Indian Army: News and Discussion

[bhramos]

Khasi, Jaintia, Garo army companies in offing - The Times of India

 

[pmaitra]

GRRC to have new scouts - The Times of India

On this historic moment, the VCOAS, who is also the 'President of the Gorkha Brigade' unveiled the flag and handed it over to Colonel Samar Singh Pundir, first commanding officer of the battalion. The battalion will be permanently located in the high altitude and rugged terrain of Sikkim. This battalion is raised on the concept of 'Sons of Soils' to guard the nation's frontiers. Based on this concept, the Indian Army already has Ladakh Scouts, Dogra Scouts, Garhwal Scouts, Kumaon Scouts & the Arunachal Scouts.


The raising ceremony was followed by a talk by the VCOAS to the 319 recruits & the core group, which has assembled to train the new entrants. It is after nearly 50 years that a new battalion has been raised as part of the Gorkha Brigade. The VCOAS exhorted all present to work hard and lay a solid foundation. He said that other troops will stay for 2-3 years in these altitudes and then withdraw, but the Scouts will be permanently there. tnn

He also said that the men have been selected since they are locals, they understand the language and are fully acclimatised. He remarked that a new beginning has been made & the Sikkim Scouts must live up to the reputation of the fabled Scouts of Indian Army.

Khasi, Jaintia, Garo army companies in offing - The Times of India

SHILLONG: The Indian Army will soon raise Khasi, Jaintia and Garo companies, in keeping with the concept of the Home and Hearth Territorial Army (TA) battalion, to recruit, train and employ youth from specified geographical areas to combat insurgents.

Meghalaya will be the fourth state in the northeast after Nagaland, Manipur and Assam to have such battalions. The exercise is also aimed at weaning away these youths from indulging in unlawful activities by gainfully employing them and making them "disciplined citizens".

The decision of the defence ministry to raise the companies comes in the wake of chief minister Mukul Sangma writing to Union defence minister A K Antony about the "chronic problem of militancy and insurgency which poses a serious threat to national security and integrity."

Very good news.

This is what is needed in the Naxal hit areas as well. One battalion comes to around 880 - 1000 troops. If we can raise 4 such battalions from WB, Jharkhand, Orissa, and Chhatisgarh, we will have added 3520 - 4000 more troops to the IA. Keep people busy, so that they are productive, instead of becoming criminals and joining insurgent groups.

 

[Simple_Guy]

@pmaitra

But sir, Scouts come under a parent regiment. Dogra Scouts with Dogra Regiment and so on.

Yeah but Territorial Army (TA) battalions from Naxal hit areas should be interesting.

 

[pmaitra]

@pmaitra

But sir, Scouts come under a parent regiment. Dogra Scouts with Dogra Regiment and so on.

Yeah but Territorial Army (TA) battalions from Naxal hit areas should be interesting.

Yes, you are right, typically these Scouts have their parent regiment.

Regarding battalions form Naxal hit areas, they could be placed under any regiment. If you take geographical proximity, then those recruited from WB and Jharkhand would come under Gurkha Regiment, while those form Chhatisgarh, or Andhra Pradesh would come under Madras Regiment.

 

[Bhadra]

Very good news.

This is what is needed in the Naxal hit areas as well. One battalion comes to around 880 - 1000 troops. If we can raise 4 such battalions from WB, Jharkhand, Orissa, and Chhatisgarh, we will have added 3520 - 4000 more troops to the IA. Keep people busy, so that they are productive, instead of becoming criminals and joining insurgent groups.

This mandate was given to CRPF and other CPOs who have raised more than 220 battalions for this purpose.

Why should Army undertake regional and local tasks except for border areas ?

So far Meghalaya etc is concerned the report talks about raising of TA Companies meant for operational tasks and not CI tasks.

As per the mandate of GoM following Kargil Committee report, Internal Security is the task of Police and they have been provided all resources and funds for that over last15 years.

Leave the Army for borders..

 

[Bhadra]

@pmaitra

But sir, Scouts come under a parent regiment. Dogra Scouts with Dogra Regiment and so on.

Yeah but Territorial Army (TA) battalions from Naxal hit areas should be interesting.

I do not think any TA battalion would be deployed against Naxals.... Flat No from Saint Antony !!

 

[pmaitra]

This mandate was given to CRPF and other CPOs who have raised more than 220 battalions for this purpose.

Why should Army undertake regional and local tasks except for border areas ?

So far Meghalaya etc is concerned the report talks about raising of TA Companies meant for operational tasks and not CI tasks.

As per the mandate of GoM following Kargil Committee report, Internal Security is the task of Police and they have been provided all resources and funds for that over last15 years.

Leave the Army for borders..

For the bureaucratic details you have provided, I agree.

You are not able to understand why I made such a suggestion. Keep raising battalions, give them commando training, let them fight insurgents, and keep them under the Home Ministry. When war breaks out, transfer them to Defense Ministry. These battle hardened troops will be our asset.

220 battalions is a pretty damn good number.

 

[Simple_Guy]

I do not think any TA battalion would be deployed against Naxals.... Flat No from Saint Antony !!

TA units will mean employment opportunities.

 

[Bhadra]

TA units will mean employment opportunities.

No sir,

TA battalions have operational tasks and there are plenty of operational tasks in the NE.

Employment forces are CPOs...

 

[Bhadra]

For the bureaucratic details you have provided, I agree.

You are not able to understand why I made such a suggestion. Keep raising battalions, give them commando training, let them fight insurgents, and keep them under the Home Ministry. When war breaks out, transfer them to Defense Ministry. These battle hardened troops will be our asset.

220 battalions is a pretty damn good number.

I agree with you.

It is better achieved by militarization of the CPOs. The Army jawans after five to ten years service should be transferred to CPOs and CPOs should by officered by the Army and you have 300 battalions of well trained Para Military Force available to swarm into Tibet or take over defenses and allow three hundred battalions of Indian Army swarm in Tibet.

That is the way out but this reduce police (specially IPS) empire and hence would not occur even in national interest .

The requirement is not of quantity but of quality. Otherwise Naxals will hack 75 of them at one time ... in one go ..

The only way to improve quality of CRPF is to undertake its semi militarization.

 

[Bhadra]

Army bashing: A new found journalistic ethic?

Published June 6, 2013 | By admin
SOURCE: Brigadier (retd) V Mahalingam/ TNN

Army bashing: A new found journalistic ethic? | idrw.org


A national newspaper came out with a scoop insinuating that a routine troop movement around Delhi was an Army coup in the making. A top secret letter addressed to the Prime Minister by General VK Singh, the then Army Chief was leaked to the press and attempts were made to implicate the Chief himself for the leak. The Intelligence Bureau (IB) who was ordered to investigate the matter has gone silent as if they had lost all their investigative skills!! The sanctity attached to a classified privileged communication from the Army Chief to the Prime Minister relating to national security was thus thrown to the winds.

Another newspaper came up with a front page story captioned "Generals home in on capital prime plot" Are the defence services officers meant to be thrown into a remote areas only throughout their life? Not long ago (1970s) the Cantonment area referred to in article was a remote area. Is it their fault if the area flourishes to become a posh area? Beyond the Daula Kuan circle (A roundabout existed then) an auto rickshaw would demand 50 rupees extra as it would be difficult for him to find return passenger.

If one had hoped that our newspaper czars would have learnt from these experiences, it was a mistaken optimism. The pity is, everyone involved in these outrageous exclusives got away without any reproof!

A leading newspaper has come up with yet another dubious report harming the reputation of an individual officer. An article titled "Senior Army general shunted after charges of irregularity", smacks of disgraceful mudslinging against a senior officer of the Indian Army without presenting any valid substance. Take a look at it and the motive would be more than evident. The report could have been planted for some extraneous considerations or mischievous intents but it has cast a doubt on the credibility and the journalistic ethics followed by one of the leading newspapers of the country.
The officer concerned is Lt Gen JP Nehra and not Lt Gen JP Mehra as reported. Obviously the reporter did not even consider it necessary to check on the correct name of the officer leave alone the facts. The editor concerned could have verified the facts but he too failed to discharge his responsibility. What was the tearing hurry for publishing the story without proper verification? Is this the way newspapers are expected to function?

The theory that the Adjutant General (AG) was transferred "abruptly" is absurd. Today in the Indian Army, even Corps Commanders who are commanders of field formations are transferred in about a year. AG is merely a staff appointment and therefore transferring the incumbent in less than a year and a half is nothing abnormal. Lt Gen Nehra was appointed AG, a Principle Staff Officer (PSO) by General VK Singh. It is possible that the present incumbent wishes to have an officer of his choice in his place. As the Chief, he is well within his right to seek a change.

The newspaper alleges that a Ministry of Defence (MOD) source has said that the "ministry top brass was briefed by the Army leadership about the alleged irregularities and sought its approval for moving him out". Since the case pertains to the AG, a PSO and a very senior officer, if at all any military leadership had briefed the ministry top brass, it cannot be anyone but the Chief. "Moving out" for committing irregularities? Guess where the officer was moved out – right within the same headquarters as the Deputy Chief of the Army Staff (DCOAS), an appointment which deals with important issues connected with operations. The punishment is as mystifying as the allegation itself.

The report claims serious allegations of "misappropriations in the Army Welfare Housing Organisation (AWHO), Ex – Servicemen Contributory Health Scheme (ECHS) etc". The author has not clarified what that "etc." meant. The report goes on further to state that "internal enquiries have found serious problems with the way the schemes were implemented and have indicated the possibility of massive irregularities". What exactly is the reporter meaning? Is he suggesting shortcomings in implementation of the schemes or is he talking about "massive irregularities"?

The reporter probably is unaware that AWHO and ECHS have a serving senior officer each as the head and are designated as Managing Directors (MD). The responsibility to run these organisations rests squarely on the MDs and not the AG. So if the so called internal inquiries found flaws in implementation, details of which the author has not specified, the blame for faulty implementation will fall unequivocally on the MDs.

The author has brought about yet another angle to his story by alleging that the AWHO projects have been "delayed around the country and in many cases serious misappropriation allegations have surfaced." Yes, AWHO has a number of Projects running simultaneously throughout the country under different Project Directors. It is possible that there are some delays, shortcomings or corruption cases in some of the projects. If it is so, would the culpability fall on the Project Director, the MD who is the final implementing authority, the DG Welfare under whom the AWHO works or the AG who oversees AWHO's work? It is here that the intention behind the story stands exposed.

The author ought to have known that all decisions pertaining to AWHO are taken by an Executive Committee consisting of the AG as the Chairman, with the Quartermaster General, and the Engineer in Chief both PSOs as members. These decisions are ratified by a Board of Governors consisting of Major Generals in Charge of Administration of all the Commands.

In the case of ECHS, the allegation is that "implementation of the scheme was marked by serious questions of propriety" What it means or implies is anybody's guess. It may be relevant to mention here that funds for ECHS and the financial sanctions are accorded by the Ministry of Defence (MOD) and the organisation is run by its MD. How is the AG involved in irregularities?

The reporter has meandered around using expressions such as implementation shortcomings, massive irregularities, delays and propriety without being specific. If indeed something was seriously wrong, why was he evasive? Obviously, he was either not sure of the facts or the aim was to essentially discredit the officer. The authenticity, credibility and the motive behind the story are therefore suspect and questionable. The point is, a national newspaper cannot make allegations based on rumors and hearsays, breech all journalistic norms and propriety to discredit an individual and go scot free.

The story further suggests that the Army's effort to play down the allegations reflect the eagerness of Army Chief not to attract unwanted and negative attention to his service after the tumultuous tenure of his predecessor Gen VK Singh. He further goes on to allude that the Chief is quietly trying to clean up various wings of the Army. Army Chiefs are not pussies. They have the mandate and the authority to be forthright and clean up things if there is a need. If the current Chief is in any way different, I am not aware of it.

The author and the newspaper perhaps are not aware or sensitive to the damage that they have done to the Army in the process. Just imagine the effect it will have on the troops and how it will affect officer man relationship. The Indian Army needs no enemy or traitors from across the borders!!

The Defence Minister and the Chief are the only two individuals who are privy to the reasons for the move of the General Officer from the post of AG to DCOAS. Whatever be the reason, to avoid damage to the institution one of them will have to come out and clarify the matter without any delay.

 

[mayankkrishna]

Re: Indian Army Artillery

India developing robotic soldiers to replace humans in warfare - Indian Express

 

[bhramos]

Indian Army helps in rescue of 12 students from Congo rebels | Business Standard

 

[TrueSpirit]

Army bashing: A new found journalistic ethic?

I see that this report is being regularly published in prominent newspapers. It is not implausible that the allegations might have elements of truth to them.

Such allegations in the past have always been validated so lets take a respite before we embark on a mindless journo-bashing spree & questioning media ethics.

Anyway, "innocent until proven" should be applied to both parties (IA officer as well as media) right ?

 

[Sridhar]

Army's top secret letter leaks, six indicted
Army's top secret letter leaks, six indicted - The New Indian Express

 

[AVERAGE INDIAN]

Ammunition bursts in T-72 tanks barrels cause concern for Army

India's T-72 tanks are facing problems with its ammunition as it sometimes bursts in the barrel and 200 such cases have been reported making the Army wonder whether its troops will be "afraid" to fire even after seeing the enemy.

"It (the T-72 ammunition) used to burst in the barrel. If it bursts in the barrel, then the firer is afraid to fire his own gun, which is not a correct thing. If he is afraid to fire his own gun, then even if he sees the enemy he will not fire," the Army has told a Parliamentary Standing Committee on Defence.

The Army informed the Government and the Parliamentary Committee that over a period of time, there have been 200 such accidents involving the ammunition and "it brings down the confidence of the firer, especially, with regard to tank ammunition."

In terms of the numbers, the T-72 tanks are the backbone of the Indian armoured fleet and have undergone several upgrades since their induction to be able to fight effectively in the battlefield.

The Army is also "concerned" over the ammunition used by its artillery called Krashnapov, which has been imported from Russia, and has failed to hit targets in high altitude ranges such as Kargil.

"They were supposed to meet certain height and temperature requirement, and they said that it is not meant for such high altitude areas. Now, this ammunition has been shifted in the plain areas because it was not working there satisfactorily," it said.

The Army said several meetings have been held with the vendors to resolve the issue but progress in this direction has been relatively slow.

Last year, former Army Chief Gen V K Singh had written a letter to the Prime Minister explaining to him the shortages of tank ammunition being faced by the force.

Ammunition bursts in T-72 tanks barrels cause concern for Army | Business Standard

 

[Himanshu Pandey]

Re: Army's Ghatak infantry platoons to go more deadly

we are having 280000 soldiers in 350 battalion in a force of 1 million.... can somebody help me to understand this.. and how many we have in armored ones.

 

[Dinesh_Kumar]

Re: Army's Ghatak infantry platoons to go more deadly

No their eqpt is not as good i agree with you.

But role they play is same - as DA /Raid/Shock troops.

So they should be given comparable equipment - like 7.62mm SAW Machine guns, Flamethrowers, All Terrain Attack Vehicles,etc.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Re: Army's Ghatak infantry platoons to go more deadly

So they should be given comparable equipment - like 7.62mm SAW Machine guns, Flamethrowers, All Terrain Attack Vehicles,etc.

Just my 2 cents.

There is a discussion of them here:

Flamethrowers - still a viable option? - Defense Technology & Military Forum

 

[Neil]

Top Army commanders shifted

On Monday, more than half the Indian Army's top commanders were shifted around in what many top generals and analysts consider a motivated and unnecessary reshuffle. The crucial Northern, Western and Central Commands now have new commanders, as do the Integrated Defence Staff and the army's training command.

Officers at army headquarters say the Army Chief, General Bikram Singh, has personally initiated this reshuffle to push through a promotion policy in which quotas, not merit, would govern the selection of brigadiers and generals.

The Indian Army, like professional Western armies, has traditionally selected its senior officers based on their career records alone. Until recently, that is, when vacancies in the rank of Brigadier started being distributed between arms (infantry, artillery, armoured corps, etc.) on a "pro rata" basis, i.e. in proportion to the number of officers in each arm. Now, Gen Singh wants to extend this to the next rank, i.e. Major General.

Officers who want meritocracy at senior ranks call this "Mandalisation" of a professional army. The official term for it is "pro rata" promotion.

Senior most amongst those shifted out is a resolute opponent of "pro rata", former Central Army Commander, Lt Gen Anil Chait. At the Army Commanders' Conference, the army's only consultative check on the chief's otherwise arbitrary power, Chait had pushed for the rollback of "pro rata" for brigadier vacancies, and blocked its extension to Major General rank. But Chait had been sidelined with his posting as chief of the Integrated Defence Staff (CISC). He is no longer an army commander.

The "pro rata" policy has been propagated by an unbroken series of army chiefs from the infantry and artillery, which most benefit from "pro rata" -Gen N C Vij (infantry); Gen S Padmanabhan (artillery); Gen J J Singh (infantry); Gen Deepak Kapoor (artillery); Gen V K Singh (infantry); and Gen Bikram Singh (infantry).

The infantry has the largest number of officers, and already benefits from "pro rata": a corresponding number become Brigadiers, regardless of merit. Extending "pro-rata" to

Major General rank would extend reservations up the promotion ladder. Benefiting similarly is the artillery, the second-largest arm.

The big loser is the armoured corps - the army's key strike arm - that has traditionally produced more Brigadiers and Generals than its small officer strength might suggest. Another loser would be the mechanised infantry, whose high-calibre Brigadiers would be denied promotion because of its small quota of major general vacancies.

Replacing Chait in Lucknow is the newly promoted Lt Gen Rajan Bakshi, who was in command of the Leh-based 14 Corps, where he successfully handled the recent Chinese intrusion in Daulat Beg Oldi. Bakshi, an armoured corps officer, was well placed to take over command of the Udhampur-based Northern Army, on Lt Gen K T Parnaik's retirement on Sunday. But that would have meant two armoured corps army commanders - Chait and Bakshi - would have opposed "pro rata". Replacing Chait with Bakshi, and posting Chait as CISC, has defanged that opposition.

Apparently, Singh cited Bakshi's armoured corps background to block him from commanding the Northern Army, involved primarily in infantry operations. This, after Bakshi successfully commanded the infantry-predominant 14 Corps, including handling the Daulat Beg Oldi intrusion.

The army said it was not considering the extension of "pro rata" to Major General rank. It said Lt Gen Anil Chait's posting as CISC "has been in the organisational interest."

During his eventful last days in Lucknow, Chait had earned plaudits for his handling of the recent Uttarakhand natural disaster. But Ministry of Defence officials said the army chief had told Defence Minister Antony that Chait was close to Mulayam Singh Yadav and, therefore, must be shifted from Lucknow.

Farsighted infantry and artillery generals like former Northern Army Commander, Lt Gen (Retd) Rostum Nanavatty, believed that "pro rata" would drag the army into mediocrity. "I opposed this proposal at every forum. How are we going to get the best commanders if we are allocating quotas at the highest rank? Every step we take in this direction will be a mistake," said Nanavatty.

To command the Northern Army, another well-settled Army Commander, Lt Gen Sanjiv Chhachra, who has commanded the Western Army for almost a year, has been shifted to Udhampur. Chhachra is an infantryman, as are the Eastern Army Commander, Lt Gen Dalbir Singh; and Lt Gen Gyan Bhushan, who heads the South-western Command.

Even after sidelining Chait, the "pro rata" policy might still encounter resistance if army commanders from the mechanised infantry dig in their heels. These are Lt Gen Philip Campose, who has taken over the Western Army at Chandimandir; Lt Gen Sanjiv Madhok at the Army Training Command at Shimla; and Lt Gen Ashok Singh, who heads the Southern Army in Pune.

The MoD has the final word on changes to promotion policy. However, it has not questioned or blocked the "pro rata" policy at Brigadier rank.


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