entered the Indian territory from Shamsabari range and were hiding in 'Gujjar Dhok' (temporary shelter for nomads) in the Poswal area of the sector.

While walking over hardened snow, one of the 4 Para squads fell into a frozen mountain stream, exactly where the militants were hiding, which led to a close quarter fight between the commandos and the militants.

“As luck would have it, where they fell, the militants were sitting right there. This led to a firefight at virtually point blank range. I have to give it to the training standards of the SF guys. Inspite of the fall, all five terrorists were killed. The complete squad was lost,” said an officer.

Two soldiers succumbed to their injuries while being airlifted to Srinagar’s Army hospital on Sunday. The other three commandos were found near the terrorists.

The 4 Para (Special Forces) is the unit of Army that undertook 2016 surgical strikes in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir where 38 terrorists were killed.

 

[Lancer]

These disasters happen, look up Op Red Wings and that was a pre-planned surveillance Mission. In direct action ops there’s always a huge risk to the hunters and it seems like the area where this happened was heavily forested. Equipment levels can only get you so far but after a certain point it’s all down to fortune and hoping you get the upper hand, like I said in a direct action mission the odds are already stacked against you.


We also can’t rule out that this was intended to be an ambush from the outset by the Paki rats, this team could’ve walked into a well planned trap and there’s not much you can do in those situations.


Just be grateful that these beastly men exist ready to go out on those choppers into the darkness to hunt these monsters
this will be my position unless it’s proven that equipment deficiencies (which are surely there) led to their deaths.


+ EDI is an entirely separate matter, that was a debacle on a monumental scale

The basic argument that Special Forces can have a bad day or an Op can go wrong is true, but Op Red Wings isn't a very relevant example here.

Op Red Wings was compromised b/c some fucking Afghan goat herders came across the SEALs, and the SEALs had to follow suicidal ROE's lest they get put on trial/court martialed/jailed. So even knowing that the goatherders would likely go and snitch to the Taliban - they had to let them go because they technically weren't combatants.

Of course, the cocksuckers went and snitched - and the SEAL team had hell to pay. Another 10 or so guys in a helicopter died due to a SAM shot while hovering over the mountain trying to find the original team and go to their aid.

Big difference from the way India usually loses SF guys.

 

[ArgonPrime]

The basic argument that Special Forces can have a bad day or an Op can go wrong is true, but Op Red Wings isn't a very relevant example here.

Op Red Wings was compromised b/c some fucking Afghan goat herders came across the SEALs, and the SEALs had to follow suicidal ROE's lest they get put on trial/court martialed/jailed. So even knowing that the goatherders would likely go and snitch to the Taliban - they had to let them go because they technically weren't combatants.

Of course, the cocksuckers went and snitched - and the SEAL team had hell to pay. Another 10 or so guys in a helicopter died due to a SAM shot while hovering over the mountain trying to find the original team and go to their aid.

Big difference from the way India usually loses SF guys.

Apples to oranges as they say.

 

[Ujjain]

Why do we have a fetish of comparing ourselves to US in everything?

Is the US fighting in its own territory?

High inferiority complex among us.

If it was US..it would have taken POK in 1948.


Lets talk about what we can do...

I dont give a fuck about how many US SF died in what operation..we lost operators and yeah the number could very well be less.

Losing so many operators against BAT which are a mix of terrorist and SF is not acceptable.

4 families lost someone..a husband..a son..a father...their lives are screwed now.

And we lost a JCO who is really experienced and may have been the team leader.

I always talk for better gear so that on these days we have lesser casualties unlike some others who will have mental masturbation watching good gear.

Jab tak khud ka nahi marta toh dard thode hota he...and thatswhy i see no concern for lives in most people's post here.

You are right. It's really disheartening to see some of us talking about death of those guys in such casual manner. Bhagat Singh paida ho par mere ghar me nahi.