Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

sorcerer

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India dispatches stealth frigate for naval drills in Africa, Europe


NEW DELHI: India has dispatched stealth frigate INS Tabar on a three-month deployment to visit ports and conduct exercises with “friendly” foreign countries in Africa and Europe.
“INS Tabar will be deployed till end-September towards enhancing military cooperation with friendly nations. The warship will transit across the Gulf of Aden, Red Sea, Suez Canal, Mediterranean Sea, North Sea and Baltic Sea while making port calls at Djibouti, Egypt, Italy, France, UK, Russia, Netherlands, Morocco, and Arctic Council countries like Sweden and Norway,” said an official.


 

FalconSlayers

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Apples to oranges comparison, a full fledged 65,000 ton CATOBAR carrier + air wing will easily cost $12 billion.
Meanwhile, even the most expensive equipment used by the Indian Army costs a few million
When I said cope karo mitrooo, I meant cope with both the tweet and the meme.
 

FalconSlayers

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India dispatches stealth frigate for naval drills in Africa, Europe


NEW DELHI: India has dispatched stealth frigate INS Tabar on a three-month deployment to visit ports and conduct exercises with “friendly” foreign countries in Africa and Europe.
“INS Tabar will be deployed till end-September towards enhancing military cooperation with friendly nations. The warship will transit across the Gulf of Aden, Red Sea, Suez Canal, Mediterranean Sea, North Sea and Baltic Sea while making port calls at Djibouti, Egypt, Italy, France, UK, Russia, Netherlands, Morocco, and Arctic Council countries like Sweden and Norway,” said an official.


What kind of Naval drills do they mean? It sounds so cool and what it actually means is they’ll pass with an African country’s navy and that’s it.
 

sorcerer

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What kind of Naval drills do they mean? It sounds so cool and what it actually means is they’ll pass with an African country’s navy and that’s it.
“In addition to passage exercises with host navies of the countries being visited, the ship is also scheduled to participate in bilateral combat exercises like ‘Konkan’ with the British Navy, ‘Varuna’ with the French Navy and ‘Indra’ with the Russian Navy,” he added.


 

omaebakabaka

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Apples to oranges comparison, a full fledged 65,000 ton CATOBAR carrier + air wing will easily cost $12 billion.
Meanwhile, even the most expensive equipment used by the Indian Army costs a few million
12 billion USD sounds expensive, thats like Ford class level....if we go by TEDBF (when its ready) then we it should be no more than 8 billion for lead and subsequent even cheaper?
 

omaebakabaka

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Indian Navy is delusional, they know submarines is the cheapest way of achieving sea denial for budget like ours. How to fund and operate all these aircraft carriers unless you have 5tn economy.
That in itself is a delusion.
Not the same, unless INR becomes basket of reserve currency we should be able to afford as long as most stuff is domestic....sea denial can be achieved with missile corvettes at cheaper price just like Iran does
 

THESIS THORON

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Indian Navy is delusional, they know submarines is the cheapest way of achieving sea denial for budget like ours. How to fund and operate all these aircraft carriers unless you have 5tn economy.
That in itself is a delusion.
imo its not delusional, it has became habit of navy due to area dominance doctrine.

It will take time to move from dominance to denial.
 

omaebakabaka

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Ulta bol Rahe ho bro.
Navy is the one who is seems to be promoting atmanirbhar most.
Meanwhile IA can't let go of their foreign toup
Not sure its totally fair regarding IAF....most critical stuff in Navy are still imported and they keep buying subs even after many TOTs while IAF being the most important arm of defence when a war breaks out has only Tejas as the option so far, so what should we expect them to do? Does anyone trust first product that comes to market to replace all critical things? Tejas still has to prove in real world in real scenarios like Balakot at minimum. As far as missiles go, IAF is certainly looking domestic in mixed share set up for now
 

FactsPlease

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Not sure its totally fair regarding IAF....most critical stuff in Navy are still imported and they keep buying subs even after many TOTs while IAF being the most important arm of defence when a war breaks out has only Tejas as the option so far, so what should we expect them to do? Does anyone trust first product that comes to market to replace all critical things? Tejas still has to prove in real world in real scenarios like Balakot at minimum. As far as missiles go, IAF is certainly looking domestic in mixed share set up for now
Good remark. Many people at this forum been repeating that Navy done better in supporting (so-called) indigenous defence industry. I will call that's a misperception. Moreover, a wide one.

Frigates wise, since 2003, Navy got 6 locally made ones (P16A batch 2, Brahmaputra x3 + P17 x3). How many Talwar class we got? Six, too. Two more P17A may (or may not) come in service at 2022, but we also got two Russian 1135.6M on order book. Means? it's at most 50%.
We got 87.5% submarines imported -- 6 Kalvari (before domestic API done to Kalvari, spare me to call them "close to" indiginous) + 1 Chakra v.s. 1 Arihant. Another close to 100% helicopters are imported - NO real big order for Dhuruv (navy version) even with Vikrant & marine force expansion in sight, not to mention obvious helo shortage. Similar dilemma seems to happen to Tejas navy version.
All supply and amphibious ships inducted in last 10 years were imported. And this trend seems to continue for next 10 years.
Yes, we inducted 3 local destroyers since 2001, and another three P28. Nevertheless, all main guns, CIWS, AA radars & missiles on them are imported. Did I mention that we ask Russia to upgrade Delhi class?

We have proud progress, yes: Brahamos, heavy torpedo, sonar, some radars, Vikrant (fingers crossed), Aridaman, K15, quite battle management systems.

Still a long way for war marching!
 

omaebakabaka

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Good remark. Many people at this forum been repeating that Navy done better in supporting (so-called) indigenous defence industry. I will call that's a misperception. Moreover, a wide one.

Frigates wise, since 2003, Navy got 6 locally made ones (P16A batch 2, Brahmaputra x3 + P17 x3). How many Talwar class we got? Six, too. Two more P17A may (or may not) come in service at 2022, but we also got two Russian 1135.6M on order book. Means? it's at most 50%.
We got 87.5% submarines imported -- 6 Kalvari (before domestic API done to Kalvari, spare me to call them "close to" indiginous) + 1 Chakra v.s. 1 Arihant. Another close to 100% helicopters are imported - NO real big order for Dhuruv (navy version) even with Vikrant & marine force expansion in sight, not to mention obvious helo shortage. Similar dilemma seems to happen to Tejas navy version.
All supply and amphibious ships inducted in last 10 years were imported. And this trend seems to continue for next 10 years.
Yes, we inducted 3 local destroyers since 2001, and another three P28. Nevertheless, all main guns, CIWS, AA radars & missiles on them are imported. Did I mention that we ask Russia to upgrade Delhi class?

We have proud progress, yes: Brahamos, heavy torpedo, sonar, some radars, Vikrant (fingers crossed), Aridaman, K15, quite battle management systems.

Still a long way for war marching!
Its complicated, even Russia struggled with 100% indigenous effort and many western countries borrow from each other patents, ip and so on....I think GOI is focusing on strategic systems and armaments and munitions for platforms (imported and exported platforms) and they are correct in doing it that way....this is what will keep our readiness and confidence at highest and at peer level. Platforms can slowly come, more hulls are domestic now surface and subsurface and so on. Helis have done really well and Tejas will do well too....tanks and arty are actively tested and next versions are drafted....I am actually worried about subs after all the TOT, there isn;t a domestic one yet.
 

ajay7322

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India will continue to maintain a naval presence in the troubled Persian Gulf and Gulf of Oman, which is aimed at protecting and reassuring Indian-flagged merchant vessels and oil tankers transiting through the region.

“The Strait of Hormuz is a major chokepoint. Disruption in trade in this region can have a major impact on our economy. Under `Operation Sankalp’, we will continue to deploy a frontline warship, either a destroyer or a frigate with a helicopter and a marine commando intervention team, in the region,” a senior Navy officer said.

India, in fact, launched Operation Sankalp in June 2019 after mysterious explosions on board two foreign oil tankers in the Gulf of Oman, MV Front Altair and MV Kokuka Courageous, amidst heightened tensions between Iran and the US.
With the attacks underlining the vulnerability of sea-borne trade transiting through the constricted geographical locations, the Navy had then dispatched destroyer INS Chennai and patrol vessel INS Sunayna to the Gulf of Oman.

“Indian Navy was the first to deploy ships to safeguard the passage of merchant ships through the region. It was taken on independently and not as a part of any coalition,” the officer added.
Two years later, the continuous forward naval deployment continues. As many as 23 Indian warships in rotation have been deployed to the Gulf region, with an average of 16 Indian-flagged merchant vessels and tankers being provided safe passage on a daily basis.

“Given the prevailing security situation there, the presence of an Indian warship acts as a deterrence to any hostile threat as well as reassures our merchant vessels. If requested, we also embark a security team of marine commandos on a vessel for some duration,” the officer said.
“Around 60% of India’s oil imports, after all, comes from this region. Despite diversification of sources for import of oil, Gulf countries are likely to
continue as major suppliers for India. Moreover, the Indian diaspora numbers around 8.5 million in the region,” he added.
Operation Sankalp is now a part of the “mission-based deployments (MBDs)” launched by the Navy in 2017 in the Indian Ocean Region, stretching from the Persian Gulf to the Malacca Strait.
Under MBDs, several warships are deployed on a “sustained basis across our areas of interest” to meet any operational contingency from conventional threats and maritime terrorism to piracy and humanitarian disaster relief.

“This not only helps us undertake foreign cooperation initiatives for the nation, but also enables our ships to respond to any emerging situation without any delay,” another officer said.
The Navy says one of its key roles as a security provider for the country’s “Blue Economy” includes maintaining a secure and stable maritime environment to enable unhindered pursuit of maritime economic activities.
 

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