Indian Army: News and Discussion

WolfPack86

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(EXCLUSIVE) Defence Acquisition Council meeting to focus on indigenous contents
India’s atmanirbharata efforts take off during tomorrow's Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) meeting with virtually all major deals having indigenous content. Even deals to be placed before the DAC headed by Defence Minister Rajnath Singh and including the three chiefs, that had some foreign content have been tailored to be as indigenous as possible.

New Delhi:
India’s atmanirbharata efforts take off during tomorrow's Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) meeting with virtually all major deals having indigenous content. Even deals to be placed before the DAC headed by Defence Minister Rajnath Singh and including the three chiefs, that had some foreign content have been tailored to be as indigenous as possible.


* The Successor AD or Air Defence Gun for the Army is one such example. Initially, about 25 guns were to have been imported and the rest, made here. Now, all 220 guns will be made here as will the 150,000 rounds of ammunition. This is a Rs 6,000 crore project. Once the project is cleared, there will be trials and then the acceptable candidates will be asked for quotations.


* The T-72 Bridge Laying Tank is also a local order as they are made indigenously. These 45-50 BLTs will cost about Rs 550-600 crore.


*The Army's requirement of 105 wheeled armoured fighting vehicles to go with the tanks is being looked at. They are wheeled (and not tracked) and therefore, will be effective not in the desert, but in the plains of Punjab, or the plateaus of Ladakh and Sikkim. Armed with an anti-tank guided missile, the 105 vehicles are likely to cost about Rs 3,500 crore.


* For the Army and also, the Navy and Indian Air Force, there are 1868 Rough Terrain Forklift vehicles. This is indigenous and is currently a Rs 900 crore project.

* It is not certain whether the purchase of 12 Swati Weapon. Locating Radars for the Army, to replace the aging American ANTPQs will come up at the DAC. As it's made in India and is a repeat order, it should be cleared either tomorrow or in the near future.
 

rkhanna

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imagine buying your enemies hardware,brings that mrfa j 17 joke to a new level
IMO everyone is reading too much into it. Checks and balances can be put on all equipment bought (irrespective of origin). Currently Chinese components make up nearly 50+% of US Mil eauipy. Yes the risk of Trojan horse obviously exists but if the Army thinks it can be managed then it can be I guess.

The BIGGER question is why would the Army go for Chinese kit when Indian Kit was available? Why did the goi allow ? Is the Indian Kit that inferior that we rather risk Chinese kit ?
 

WolfPack86

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Indian Army to be strengthened, modern weapons to be procured at a cost of Rs 76,390 crore, DAC approves
The proposals were approved by the Defense Acquisition Council (DAC), chaired by Defense Minister Rajnath Singh, the ministry said in a statement. This decision of the Ministry of Defense will further strengthen the ‘Atmanirbhar Bharat’ campaign.
An important step was taken by the Ministry of Defense (Defense Ministry) On Monday, it approved the purchase of military equipment and other equipment worth Rs 76,390 crore from local industries. The ministry said in a statement that the defense minister Rajnath SinghOf (Rajnath Singh) Chaired Defense Acquisition Council (DAC) It approved the proposals.

Let me tell you that this decision of the Ministry of Defense will further strengthen the ‘Self-Reliant India’ campaign and strengthen the strategic strength of our country. The acquisition of modern weapons will make the Indian Army stronger.

For the Indian Navy, the DAC is about Rs. Next generation Corvettes at an estimated cost of Rs 36,000 crore (NGCs) Has approved the purchase of, the ministry said. The Corvette is a kind of small ship. According to the ministry, these NGCs will be useful for a variety of roles, including surveillance and attacks. The NGC will be built on the Indian Navy’s new ‘in-house design’ and will use state-of-the-art shipbuilding technology, the statement said.

Indigenization will be encouraged

The DAC also approved Hindustan Aeronautics Limited’s proposal to build Dornier aircraft and Su-30MKI aero-engines to promote indigenization. DAC (Defense Acquisition Council) It has given new approval to the Indian Army for procurement of Tough Area Friendly Trucks (RTFLT), Special Tank (BLT) etc. along with Anti-Tank Guided Missiles (ATGM) and other weapons from local sources.

The country is moving towards becoming a ‘self-reliant India’
The country is constantly moving towards becoming a ‘self-reliant India’. India is at the forefront of purchasing sophisticated weapons. Last week, the Ministry of Defense signed an agreement with Bharat Dynamics Limited (BDL) for the purchase of Air-to-Air Astra Mk-I missiles and related equipment. 2,971 crore.


The ministry said missiles were being procured for the Indian Air Force (IAF) and the Indian Navy. The Astra Mk-I BVR AAM has been indigenously designed and developed by the Defense Research and Development Organization (DRDO) to meet the needs of the Indian Air Force.
 

Waanar

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IMO everyone is reading too much into it. Checks and balances can be put on all equipment bought (irrespective of origin). Currently Chinese components make up nearly 50+% of US Mil eauipy. Yes the risk of Trojan horse obviously exists but if the Army thinks it can be managed then it can be I guess.

The BIGGER question is why would the Army go for Chinese kit when Indian Kit was available? Why did the goi allow ? Is the Indian Kit that inferior that we rather risk Chinese kit ?
They're probably guinea pig pieces to test countermeasures on.
 

rkhanna

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On the dumbassry of Tour of Duty:

Please read

1) https://m.tribuneindia.com/news/comment/tour-of-duty-plan-loaded-against-the-soldier-401594

2)
r 2022

@rathorekaran17:

#Tourofduty
A thread on bringing in #Tourofduty concept into the armed forces without doing a deep dive into the possible ramifications and without tying up all loose ends .

Background
1. Prior to independence in the British Indian Army colour service gor a sepoy was 7 years.

Following which the sepoys were released from the army with a reserve liability. The British had an informal system that worked, wherein the centre commandant or CO would write to the Distt admin or concerned State for re employment of the retiring soldier and it was honoured.

So this informal system ensured all retiring pers desirous of getting a job got one. The British ensured that.
2. Post independence, govts coming to power kept increasing the colour service. It was a demand from the rank and file, and had deep political connotations.

Finally it came to be that the govt ordained all ranks will serve above 15 years and hence were all pensionable. The pension bill incr considerably. The pendulum had swung the other way. Now the Govt was pressing the armed forces to reduce pension bill.

3. There are various factors at work in this imbroglio. First the pressing need to keep the armed forces young. This is in steep contrast with all other govt jobs or CAPFs and police jobs where pers serve upto 60 years across the board.

Secondly was the pressing need to resettle the retiring service pers who on account of different terms of service are retired at a young age starting at 35 years. As stated earlier the British had a functional informal system to do so.

Post independence, the govt seized of the problem directed reservation of 12.5 and 15 percent in all govt jobs, incl police and CAPF to resettle ESM.
As is typical of this nation, there is a yawning gap between theory and practice.

The present rate of absorption of ESM in Govt jobs at the centre and states incl the police and CAPFs varies between 0.2 to 2 percent. Surprisingly even police and CAPFs don't want ESM. And the few that they induct, are inducted at the bottom of the rung

with no cognisance given to the experience, training and competence of the ESM. The ESM find it extremely humiliating. In fact in most states the ESM joining the police are made to undergo the recruit training along with new recruits all over again, Ditto for CAPFs.

We really seem to have bid goodbye to our good sense. These decisions are being taken by officers of these forces. Of course @adgpi maintains a stand offish attitude and has failed to intervene at the appropriate levels.

So as things stand today, there is formidable angst in the ESM for the step motherly treatment being handed out after demobbing them at young age of 35-40 years, whereas all others serve till 60; and even more importantly failing to ensure the 12.5 and 15 percentage job

Reservation commitment is fulfilled wherein the could serve again with dignity and assurance covered by well drafted rules .
In context of the #Tourofduty now being contemplated this will aggravate an already adverse situation with very serious consequences for the nation.

So we would be well served to carry out an in depth analysis before jumping ship, and by letting the tail wag the dog, wherein to fulfill the demand to reduce pensions, we tinker with fundamentals of the services and also create conditions which have possible disastrous effects.

To amplify.
The #Touroffuty pers will be released after3/5/7 years of service with no assurance ( except on paper) of re employment or reabsorbtion in Govt service. So we will have hundreds of thousands of youth, thrown out of service at age below 30 with no future in sight

Lack of suitable absorption will lead to intense frustration towards the society and govt for having neglected them. These are all trained soldiers. It will have deep repercussions on the stability and peace of the society, simply stated.
It will have a cascading effect.

The angst in #Tourofduty pers will find reflection in the serving pers of the army. It will have serious repercussions. Hopefully @adgpi will examine it in depth and NOT come under pressure of the govt/bureaucratic establishment who don't have to handle the baby.

So what's the way out. Well the following is suggested.
1. Ensure such terms of service that those pers desirous of serving on, are assured emp in CAPFs/ police/ govt jobs with protected service and pay.

Lobbies that have thwarted this sound concept thus far must be ruthlessly dealt with.
2.We must close the loop. You can't enroll a young man in the Services at 18 years and at 22-27 years age tell him to fend for himself. Throw him to the wolves. Repercussions will be serious.

https://twitter.com/rathorekaran17/stat ... BPddw&s=19

Cross posting from BR courterhs Anoop

3. A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent. There are no regimental or training facilities (space, equipment, manpower) available to handle these training needs. This does not even take into account the deployment state in COIN.

3b A largely conscript core severely compromises operational efficiency, as seen in the Russian side. The Ukranian side is fighting for dear life and the country is devastated as they trade space for time. This approach is not acceptable in the Indian doctrine.
- Manpower rationalization can be achieved to some extent by outsourcing civil jobs like housing construction, cantonment upkeep etc on contract basis and reducing the permanent civilian cadre employed, like MES.



Supposedly the Army hates this idea but it's being rammed down their throats
 

Marliii

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On the dumbassry of Tour of Duty:

Please read

1) https://m.tribuneindia.com/news/comment/tour-of-duty-plan-loaded-against-the-soldier-401594

2)
r 2022

@rathorekaran17:

#Tourofduty
A thread on bringing in #Tourofduty concept into the armed forces without doing a deep dive into the possible ramifications and without tying up all loose ends .

Background
1. Prior to independence in the British Indian Army colour service gor a sepoy was 7 years.

Following which the sepoys were released from the army with a reserve liability. The British had an informal system that worked, wherein the centre commandant or CO would write to the Distt admin or concerned State for re employment of the retiring soldier and it was honoured.

So this informal system ensured all retiring pers desirous of getting a job got one. The British ensured that.
2. Post independence, govts coming to power kept increasing the colour service. It was a demand from the rank and file, and had deep political connotations.

Finally it came to be that the govt ordained all ranks will serve above 15 years and hence were all pensionable. The pension bill incr considerably. The pendulum had swung the other way. Now the Govt was pressing the armed forces to reduce pension bill.

3. There are various factors at work in this imbroglio. First the pressing need to keep the armed forces young. This is in steep contrast with all other govt jobs or CAPFs and police jobs where pers serve upto 60 years across the board.

Secondly was the pressing need to resettle the retiring service pers who on account of different terms of service are retired at a young age starting at 35 years. As stated earlier the British had a functional informal system to do so.

Post independence, the govt seized of the problem directed reservation of 12.5 and 15 percent in all govt jobs, incl police and CAPF to resettle ESM.
As is typical of this nation, there is a yawning gap between theory and practice.

The present rate of absorption of ESM in Govt jobs at the centre and states incl the police and CAPFs varies between 0.2 to 2 percent. Surprisingly even police and CAPFs don't want ESM. And the few that they induct, are inducted at the bottom of the rung

with no cognisance given to the experience, training and competence of the ESM. The ESM find it extremely humiliating. In fact in most states the ESM joining the police are made to undergo the recruit training along with new recruits all over again, Ditto for CAPFs.

We really seem to have bid goodbye to our good sense. These decisions are being taken by officers of these forces. Of course @adgpi maintains a stand offish attitude and has failed to intervene at the appropriate levels.

So as things stand today, there is formidable angst in the ESM for the step motherly treatment being handed out after demobbing them at young age of 35-40 years, whereas all others serve till 60; and even more importantly failing to ensure the 12.5 and 15 percentage job

Reservation commitment is fulfilled wherein the could serve again with dignity and assurance covered by well drafted rules .
In context of the #Tourofduty now being contemplated this will aggravate an already adverse situation with very serious consequences for the nation.

So we would be well served to carry out an in depth analysis before jumping ship, and by letting the tail wag the dog, wherein to fulfill the demand to reduce pensions, we tinker with fundamentals of the services and also create conditions which have possible disastrous effects.

To amplify.
The #Touroffuty pers will be released after3/5/7 years of service with no assurance ( except on paper) of re employment or reabsorbtion in Govt service. So we will have hundreds of thousands of youth, thrown out of service at age below 30 with no future in sight

Lack of suitable absorption will lead to intense frustration towards the society and govt for having neglected them. These are all trained soldiers. It will have deep repercussions on the stability and peace of the society, simply stated.
It will have a cascading effect.

The angst in #Tourofduty pers will find reflection in the serving pers of the army. It will have serious repercussions. Hopefully @adgpi will examine it in depth and NOT come under pressure of the govt/bureaucratic establishment who don't have to handle the baby.

So what's the way out. Well the following is suggested.
1. Ensure such terms of service that those pers desirous of serving on, are assured emp in CAPFs/ police/ govt jobs with protected service and pay.

Lobbies that have thwarted this sound concept thus far must be ruthlessly dealt with.
2.We must close the loop. You can't enroll a young man in the Services at 18 years and at 22-27 years age tell him to fend for himself. Throw him to the wolves. Repercussions will be serious.

https://twitter.com/rathorekaran17/stat ... BPddw&s=19

Cross posting from BR courterhs Anoop

3. A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent. There are no regimental or training facilities (space, equipment, manpower) available to handle these training needs. This does not even take into account the deployment state in COIN.

3b A largely conscript core severely compromises operational efficiency, as seen in the Russian side. The Ukranian side is fighting for dear life and the country is devastated as they trade space for time. This approach is not acceptable in the Indian doctrine.
- Manpower rationalization can be achieved to some extent by outsourcing civil jobs like housing construction, cantonment upkeep etc on contract basis and reducing the permanent civilian cadre employed, like MES.



Supposedly the Army hates this idea but it's being rammed down their throats
Calling tour of duty "conscripts" doesn't make sense
 

ezsasa

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On the dumbassry of Tour of Duty:

Please read

1) https://m.tribuneindia.com/news/comment/tour-of-duty-plan-loaded-against-the-soldier-401594

2)
r 2022

@rathorekaran17:

#Tourofduty
A thread on bringing in #Tourofduty concept into the armed forces without doing a deep dive into the possible ramifications and without tying up all loose ends .

Background
1. Prior to independence in the British Indian Army colour service gor a sepoy was 7 years.

Following which the sepoys were released from the army with a reserve liability. The British had an informal system that worked, wherein the centre commandant or CO would write to the Distt admin or concerned State for re employment of the retiring soldier and it was honoured.

So this informal system ensured all retiring pers desirous of getting a job got one. The British ensured that.
2. Post independence, govts coming to power kept increasing the colour service. It was a demand from the rank and file, and had deep political connotations.

Finally it came to be that the govt ordained all ranks will serve above 15 years and hence were all pensionable. The pension bill incr considerably. The pendulum had swung the other way. Now the Govt was pressing the armed forces to reduce pension bill.

3. There are various factors at work in this imbroglio. First the pressing need to keep the armed forces young. This is in steep contrast with all other govt jobs or CAPFs and police jobs where pers serve upto 60 years across the board.

Secondly was the pressing need to resettle the retiring service pers who on account of different terms of service are retired at a young age starting at 35 years. As stated earlier the British had a functional informal system to do so.

Post independence, the govt seized of the problem directed reservation of 12.5 and 15 percent in all govt jobs, incl police and CAPF to resettle ESM.
As is typical of this nation, there is a yawning gap between theory and practice.

The present rate of absorption of ESM in Govt jobs at the centre and states incl the police and CAPFs varies between 0.2 to 2 percent. Surprisingly even police and CAPFs don't want ESM. And the few that they induct, are inducted at the bottom of the rung

with no cognisance given to the experience, training and competence of the ESM. The ESM find it extremely humiliating. In fact in most states the ESM joining the police are made to undergo the recruit training along with new recruits all over again, Ditto for CAPFs.

We really seem to have bid goodbye to our good sense. These decisions are being taken by officers of these forces. Of course @adgpi maintains a stand offish attitude and has failed to intervene at the appropriate levels.

So as things stand today, there is formidable angst in the ESM for the step motherly treatment being handed out after demobbing them at young age of 35-40 years, whereas all others serve till 60; and even more importantly failing to ensure the 12.5 and 15 percentage job

Reservation commitment is fulfilled wherein the could serve again with dignity and assurance covered by well drafted rules .
In context of the #Tourofduty now being contemplated this will aggravate an already adverse situation with very serious consequences for the nation.

So we would be well served to carry out an in depth analysis before jumping ship, and by letting the tail wag the dog, wherein to fulfill the demand to reduce pensions, we tinker with fundamentals of the services and also create conditions which have possible disastrous effects.

To amplify.
The #Touroffuty pers will be released after3/5/7 years of service with no assurance ( except on paper) of re employment or reabsorbtion in Govt service. So we will have hundreds of thousands of youth, thrown out of service at age below 30 with no future in sight

Lack of suitable absorption will lead to intense frustration towards the society and govt for having neglected them. These are all trained soldiers. It will have deep repercussions on the stability and peace of the society, simply stated.
It will have a cascading effect.

The angst in #Tourofduty pers will find reflection in the serving pers of the army. It will have serious repercussions. Hopefully @adgpi will examine it in depth and NOT come under pressure of the govt/bureaucratic establishment who don't have to handle the baby.

So what's the way out. Well the following is suggested.
1. Ensure such terms of service that those pers desirous of serving on, are assured emp in CAPFs/ police/ govt jobs with protected service and pay.

Lobbies that have thwarted this sound concept thus far must be ruthlessly dealt with.
2.We must close the loop. You can't enroll a young man in the Services at 18 years and at 22-27 years age tell him to fend for himself. Throw him to the wolves. Repercussions will be serious.

https://twitter.com/rathorekaran17/stat ... BPddw&s=19

Cross posting from BR courterhs Anoop

3. A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent. There are no regimental or training facilities (space, equipment, manpower) available to handle these training needs. This does not even take into account the deployment state in COIN.

3b A largely conscript core severely compromises operational efficiency, as seen in the Russian side. The Ukranian side is fighting for dear life and the country is devastated as they trade space for time. This approach is not acceptable in the Indian doctrine.
- Manpower rationalization can be achieved to some extent by outsourcing civil jobs like housing construction, cantonment upkeep etc on contract basis and reducing the permanent civilian cadre employed, like MES.



Supposedly the Army hates this idea but it's being rammed down their throats
This tour of duty concept need not be permanent, need it atleast till 2030 in case the churn in geo politics goes downhill, and in case there will be a need to swell the ranks fast.
 

rkhanna

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This tour of duty concept need not be permanent, need it atleast till 2030 in case the churn in geo politics goes downhill, and in case there will be a need to swell the ranks fast.
in a democracy any change happens with great difficulty. Undoing the change is even more impossible. Today the Tour of Duty bill has no scope for a roll back.
 

Haldilal

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Ya'll Nibbiars The Indian Army rescued a 18-month old Shivam who had accidentally fallen into a 300-ft borewell in Gujarat's Dudapur village. And The Incidents related to borewell are now common in India. Enact a law that non closure of borewell is attempt to murder.

FUy-2LGaUAAPRmL.jpeg


Can I join army as"tour of duty" i am +105kg age 24 plus my eyesight is -3.75



It's a dream to wear that uniform 😓 i think will never be fulfilled
Ya'll Nibbiars see Territorial Army.
 

tribendra bisoi.

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Can you Run for 20 KM with a 20 KG LOAD on your shoulders

One can run long distance by -

-gradually reducing weight .
- Lean protein is necessary like fish and chicken breast , egg white ( for those who are fat )
- These days there is issue of cholesterol even among young due to modern life style . It reduces stamina . So stay away from junk fried food .
- skipping or jumping rope is the biggest friend you ll have to gradually master the breathing , increase density of bones , muscles where it matters . And best part is the injury or bone / muscle fatigue is far less compared to running .
- Capacity of lungs can be increased with " pranayam "

Some people does not need any of above ...
 
Last edited:

WolfPack86

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ARMY INDUCTS RUSSIAN IGLA-S MANPADS
Air Defence functions in three levels – gun/missile system, medium range, and high range. Igla-S is a short-range weapon


The Army, which has for long been looking for new man portable air defence systems, has inducted a small number of Igla-S systems recently bought from Russia under emergency procurement, according to defence sources. However, a much larger contract for Igla-S systems under the Very Short Range Air Defence System (VSHORAD) deal is still pending and under review by the Defence Ministry.

“The contract was signed in December 2020 and the equipment was delivered by December 2021. This includes 24 launchers, 216 missiles and testing equipment,” one of the sources said.

The procurement was done through the Vice Chiefs emergency financial powers given to the Services for the first time after the Balakot air strike in February 2019 and further extended after the standoff with China in Eastern Ladakh in May 2020. Under this, Services can procure weapons systems upto ₹300 crores on an urgent basis without any further clearances.

In the backdrop of the Russian special military operation in Ukraine and the Western sanctions, India and Russia are working out modalities to utilise the Rupee-Rouble route in a large way for trade and payments. The Ministry is also assessing the impact it would have on the timely execution of deals as well as steady supplies of spares and support.

The larger VSHORAD deal which began in 2010 and saw several rounds of trials and re-trials is still pending.

This deal which was close to conclusion is now under review as part of the overall relook at all direct import deals by the Defence Ministry. Deliberations are still continuing on the larger VSHORAD deal, another defence source said.

The Request for Proposal (RFP) for VSHORAD was issued in October 2010 for over 5,000 missiles, 258 single launchers and 258 multi-launchers. Five contenders responded and eventually three made it to the trials - MBDA of France, Rosoboronexport of Russia and SAAB of Sweden. Eventually all three companies were declared technically compliant in 2017 and Igla-S was declared the lowest bidder in November 2018.

While the benchmark price arrived at by the Army was just over $2 bn, ROSOBORONEXPORT’s bid was much lower at around $1.47 bn, SAAB at about $2.6 bn, and MBDA at about $3.68 bn. This led to much deliberation within the Ministry as the Russian bid was much lower compared to the benchmark price. The deal also saw several allegations of deviations in procedures with some of the vendors sending protest letters.

As per requirements, the VSHORAD should have a maximum range of 6 km, altitude of 3 km along with all-weather capability and will replace the existing Igla in service which is in urgent need of replacement. VSHORAD is the soldier’s last line of defence against enemy combat aircraft and helicopters in the multi-layered air defence network.

In addition to the Igla-S, the Army variant of the Medium Range Surface to Air Missile (MRSAM) being jointly developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) and Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI) completed trials earlier this month and is now ready for induction. The maiden launch of MRSAM Army Version was conducted in December 2020.

Air Defence functions in three levels – gun/missile system, medium range, and high range. Within this the Air Defence guns are of two types, AD Gun Missile system, AD self propelled guns. The Army is looking for AD guns in both the categories. In the medium segment, it has the indigenous Akash SAM while MRSAM fits in the high range.
 

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