India-Pakistan LoC/IB Skirmishes in the Aftermath of August 5 2019

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Suryavanshi

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We are always talking about capturing POK but has anyone thought what is the most likley route to Push through.

Is assault through Kargil possible?
Or is it gonna be another area?
 

abhay rajput

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we need to keep testing the PAKI bluff keep pushing them see how far before we break them.
They will not break .. when they start losing officers, they simply retreat from the forward position until firing stops. Pakistani call there jawans foot soldiers , they don't really care about them. They can get thousands of these foot soldiers everyday. Pakistan get hurt when they start losing officers. That's what I have heard and that's what we are doing in border. They had lost even brigadier rank officer in early skirmishes days
 
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They will not break .. when they start losing officers, they simply retreat from the forward position until firing stops. Pakistani call there jawans foot soldiers , they don't really care about them. They can get thousands of these foot soldiers everyday. Pakistan get hurt when they start losing officers. That's what I have heard and that's what we are doing in border. They had lost even brigadier rank officer in early skirmishes days
They will break there is already a legal premise to take back our territoryand throw
indus watery treaty in the garbage where it belongs.. Once these steps take place
the chaos within the country will be unmanageable as well as supporting
baluchi freedom. We will break them and nothing will stop us. Losiing officers is
nice but they need to start losing territory.
 
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I am Very Surprised Porkis don’t have more Bases up in POK. To me this Map looks outdated. I am pretty sure Porkis have more air bases up in those mountains and Porkis might also use civilian airports as air bases so we need to count them as well. There might be even hidden Airbases as well hide from Recon satellites and Aerial Recons. How old do you think this map is?
They are banking on chinese to save them(will not happen)
 

Deathstar

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Common sense is not so common in people like you who use that 45 days logic. I mean even a 10 year old can understand

1. Since satellite pictures were released that which showed Indians failed airstrikes. Then why they should be in hurry to take someone there? Are the whole world blind that they can't see Satellite images or is it only indians that can't see the pics clearly ?

2. Indian Satellite images or whatever those "FRIENDS" you rely on to take pictures to show the world Pakistan Army is repairing the damage or roofs or whatever you are claiming them to do. Where is the SAT images of Pakistan army doing such that?

3. You got nothing to proof hence desperatly clutching onto the straws that PA took the delegations after 45 days. You have satellite images. Go ponder over to that if Indian airstrikes were successful or not


BTW what happened to Indian embassy delegation not coming to Pakistan KAshmir when Pakistan army invited them recently ? Were indians afraid of their lies will be exposed hence they didn't come ?
Keep patience , remember Kargil truth came out after 10 years lol. PA soldiers bodies are still buried in Indian soil. Just like 71 surrender ,truth will be out.
I wonder what was the need to release our pilot in just 3 days when u were winning??
Anyways for now u have won ,go enjoy your op swift retort museum lol
 

dkkgp

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Keep patience , remember Kargil truth came out after 10 years lol. PA soldiers bodies are still buried in Indian soil. Just like 71 surrender ,truth will be out.
I wonder what was the need to release our pilot in just 3 days when u were winning??
Anyways for now u have won ,go enjoy your op swift retort museum lol
Tell that @Sayaaf guy 1. India used penetrator bombs which create 1m radius holes. I can cover that up in half an hour.
2. Also, holes can be seen in commercial-grade satellite pics available in the public domain.
3. It's not about taking reporters after 45 days but not allowing them to enter for 45 days including local police and cordoning off the entire area for the same period. Local police weren't allowed to enter and ground video reports from the first day clearly mention that!
4. Reporters, when taken, were taken to the building where India didn't strike whereas India clearly put out in the public domain as to which buildings we struck! This was reported by the reporters themselves.
5. Please let us know of that super-advanced satellite imagery tech which Pak possesses through which we can detect construction workers in the building!
6. There are satellite images in those 45 days which shows a cloud of dust over those buildings in those 45 days
7. Recently India killed some 70/80 terrorists with shelling in 1 night. Ghafoor claimed 7 civilian casualties whereas Videos uploaded in the early hours from Pak show people discussing 80 Pathans killed in just one target area
8. Agar 26th-28th Feb Pak version was actually the one which had happened your army would have the balls to attack after Aug 5, Aukaat hi nahi hain! Modi ne Ghafoora/Bajwa aur Imraan ko pura saal sirf Mujra nachaya.
9 Last but not the least I am missing IKs drunken frustrated tweets
 

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Pak Army’s ISPR works tirelessly to conceal their military casualties
3 days ago Nilesh Kunwar



Maj Gen Asif Ghafoor, Director General Inter Services Public Relations. DG ISPR, Asif Ghafoor, is the Spokesperson of Pakistan Armed Forces.

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The good thing about Pakistan Army’s media wing Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR) is that it never disappoints those who are looking for a good laugh. Remember how after the post Balakot aerial combat, Director General (DG) ISPR Maj Gen Asif Ghafoor announced with great flourish that “our ground forces arrested two (Indian Air Force) pilots; one of them was injured and has been shifted to CMH (Combined Military Hospital) and, God-willing, he will be taken care of.” It seems that God answered Maj Gen Ghafoor’s prayer and had really “taken care” of the injured pilot, because by evening, this pilot simply vanished from the face of the earth without any trace and hasn’t been heard of ever since!

Then, on the same day, DGISPR went on to vehemently deny that Pakistan Air Force (PAF) had used US supplied F-16 fighter jets during its February 27 foray across the Line of Control (LoC). However, even when IAF displayed remnants of AIM-120 C-5 AMRAAM air-to-air missile that can only be fired from an F-16, DGISPR didn’t give up and continued to stand by his statement. But on April 1, he suddenly made a U-turn by saying “Even if F-16 have been used as at that point in time complete PAF was airborne including F-16s, the fact remains that Pakistan Air Force shot down two Indian jets in self-defence.” This admission once again revived the issue that a PAF F-16 being downed by IAF on February 27.

Surprisingly, just four days later, Foreign Policy, an American news publication carried an article quoting “two senior US defense officials with direct knowledge of the situation” as saying that US personnel had counted the F-16 of PAF after the February 27 aerial combat and found none ohttps://foreignpolicy.com/2019/04/04/did-india-shoot-down-a-pakistani-jet-u-s-count-says-no/f them missing. It went on to say that “The findings directly contradict the account of Indian Air Force officials, who said that Wing Commander Abhinandan Varthaman managed to shoot down a Pakistani F-16 before his own plane was downed by a Pakistani missile.” This report should have vindicated Maj Gen Ghafoor’s claim, but rather than settle the issue once for all, its contents and subsequent developments made his assertions appear all the more suspicious.

For one, the article didn’t name the two officials, which is intriguing as the magazine said it was Pakistan that had invited the US to physically count its F-16 planes after the incident as part of an end-user agreement signed when the foreign military sale was finalised. Therefore, there was nothing secretive about US auditing the holding of F-16s of PAF that necessitated anonymity. Secondly, it’s quite unlikely that “two senior US defence officials” would indulge in speculation just to ratify DGISPR’s stance by saying “It is possible that in the heat of combat, Varthaman, flying a vintage MiG-21 Bison, got a lock on the Pakistani F-16, fired, and genuinely believed he scored a hit.”

However, the knockout blow came when Pentagon confirmed that it was “not aware” of US carrying out any such audit of F-16s!

But Maj Gen Ghafoor’s latest tweet claiming that the Indian Army had lost more than 60 soldiers along the LoC since February 27 suggests that ISPR hasn’t learnt anything despite its monumental failures of the past. But with India using its special forces, air force and long-range artillery to pulverise terrorist camps located inside Pakistan-occupied Kashmir (PoK), DGISPR has no other option but to exaggerate Indian Army casualty figures to such an extent that public opinion at home is diverted. The Indian Army, no doubt, has been suffering casualties due to ceasefire violations along the LoC, but unlike Pakistan Army which has a proven record of concealing its fatalities, the Indian Army doesn’t have any such perverted proclivity.

Remember how during the Kargil Aar in 1999, Pakistan Army refused to accept the dead bodies of its soldiers killed in combat? In fact, such has been Pakistan Army’s obsession with suppressing data on fatal battle casualties that in 2017, this issue was hotly debated in the Upper House of Pakistan Parliament and what transpired there was downright comical. During a discussion on the situation along the LoC, senators were shocked when the Minister of State for Power who was speaking on behalf of the Defence Minister only gave out the details of civilian casualties, clarifying that “Pakistan Army wants to withhold the information about the losses suffered by its troops due to security reasons.” This irked six-time Senator and Senate Chairman Raza Rabbani so much that he not only shot back saying “Nothing can be withheld from parliament” but even hit out at the Pakistan Army by saying “Declare us irresponsible people, then (it’ll be) fair enough.”

Needless to say, Rabbani’s assertion on supremacy of the legislature fell on deaf years as the military stood by its illogical explanation that declaring details of fatal military casualties would compromise Pakistan Army’s security. Consequently, while Rawalpindi celebrated the deaths of Indian soldiers in artillery duels and skirmishes along the LoC, many of its own casualties were denied the respect that are due to martyrs simply because they went unreported. Data of Pakistan Army casualty figures collated by reputed military analysts who have been meticulously monitoring open sources of information reveals that the Pakistan Army has suffered inordinately high casualties after it escalated hostilities after the Balakot airstrike.

One such analysis lists out the names of more than 60 Pakistan Army soldiers along with the date and place where they were killed within just a matter of five weeks during July-August this year. The fact that this handle has been suspended by Twitter clearly indicates that this was done on the complaint of some entity that wasn’t very comfortable with such specific data and this in turn establishes beyond any doubt that the Pakistan Army does have plenty of skeletons in its cupboards when it comes to supressing data on its fatal casualties!

But ISPR would still like us to believe that while the Pakistan Army is bleeding Indian Army dry along the LoC, it itself remains unscathed despite Indian Army’s devasting retaliation and this in itself is a howler that’s beyond compare!

Tailpiece: Napoleon may have been exaggerating when he said “God fights on the side with the best artillery” but the fact is that this adage is very apt for the LoC. It’s no secret that the guns and munition available to the Indian Army are far more superior in both quality and quantity than what the Pakistan Army has and it’s but natural that being badly outgunned, the Pakistan Army has always been at the receiving end when guns blaze along the LoC. That’s why, when Gen Pervez Musharraf declared a unilateral ceasefire along the LoC in 2003 even after having had to bite the dust in Kargil, it was not out of any goodwill or his quest for peace, but purely to reduce the humungous casualties that the Pakistan Army was suffering!

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Nilesh Kunwar

Writer is a retired Indian Army Officer who has served in terrorism-infested areas of Jammu & Kashmir, Assam, Nagaland and Manipur. He is a ‘Kashmir-Watcher’ who keeps a close tab on the state’s developments.

See author's posts
 

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26/11 Mumbai Terror Attack: ISI Erasing Evidence of Pak’s Involvement
1 week ago Nilesh Kunwar



The Taj Mahal Hotel in Mumbai after the terrorist attack on 26/11/2008.

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As the tenth anniversary of the horrendous Mumbai massacre that snuffed out 166 lives and left countless injured approaches, we will (just like we have been doing for the last nine years), express solidarity with the unfortunate victims by holding prayers and memorial services for their souls and denounce terrorism in the strongest of words. We will also wax eloquent on the indomitable ‘Mumbai spirit’ that helped the physically and mentally scarred Mumbaikars to quickly overcome their trauma and quickly move on as if nothing happened. But all this doesn’t hide the fact that we’ve failed the 26/11 victims because even after a decade the masterminds of this carnage haven’t been brought to book!

Though Islamabad has put the Mumbai terror attack accused on trial, this case has been dragging and the way things are going, it’d extremely unlikely that anyone will end up being convicted. Reason? Pakistan claims India has failed to provide evidence that could establish beyond all doubts the involvement of the accused in these attacks. But even though New Delhi has consistently maintained that it had provided irrefutable evidence, yet Islamabad doesn’t agree. Yousaf Raza Gilani, the then Prime Minister of Pakistan didn’t agree. In fact he told the Parliament that what India had provided was “some information” on Mumbai attacks, emphasising, “I say ‘information’ because these are not evidence.”

Since Islamabad insists it doesn’t have irrefutable evidence to proceed against the 26/11 accused, so let’s go over certain available details which are available in public domain that are not (to borrow Gilani’s words) “some information” but concrete evidence.

Even after it was conclusively proved by Geo TV through its report from ‘ground zero’ that Ajmal Kasab was a Pakistani national, Islamabad still refused to accept the same, prompting Nawaz Sharif whose party was giving outside support to the Zardari government to question as to why was Kasab’s house and village cordoned off by security agencies. Sharif rightly opined that rather than undertake the impossible task of hiding the truth, “…the people and media should be allowed to meet Iman’s (Kasab’s) parents so that the truth could come out in the open,” adding, “We need some kind of introspection.” But Islamabad didn’t budge and a month and a half later, when National Security Adviser Mehmood Ali Durrani told an Indian news channel that Kasab was a Pakistani national, he was summarily sacked by Gilani!

If the Pakistani establishment and deep state had nothing to do with the Mumbai carnage at all, then where was the requirement for Islamabad to be so paranoid as to go out of its way to conceal the fact that Kasab was a Pakistani national?

Even if we for a moment accept that what New Delhi gave Islamabad was merely “some information,” what about the irrefutable evidence that Pakistan’s Federal Investigation Agency (FIA) had collected? Why hasn’t the same been used as evidence? So instead of complaining about lack of evidence against the Mumbai attack masterminds and blaming India for the same, Islamabad would do well to open the FIA file on the Mumbai attacks prepared when Tariq Khosa was its Director General (DG).

That the FIA had done a thoroughly professional investigation in the 26/11 case would probably have never come to light if the 2014 APS Peshawar carnage hadn’t taken place. Shaken by this massacre of innocent school children by terrorists, the conscious stricken former DG FIA penned down an article that was published in Dawn (‘Mumbai Attack Trial’, August 3, 2015) in which he mentioned that “Pakistan has to deal with the Mumbai mayhem, planned and launched from its soil. This requires facing the truth and admitting mistakes. The entire state security apparatus must ensure that the perpetrators and masterminds of the ghastly terror attacks are brought to justice. The case has lingered on for far too long.” In his article, Khosa has confirmed that the FIA investigation had conclusively ascertained the following:

  • First, Ajmal Kasab was a Pakistani national, whose place of residence and initial schooling as well as his joining a banned militant organisation was established by the investigators.
  • Second, the Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) terrorists were imparted training near Thatta, Sindh and launched by sea from there. The training camp was identified and secured by the investigators. The casings of the explosive devices used in Mumbai were recovered from this training camp and duly matched.
  • Third, the fishing trawler used by the terrorists for hijacking an Indian trawler in which they sailed to Mumbai, was brought back to harbour, then painted and concealed. It was recovered by the investigators and connected to the accused.
  • Fourth, the engine of the dinghy abandoned by the terrorists near Mumbai harbour contained a patent number through which the investigators traced its import from Japan to Lahore and then to a Karachi sports shop from where an LeT-linked militant purchased it along with the dinghy. The money trail was followed and linked to the accused who was arrested.
  • Fifth, the operations room in Karachi, from where the operation was directed, was also identified and secured by the investigators. The communications through Voice over Internet Protocol were unearthed.
  • Sixth, the alleged commander and his deputies were identified and arrested.
  • Seventh, a couple of foreign-based financiers and facilitators were arrested and brought to face trial.
Besides this incriminating FIA’s report, there are many other sources that provide details that can nail the accused.

Pakistan’s former ambassador to the US, Husain Haqqani writes in his book (‘India vs Pakistan: Why Can’t We Just Be Friends?’) that while talking about the Mumbai attacks, Lt Gen Ahmad Shuja Pasha, who was the ISI chief then, had confided that “Log hamaray theh, operation hamara nahin tha” (those involved in the operation (Mumbai attacks) were our men, but the operation wasn’t ours). Islamabad may dismiss this claim on the grounds that being an accused in ‘memo-gate’ scandal, Haqqani has an anti-Pakistan bias, but then he isn’t the only one to have made this claim!

In his book (‘Playing to the Edge’), former CIA Director Michael Hayden, also writes that “His (Lt Gen Pasha’s) investigation had revealed that some former ISI members were involved (in Mumbai attacks) with Lashkar-e-Taiba. Pasha admitted that these unspecified retirees may have engaged in some broad training of the attackers, but he was characteristically vague about any detailed direction the attackers had gotten during the attack via cell phone from Pakistan.”

Similarly, investigative journalist Bob Woodward, in his book ‘Obama’s Wars’ has also quoted Lt Gen Pasha telling the CIA chief that “There may have been people associated with my organization who were associated with this (Mumbai attacks). That’s different from authority, direction and control.” Woodward too has stated that “…the CIA later received reliable intelligence that the ISI was directly involved in the training for Mumbai (attacks).”

So, even if Haqqani’s account is prejudiced, but surely neither Hayden nor Woodward have any reasons to risk their well-established credibility by making false accusations!

In 2017, while speaking at the 19th Asian Security Conference being held at the Institute for Defence and Studies and Analyses (IDSA) in New Delhi, former Pakistan NSA Mahmood Ali Durrani told the audience that “26/11 Mumbai attack carried out by a terror group based in Pakistan is classic trans-border terrorist event.” A year later, Nawaz Sharif also admitted that Pakistan was involved in the Mumbai attacks when he told Dawn newspaper that “militant organisations are active. Call them non-state actors, (but) should we allow them to cross the border and kill 150 people in Mumbai?”

Therefore, if Islamabad is still complaining that all it has is “some information,” it’s only because though available in abundance, clinching evidence against those who were terrorist commanders, who masterminded the 26/11 carnage and who provided training, armament and logistic support to the attackers has conveniently been “disappeared” by the ISI!

Postscript

It’s quite unlikely that Rawalpindi will ever allow the state to persecute its proxies who executed the ISI planned Mumbai attacks. But if Nawaz Sharif can express his anguish by asking Islamabad “Why can’t we complete the (Mumbai attacks) trial?” and terming this inordinate delay as something “absolutely unacceptable,” then rather than only holding prayers and memorial services, can’t we also focus more on demanding justice for 26/11 victims?
 

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It’s time to call Pakistan’s nuclear bluff
3 months ago Nilesh Kunwar



Gen. Qamar Javed Bajwa, the current Chief of Pakistan Army

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There is an old saying that ‘desperate times call for desperate measures’ and Islamabad’s situation after New Delhi’s abrogation of Article 370 in Jammu & Kashmir, is despairing, to say the least. For Prime Minister Imran Khan, who after his recent US visit thought that with President Donald Trump’s mediation offer on Kashmir, he had “returned with the World Cup,” this sudden development was even more embarrassing.

On the domestic front, Khan was so badly ridiculed for government’s inaction on Article 370 abrogation issue in their Senate that in a fit of sheer exasperation he blurted, “What can I do? Do you want me to attack India?” But that’s not all. A few days back, a video surfaced in which opposition leader and Pakistan Peoples’ Party (PPP) chairman Bilawal Bhutto can be heard mocking Khan by saying, “Earlier, Pakistan’s policy on Kashmir was on how we will take Srinagar. Now, under Imran Khan’s government, we have been forced to think on how we will save Muzaffarabad!”

As far as the international arena is concerned, Islamabad’s high decibel pitch against abrogation of Article 370 ended in an inaudible whimper after it failed to gather global support against this move which Khan described as an “illegal” and “unilateral” step. What made matters even worse was that the UNSC (United Nations Security Council) meet on Kashmir which Foreign Minister Shah Mehmood Qureshi had hailed as “Pakistan’s big success at diplomatic front” and which according to him “had landed India in utmost panic,” didn’t even result in a communiqué or statement being issued on what transpired during this ‘closed door’ meeting.

With the UNSC refusing to comment on the recent developments in Kashmir, Islamabad’s allegation that abrogation of Article 370 was in violation of UNSC resolutions on Kashmir fell flat. Pushed into a corner by its own diplomatic intransigence, the only recourse left for Rawalpindi that actually formulates Pakistan’s Kashmir policy was to start beating the war drum with military precision. The first thing Khan did (or, rather was instructed to do by Pakistan Army), was to play ‘victim’ by claiming that he had definite information that India would orchestrate a ‘Pulwama-type false flag operation’ in Kashmir to give it an excuse to carry out a pre-meditated attack in Pakistan occupied Kashmir (PoK).

Though this plot seems to have been lifted straight out of a John le Carré novel, yet there were chances that it could still have gained some sort of acceptability had it not been for two major blunders that Pakistan made. The first was that during his maiden US visit, Khan had himself dubbed the Pulwama car-bomb suicide attack as an “indigenous thing” and went on to justify his allegation by saying “A Kashmiri boy was radicalised after the brutalities of the Indian security forces and he carried out the attack.” But just within two months, he suddenly made a U-turn and started accusing New Delhi of orchestrating this attack and tried to raise a “false flag operation” bogey without even furnishing any evidence to substantiate his allegation.

The second (and bigger) blunder was made by Pakistan Army chief Gen. Qamar Javed Bajwa himself, when just a day after New Delhi abrogated Article 370, he declared that “Pakistan Army firmly stands by the Kashmiris in their just struggle to the very end. We are prepared and shall So, it’s high time that the international community called Pakistan’s nuclear bluff.

An important issue that Islamabad failed to take note of is that while India has a ‘no first use policy’ in place and reconsidering the same is mere loud-thinking, its own nuclear doctrine doesn’t have any such stipulation. So, would it be incorrect if the international community retorts to Khan’s tirade on the possibility of a pre-emptive Indian nuclear strike by saying, “look who’s talking?”
 

hit&run

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India loses men. Pakistan loses men.
India doesn't get pok or an inch of land.
India is 7 times bigger than pak.

So who's winning this war?
You have a good point. In my understanding, we are waiting for the right oppurtunity.
 

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India loses men. Pakistan loses men.
India doesn't get pok or an inch of land.
India is 7 times bigger than pak.

So who's winning this war?
I can see Some Merit in your comments. Most Porkis that we killed are in defensive actions while most attacks come from PorkiShitan.What has PorkiShitani Dogs gain from all fighting on the LOC? They couldn’t even gain one inch land on the LOC even after some many years of battles. PorkiShitan been a Smaller and Poorer State than India can’t sustain such highly dangerous and costly actions for ever. India been Seven Times Bigger has Numbers and Resources to fight these battles to the very end. But very interesting thing is that Even if they are losing resources PorkiShitanis have grown bolder and bolder ever since there 1971 Defeat. They know they can’t defeat India in a conventional and drawn out war. So proxy wars which are less costly and cheap to fund combined with Pisslamic Terrorist ideology are best tactics to fight India on long term. India could have ended this Pisslam Terrorist Threat along time ago if it had The Entire POK under its control along with more powerful actions on border with PorkiShitan. Indian inaction is the biggest reason why we always get effected by Terrorist attacks from PorkiShitan.
 
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Illusive

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Some really idiotic questions being asked, please learn about basics of warfare...

Is Indian army 7 times larger than paki army?

What would be the ratio required for a successfull invasion?

Is POK a flat terrain through which our army could blitz past them without worrying about the logistics?

Has India policy makers have ever actually tried to even take back pok in their agenda when the past evidence shows our policy makers were always interested in turning LOC into IB? Until recently.

What would be the cost that India would have to incur to fund to achieve it's objectives?

Wouldn't it be better to destroy the enemy economically before moving to secure territory?

And many more questions that need to be answered instead of foolish assuming things that we have no clue about.
 
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