India to select one or more fighter aircraft to be built by private sector

[BON PLAN]

BTW Photonic radar, the Russians are talking of making it operational in 2018, where is the West with it? Still with AESA? Thats called Quantum jump.

2018 ? let's say 2028 +.
They are again with a PESA radar on SU35 .....

 

[Bahamut]

ABSOLUTELY NOT.

350 ? .... oups! no, sorry, only 300 km = target RCS of 10m² !!!!

Sir the detection range in the graph is in nautical mile not Km. 1NIM=1.852Km
For Rafale according to graph taking the RCS between 1-5 m^2 is between 278 to 463 km.

 

[BON PLAN]

And by the way one Indo French exercise in India last year, Rafale had met the similar fate as Eurofighters

As we are saying in France : "il ne faut pas vendre la peau de l'ours avant de l'avoir tué". Use google translate.

It's one of the two website you use everyday, with you bible Wikipedia.

 

[BON PLAN]

Sir the detection range in the graph is in nautical mile not Km. 1NIM=1.852Km
For Rafale according to graph taking the RCS between 1-5 m^2 is between 278 to 463 km.

Sorry. OK for NM and not KM.
But I don't read like you : 1,5 to 2 m² => less than 400 km.

It's amazing how Russian are doubling the range from SU30 to SU35 ....

 

[Bahamut]

just have a look to the plane : it's a past/copy of SU27 which is not knowed as stealthy.

There is a change in the air brake and also increase in composite material ,plus new control surface.

1,5 to 2 m²

Sir it is 1 to 5 m^2 not 1.5 to 2m^2

It's amazing how Russian are doubling the range from SU30 to SU35

For Su 30 MKI from Wiki
The forward-facing NIIP N011M Bars (Panther) is a powerful integrated passive electronically scanned array radar. The N011M is a digital multi-mode dual frequency band radar.[45] The N011M can function in air-to-air and air-to-land/sea mode simultaneously while being tied into a high-precision laser-inertial or GPS navigation system. It is equipped with a modern digital weapons control system as well as anti-jamming features. N011M has a 400 km search range and a maximum 200 km tracking range, and 60 km in the rear hemisphere.[46] The radar can track 15 air targets and engage 4 simultaneously.[46] These targets can even include cruise missiles and motionless helicopters. The Su-30MKI can function as a mini-AWACS as a director or command post for other aircraft. The target co-ordinates can be transferred automatically to at least four other aircraft. The radar can detect ground targets such as tanks at 40–50 km.[46] The Bars radar will be replaced by Zhuk-AESA in all Su-30MKI aircraft.[47][48][49]

OLS-30 laser-optical Infra-red search and track includes a day and night FLIR capability and is used in conjunction with the helmet mounted sighting system. The OLS-30 is a combined IRST/LR device using a cooled, broad waveband sensor. Detection range is up to 90 km, while the laser ranger is effective to 3.5 km. Targets are displayed on the same LCD display as the radar. Israeli LITENING targeting pod is used to target laser guided munitions. The original Litening pod includes a long range FLIR, a TV camera, laser spot tracker to pick up target designated by other aircraft or ground forces, and an electro-optical point and inertial tracker, which enables engagement of the target even when partly obscured by clouds or countermeasures; it also integrates a laser range-finder and flash-lamp powered laser designator for the delivery of laser-guided bombs, cluster and general purpose bomb
And some Good News for France
In 2012, upgrades of the earlier 80 Su-30MKIs involves equipping them with stand-off missiles with a range of 300 km; a request for information (ROI) was issued for such weapons.[38] In 2011, India issued a request for information to MBDA for the integration of the Brimstone ground attack missile and the long-range Meteor air-to-air missile.
So Rafale and Su 30 MKI might share weapons also.

 

[smestarz]

So it means SPECTRA is not what it is? I mean the Rafale boys are talking of passive detection etc, but if Su-35 opens its Radars at long range, Targets the Rafale and fires its R-77 and then goes passive. what does Rafale do? Just be shot down, what else.

So the point of the article was that SPECTRA is self protection suite and it has big limitations, and Rafale has to depend on Radar and so it cannot be passive. In BVR, Su-35 will detect and fire on Rafale much before Rafale can fire on Su-35, and with the missile heading its way, not much a rafale can do.

Are you so stupid?
If the opponent doesn't open it's own radar, and without AWACS or ground radar, or inside the opto systeme range (limited to +/- 50km) how do you think a Rafale or any other fighter can find its target and calculate a fire solution at medium/long range ?

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Radar = PESA. 15 years technology.

What is this?

Much better EW ? versus what?

Compared to anything. Though it may not be the best like spectra.

Low RCS ? just have a look to the plane : it's a past/copy of SU27 which is not knowed as stealthy.

Do you know that T 50 PKFA was also derived from SU 30 still a stealth fighter?

Do you know that we have a plan of super sukhoi in which same palne's RCS will be lowered to just 15% of current RCS?

Everybody know that Russia lags behind west in Electronics but in recent years they have made a good progress and certainly they are not very much behind like they used to be once upon a time.

 

[WolfPack86]

India To Select Fighter Jet Under ‘Make In India’ By March 2017

 

[smestarz]

Hilarious That phrase does in a way apply to France and Eric Trappier and your DM Mr. Drain in particular,
I do not contribute much on IDF, it has become more like RDF with crap from there coming on DFI to market Rafale. Heel Dogmatix

I do read Wiki, its an interesting place to get knowledge, and why not? But what you fail to note is that knowledge is about knowing more and not just having one source as the correct source.

And if you did not refer to Wiki perhaps you would not know how the French were beaten off in Vietnam and how the Americans had to come in (again) to pull the french our of trouble. It is not very detailed, but there are lot of facts and sources that confirm it. You should try reading it more. And do keep reading the French phrases, should be interesting in future

As we are saying in France : "il ne faut pas vendre la peau de l'ours avant de l'avoir tué". Use google translate.

It's one of the two website you use everyday, with you bible Wikipedia.

 

[smestarz]

Dont bother, he is French, The Rafale got operational AESA just a few years ago, During MRCA the RBE-2AA AESA was the prototype. Till few years ago, all Rafales used PESA and even now not all Rafales have an AESA. Just in November 2015 French navy tested the AESA in operation. And to just give you comparison, both F/16 and F/A-18 have operational AESA for many years. So for the french its a new thing.
For example its a street where many kids have bicycles (AESA) and only the French kid is pushing the tyre, Then one day his father brings him a second hand cycle, and then you see this kid showing around the 2nd hand cycle with pride. The other kids are not even bothered by it, but the kid feels that the others are jealous because he has a cycle.

So in a way, PESA is older tech, Rafales still have PESA radars even Su-30 MKI and Su-35 have them. Presently France is using AESA with Gallium Arsenide modules, where as the newer tech is Gallium Nitride. as they give a better efficiency and results. Russians are developing Photonic radar which will outclass AESA radars,

For Sukhoi, we are looking for Russia to provde a bigger Radar with more TR modules so that it becomes one of the most powerful airborne radar employed by any miliary fighter and we want it with GaN modules. and there are many upgrades that are listed and will be incorporated in Super Sukhoi upgrade package.

Most french say that the AESA version of a PESA radar the Detection range will be almost twice that of PESA, thus IRBIS-E, therotically would be an AWACS in itself, And this is what is threatening France.

SPECTRA is just data fusion, nothing else, we are now in an era where even the typhoons and hurricanes are named. SPECTRA is data fusion of many sensors including Radar and the french have exaggerate the capabilities of the sensors a lot.

You can say that Russia in a way lags behind west because Riussia does not tend to market the products or over exaggerate them, Russians have a financial crunch and thats wheere Iran and India come into the picture. With India putting its support behind PAKFA/FGFA complex, things are moving faster,
The French are already regretting their decision of holding too tight the MMRCA discussions, even the 36 planes are noiw impossible, If they give less then Egypt and Qatar will have a problem of prices. After all france offered them "special Friend" prices

What is this?

Compared to anything. Though it may not be the best like spectra.


Do you know that T 50 PKFA was also derived from SU 30 still a stealth fighter?

Do you know that we have a plan of super sukhoi in which same palne's RCS will be lowered to just 15% of current RCS?

Everybody know that Russia lags behind west in Electronics but in recent years they have made a good progress and certainly they are not very much behind like they used to be once upon a time.

 

[BON PLAN]

Parrikar Comments creates Buzz over F-18 offer
Published May 28, 2016 SOURCE: IDRW

NEWS NETWORK Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar created media buzz when he said that in a recent Interview that “After 36 Twin engined Rafale fighter India will buy another Twin engined Fighter jet ” . A Certain section of media speculated that both single-engined F-16 and Gripen E more or less have been rejected in favour of Twin-Engined F-18 Super Hornet which was offered by Boeing . But Highly informed sources close to idrw.org have informed us that media might have misunderstood what Defence minister actually meant and he might not be actually referring to Boeing F-18 but to the proposed Indo-Russian Joint venture to develop 5th Generation FGFA based on Sukhoi Pak-fa . According to media reports which quoted Defence ministry officials said that India plans to induct 400 New fighter jets by 2030 . 36 Rafale fighter jets will be procured from France and 114 FGFA 5th Generation fighter jets will be produced in India . IAF has also agreed to place orders for 100 Upgraded Tejas MK-1A and 20 Tejas MK1 and Development of Stretched and upgraded MK2 fighter jets too will be carried out and orders for Indigenous LCA-Tejas and its variants might expand to 250 aircraft. Previously idrw.org had reported that DRDO plans to have first flight of LCA-Tejas MK-2 by 2022 and GE officials in at recently concluded DEFExpo 2016 in Goa have confirmed that considerable progress on the development of F414-INS6 has been made and development work of F414-INS6 for LCA Tejas Mk II will be completed by the end of 2016 . ” We are ready to initiate technology transfer for F414-INS6 engine production with HAL and we are in talks for continuing supply of F404-IN20 engines for LCA Tejas Mk I and for its variants ( MK-1A),” Said GE official to idrw.org . Previous Defence Minister A.K.Antony few years back had hinted that Indigenous LCA-Tejas fighter jet will replace all retiring fleet of Mig-21 and Mig-27 from Indian Air Force which might take LCA-Tejas orders well over 300 to replace one to one aircraft been retired .

..http://idrw.org . Read more at India No 1 Defence News Website , Kindly don http://idrw.org/parrikar-comments-creates-buzz-f-18-offer/#more-96169 .

 

[smestarz]

OK. lets say Russians will be with Photonic Radar by 2028 ? French? Perhaps the natural french answer "we do not need it" and that possible, by 2028 every plane in existence will be able to take down Rafale with pilot maybe not using hands saying "Look ma, no hands " So the French have an option to get Rafale shot down with photonic radar OR without Photonic radar.. well if its going to be shot down anyway, why invest in new Radar?
No one will be wanting to touch Rafale even by a pole by then, maybe only France.

The PESA on Su-35 has an excellent range, so why not use that capability? Su-35 with PESA can detect Rafale with AESA at much longer distance, So Rafale will know its detected but not know from where and whom. And with longer range missile, it can take down a Rafale. So why would it need an AESA when PESA can do the job ?

The BARS radar on Su-30 MKI does not have the range of IRBIS-E and so it would be upgraded, but then Rafale will find itself totally wanting.. Su-30 with AESA = Rafale grounded. why? When the eagles fly, the doves stay on the ground.

2018 ? let's say 2028 +.
They are again with a PESA radar on SU35 .....

 

[Zebra]

It will be great if PM Modi talk about F/A-18s / F-16s in his US visit this time.

What say..................!......?

 

[BON PLAN]

OK. lets say Russians will be with Photonic Radar by 2028 ? French? Perhaps the natural french answer "we do not need it" and that possible, by 2028 every plane in existence will be able to take down Rafale with pilot maybe not using hands saying "Look ma, no hands " So the French have an option to get Rafale shot down with photonic radar OR without Photonic radar.. well if its going to be shot down anyway, why invest in new Radar?
No one will be wanting to touch Rafale even by a pole by then, maybe only France.

The PESA on Su-35 has an excellent range, so why not use that capability? Su-35 with PESA can detect Rafale with AESA at much longer distance, So Rafale will know its detected but not know from where and whom. And with longer range missile, it can take down a Rafale. So why would it need an AESA when PESA can do the job ?

The BARS radar on Su-30 MKI does not have the range of IRBIS-E and so it would be upgraded, but then Rafale will find itself totally wanting.. Su-30 with AESA = Rafale grounded. why? When the eagles fly, the doves stay on the ground.

Photonics radar are not ready. We don't know the exact performance. And perhaps it's already on study inside Thales labs....
Absolutely no proof SU35 PESA radar can detect before a far more stealthier Rafale than the AESA Rafale radar can detect a huge SU35. Don't forget, and you just have to look at, than SU35 is a copy & paste of SU27, which is all but stealthier.

Another time, don't over estimate russian products. They are not supermen.

 

[BON PLAN]

There is a change in the air brake and also increase in composite material ,plus new control surface.

Sir it is 1 to 5 m^2 not 1.5 to 2m^2

For Su 30 MKI from Wiki
The forward-facing NIIP N011M Bars (Panther) is a powerful integrated passive electronically scanned array radar. The N011M is a digital multi-mode dual frequency band radar.[45] The N011M can function in air-to-air and air-to-land/sea mode simultaneously while being tied into a high-precision laser-inertial or GPS navigation system. It is equipped with a modern digital weapons control system as well as anti-jamming features. N011M has a 400 km search range and a maximum 200 km tracking range, and 60 km in the rear hemisphere.[46] The radar can track 15 air targets and engage 4 simultaneously.[46] These targets can even include cruise missiles and motionless helicopters. The Su-30MKI can function as a mini-AWACS as a director or command post for other aircraft. The target co-ordinates can be transferred automatically to at least four other aircraft. The radar can detect ground targets such as tanks at 40–50 km.[46] The Bars radar will be replaced by Zhuk-AESA in all Su-30MKI aircraft.[47][48][49]

OLS-30 laser-optical Infra-red search and track includes a day and night FLIR capability and is used in conjunction with the helmet mounted sighting system. The OLS-30 is a combined IRST/LR device using a cooled, broad waveband sensor. Detection range is up to 90 km, while the laser ranger is effective to 3.5 km. Targets are displayed on the same LCD display as the radar. Israeli LITENING targeting pod is used to target laser guided munitions. The original Litening pod includes a long range FLIR, a TV camera, laser spot tracker to pick up target designated by other aircraft or ground forces, and an electro-optical point and inertial tracker, which enables engagement of the target even when partly obscured by clouds or countermeasures; it also integrates a laser range-finder and flash-lamp powered laser designator for the delivery of laser-guided bombs, cluster and general purpose bomb
And some Good News for France
In 2012, upgrades of the earlier 80 Su-30MKIs involves equipping them with stand-off missiles with a range of 300 km; a request for information (ROI) was issued for such weapons.[38] In 2011, India issued a request for information to MBDA for the integration of the Brimstone ground attack missile and the long-range Meteor air-to-air missile.
So Rafale and Su 30 MKI might share weapons also.

Alleluia.
Russian are making gold of all they are touching.

 

[BON PLAN]

So it means SPECTRA is not what it is? I mean the Rafale boys are talking of passive detection etc, but if Su-35 opens its Radars at long range, Targets the Rafale and fires its R-77 and then goes passive. what does Rafale do? Just be shot down, what else.

So the point of the article was that SPECTRA is self protection suite and it has big limitations, and Rafale has to depend on Radar and so it cannot be passive. In BVR, Su-35 will detect and fire on Rafale much before Rafale can fire on Su-35, and with the missile heading its way, not much a rafale can do.

always bla bla bla......:blah::blah::blah:

 

[BON PLAN]

Compared to anything. Though it may not be the best like spectra.

Sure russians are known to be top of the world in electronic devices ....
They have invented microsoft, apple, credit card, internet, PC ....

russians are late. It's why to day they induce new plane (SU35) with PESA radar. And don't say it's because it more than enough ! An AESA is far more reliable, powerfull, flexible, smart.

 

[BON PLAN]

Dont bother, he is French, The Rafale got operational AESA just a few years ago, During MRCA the RBE-2AA AESA was the prototype. Till few years ago, all Rafales used PESA and even now not all Rafales have an AESA. Just in November 2015 French navy tested the AESA in operation. And to just give you comparison, both F/16 and F/A-18 have operational AESA for many years. So for the french its a new thing.

PLEASE !!!! CHECH YOUR DATAS.

First production RBE2 AESA was produce in summer 2010. First operationnal Rafale with AESA leave Merignac for French air force in 2012. We are in 2016 .....
what is that story of november 2015 ???

Rafale is the first (an today the sole) european fighter with an AESA radar.

 

[smestarz]

As I said you are blind and stupid. November 2015 is when French navy tested AESA,.
Go and check the facts and then post something here, dogmatix.,.. behave and stop barking

PLEASE !!!! CHECH YOUR DATAS.

First production RBE2 AESA was produce in summer 2010. First operationnal Rafale with AESA leave Merignac for French air force in 2012. We are in 2016 .....
what is that story of november 2015 ???

Rafale is the first (an today the sole) european fighter with an AESA radar.

 

[smestarz]

I did notice that when I talk of SPECTRa you come up with the same thing
Guess SPECTRA BS is too classified for you to understand?

always bla bla bla......:blah::blah::blah: