Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

binayak95

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2011
Messages
1,337
Likes
2,622
Yes, indeed! Loved the experience!

And one thing i realized from the conversations, unlike people in this forum, these men are not defense analysts . Though they would have all the knowledge of their own platform they are serving in, their protocols, procedures, exact capabilities,etc , they have little knowledge of whats outside that.
That is true, few of my coursemates are interested in military history/tactics/developments in India! Forget the world. That interest develops only later when officers attend staff courses at Wellington. And our training is such that you get to know your role and your unit/ship thoroughly so that you can perform optimally. Thats it. Nothing more, nothing less.
 

Kranthi

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2012
Messages
152
Likes
70
Yes, indeed! Loved the experience!

And one thing i realized from the conversations, unlike people in this forum, these men are not defense analysts . Though they would have all the knowledge of their own platform they are serving in, their protocols, procedures, exact capabilities,etc , they have little knowledge of whats outside that.
Thanks for sharing the information Rohit.

That's surprising. It is expected that atleast the weapons officer and captain (of a ship of this size) must always be aware of what's outside and what they will be facing. May be they didn't want to talk much about anything other than what is on their ships..

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
 

singh100ful

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2016
Messages
102
Likes
73
Okay some facts about INS Kolkata/INS Tarkash I learnt today

1. Asked about the range of the Main MFSTAR. As the makers say its "Over 250 kms", i was expecting it to be around 300 kms. Asked 2 officers, both said its around 500 kms .
I visited there today even i was told that it was 500 kms.
when i asked about HAL Dhruv in anti submarine warfare the officer said there is very less chance of that happening.
 

Vijyes

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2016
Messages
1,978
Likes
1,719
I visited there today even i was told that it was 500 kms.
when i asked about HAL Dhruv in anti submarine warfare the officer said there is very less chance of that happening.
Does it matter whether it is 250km+ or 500km? BARAK-8 is 70km in range. Even if missile is detected at 200km, it has to wait till the missile is at 70km-90km to fire. Also, the AESA detection rangedepends on RCS of target.
 

sorcerer

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2013
Messages
24,521
Likes
86,854
Country flag
Indian Warships now being constructed using Carbon Fibre, more Stealthier

Garden Reach Shipbuilders and Engineers (GRSE), under the Ministry of Defence, which recently completed major modernisation of its infrastructure facility and has doubled its capacity, has become the first Indian shipyard to build warships using carbon fibre composite material.

An official said integrating the carbon composite superstructure with the steel hull has helped reduce the total weight of the vessel and has increased its stealth capability. The Kolkata-based shipyard has incorporated this technology in its ongoing project of third and fourth ASW (anti-submarine warfare) Corvettes being built for the Indian Navy.


Imported material

The carbon fibre material, imported from Swedish stockyard Kockumo, is reportedly lighter than stainless steel, which is traditionally used to construct warships.

The official added the composite material was used to construct the superstructure of the ship, which would ensure that the vessel is 30 per cent lighter.

In the ASW Corvette, stealth is a key ingredient, said the official, and the composite material would help make it less susceptible to detection.

In a record for a ship of her size, the third ASW Corvette has successfully completed Contractor’s sea trials in the first sea sortie itself, while the final machinery trials for the vessel have also been subsequently completed.

The company had won the contract for four anti-submarine warfare Corvettes.

The first two ASW Corvettes, INS Kamorta and INS Kadmatt, delivered by the shipyard to the Indian Navy have been generating interest across the globe.

The modernisation project at GRSE was undertaken to help the shipyard build quality ships, modern frigates and destroyers in a reduced timeframe, said the official.

It has paved the way for the shipyard to undertake construction of three advanced stealth frigates for the Indian Navy.

Recently, the last warship of the four ‘follow on’ water jet fast attack crafts (FACs) built by GRSE was commissioned into the Indian Navy.

INS Tarasa is the fourth and last of the FAC, and has been commissioned with all weapon and sensor trials completed.

The ship is armed with a 30 mm main gun that has been indigenously built, and a number of light, medium and heavy machine guns to undertake coastal defence operations.

The first two ships of the class, INS Tarmugli and INS Tihayu were commissioned in 2016 and are based at Visakhapatnam, while the third ship INS Tillanchang was commissioned earlier this year in March at Karwar.

These ships are an upgrade of the Car Nicobar class Fast Attack Crafts with the Indian Navy, which were alsoindigenously designed and built by GRSE


http://www.thehindubusinessline.com...on-fibre-to-build-warships/article9883479.ece
 

kstriya

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2015
Messages
488
Likes
506
Country flag
I visited there today even i was told that it was 500 kms.
when i asked about HAL Dhruv in anti submarine warfare the officer said there is very less chance of that happening.
Any reason given for Dhruv not fulfilling the ASW role?
 

Kalki_2018

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2017
Messages
720
Likes
1,243
Country flag
Time at station will not be enough to match Seaking. Instead of US-2 I would prefer S-70B's or IMRH if available.
 

Vijyes

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2016
Messages
1,978
Likes
1,719
Time at station will not be enough to match Seaking. Instead of US-2 I would prefer S-70B's or IMRH if available.
US-2 SHINMAYAWI is this -
images (1).jpg


This is not a helicopter and hence can't be compared to helicopters
 

Kalki_2018

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2017
Messages
720
Likes
1,243
Country flag
It is only good for SAR and not ASW. Right now ASW helicopters are necessary not US-2's.
 

Adioz

शक्तिः दुर्दम्येच्छाशक्त्याः आगच्छति
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2015
Messages
1,419
Likes
2,792
It is only good for SAR and not ASW. Right now ASW helicopters are necessary not US-2's.
:smash:
I never get this part of human behaviour. "We need ASW helicopters, so don't buy SAR aircraft."
"We don't need to buy X, better spend that money on purchasing Y."

Why?

Did we stall/sacrifice the ASW helicopters deal to sign this contract? Are these two projects not running parallel? What is your angle here?

Indian Warships now being constructed using Carbon Fibre, more Stealthier

Garden Reach Shipbuilders and Engineers (GRSE), under the Ministry of Defence, which recently completed major modernisation of its infrastructure facility and has doubled its capacity, has become the first Indian shipyard to build warships using carbon fibre composite material.

An official said integrating the carbon composite superstructure with the steel hull has helped reduce the total weight of the vessel and has increased its stealth capability. The Kolkata-based shipyard has incorporated this technology in its ongoing project of third and fourth ASW (anti-submarine warfare) Corvettes being built for the Indian Navy.


Imported material

The carbon fibre material, imported from Swedish stockyard Kockumo, is reportedly lighter than stainless steel, which is traditionally used to construct warships.

The official added the composite material was used to construct the superstructure of the ship, which would ensure that the vessel is 30 per cent lighter.

In the ASW Corvette, stealth is a key ingredient, said the official, and the composite material would help make it less susceptible to detection.

In a record for a ship of her size, the third ASW Corvette has successfully completed Contractor’s sea trials in the first sea sortie itself, while the final machinery trials for the vessel have also been subsequently completed.

The company had won the contract for four anti-submarine warfare Corvettes.

The first two ASW Corvettes, INS Kamorta and INS Kadmatt, delivered by the shipyard to the Indian Navy have been generating interest across the globe.

The modernisation project at GRSE was undertaken to help the shipyard build quality ships, modern frigates and destroyers in a reduced timeframe, said the official.

It has paved the way for the shipyard to undertake construction of three advanced stealth frigates for the Indian Navy.

Recently, the last warship of the four ‘follow on’ water jet fast attack crafts (FACs) built by GRSE was commissioned into the Indian Navy.

INS Tarasa is the fourth and last of the FAC, and has been commissioned with all weapon and sensor trials completed.

The ship is armed with a 30 mm main gun that has been indigenously built, and a number of light, medium and heavy machine guns to undertake coastal defence operations.

The first two ships of the class, INS Tarmugli and INS Tihayu were commissioned in 2016 and are based at Visakhapatnam, while the third ship INS Tillanchang was commissioned earlier this year in March at Karwar.

These ships are an upgrade of the Car Nicobar class Fast Attack Crafts with the Indian Navy, which were alsoindigenously designed and built by GRSE


http://www.thehindubusinessline.com...on-fibre-to-build-warships/article9883479.ece
Wikipedia mentions that we have a Project 28A for 8 more corvettes in the pipeline, as a follow on to Project 28 (Kamorta class). Is this confirmed? If so, then is it safe to assume these will also be made in the ASW role?
 

singh100ful

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2016
Messages
102
Likes
73
Does it matter whether it is 250km+ or 500km? BARAK-8 is 70km in range. Even if missile is detected at 200km, it has to wait till the missile is at 70km-90km to fire. Also, the AESA detection rangedepends on RCS of target.
There is also Brahmos for Surface to surface which is 290kms and the 450kms range one will be integrated with INS Kolkata
Any reason given for Dhruv not fulfilling the ASW role?
May be its load carrying capacity or some thing else
 

sum1

Regular Member
Joined
May 25, 2017
Messages
46
Likes
92
Country flag
Might be to do with acceptable noise and vibration levels in ASW role for Dhruv??
 

binayak95

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2011
Messages
1,337
Likes
2,622
:smash:
I never get this part of human behaviour. "We need ASW helicopters, so don't buy SAR aircraft."
"We don't need to buy X, better spend that money on purchasing Y."

Why?

Did we stall/sacrifice the ASW helicopters deal to sign this contract? Are these two projects not running parallel? What is your angle here?


Wikipedia mentions that we have a Project 28A for 8 more corvettes in the pipeline, as a follow on to Project 28 (Kamorta class). Is this confirmed? If so, then is it safe to assume these will also be made in the ASW role?
Completely in agreement with your reply. And who says the US2 can't be used for ASW? Sure, we'll have to modify it, but seaplanes make for the best MRASW aircraft!

Yeah, the P28A are all going to be next-gen ASW corvettes. The third and fourth Kamorta class corvettes are kind of transition ships- incorporating some of the tech to be used in the P28A (carbon fibre superstructure especially)
 

Kranthi

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2012
Messages
152
Likes
70
There is also Brahmos for Surface to surface which is 290kms and the 450kms range one will be integrated with INS Kolkata

May be its load carrying capacity or some thing else
I don't think this radar is going to be of much use for Brahmos. Brahmos's target will always be a surface target and no radar can see surface or ships at 450 kms from it, due to earth's curvature.

The 500 km range will only help identify air targets earlier.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
 

Vijyes

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2016
Messages
1,978
Likes
1,719
It is important to specify range and RCS to make sense. For example, a radar that can detect objects of RCS 1 metre square at 300km, or 5m^2 at 400km etc.

Just saying that range of radar is 500km doesn't make sense. It is not that after 500km,the waves will suddenly vanish. Waves attenuate slowly and steadily
 

kstriya

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2015
Messages
488
Likes
506
Country flag
Might be to do with acceptable noise and vibration levels in ASW role for Dhruv??
In the ALH page we have a ASW Dhruv being discussed in detail. I do not foresee any challenges in induction of the ALH in the ASW role. Now we do not have a ASW rotor platform. We might not have the best ASW Hello but it’s better to have one with limited or lesser capabilities then not having one. We have ships without ASW helps which leave them very vulnerable. Instead we can have two ALH on a ship if space permits and might be at the cost of one imported ASW helo. ALH cannot carry heavy torpedos but light torpedo
 

NeXoft007

Senior Member
Joined
May 10, 2017
Messages
1,346
Likes
10,292
Country flag
This submarine model design doesn't matches with existing Indian submarines nor foreign ones (maybe I missed some other foreign SSKs?). The closest to resemble this model is Saab A26 but the location of fins at forward section of the hull instead at conning tower of A26's suggests its a new design pointing to India's ambitious indigenous conventional submarine Project 76 SSK.
IMG_20171005_124720.jpg
 

Adioz

शक्तिः दुर्दम्येच्छाशक्त्याः आगच्छति
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2015
Messages
1,419
Likes
2,792
This submarine model design doesn't matches with existing Indian submarines nor foreign ones (maybe I missed some other foreign SSKs?). The closest to resemble this model is Saab A26 but the location of fins at forward section of the hull instead at conning tower of A26's suggests its a new design pointing to India's ambitious indigenous conventional submarine Project 76 SSK.
View attachment 20650
Project 76 SSK? Do you mean Project 75I?
Looks like a Trafalgar class submarine. Where was the pic taken?
 

Vijyes

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2016
Messages
1,978
Likes
1,719
Project 76 SSK? Do you mean Project 75I?
Looks like a Trafalgar class submarine. Where was the pic taken?
Not scorpene but attack submarines, maybe nuclear ssk. India doesn't have nuclear SSK till now. Maybe it is time to make them
 

Adioz

शक्तिः दुर्दम्येच्छाशक्त्याः आगच्छति
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2015
Messages
1,419
Likes
2,792
Not scorpene but attack submarines, maybe nuclear ssk. India doesn't have nuclear SSK till now. Maybe it is time to make them
Nobody in the world has a nuclear SSK. :wink:
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top