Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

[WolfPack86]

India signs deal with Turkey’s TAIS Shipyards for five fleet support vessels
India's state-owned Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL) and TAIS, a consortium of five Turkish shipbuilders, have signed an INR160 billion (USD2.1 billion) deal to jointly design and build five 45,000-tonne fleet support vessels for the Indian Navy.


The Turkish consortium won the tender for 5 fleet support vessels for the Indian navy in May of last year. But the formal deal was signed during President Erdogan’s visit to Islamabad last month. This decision came after being put on hold for months over tensions between New Delhi and Ankara.

TAIS will carry out the modernization of the local shipyard, the design of the ships, engineering services, planning and management of production, preparation of shipbuilding material specifications and main materials.

Support Vessels are capable of acting as underway supply points or as coastal supply points where harbor installations are not available or safe enough. They provide fuel, food, ammunition and spare parts to ensure the continued operational readiness of Task Groups at all times.

In addition, they support Task Groups with their special repair facilities and feature on-board hospital for disaster relief operations. They act as Command Platforms for various types of Tasks Groups and provide navies with a tactical advantage.

The construction of the first vessel was initially scheduled to begin by the end of 2020, with the first vessel expected to be delivered to the Navy in 2024.

India signs deal with Turkey’s TAIS Shipyards for five fleet support v

India's state-owned Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL) and TAIS, a consortium of five Turkish shipbuilders, have signed an INR160 billion (USD2.1 billion) de

www.navyrecognition.com

 

[FalconSlayers]

Russian junks

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Its high time to reduce army personal count and divert this fund to air-force, navy

Gone are the days when army used to dominate battlefield. Modern wars are decided by air-force and to certain extent navy.

Please stop applying Western military logic to Indian situation. The CDS is not a fool. Reduction in Army personnel is being done where it can be done without compromising field strength of the Army. Even now, Army is so short of manpower, that they couldn't raise the second Mountain Strike Corps. In the end, last year's standoff forced the Army to dismantle I Strike Corps and move two of its Divisions to Ladakh, to be later formed into the promised second Mountain Strike Corps. So we had to reduce our strength of Strike Corps in plains from 3 to 2. Army is already doing all it can to arrest its ballooning revenue expenditure. A deep review of all cadres is being undertaken. Even civilians on a Tour of Duty was being considered. Flab in the Army is impacting the Army much more than the Air Force or the Navy. Look at each service's CAPEX as a ratio of total budgets. Air Force and Navy have healthy ratios. Army's ratio is pathetic and its their own modernization that is suffering the most. So please don't make blanket statements without taking into account the ground situation.

 

[Lonewolf]

Please stop applying Western military logic to Indian situation. The CDS is not a fool. Reduction in Army personnel is being done where it can be done without compromising field strength of the Army. Even now, Army is so short of manpower, that they couldn't raise the second Mountain Strike Corps. In the end, last year's standoff forced the Army to dismantle I Strike Corps and move two of its Divisions to Ladakh, to be later formed into the promised second Mountain Strike Corps. So we had to reduce our strength of Strike Corps in plains from 3 to 2. Army is already doing all it can to arrest its ballooning revenue expenditure. A deep review of all cadres is being undertaken. Even civilians on a Tour of Duty was being considered. Flab in the Army is impacting the Army much more than the Air Force or the Navy. Look at each service's CAPEX as a ratio of total budgets. Air Force and Navy have healthy ratios. Army's ratio is pathetic and its their own modernization that is suffering the most. So please don't make blanket statements without taking into account the ground situation.

But we can atleast do away with rubbish procurement procedure and save the money rise due to inflation , also we can start to make maintenance and servicing innovation for cost cutting , in some areas army have to run diesel generator ,in others it has to make lot of transportation movement , we can find solutions for such problem , accomodations can be made pocket friendly , and all these problems are small and easy to solve but require planning and guidance of army , these small cost cutting can give some budget for small gear upgradation ,like bpj , plate carrier , guns , sights , helmets , drdo radae for personnel tracking and all can be implemented , all these will give some capability enhancement without much budget enhancement .

 

[sorcerer]

Indian and Indonesian navies carry out military drill in Southern Arabian sea

New Delhi, May 8 (PTI) The navies of India and Indonesia on Saturday carried out a military drill in the Southern Arabian sea with a focus on further improving their interoperability, officials said.
The Indian Navy was represented at the ''Passage'' exercise by INS Sharda, an offshore patrol vessel (OPV), and the Indonesian Navy was represented by KRI Sultan Hasanudin, a corvette, they said.

Outlook India Magazine Online- Read News India, Latest News Analysis, World, Sports, Entertainment | Best Online Magazine India

Outlook covers the latest India news, analysis, business news and long-form stories on culture, money market and personal finance. Read India's best online magazine.

www.outlookindia.com

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

But we can atleast do away with rubbish procurement procedure and save the money rise due to inflation , also we can start to make maintenance and servicing innovation for cost cutting , in some areas army have to run diesel generator ,in others it has to make lot of transportation movement , we can find solutions for such problem , accomodations can be made pocket friendly , and all these problems are small and easy to solve but require planning and guidance of army , these small cost cutting can give some budget for small gear upgradation ,like bpj , plate carrier , guns , sights , helmets , drdo radae for personnel tracking and all can be implemented , all these will give some capability enhancement without much budget enhancement .

Agreed. The restructuring of Ordnance Depots and Army HQ itself should be able to drive some of these improvements. Another factor that will drive the kind of improvements you mention is TOT from DRDO to private Indian companies. Its good that now a certain amount of CAPEX (I think 15%) is earmarked for procurement from Private Indian industries. Dependence on OFB drives half these problems.

Thing is, Army (at least under General Rawat) appears to be making conscious changes towards reducing all kinds of wastage. General Rawat will be remembered as one who carried forward the legacy of General VK Singh.

 

[Lonewolf]

Agreed. The restructuring of Ordnance Depots and Army HQ itself should be able to drive some of these improvements. Another factor that will drive the kind of improvements you mention is TOT from DRDO to private Indian companies. Its good that now a certain amount of CAPEX (I think 15%) is earmarked for procurement from Private Indian industries. Dependence on OFB drives half these problems.

Thing is, Army (at least under General Rawat) appears to be making conscious changes towards reducing all kinds of wastage. General Rawat will be remembered as one who carried forward the legacy of General VK Singh.

Current Chief of tri service are understanding the wind well , neither they are hurrying and create hazard , neither they are laid back , just doing the right thing .



Coming to topic , we should focus on implement what we have , we have kalvari Design , we have vikrant Design , we have visakhapatnam Design , tdv , oss Design , all these are good and need to be used as basis for various ships we want , a design in between vikrant and oss can serve as lhd , oss can be used for some basis for ngd , ngf can be deruved frim ship 20 , kamorta have enough potential to be used as a class of smaller frigate with 32 vls , can be stationed at Mauritius base and Andaman and nicobar , can be used at Gujarat , for some pork roasting , as they are small will carry lesser fuel but enough firepower can be used for shorter area like in Mauritius blocking trade , in Andaman keeping eye on chinese vessel ,

 

[Gessler]

India signs deal with Turkey’s TAIS Shipyards for five fleet support vessels
India's state-owned Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL) and TAIS, a consortium of five Turkish shipbuilders, have signed an INR160 billion (USD2.1 billion) deal to jointly design and build five 45,000-tonne fleet support vessels for the Indian Navy.


The Turkish consortium won the tender for 5 fleet support vessels for the Indian navy in May of last year. But the formal deal was signed during President Erdogan’s visit to Islamabad last month. This decision came after being put on hold for months over tensions between New Delhi and Ankara.

TAIS will carry out the modernization of the local shipyard, the design of the ships, engineering services, planning and management of production, preparation of shipbuilding material specifications and main materials.

Support Vessels are capable of acting as underway supply points or as coastal supply points where harbor installations are not available or safe enough. They provide fuel, food, ammunition and spare parts to ensure the continued operational readiness of Task Groups at all times.

In addition, they support Task Groups with their special repair facilities and feature on-board hospital for disaster relief operations. They act as Command Platforms for various types of Tasks Groups and provide navies with a tactical advantage.

The construction of the first vessel was initially scheduled to begin by the end of 2020, with the first vessel expected to be delivered to the Navy in 2024.

India signs deal with Turkey’s TAIS Shipyards for five fleet support v

India's state-owned Hindustan Shipyard Limited (HSL) and TAIS, a consortium of five Turkish shipbuilders, have signed an INR160 billion (USD2.1 billion) de

www.navyrecognition.com

Wrong.

First off, this article is from March 2020, a year later nothing has happened.

Second, "INDIA" did not sign any deal with TAIS. HSL did. In other words HSL definitively chose TAIS as it's design partner. However, this design in question has not won any order from Indian MoD as of today.

Read this for latest & proper situation: https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...essels-with-turkish-help-101614007642406.html

Navyrecognition bungled up a lot of reports.

Personally I'd think this would never happen, but won't be surprised if it does - the idiots in GoI have let much bigger gaffes take place, purely by being oblivious. And the fact that this is a f@ucking state-owned DPSU shipyard doing this just makes me want to facepalm twice.

 

[WolfPack86]

Update On LCA Tejas and TEDBF: जल्द होगा HAL Tejas तैनात Navy का First Choice TEDBF

 

[sorcerer]

Navy Pitches for 6 Nuclear Attack Submarines to Counter Challenges in Indo-Pacific Region

The Indian Navy has informed the government of its requirement to build six nuclear-powered attack submarines (SSNs) to counter challenges in the Indo-Pacific region, the new strategic frontier, which has received recognition by the Quad, European Union and the United Kingdom.

Navy Pitches for 6 Nuclear Attack Submarines to Counter Challenges in Indo-Pacific Region - News18

The submarines would provide Navy with the long legs it needs for deterrence patrols and access denial in the Indo-Pacific region.

www.news18.com

 

[Gessler]

What I consider to be a very realistic assessment of what kind of force structure the Indian Navy is aiming for in the long-run. Note that 1) new ships will be replacing old classes 2) I'm not counting any fictional boats that either do not have approval, or never quoted as existing, or too far away to consider as realistic like IAC-2 or P-28A or P-76 SSP respectively.

34 Major Surface Combatants

• 4 x Project 15B Visakhapatnam-class -- Destroyer
• 3 x Project 15A Kolkata-class -- Destroyer
• 3 x Either/or Project 15 Delhi-class SLEP or Project 18 NGD (1 to 1 replacement possible) -- Destroyer
• 7 x Project 17A Nilgiri-class -- Frigate
• 3 x Project 17 Shivalik-class -- Frigate
• 10 x Talwar/Krivak-II/Adm. Grigorovich-class -- Frigate
• 4 x Project 28 Kamorta-class -- Ocean-going Corvette

52 Minor Surface Combatants

• 7 x NGC -- Corvette
• 6 x NGMV -- Corvette
• 16 x Shallow-water ASW -- Littoral Corvette
• 11 x NGOPV -- Ocean-going OPV
• 4 x Saryu-class -- Ocean-going OPV
• 8 x NG-MCMV -- Minesweeper

2 Aircraft Carriers

• 1 x Vikramaditya -- STOBAR
• 1 x Project 71 Vikrant -- STOBAR

11 Amphibious Warfare Platforms

• 2 x MRSV -- LHD
• 8 x Mk.4 -- LCU
• 1 x Jalashwa -- LPD

13 Nuclear Submarines

• 3 x Arihant-class -- SSBN (later possible SSGN)
• 1 x S4* class -- SSBN
• 3 x S5 class -- SSBN
• 6 x Project 75A/Project 76 -- SSN

12 Diesel Submarines

• 6 x Project 75 Kalvari-class -- SSK (later SSP)
• 6 x Project 75I class -- SSP

Further notes: Not counting any support vessels like tankers, survey ships etc. Wherever possible, I've gone with the more conservative number (like 3 instead of 4 boats each of S-5 SSBN & NGD).

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

What I consider to be a very realistic assessment of what kind of force structure the Indian Navy is aiming for in the long-run. Note that 1) new ships will be replacing old classes 2) I'm not counting any fictional boats that either do not have approval, or never quoted as existing, or too far away to consider as realistic like IAC-2 or P-28A or P-76 SSP respectively.

34 Major Surface Combatants

• 4 x Project 15B Visakhapatnam-class -- Destroyer
• 3 x Project 15A Kolkata-class -- Destroyer
• 3 x Either/or Project 15 Delhi-class SLEP or Project 18 NGD (1 to 1 replacement possible) -- Destroyer
• 7 x Project 17A Nilgiri-class -- Frigate
• 3 x Project 17 Shivalik-class -- Frigate
• 10 x Talwar/Krivak-II/Adm. Grigorovich-class -- Frigate
• 4 x Project 28 Kamorta-class -- Ocean-going Corvette

52 Minor Surface Combatants

• 7 x NGC -- Corvette
• 6 x NGMV -- Corvette
• 16 x Shallow-water ASW -- Littoral Corvette
• 11 x NGOPV -- Ocean-going OPV
• 4 x Saryu-class -- Ocean-going OPV
• 8 x NG-MCMV -- Minesweeper

2 Aircraft Carriers

• 1 x Vikramaditya -- STOBAR
• 1 x Project 71 Vikrant -- STOBAR

11 Amphibious Warfare Platforms

• 2 x MRSV -- LHD
• 8 x Mk.4 -- LCU
• 1 x Jalashwa -- LPD

13 Nuclear Submarines

• 3 x Arihant-class -- SSBN (later possible SSGN)
• 1 x S4* class -- SSBN
• 3 x S5 class -- SSBN
• 6 x Project 75A/Project 76 -- SSN

12 Diesel Submarines

• 6 x Project 75 Kalvari-class -- SSK (later SSP)
• 6 x Project 75I class -- SSP

Further notes: Not counting any support vessels like tankers, survey ships etc. Wherever possible, I've gone with the more conservative number (like 3 instead of 4 boats each of S-5 SSBN & NGD).

Missed to include Magar and Shradul class LST. Jalashwa should retire soon.
This is the bottom line of what will most definitely be. There is almost certainly going to be more than this given the fact that Navy's capital expenditure is going to at least double by end of decade.

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

What I consider to be a very realistic assessment of what kind of force structure the Indian Navy is aiming for in the long-run. Note that 1) new ships will be replacing old classes 2) I'm not counting any fictional boats that either do not have approval, or never quoted as existing, or too far away to consider as realistic like IAC-2 or P-28A or P-76 SSP respectively.

34 Major Surface Combatants

• 4 x Project 15B Visakhapatnam-class -- Destroyer
• 3 x Project 15A Kolkata-class -- Destroyer
• 3 x Either/or Project 15 Delhi-class SLEP or Project 18 NGD (1 to 1 replacement possible) -- Destroyer
• 7 x Project 17A Nilgiri-class -- Frigate
• 3 x Project 17 Shivalik-class -- Frigate
• 10 x Talwar/Krivak-II/Adm. Grigorovich-class -- Frigate
• 4 x Project 28 Kamorta-class -- Ocean-going Corvette

52 Minor Surface Combatants

• 7 x NGC -- Corvette
• 6 x NGMV -- Corvette
• 16 x Shallow-water ASW -- Littoral Corvette
• 11 x NGOPV -- Ocean-going OPV
• 4 x Saryu-class -- Ocean-going OPV
• 8 x NG-MCMV -- Minesweeper

2 Aircraft Carriers

• 1 x Vikramaditya -- STOBAR
• 1 x Project 71 Vikrant -- STOBAR

11 Amphibious Warfare Platforms

• 2 x MRSV -- LHD
• 8 x Mk.4 -- LCU
• 1 x Jalashwa -- LPD

13 Nuclear Submarines

• 3 x Arihant-class -- SSBN (later possible SSGN)
• 1 x S4* class -- SSBN
• 3 x S5 class -- SSBN
• 6 x Project 75A/Project 76 -- SSN

12 Diesel Submarines

• 6 x Project 75 Kalvari-class -- SSK (later SSP)
• 6 x Project 75I class -- SSP

Further notes: Not counting any support vessels like tankers, survey ships etc. Wherever possible, I've gone with the more conservative number (like 3 instead of 4 boats each of S-5 SSBN & NGD).

Wouldn't the Next Generation Corvette(NGC) and Next Generation Missile Vessels(NGMV) be part of Major Surface combatant fleet given that both will displace apprx 2000-3000 tonnes?

 

[Gessler]

Missed to include Magar and Shradul class LST. Jalashwa should retire soon.
This is the bottom line of what will most definitely be. There is almost certainly going to be more than this given the fact that Navy's capital expenditure is going to at least double by end of decade.

Jalashwa should probably retire agree, however only 2 MRSV coming as opposed to originally intended 4 might force it to linger on for longer.

As of LSTs, with the MRSVs in play with their LCACs on the high end and the Mk4 LCUs on the low end, the LST classes may lose their relevance and retire.

 

[Gessler]

Wouldn't the Next Generation Corvette(NGC) and Next Generation Missile Vessels(NGMV) be part of Major Surface combatant fleet given that both will displace apprx 2000-3000 tonnes?

I've arbitrarily drawn the line at 3000T.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Jalashwa should probably retire agree, however only 2 MRSV coming as opposed to originally intended 4 might force it to linger on for longer.

As of LSTs, with the MRSVs in play with their LCACs on the high end and the Mk4 LCUs on the low end, the LST classes may lose their relevance and retire.

LST can still be used for logistics. Our sealift capability is limited. I don't see why we would want to retire ships before their age limit. Like you said, MRSV order has been limited to 2 ships, we can't be prematurely retiring our ships.

 

[Willy3]

Navy need more tankers, Minesweeper landing crafts and LPD "for now", these are the most neglected area in our navy.
18-24* Minesweeper
8-12 * Tankers
6/8 * LPD

I am putting this figure by end of 2035, if we can start procurement now we might reach this figure in batch orders.
if lockdowns doesn't fucked up with our economy then by 2035-40 we will have enough financial muscles to secure IOR without taking help from Sam uncle.

 

[Lonewolf]

Navy need more tankers, Minesweeper landing crafts and LPD "for now", these are the most neglected area in our navy.
18-24* Minesweeper
8-12 * Tankers
6/8 * LPD

I am putting this figure by end of 2035, if we can start procurement now we might reach this figure in batch orders.
if lockdowns doesn't fucked up with our economy then by 2035-40 we will have enough financial muscles to secure IOR without taking help from Sam uncle.

Sorry but then our biggest threat would be both sam uncle and choyna

 

[Haldilal]

Ya'll Nibbiars who will be the next CoNS?. Ravindra Jayant Nadkarni?.

 

[WolfPack86]

Rafale M lease possible Indian navy