Indian Army: News and Discussion

tsunami

New Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2015
Messages
3,529
Likes
16,572
Country flag
If locals who want to continue with terror by displaying flags of ISIS and Pak then we'll treat them as anti nationals and will not spare them. Those who obstruct our operations during encounters and are not supportive will be treated as overground workers of terrorists: Army Chief General Bipin Rawat
 

WolfPack86

New Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2015
Messages
10,571
Likes
16,993
Country flag
Plans To Induct New Anti-Tank Guided Missiles could Be Delayed
A committee will examine procedural aspects of the deal for Israeli Spike ATGM systems, manufactured by Rafael Advanced Defense Systems Ltd.
The army may have to wait longer to induct new anti-tank guided missiles (ATGM), as the defense ministry has appointed a committee to examine a Rs 3,200-crore deal that was about to be closed.
An army source told Hindustan Times that a committee, headed by a two-star general, will examine procedural aspects of the deal for Israeli Spike ATGM systems, manufactured by Rafael Advanced Defense Systems Ltd.
While India chose the Israeli ATGM over US defense and aerospace firm Raytheon’s Javelin system three years ago, the deal was delayed as commercial issues needed to be ironed out.
“The deal was ready to be put up for clearance by the Cabinet Committee on Security. But now we will have to wait for the panel’s report,” the source said on the condition of anonymity .
India is negotiating the purchase of 321 launchers and 8,356 fire-and-forget missiles with the Israeli firm.
The missile can destroy armored vehicles and bunkers from a distance of 2.5 km and the army plans to equip more than 400 of its infantry and mechanized units with the third-generation ATGM systems.
The army’s requirement for larger number of launchers and missiles will be met through licensed production of the ATGM systems by state-owned Bharat Dynamics Limited (BDL). The army currently uses Milan and Konkur ATGMs built by BDL under license from French and Russian firms, respectively.
http://www.indiandefensenews.in/2017/03/plans-to-induct-new-anti-tank-missiles.html
 

WolfPack86

New Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2015
Messages
10,571
Likes
16,993
Country flag
I don't know why do we need to appoint committee to examine this deal. This deal is important as Army need to have anti-tank guided missiles at asap.
 

deepak ghanvatkar

New Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2017
Messages
72
Likes
25
Army is I believe not prepared to deal with Journalist like Barkha Dutt who hurt the army in places where it hurts army the most and Army is not able to do deal with outcome... There are some people who link the death/Sucide/murder of the Jawan at Nashik with her interview... the truth is not known but such words hurt army's image...
 

Trinetra

New Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2017
Messages
260
Likes
552
Country flag
INSAS rifles to retire; to be replaced by imported weapons

NEW DELHI: After nearly 20 years, the indigenously manufactured INSAS rifles will be finally 'retiring' from the army and replaced by an imported assault rifle to be manufactured in the country later.

The Indian Small Arms System (INSAS), which was inducted in the army 1988, is likely to be replaced with deadlier assault rifles of higher caliber (7.62x51), official sources said.

The sources said that as many as 18 vendors, including some Indian companies having a tie-up with foreign arms manufacturing firms, have sent in their consent to replace nearly two lakh such rifles used by the army along the borders and in counter-insurgency operations.

The reason for phasing out of INSAS, as cited by experts, was that it was not effective at long range and at best, could only maim the enemy.

The sources said that 7.62x51 assault rifles have already been introduced in the Pakistani army which purchased them from Heckler and Koch, one of the world's leading small arms manufacturers based in Germany.

The proposal for procuring the new assault rifles was in pre-Acceptance of Necessity (AoN) stage and expected to be completed by the year end after putting the process of purchase of these weapons on a fast track.

The sources said that emphasis was being laid on arming the Special Forces of the army in the Northeast as of now and the proposal will come up before the Defence Acquisition Committee (DAC) soon.

After the new weaponry for the Special Forces aimed at helping them in close-combat situations, the focus will shift to procurement of the assault rifles and replace the INSAS, the sources said.

The foreign vendor would also be required to participate in Transfer of Technology (ToT) so that there is no dearth of ammunition and maintenance of the assault rifles in the country. These weapons can kill the enemy up to an effective range (rpt) range of 500 metres.

The conceptualisation of the INSAS began in early 1980's before it was finally handed over for production to Ichapur Ordnance Factory in West Bengal. In 1993, the design of the rifle was changed before being introduced in the army in 1996.

The rifle was put to use during the 1999 Kargil war.
 

tejas warrior

New Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2015
Messages
1,268
Likes
3,723
Country flag
Defence Ministry's loss to be Goa's gain? Strong indications that smaller parties will support BJP govt only if Parrikar returns

upload_2017-3-12_12-48-40.png
 

Tarun Kumar

New Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
942
Likes
1,047
Parrikar should go asap from MOD as he is responsible for many delays. Put someone like Piyush Goyal in charge of MOD
 

Akshay_Fenix

Member
New Member
Joined
Sep 19, 2016
Messages
2,226
Likes
7,024
Parrikar should go asap from MOD as he is responsible for many delays. Put someone like Piyush Goyal in charge of MOD
LOL. 3 trillion rupees worth of orders placed last year. And if the rains are good this year, more orders will be placed this year too.

He is the sole reason why Tejas is still in picture, second line of production has been given go-ahead, talks for third line going on.

It's not his fault that PSU cannot even produce quality ammunition even after 70 years of Independence. Reason why we are still importing ammo.
 
Last edited:

tejas warrior

New Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2015
Messages
1,268
Likes
3,723
Country flag
If @manoharparrikar returns to Goa politics, who'd be a good DefMin? Probably @sureshpprabhu. But, I suspect @nitin_gadkari wud get the job.

Screenshot_20170312-143129.png
 

Akshay_Fenix

Member
New Member
Joined
Sep 19, 2016
Messages
2,226
Likes
7,024
How about VK Singh? Now that the Air Force and Navy is back on track with Kaveri, rafael, french subs etc etc, it's the Army which is still lagging behind.
VK Singh being an army man can put things back in order.
Judging from his past media interviews he is quite a knowledgeable guy when it comes to defence products.
Most importantly he is not corrupt.
 

ezsasa

Designated Cynic
New Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2014
Messages
32,663
Likes
151,106
Country flag
How about VK Singh? Now that the Air Force and Navy is back on track with Kaveri, rafael, french subs etc etc, it's the Army which is still lagging behind.
VK Singh being an army man can put things back in order.
Judging from his past media interviews he is quite a knowledgeable guy when it comes to defence products.
Most importantly he is not corrupt.
VK singh can be used as a wartime defence minister, in peace time we will need a technocrat like Piyush Goyal or kiran rijuju.

People like Suresh prabhu, Gadkari have unfinished business in their ministries better not to disturb them.
 

OverLoad

Snake Eater
New Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2016
Messages
102
Likes
26
Big New Hurdle For India’s Arjun Battle Tank
Shiv AroorMar 13 2017 12 35 pm



India’s Arjun main battle tank, possibly the country’s longest and most trouble-ridden armament programme, has just hit the latest in a history of formidable hurdles. And it’s a big one. One that amplifies the programme’s inextricable quality as a faraway castle that will never be fully realised by its makers or embraced by its customer, a tragicomic meandering that began with a requirement, stupefyingly enough, right after India’s 1971 war with Pakistan. In the tech world, the Arjun would be veritablyvaporware.

If you’ve tracked the Arjun tank’s journey, you know that the platform’s weight has been a key factor slowing its acceptance by the Indian Army. Now, over 100 Arjun Mk.I tanks are operational across two tank regiments in India’s western desert sector. The beefed up, improved Arjun Mk.II, of which the Indian Army officially ordered 118 in 2014, is currently going through the paces to prove the smorgasbord of capability upgrades and add-ons. But a new, yet familiar, flashpoint has now presented itself, providing the sharpest sense of deja vu for the team proving the tank. And it has just been detailed in an easy-to-miss report by India’s Standing Committee on Defence in the country’s Parliament.

The Indian Army wants the DRDO to fully redesign the Arjun Mk.II’s hull and turret structures and use newer materials to replace the conventional structure, in an effort to ‘achieve a reasonable reduction in weight, without removing any of the major improvements’. The Arjun Mk.II currently weighs 68.6 tons — a full six tons over the MK.I, owning entirely to the 73 improvements the Army demanded on the newer tank. The Army has stated, in no uncertain terms, that the 68.6 ton weight of the Arjun Mk.II is too much for ‘seamless application in semi-developed and developed sectors of the Western Front’. In other words, the Arjun Mk.II, the Army says, can’t be forward deployed beyond the deserts, in the event of active hostilities with Pakistan. But more on that a little later.

Livefist can confirm that on September 27 last year, the DRDO was left with no choice but to initiate an exercise to redesign the hull/turret structures on the Arjun Mk.II. At at meeting that included DRDO chief S. Christopher, the Army’s Deputy Chief for Policy & Systems and the Director General Mechanised Forces, the DRDO fought the recommendation, stating that ‘redesign of hull/turret including use of advanced armour material is not recommended considering the long development and validation cycle’. It was a painful blow — while the DRDO was hoping to accelerate trials in an effort to nudge the Indian Army into doubling its order for 118 Arjun Mk.II tanks had just been told even the existing ones weren’t really good enough for full operational use. The DRDO’s Combat Vehicles laboratory near Chennai has begun the weight reduction/redesign exercise, with an ambitious target of March 2018 to demonstrate a weight reduction of 3 tons. The DRDO will need to demonstrate each module separately to the Indian Army.

The story doesn’t really end there. In fact it gets more perplexing. While the DRDO gets busy trying to redesign the Arjun Mk.II’s hull/turret structures and use new materials, the Army has already written off the exercise. In fact, at the very same September 2016 meeting where the DRDO committed to a 3 ton weight reduction, the Army stated, ‘There are no major advantages from tactical and operational point of view with 65 t weight reduction also. It is felt that even weight reduction to 62 tons (equal to that of Arjun MBT Mk-I) may not provide any significant tactical/ operational advantages.’

In other words, the Army believes the weight reduction exercise is fundamentally useless. Worse, the Army projects that the ‘cycle time for 65 ton weight reductions of Arjun MBT Mk-II and validation will take about four to six years for successful acceptance by user after trials/procedures.’ The Army clearly has a real problem here — and this could be indicative of government pressure to press on with the programme.

The DRDO, which was hoping the Arjun tank had finally turned the corner, transforming an adversarial relationship with its main customer into one of comfort, has hit another stone wall with the Army. While insisting that the Arjun Mk.II has ‘exhibited the required performance in all aspects of agility, mobility and other operational/functional parameters in the desert and semi-desert terrains during various phases of user trials’ and that it is ‘confident that that Arjun Mk.II will have requisite agility, mobility and other operational/functional parameters in various developed and semi developed terrains also’, the DRDO is also wondering why the Army is averse to a proposal to operationally compare the Arjun Mk.II with the T-90 (a comparison that was conducted over a decade ago on the Mk.I). According to the DRDO, “As directed by Hon’ble RM (Defence Minister), DRDO requested Army for mobility comparative trials with the Arjun MBT Mk-II even with 68.6 t’ along with T-90 to prove its tactical and operational mobility aspects in all envisaged terrains (including developed and semi developed terrains) for its future employability. However, Army intimated that Arjun MBT Mk-II and T90 are of different class & weight classification and their deployment is as per assigned operational roles. Arjun MBT has operational employment restrictions to specific sectors (desert/semi desert) being heavy tank. Therefore, Army intimated that the conduct of comparative mobility trials is not required.”

Even if all goes well, it is now clear that the Arjun Mk.II will only be fully deployable if the government beefs up road/bridge infrastructure to able to handle the tank’s heft. That alone is an alarming development that adds pressure on a system beyond the Army’s direct control. The Arjun family of tanks are principally for a potential war with Pakistan. The tanks are too heavy to be airlifted to any of the sectors India currently shares with China. And the new deployability concerns rule out moving them there by rail either.

The redesign exercise shackles the Arjun tank to its endless, looping development and proving cycle — one that it hasn’t been able to break out of for decades. Top sources in the Army say that while there is government pressure to endorse the Arjun tank as an Indian product, the Army doesn’t believe it makes sense to buy more of a tank that will be operationally restricted to the desert/semi-desert sectors of the west. A maximum of four or five Arjun regiments across variants is many as the Army believes it needs, given what the tank has been proven to be capable of. If the weight reduction exercise doesn’t work out, the Army takes delivery of those 118 Arjun Mk.IIs on schedule and will unlikely order any more. If it does work out, it remains to be seen if the Army will order more. The Arjun programme, as the DRDO has said before, is a dead loss if the Army doesn’t order more than 500 tanks in total. Right now, the numbers are nowhere close. Nothing is.

I posted this other forum...(As per Paanwala news)
My Friend ,Arjun could have been a great tank but Army Killed it purposely from Day 1 when they inducted it.Reason are many but yes corruption is one of the reason. We must leave Arjun MBT alone(Sheer hard luck for this great tank) and now India should start working on Advance Arjun MBT.

The commanders of All Arjun MBT has 1 thing to say in common and they swear about it ...In their own words- This Tank kick like Donkey(Power),comfortable like Elephant(Crew comfort)and Give a confidence like War Horse (Due to safety aspect).
 

Pandora

New Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
Messages
985
Likes
2,196
Country flag
Big New Hurdle For India’s Arjun Battle Tank
Shiv AroorMar 13 2017 12 35 pm



India’s Arjun main battle tank, possibly the country’s longest and most trouble-ridden armament programme, has just hit the latest in a history of formidable hurdles. And it’s a big one. One that amplifies the programme’s inextricable quality as a faraway castle that will never be fully realised by its makers or embraced by its customer, a tragicomic meandering that began with a requirement, stupefyingly enough, right after India’s 1971 war with Pakistan. In the tech world, the Arjun would be veritablyvaporware.

If you’ve tracked the Arjun tank’s journey, you know that the platform’s weight has been a key factor slowing its acceptance by the Indian Army. Now, over 100 Arjun Mk.I tanks are operational across two tank regiments in India’s western desert sector. The beefed up, improved Arjun Mk.II, of which the Indian Army officially ordered 118 in 2014, is currently going through the paces to prove the smorgasbord of capability upgrades and add-ons. But a new, yet familiar, flashpoint has now presented itself, providing the sharpest sense of deja vu for the team proving the tank. And it has just been detailed in an easy-to-miss report by India’s Standing Committee on Defence in the country’s Parliament.

The Indian Army wants the DRDO to fully redesign the Arjun Mk.II’s hull and turret structures and use newer materials to replace the conventional structure, in an effort to ‘achieve a reasonable reduction in weight, without removing any of the major improvements’. The Arjun Mk.II currently weighs 68.6 tons — a full six tons over the MK.I, owning entirely to the 73 improvements the Army demanded on the newer tank. The Army has stated, in no uncertain terms, that the 68.6 ton weight of the Arjun Mk.II is too much for ‘seamless application in semi-developed and developed sectors of the Western Front’. In other words, the Arjun Mk.II, the Army says, can’t be forward deployed beyond the deserts, in the event of active hostilities with Pakistan. But more on that a little later.

Livefist can confirm that on September 27 last year, the DRDO was left with no choice but to initiate an exercise to redesign the hull/turret structures on the Arjun Mk.II. At at meeting that included DRDO chief S. Christopher, the Army’s Deputy Chief for Policy & Systems and the Director General Mechanised Forces, the DRDO fought the recommendation, stating that ‘redesign of hull/turret including use of advanced armour material is not recommended considering the long development and validation cycle’. It was a painful blow — while the DRDO was hoping to accelerate trials in an effort to nudge the Indian Army into doubling its order for 118 Arjun Mk.II tanks had just been told even the existing ones weren’t really good enough for full operational use. The DRDO’s Combat Vehicles laboratory near Chennai has begun the weight reduction/redesign exercise, with an ambitious target of March 2018 to demonstrate a weight reduction of 3 tons. The DRDO will need to demonstrate each module separately to the Indian Army.

The story doesn’t really end there. In fact it gets more perplexing. While the DRDO gets busy trying to redesign the Arjun Mk.II’s hull/turret structures and use new materials, the Army has already written off the exercise. In fact, at the very same September 2016 meeting where the DRDO committed to a 3 ton weight reduction, the Army stated, ‘There are no major advantages from tactical and operational point of view with 65 t weight reduction also. It is felt that even weight reduction to 62 tons (equal to that of Arjun MBT Mk-I) may not provide any significant tactical/ operational advantages.’

In other words, the Army believes the weight reduction exercise is fundamentally useless. Worse, the Army projects that the ‘cycle time for 65 ton weight reductions of Arjun MBT Mk-II and validation will take about four to six years for successful acceptance by user after trials/procedures.’ The Army clearly has a real problem here — and this could be indicative of government pressure to press on with the programme.

The DRDO, which was hoping the Arjun tank had finally turned the corner, transforming an adversarial relationship with its main customer into one of comfort, has hit another stone wall with the Army. While insisting that the Arjun Mk.II has ‘exhibited the required performance in all aspects of agility, mobility and other operational/functional parameters in the desert and semi-desert terrains during various phases of user trials’ and that it is ‘confident that that Arjun Mk.II will have requisite agility, mobility and other operational/functional parameters in various developed and semi developed terrains also’, the DRDO is also wondering why the Army is averse to a proposal to operationally compare the Arjun Mk.II with the T-90 (a comparison that was conducted over a decade ago on the Mk.I). According to the DRDO, “As directed by Hon’ble RM (Defence Minister), DRDO requested Army for mobility comparative trials with the Arjun MBT Mk-II even with 68.6 t’ along with T-90 to prove its tactical and operational mobility aspects in all envisaged terrains (including developed and semi developed terrains) for its future employability. However, Army intimated that Arjun MBT Mk-II and T90 are of different class & weight classification and their deployment is as per assigned operational roles. Arjun MBT has operational employment restrictions to specific sectors (desert/semi desert) being heavy tank. Therefore, Army intimated that the conduct of comparative mobility trials is not required.”

Even if all goes well, it is now clear that the Arjun Mk.II will only be fully deployable if the government beefs up road/bridge infrastructure to able to handle the tank’s heft. That alone is an alarming development that adds pressure on a system beyond the Army’s direct control. The Arjun family of tanks are principally for a potential war with Pakistan. The tanks are too heavy to be airlifted to any of the sectors India currently shares with China. And the new deployability concerns rule out moving them there by rail either.

The redesign exercise shackles the Arjun tank to its endless, looping development and proving cycle — one that it hasn’t been able to break out of for decades. Top sources in the Army say that while there is government pressure to endorse the Arjun tank as an Indian product, the Army doesn’t believe it makes sense to buy more of a tank that will be operationally restricted to the desert/semi-desert sectors of the west. A maximum of four or five Arjun regiments across variants is many as the Army believes it needs, given what the tank has been proven to be capable of. If the weight reduction exercise doesn’t work out, the Army takes delivery of those 118 Arjun Mk.IIs on schedule and will unlikely order any more. If it does work out, it remains to be seen if the Army will order more. The Arjun programme, as the DRDO has said before, is a dead loss if the Army doesn’t order more than 500 tanks in total. Right now, the numbers are nowhere close. Nothing is.

I posted this other forum...(As per Paanwala news)
My Friend ,Arjun could have been a great tank but Army Killed it purposely from Day 1 when they inducted it.Reason are many but yes corruption is one of the reason. We must leave Arjun MBT alone(Sheer hard luck for this great tank) and now India should start working on Advance Arjun MBT.

The commanders of All Arjun MBT has 1 thing to say in common and they swear about it ...In their own words- This Tank kick like Donkey(Power),comfortable like Elephant(Crew comfort)and Give a confidence like War Horse (Due to safety aspect).
Lol am the one Gorkhali in PDF and Pandora here...:p
 

Articles

Top