India to select one or more fighter aircraft to be built by private sector

[SajeevJino]

OK.
Nice.

but march of? 2017? 2027? 2037 .....

We will tell you which march in the end of this year

 

[sasum]

It has a better GaN radar and IRST is off the same level as Rafale plus integrating any system is the easiest .

Zhuk-AE (FGA 35(3D) has 960 TR modules, only 2nd in calibre, first being APG-79.

 

[Bahamut]

Tejas Mk 1 will only have a classical antenna radar.

Tejas Mk 2, if unveilled, will have AESA one.

And why this AESA will be better than Rafale one?
Rafale is the first non US plane to received an operational AESA radar (Russian ones are not operational) and it can use the 12 years of experience of PESA radar, as it use the same, and regulary upgraded, back calculator section. That means actual AESA Rafale radar has a 15 years data base and experiment and developpment. The israeli counterpart doesn't have such experience.

I was taking about Mig 35S not Tejas ,as for Tejas radar it will be initial an Israeli AESR which will be latter replaced by a domestic version

 

[Navnit Kundu]

2017.
Do not troll.

R.I.P. 30 characters rule.

What difference does it make? The Rafale deal is on the verge of being cancelled. France cannot negotiate from a position of strength anymore, given the competitive offers we have received from others. The only reason they are staying in this bid is because they are desperate to sell. Let's bleed them some more.

Please take note of the fact that there are labor riots going on in France right now (since a month, actually). Their president's approval ratings are the lowest any president has had in a long time. He will be counting on this sale to bolster his image back home.

This is month old footage, but fresh riots broke out today as well. You can find that on TV news.


Yesterday's footage :

 

[Indx TechStyle]

What difference does it make? The Rafale deal is on the verge of being cancelled. France cannot negotiate from a position of strength anymore, given the competitive offers we have received from others. The only reason they are staying in this bid is because they are desperate to sell. Let's bleed them some more.

Please take note of the fact that there are labor riots going on in France right now (since a month, actually). Their president's approval ratings are the lowest any president has had in a long time. He will be counting on this sale to bolster his image back home.

This is month old footage, but fresh riots broke out today as well. You can find that on TV news.


Yesterday's footage :

It's highly unlikely that deal gets hung so long like Rafael. Though, our French friend is frustrated.

 

[Navnit Kundu]

It's highly unlikely that deal gets hung so long like Rafael. Though, our French friend is frustrated.

He is doing whatever is in his national interest. We should do whatever is in our national interest, although he has the right to opine, his opinions don't hold any weight in our decision making process. India should stall and stall, until France gets more desperate, once they do, we can offer to buy engine TOT, as was agreed as an ad hoc solution during the building of *Kaveri engine which they cheated and fleeced us on. Renegotiate that contract and make them deliver this time. Use that engine for AMCA. Trash the Rafale.

Meanwhile be prepared for the corrupt officials in IAF to do press reports about how India will be invaded by Pakistan and China if we don't get new planes immediately and how we are ill equipped for it and how we immediately need to buy 999999 new shiny planes from France to defend ourselves, as that is our only hope to survive as a nation. I am actually beginning to miss their drama. The IAF is very punctual like that. They usually do it once every month, haven't done it in this month, maybe they forgot.

Ohh wait! what is this? IAF chief taking a ride in IAF. Did he suddenly grow faith in this plane which he had systematically denigrated for so many years? Did he suddenly become patriotic or maybe I am dreaming, I don't know. When there is change of leadership at the top and the leadership has a clear vision, such unexpected things happen. Dassault's arrogance will meet the same fate.


@Indx TechStyle I think, instead of France selling us Rafales, we might end up selling Mahindra anti-riot vehicles to them. Seems like they need it, a lot of police vehicles are being burnt.

 

[Zebra]

Can we assume that all the new squadrons from here on will be dedicated towards the east. If east it would mean the new fighters should be able to traverse both sea and land conditions. Taking it a bit further interoperability with other nation's air forces will also become a critical factor in the selection. Twin engine may also be a factor.

Wouldn't it mean F-18 & rafale have an edge going by the above logic?

Sir, both twin engine is too much. I guess.

But, you can go whichever way you like.

In 2016, the best option is F/A-18 & Gripen, (and that is bcz of GE F414).

 

[BON PLAN]

France cannot negotiate from a position of strength anymore, given the competitive offers we have received from others. The only reason they are staying in this bid is because they are desperate to sell. Let's bleed them some more.

Ouarf ouarf ouarf !!!
We are desesperating? In your dreams.
We already have sell 48 Rafale.
Qatar will ordered the 12 on option (for the rest they will choose a US plane, as UAE).
I think Egypte will ordered 24 more.
And UAE has promised to our Def Min they will ordered 60 (Qatar made the same kind of promise some years ago).

Dassault really is not in a hurry !

Indian Def Min said some day ago "for the cost of 1 Rafale you can have 2 Tejas". In this case, and with the far superior performance of Rafale, if it cost too much for you... Bye Bye !

 

[BON PLAN]

we might end up selling Mahindra anti-riot vehicles to them. Seems like they need it, a lot of police vehicles are being burnt.

You are miss informed. Only one police car was burnt.

Do you want to speak about the thousand indian women attacked with acid on the face ?

It's internal affair. Let's go bak to toppic.

 

[Navnit Kundu]

Indian Def Min said some day ago "for the cost of 1 Rafale you can have 2 Tejas". In this case, and with the far superior performance of Rafale, if it cost too much for you... Bye Bye !

This is exactly the statement which we are eagerly waiting the French negotiators to give. But, for some reason, the negotiators seem a little more compromising than their uptight brethren on online forums. Perhaps it's this little thing biting them, it's apparently called 'reality' or something like that. I really hope your negotiators grow the spine to reject the negotiations and leave if they have any self respect, I mean, it sure as hell is gonna look very embarrassing selling planes to a country where women are attacked with acid. You would have a hard time swallowing your pompous words then, as it might seem a bit inconsistent with your values to take the money of a nation which bathes its women in acid. Better cancel it right now to maintain a consistent moral high ground. I mean, you wont make a lot of money but having a moral high ground trumps everything, it feeds the soul.

So, how soon can we expect your French negotiators to get up and leave in contempt? I hope soon. The longer they stay the more stupid their pompous statements appear. No kidding.

You are miss informed. Only one police car was burnt.

Do you want to speak about the thousand indian women attacked with acid on the face ?

It's internal affair. Let's go bak to toppic.

Don't get so frustrated, man, if things in the French camp really are under control as you make it sound then I'm happy for you. I mean, you sure do have so many other potential customers like Pakistan, whose economy runs on alms from IMF. I'm sure they will buy your Rafales for 250 million $ each. Or Sri Lanka, or Myanmar, or Somalia, or Nigeria, I mean, hey, once you get imaginative it's hard to stop. You can imagine making imaginary $ out of imaginary sales to so many nations as long as you have a good imagination. Napolean and Hitler got imaginative once, we all know how that turned out. Hint : Not good for France on both counts.

 

[BON PLAN]

This is exactly the statement which we are eagerly waiting the French negotiators to give. But, for some reason, the negotiators seem a little more compromising than their uptight brethren on online forums. Perhaps it's this little thing biting them, it's apparently called 'reality' or something like that. I really hope your negotiators grow the spine to reject the negotiations and leave if they have any self respect, I mean, it sure as hell is gonna look very embarrassing selling planes to a country where women are attacked with acid. You would have a hard time swallowing your pompous words then, as it might seem a bit inconsistent with your values to take the money of a nation which bathes its women in acid. Better cancel it right now to maintain a consistent moral high ground. I mean, you wont make a lot of money but having a moral high ground trumps everything, it feeds the soul.

So, how soon can we expect your French negotiators to get up and leave in contempt? I hope soon. The longer they stay the more stupid their pompous statements appear. No kidding.



Don't get so frustrated, man, if things in the French camp really are under control as you make it sound then I'm happy for you. I mean, you sure do have so many other potential customers like Pakistan, whose economy runs on alms from IMF. I'm sure they will buy your Rafales for 250 million $ each. Or Sri Lanka, or Myanmar, or Somalia, or Nigeria, I mean, hey, once you get imaginative it's hard to stop. You can imagine making imaginary $ out of imaginary sales to so many nations as long as you have a good imagination. Napolean and Hitler got imaginative once, we all know how that turned out. Hint : Not good for France on both counts.

Frustrated? absolutely not.
Who choose Rafale as L1? French people? Napoleon? NO.
I think our negociators gave you all is possible weeks or months ago. You want more and we can't. The process is stopped. We are not in a hurry.
Tejas is ready ? so induce it at full speed. We are waiting and watching the progress. Unfortunately I think it will be slow....
I don't want to be cruel with you, so I don't spell you how many times this light and simple plane is on the drawing board.

 

[smestarz]

Actually I am expecting ex-IAF top brass to have a pro Rafale article by this weekend.

As I understamd the DM has called IAF bluff, like We shall get Rafales if and only if the business and financial proposal is good, we discounted too much already (Tech transfer, make in india etc) to ensure that the order is completed ASAP, but if the French still insist on their rates then they can go and F themselves.

IAF Chief has seen the signal very clearly and the govt has shown that in their stance when they are not reacting to any media reports, specially the one that said .. "Rafale deal ready to be signed."

The DM has gone thru various pressures possible from all sections, Politcal, Service and ex-service and BJP has managed to nullify all of these. Raha has signaled that he is not against Tejas and that Tejas is not an option but the choice for IAF, where as Rafale now is the option.

The French have been short changing us for a long time in name of Friendship, I guess its time for us to realise its just business and deal like businessmen

He is doing whatever is in his national interest. We should do whatever is in our national interest, although he has the right to opine, his opinions don't hold any weight in our decision making process. India should stall and stall, until France gets more desperate, once they do, we can offer to buy engine TOT, as was agreed as an ad hoc solution during the building of *Kaveri engine which they cheated and fleeced us on. Renegotiate that contract and make them deliver this time. Use that engine for AMCA. Trash the Rafale.

Meanwhile be prepared for the corrupt officials in IAF to do press reports about how India will be invaded by Pakistan and China if we don't get new planes immediately and how we are ill equipped for it and how we immediately need to buy 999999 new shiny planes from France to defend ourselves, as that is our only hope to survive as a nation. I am actually beginning to miss their drama. The IAF is very punctual like that. They usually do it once every month, haven't done it in this month, maybe they forgot.

Ohh wait! what is this? IAF chief taking a ride in IAF. Did he suddenly grow faith in this plane which he had systematically denigrated for so many years? Did he suddenly become patriotic or maybe I am dreaming, I don't know. When there is change of leadership at the top and the leadership has a clear vision, such unexpected things happen. Dassault's arrogance will meet the same fate.


@Indx TechStyle I think, instead of France selling us Rafales, we might end up selling Mahindra anti-riot vehicles to them. Seems like they need it, a lot of police vehicles are being burnt.

 

[smestarz]

YES the French are very desperate, They still have got order of just 48, They are speculating the purchase of more planes by Qatar and Egypt,, Let Egypt have a stable govt for the next 5 years and that would be enough.
In a way Qatar and Egypt did want to put Road block for purchase of Rafales by India and they did it, So in a way India is well adviced to keep away from Rafale.

France knows that selling to India would open doors to Malaysia and other countries who would then risk a dozen or so planes, But India not favouring Rafale will send signal to most East Asian countries to look for Russian hardware .

About Rafale,, why not convince your countrymen that its too expensive for india so lets sell the planes to someone else and lets try some French forum to discus?? That might help

Ouarf ouarf ouarf !!!
We are desesperating? In your dreams.
We already have sell 48 Rafale.
Qatar will ordered the 12 on option (for the rest they will choose a US plane, as UAE).
I think Egypte will ordered 24 more.
And UAE has promised to our Def Min they will ordered 60 (Qatar made the same kind of promise some years ago).

Dassault really is not in a hurry !

Indian Def Min said some day ago "for the cost of 1 Rafale you can have 2 Tejas". In this case, and with the far superior performance of Rafale, if it cost too much for you... Bye Bye !

 

[smestarz]

Why Rafale was chosen as L1? Rafale was actually dumped out of the race once but then political pressure got them in again. France is one of the country that shows its hands as clean but has mastered the art of paying commissions. After all if its getting business why not.

You are not in hurry because you have order
We are not in hurry as we have a lot of options, so best is to hve rest and pretend to negotiate.

BTW the light and simple plane flies, carries a lot of weapons, is cheap to buy and use and has potentially BIGGER MARKET THAN RAFALE.... ooops you did not notice that did you?
That is why France is in a way eager to scuttle Tejas, if Tejas is purchased and inducted, there is absoluately no chance for Rafale even though you brng the topic of Light, heavy medium...
The DM knows that its all about performance and ability and not about weight.

Frustrated? absolutely not.
Who choose Rafale as L1? French people? Napoleon? NO.
I think our negociators gave you all is possible weeks or months ago. You want more and we can't. The process is stopped. We are not in a hurry.
Tejas is ready ? so induce it at full speed. We are waiting and watching the progress. Unfortunately I think it will be slow....
I don't want to be cruel with you, so I don't spell you how many times this light and simple plane is on the drawing board.

 

[Mikesingh]

Has the MiG - 35 been completely ruled out, given the fact that it was the only one not mentioned by Parikar ?

And the SU-35 too! No mention of this top-of-the-line aircraft. We already have the basic infrastructure for the SUs. Thus overall, it'll be cheaper over its life cycle. In other words, we'll have a very cost effective weapons platform with cutting edge technology.

 

[Navnit Kundu]

We'll have a very cost effective weapons platform with cutting edge technology...

...just like the Russians.

We are still getting our weapon systems at at least 3X to 7X the original rate which the OEM inducts it in their own military. So Russia and India, even after spending comparatively similar amount of money on defense, allows Russia to take on USA in multiple fronts while India is still stuck with Pakistan. Imagine how many more weapons we can get, quantitatively and qualitatively if a large % of them are manufactured in India.

The space suit that we made costs just 10 lakh, as opposed to buying it for 2 crore from Russia or USA. Imagine how much money we are spending on other systems simply paying heavy premiums to other manufacturers. That's why it is important to stall foreign sales like Rafales and go in for indegenous or give in to Russian demand for a silghtly higher rates and buy licences from them to bulk manufacture Sukhois and sell to Vietnam, Malaysia and other nations. On one hand it will make us self-reliant, on the other hand it will prevent the west from making any inroads in our backyard by selling weapons to Asian countries and having a pressure point to blackmail them with.

 

[SajeevJino]

And the SU-35 too! No mention of this top-of-the-line aircraft. We already have the basic infrastructure for the SUs. Thus overall, it'll be cheaper over its life cycle. In other words, we'll have a very cost effective weapons platform with cutting edge technology.

Only retards can bring Su 35 in this contest.. Get some reference about MRCA before putting these Shit

 

[smestarz]

What did the MRCA originate as? IT was actually a simple order that IAF wanted as 126 Mirage 2000-5 to replace MiG-21 !!! During Kargil Mirage 2000 impressed IAF (which easily gets impressed somewhat like how Congress is impressed when Rahul Gandhi talks) So what exactly was the requirement in your views? That time there was no mention of Medium etc. IAF just wanted to replace MiGs with French imports Thus and let me point here A SINGLE SEAT AIR INTERCEPTOR. like MiG was to be replaced by another single seat, single engine plane that could handle other roles also. This was done because on other hand, IAF did not want Tejas and was doing everything to scuttle the project. When GoI asked it to make it RFP since what Mirage was available 2000-5 was different version than what IAF had and so, it could not be taken as follow on order.
When RFP was issued there were many heavy hitters and Mirage 2000 was easily the weakest of the lot. So Dassault changed the entry to Rafale. Then some "wise" chair marshalls (who we can now understand were heavily influenced) did favour Rafale, and thus they put the "medium" on the category by putting weight restriction to ensure that RUSSIA DOES NOT ENTER WITH SU-30 OR SU-35
IAF already uses one of the planes and knew that this plane might actually be the runaway winner and thus Rafale would have no chance whatsoever. And if you see how the process went, They ensured that the cheaper planes were eliminated first, and the EF and Rafale were finalists. And then the nos were manipulated in favour of Rafale to get it L1. CNC is on record that the Dassault had submitted incomplete bid, and that NAK browne did give CNC the details which were assumed. This is very much like going to exams and leaving the answer sheet blank, and later after the exams given the chance to write the answer sheet at your own convenience..

Only retards can bring Su 35 in this contest.. Get some reference about MRCA before putting these Shit

 

[Yodha]

Only retards can bring Su 35 in this contest.. Get some reference about MRCA before putting these Shit

Hey, do you know that you can put your words in some respectable manner too?
Everyone is not a wizard like you. Show some respect man.

Sent from my XT1022 using Tapatalk

 

[Mikesingh]

Hey, do you know that you can put your words in some respectable manner too?
Everyone is not a wizard like you. Show some respect man.

Sent from my XT1022 using Tapatalk

This Frenchie, SajeevJino seems to have a complex. Or is he like many others in his little kingdom who are pissed off at India for not buying their Rafale, the second costliest operational fighter aircraft in the world after the F-22?

By the way, why is my undie called a Frenchie?